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TheIriaeban
Master of Realmslore
USA
1289 Posts |
 Posted - 21 Apr 2020 : 19:15:34
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Kanchelsis was brought up in another thread and that has gotten me thinking about where he is now. Velsharoon was the god of undeath which, I would guess, would make him god of the undead. However, Velsharoon was killed/destroyed in 4e. Has anything been said as to who now has that portfolio? Could Kanchelsis have seized it and thus become the god of the undead?
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"Iriaebor is a fine city. So what if you can have violence between merchant groups break out at any moment. Not every city can offer dinner AND a show."
My FR writeups - http://www.mediafire.com/folder/um3liz6tqsf5n/Documents
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BrennonGoldeye
Learned Scribe
105 Posts |
Posted - 21 Apr 2020 : 19:36:39
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| As far as I know Velsharoon is right back where he was in 3.5, as are the rest of the Gods. |
Sam |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36779 Posts |
Posted - 21 Apr 2020 : 19:48:29
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Kanchelsis is more interesting than Velsharoon... But Vellie is the god of necromancy, and as I recall, Kanchelsis is specifically about vampires, while Orcus is (or at least was) the god of the undead.
I don't think Kanchelsis has a presence in the Realms. |
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Edited by - Wooly Rupert on 21 Apr 2020 19:54:32 |
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TheIriaeban
Master of Realmslore
USA
1289 Posts |
Posted - 21 Apr 2020 : 20:00:01
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| ALL of them are back? I knew that a few of them were from what I have seen on here and at the wiki. The wiki still has Vel listed as dead. Oh, well, that could have been fun. |
"Iriaebor is a fine city. So what if you can have violence between merchant groups break out at any moment. Not every city can offer dinner AND a show."
My FR writeups - http://www.mediafire.com/folder/um3liz6tqsf5n/Documents
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TheIriaeban
Master of Realmslore
USA
1289 Posts |
Posted - 21 Apr 2020 : 20:12:49
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quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
Kanchelsis is more interesting than Velsharoon... But Vellie is the god of necromancy, and as I recall, Kanchelsis is specifically about vampires, while Orcus is (or at least was) the god of the undead.
I don't think Kanchelsis has a presence in the Realms.
Yeah, see, that is the confusing part. You have demon lords that are kinda like gods but aren't so you aren't sure where they fit in. Kanchelsis is an intermediate power so I would think that would rank higher then a demon lord, power-wise. Kanchelsis could drain a mortal to where they die and then just bring 'em back and do it all over again. That is something that a demon lord could not do without some help of some kind and it would be a nice little threat Kanchelsis could use on mortals.
As for the realms, could he be considered part of Lolth's bunch since he is from the Seldarine? |
"Iriaebor is a fine city. So what if you can have violence between merchant groups break out at any moment. Not every city can offer dinner AND a show."
My FR writeups - http://www.mediafire.com/folder/um3liz6tqsf5n/Documents
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36779 Posts |
Posted - 21 Apr 2020 : 20:40:55
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quote:
Originally posted by TheIriaeban
ALL of them are back? I knew that a few of them were from what I have seen on here and at the wiki. The wiki still has Vel listed as dead. Oh, well, that could have been fun.
It was a very clumsy hand-wave; we've been told all the gods are back -- but some very clearly are not, like Tyche or the powers slain by the Dead Three on their rise.
One approach I've considered is that maybe all the powers around for the ToT did come back, but the fallen ones are at the lowest rung of divine power, and would have to fight to regain their former strength. |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36779 Posts |
Posted - 21 Apr 2020 : 20:43:23
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quote:
Originally posted by TheIriaeban
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
Kanchelsis is more interesting than Velsharoon... But Vellie is the god of necromancy, and as I recall, Kanchelsis is specifically about vampires, while Orcus is (or at least was) the god of the undead.
I don't think Kanchelsis has a presence in the Realms.
Yeah, see, that is the confusing part. You have demon lords that are kinda like gods but aren't so you aren't sure where they fit in. Kanchelsis is an intermediate power so I would think that would rank higher then a demon lord, power-wise. Kanchelsis could drain a mortal to where they die and then just bring 'em back and do it all over again. That is something that a demon lord could not do without some help of some kind and it would be a nice little threat Kanchelsis could use on mortals.
As for the realms, could he be considered part of Lolth's bunch since he is from the Seldarine?
Yeah, the whole fiends who are gods thing is a mess. If you consider them to be demon lords who ascended, that's a bit more workable.
I don't think Kanchelsis has ever been active in the Realms, though it'd be easy enough to squeeze him in, using pretty much the same backstory. |
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LordofBones
Master of Realmslore
1477 Posts |
Posted - 21 Apr 2020 : 23:41:42
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I don't really think Kanchelsis should be considered part of Lolth's bunch. For one, he's effectively her equal as far as divine strata goes and can tell her where to stuff her orders. For the other, Kanchelsis didn't betray the Seldarine so much as his existence is a mockery of all that the Seldarine stand for.
To the Seldarine, he's the equivalent of an inverted cross floating in urine. |
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TheIriaeban
Master of Realmslore
USA
1289 Posts |
Posted - 22 Apr 2020 : 05:30:59
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Looking in Demihuman Deities, it kinda looks like he is the opposite of Hanali Celanil (love, romance). His being an intermediate power with no worshippers really doesn't make sense. He has to have more than a cult status to be an intermediate power. Now, I could see him as being outside both the Elf and Drow pantheons with worshippers among the drow. He may have another aspect that is worshiped among humans (that is why his avatar looks half-elven). I could also see him as THE god of blood magic (and possibly the patron god of blood mages). That would give him the wide worship base to be an intermediate power.
Another option is that he and Hanali Celanil were split from each other like Tymora/Beshaba only he got more than 50% of the divine power. This is why Hanali Celanil has to be part of the Triune Goddess to stay alive and he is able to be an intermediate god with no worshippers because he is draining power from Halali. As long as she is an intermediate power, so is he. |
"Iriaebor is a fine city. So what if you can have violence between merchant groups break out at any moment. Not every city can offer dinner AND a show."
My FR writeups - http://www.mediafire.com/folder/um3liz6tqsf5n/Documents
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Edited by - TheIriaeban on 22 Apr 2020 05:31:38 |
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LordofBones
Master of Realmslore
1477 Posts |
Posted - 22 Apr 2020 : 06:05:06
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It's mostly because Kanchelsis came from a time when gods weren't inherently dependent on mortal worship. Ilsensine has a pitiful amount of clerics, but he's a greater power.
Kanchelsis maintains his divinity through the aspects of his portfolio. Every act of vampirism, every act of debauchery that mocks the Seldarine, every act of magic that profanes the natural sorcery of the elves, empowers Kanchelsis. Mellifleur is much the same, being empowered by the acts and ascension of liches and the sorcery of lichcraft, not by any specific veneration. It wouldn't surprise me if he saw to the existence of failed liches to ensure that only best and the most ambitious wizards pursued lichdom.
EDIT: I think that a deity's metaphysical aspects should be emphasised a bit more than the number of his worshipers. Kanchelsis, for example, isn't just the god of being Count Dracula, he's a dark mirror of the Seldarine, a twisted monster that mocks everything that they are.
Hanali encourages the free, unbridled romances and loves of the elves? Kanchelsis sees to it that her love and freedom reaches what he sees as its inevitable conclusion of passion, lust and hedonism; that is, one filtered through the lens of an immortal ever hungry for new sensations.
Rillifane is the god of nature? What is a vampire if not the ultimate predator? Is he not a fair hunter, leaving the cattle to breed and spawn, cultivating his herd like a proud shepard?
Corellon is the Coronal of Magic, but Kanchelsis sees himself as a reminder that magic is a thing of power, and all power requires sacrifice. What greater sacrifice is there than blood, the essence of life itself?
He was born from the blood of all the Seldarine. In some way, I think they see their dark son as a warning, a mirror aspect of what they represent.
Also, an artifact called the Moonblood Periapt supposedly holds a portion of the original blood that spawned Kanchelsis. Baphomet sided with Orcus in a dispute over it with Graz'zt. It could be a fun campaign hook. |
Edited by - LordofBones on 22 Apr 2020 08:15:24 |
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TheIriaeban
Master of Realmslore
USA
1289 Posts |
Posted - 22 Apr 2020 : 14:28:08
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| Wasn't it Ao, though, that decided that all gods had to be more closely tied to their worshippers? Wouldn't that preclude his independence from worshippers? That could also explain his power drop from intermediate to demi-power. Was there any explanation given about how all the dead gods came back? Could that be what returned him to intermediate power status? |
"Iriaebor is a fine city. So what if you can have violence between merchant groups break out at any moment. Not every city can offer dinner AND a show."
My FR writeups - http://www.mediafire.com/folder/um3liz6tqsf5n/Documents
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LordofBones
Master of Realmslore
1477 Posts |
Posted - 22 Apr 2020 : 14:51:26
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AO only has power within Realmspace. It also doesn't explain Urdlen and Ilsensine, who have very few actual worshipers but are an Intermediate and Greater power respectively. Myrkul is called out as having few priests and an unpopular faith, but he was a greater deity. Mystra is the goddess of magic, but arcane spellcasters represent a minority in the Realms, certainly not enough to tip her to greater power status just by the number of her worshipers.
However, look at them metaphysically.
Urdlen is the Gnomish Nightmare. He's an ancient abominable horror that not even Garl can put down, not some random nuisance. His motives are unknown, his goals unfathomable, and he wants you to die. He's the shadow of the gnomish psyche, a relic of long-forgotten times that exists to torment the gnomish race.
Ilsensine Is. He is Illithid and Illithid is He. He is the sum of the knowledge of the Mind-Flayer race, and everything they learn, everything they do, everything that they are is simply a tiny cell, a minute electric impulse of the great brain of Ilsensine.
The Weave is the Realms and Mystra is the Weave.
Myrkul is the god of inevitability. All things rot and wither and die, and all come to him. Even dragons grow old, and even the mightiest lich will wither to dust. Even gods must die, and at the end, he'll be waiting for them all. He is everywhere, for where there is life, death must be there too.
Kanchelsis? He's the inverted mirror of the Seldarine. Where the Seldarine exist, so too must Kanchelsis. He's their dark son, their greatest shame, their own deific blood given unholy life. |
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BrennonGoldeye
Learned Scribe
105 Posts |
Posted - 22 Apr 2020 : 15:15:42
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quote:
Originally posted by TheIriaeban
Wasn't it Ao, though, that decided that all gods had to be more closely tied to their worshippers? Wouldn't that preclude his independence from worshippers? That could also explain his power drop from intermediate to demi-power. Was there any explanation given about how all the dead gods came back? Could that be what returned him to intermediate power status?
Yes, it's an AO thing. Well actually its a "Writer" thing. |
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TheIriaeban
Master of Realmslore
USA
1289 Posts |
Posted - 22 Apr 2020 : 16:13:49
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quote:
Originally posted by LordofBones
AO only has power within Realmspace. It also doesn't explain Urdlen and Ilsensine, who have very few actual worshipers but are an Intermediate and Greater power respectively. Myrkul is called out as having few priests and an unpopular faith, but he was a greater deity. Mystra is the goddess of magic, but arcane spellcasters represent a minority in the Realms, certainly not enough to tip her to greater power status just by the number of her worshipers.
However, look at them metaphysically.
Urdlen is the Gnomish Nightmare. He's an ancient abominable horror that not even Garl can put down, not some random nuisance. His motives are unknown, his goals unfathomable, and he wants you to die. He's the shadow of the gnomish psyche, a relic of long-forgotten times that exists to torment the gnomish race.
Ilsensine Is. He is Illithid and Illithid is He. He is the sum of the knowledge of the Mind-Flayer race, and everything they learn, everything they do, everything that they are is simply a tiny cell, a minute electric impulse of the great brain of Ilsensine.
The Weave is the Realms and Mystra is the Weave.
Myrkul is the god of inevitability. All things rot and wither and die, and all come to him. Even dragons grow old, and even the mightiest lich will wither to dust. Even gods must die, and at the end, he'll be waiting for them all. He is everywhere, for where there is life, death must be there too.
Kanchelsis? He's the inverted mirror of the Seldarine. Where the Seldarine exist, so too must Kanchelsis. He's their dark son, their greatest shame, their own deific blood given unholy life.
Prayers power the gods except for special cases. Mystra and Ilsensine are the sum of something (respectively magic and mind flayers) so they are special cases. The other gods get prayers so they DON'T show up. A lone gnome, seeing a tribe of orcs, may whisper a quick prayer to Urdlen to not bring destruction down on his home similar to how sailors will make an offering to Umberlee to NOT cause problems on their voyage. Same thing for Myrkul, a quick prayer to ward off parasites or corruption. For Kanchelsis, I suppose there could be quick prayers to not have their party become an drug-fueled orgy but it would seem to make more sense that the reason he has that much power is that he is the sum total of blood magic. That would be constant and would exist as long as there is at least one blood mage out there. It could also be how he was brought into the Realms: a blood mage or two from somewhere else appeared on Toril and he suddenly had an invitation. A new land to drink in its pleasures and people. Oh, and the Seldarine are here, too? Another world where he can thumb his nose at them, as well. |
"Iriaebor is a fine city. So what if you can have violence between merchant groups break out at any moment. Not every city can offer dinner AND a show."
My FR writeups - http://www.mediafire.com/folder/um3liz6tqsf5n/Documents
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LordofBones
Master of Realmslore
1477 Posts |
Posted - 23 Apr 2020 : 03:42:04
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I'd imagine that it would be rather uncomfortable for the Seldarine as Kanchy is their aspects taken to their logical extremes.
I'd think the best way to portray a Kanchelsian is to have him be classically noble: polite, eloquent, well-bred and regal. It's just that the facade hides a monster. Maybe Kanchelsians have a sense of noblesse oblige among them, believing that it's their duty to tend to the cattle. Like their god, they disprove heavily of vampires that have given in to their instincts, and hire adventurers to wipe out the mongrels.
I'd personally play up the whole 'monster beneath a veneer of nobility' thing. |
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Delnyn
Senior Scribe
USA
890 Posts |
Posted - 23 Apr 2020 : 12:24:35
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quote:
Originally posted by LordofBones
I'd imagine that it would be rather uncomfortable for the Seldarine as Kanchy is their aspects taken to their logical extremes.
I'd think the best way to portray a Kanchelsian is to have him be classically noble: polite, eloquent, well-bred and regal. It's just that the facade hides a monster. Maybe Kanchelsians have a sense of noblesse oblige among them, believing that it's their duty to tend to the cattle. Like their god, they disprove heavily of vampires that have given in to their instincts, and hire adventurers to wipe out the mongrels.
I'd personally play up the whole 'monster beneath a veneer of nobility' thing.
Imagine the irony of Kelemvor's doomguides or Lathander's morninglords unwittingly doing Kanchelsis's bidding by enthusiastically eradicating whom he considers rogue vampires. Even better for Kanchelsis, such clerics would be willing to do so at cheaper rates than more money-driven adventurers. Of course "Kanchy" would carefully hide his sponsorship. |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36779 Posts |
Posted - 23 Apr 2020 : 15:29:19
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quote:
Originally posted by Delnyn
quote:
Originally posted by LordofBones
I'd imagine that it would be rather uncomfortable for the Seldarine as Kanchy is their aspects taken to their logical extremes.
I'd think the best way to portray a Kanchelsian is to have him be classically noble: polite, eloquent, well-bred and regal. It's just that the facade hides a monster. Maybe Kanchelsians have a sense of noblesse oblige among them, believing that it's their duty to tend to the cattle. Like their god, they disprove heavily of vampires that have given in to their instincts, and hire adventurers to wipe out the mongrels.
I'd personally play up the whole 'monster beneath a veneer of nobility' thing.
Imagine the irony of Kelemvor's doomguides or Lathander's morninglords unwittingly doing Kanchelsis's bidding by enthusiastically eradicating whom he considers rogue vampires. Even better for Kanchelsis, such clerics would be willing to do so at cheaper rates than more money-driven adventurers. Of course "Kanchy" would carefully hide his sponsorship.
That is a brilliant idea! |
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TheIriaeban
Master of Realmslore
USA
1289 Posts |
Posted - 23 Apr 2020 : 16:28:21
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quote:
Originally posted by LordofBones
I'd imagine that it would be rather uncomfortable for the Seldarine as Kanchy is their aspects taken to their logical extremes.
I'd think the best way to portray a Kanchelsian is to have him be classically noble: polite, eloquent, well-bred and regal. It's just that the facade hides a monster. Maybe Kanchelsians have a sense of noblesse oblige among them, believing that it's their duty to tend to the cattle. Like their god, they disprove heavily of vampires that have given in to their instincts, and hire adventurers to wipe out the mongrels.
I'd personally play up the whole 'monster beneath a veneer of nobility' thing.
Yep, I have started a rewrite of his Monster Mythology entry to make it more like a Faiths and Avatars entry. The way I am picturing him is like how Dracula was portrayed in the recent Netflix show (highly recommended if you haven't seen it yet). However, that Dracula is much too nice for Kanchy's monster side. I do see him playing with his food, though. |
"Iriaebor is a fine city. So what if you can have violence between merchant groups break out at any moment. Not every city can offer dinner AND a show."
My FR writeups - http://www.mediafire.com/folder/um3liz6tqsf5n/Documents
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LordofBones
Master of Realmslore
1477 Posts |
Posted - 26 Apr 2020 : 09:16:35
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In case anyone's interested, here's what I have for Kanchy
KANCHELSIS
Lord of Vampires, the First Vampire, the Eternal Elder Vampire, the Beast, the Rake, Folly of the Seldarine
Intermediate Power of the Abyss
Domain Bat with glowing crimson eyes
Domain 487th/Mansion of the Rake or Lair of the Beast
Alignment Chaotic Evil
Aliases Maastracht
Superior none
Allies Abraxas, Afflux, Bhaal (dead), Cas, Evening Glory, Eshebala, Lolth, Malcanthet, Mellifleur, Nocticula, Syrul, Velsharoon
Foes Graz'zt, Lathander, Malar, Pelor, Pholtus, Rao, Selune, Sune, the Seldarine, Zura
Servants Memnul, Dagrobard, and Vonce (proxies); Union of Eclipses
Servitor Creatures bats (all types), blood amniotes, blood elementals, blood golems, bloodmote clouds, crypt chanters, nightshades, spectral lyrists, stirges, tanar'ri (blood fiends, cambions, chasme, incubi, shadow demons, succubi), vampires (all types), werebats, wolves (all types)
Manifestations a pale masculine hand wearing a silver, ruby-encrusted ring, a full-lipped man's mouth with piercing canines
Signs of Favour puddles or trails of bright red blood where there should be none (favour), black, brackish or clotted blood (disfavour)
Worshipers alchemists, vampires and their spawn, vampiric creatures, hedonists, the debauched, thrill-seekers, spellcasters (especially blood magi), those who revere the mystical properties of blood, evil half-elves, drow
Cleric Alignments CN, CE, NE
Specialty Priests unknown
Holy Days unknown
Portfolio blood, vampires, magic (especially blood magic), seduction, debauchery, the night
Domains Beguilement, Chaos, Charm, Corruption, Evil, Magic, Nobility, Night, Spell, Temptation, Trickery
Favored Weapon Sanguine, the Blade of the Vampire King (Rapier)
Pathfinder
Domains Chaos, Charm, Darkness, Evil, Magic, Nobility, Trickery
Subdomains Alchemy, Arcane, Aristocracy, Blood*, Captivation, Corruption, Deception, Demon, Fear, Lust, Night, Revelry
*Kanchelsis only offers the Blood subdomain of the War domain. Clerics of Kanchelsis cannot take use the Blood subdomain to qualify for anything that requires the War domain. |
Edited by - LordofBones on 26 Apr 2020 09:20:19 |
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TheIriaeban
Master of Realmslore
USA
1289 Posts |
Posted - 26 Apr 2020 : 16:52:01
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Thank you. That is giving me some ideas. I am going with the "no priests" mention in Monster Mythology and this is some of what I have so far(2e):
The Church
There is no Church of Kanchelsis. Certainly, he has a large number of sycophants but he doesn’t recognize them as worshippers and grants no spells. He has become aware of individuals who have performed truly epic levels of debauchery, created powerful blood magic, or are vampires of such renown that he has granted them spur of the moment boons. In at least one case, he even returned a vampire to unlife after it had been destroyed. Otherwise, he tends to help no one unless it is to start/contribute to an elf’s or half-elf’s journey away from elven cultural norms and towards Kanchelsis’ culture of corruption.
Major Centers of Worship: Kanchelsis has no official centers of worship on Toril since he doesn’t have any clergy. However, more and more individuals are becoming aware of him and are invoking his blessing at the beginning of their dark “festivities”. Whether or not this actually leads to the creation of a church is not known at this time. It is getting the attention of the Dark Seldarine as more of the drow become aware of Kanchelsis and are pulled away from Lolth’s slavish devotion.
The largest collection of his sycophants is in Myth Akhmhaor located on 487th layer of the Abyss. The city is five miles south from the hill on which Kanchelsis’ mansion sits. Surrounding both the city and the hill is Mormista, the Forest of Darkness (the five miles between the two is also covered in forest).
The city, whose elven name means City of Corrupted Duty, is obviously of elven construction. Built millennia ago by elves that Kanchelsis had enticed away from worshipping the Seldarine, the city is a mixture of slender, black stone buildings and traditional tree-based elven dwellings (the trees are leafless and appear to be dead while remaining quite sturdy). Although the city has expanded over the centuries, the same style was used so that the “elven feel” has been kept.
The city is ruled by the N’Manth’Quessir (the Disavowed Ones). This group has little patience for anyone who causes anything more than a small disturbance. Those that draw their attention are used as the “guest of honor” in one of the more depraved parties (which ends with their death) if they are not just killed on the spot. If the individual or group appears to be able to put up a concerted resistance, four or more goristroi (greater tanar’ri) are called upon to deal with the interlopers. If needed, they are assisted by members of the Sharr Mathla (Tower of Blood Magic).
Otherwise, the city exists for one reason only: pleasure. No pleasure is too extreme and there is an extensive slave trade to supply those that have base desires. No other location in the outer or inner planes has a more extensive choice of consciousness altering substances available (which results in a common occurrence of someone with an altered mental state wandering out of the city and into the forest where they are killed by the flora or fauna there). While even the most jaded of travelers would find something new here, it may cause them to retch just thinking about it.
It is these offerings that have attracted those of dubious moral values from far and wide. At any time, almost all of the major races can be spotted roaming the black stone streets. Vampires (including their relations) and other intelligent undead are also commonly seen. The only beings not welcome are those that are there to cause trouble.
Those wanting to visit the city (as well as the mansion) must travel on a winding black stone road that passes through Mormista. Anyone that has been there before knows to stay on the road and not cut through the forest. Visitors that wander off the road usually fall prey to the flora and fauna of the forest: blood rose plants, bloodflowers, bloodgrass, bloodsippers, bloodvines, dark trees, giant bloodworms, kruels, lashweed, nightshades, undead treants, vampiric wolves, venus weeds, and wicked leprechauns (every couple days, it rains blood in the forest to feed the plants that would need it to survive). In general, both plants/trees with leaves and those without (that look dead) are common throughout the forest.
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"Iriaebor is a fine city. So what if you can have violence between merchant groups break out at any moment. Not every city can offer dinner AND a show."
My FR writeups - http://www.mediafire.com/folder/um3liz6tqsf5n/Documents
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Arivia
Great Reader
Canada
2965 Posts |
Posted - 26 Apr 2020 : 17:03:00
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quote:
Originally posted by LordofBones
In case anyone's interested, here's what I have for Kanchy
KANCHELSIS
Lord of Vampires, the First Vampire, the Eternal Elder Vampire, the Beast, the Rake, Folly of the Seldarine
Intermediate Power of the Abyss
Domain Bat with glowing crimson eyes
Domain 487th/Mansion of the Rake or Lair of the Beast
Alignment Chaotic Evil
Aliases Maastracht
Superior none
Allies Abraxas, Afflux, Bhaal (dead), Cas, Evening Glory, Eshebala, Lolth, Malcanthet, Mellifleur, Nocticula, Syrul, Velsharoon
Foes Graz'zt, Lathander, Malar, Pelor, Pholtus, Rao, Selune, Sune, the Seldarine, Zura
Servants Memnul, Dagrobard, and Vonce (proxies); Union of Eclipses
Servitor Creatures bats (all types), blood amniotes, blood elementals, blood golems, bloodmote clouds, crypt chanters, nightshades, spectral lyrists, stirges, tanar'ri (blood fiends, cambions, chasme, incubi, shadow demons, succubi), vampires (all types), werebats, wolves (all types)
Manifestations a pale masculine hand wearing a silver, ruby-encrusted ring, a full-lipped man's mouth with piercing canines
Signs of Favour puddles or trails of bright red blood where there should be none (favour), black, brackish or clotted blood (disfavour)
Worshipers alchemists, vampires and their spawn, vampiric creatures, hedonists, the debauched, thrill-seekers, spellcasters (especially blood magi), those who revere the mystical properties of blood, evil half-elves, drow
Cleric Alignments CN, CE, NE
Specialty Priests unknown
Holy Days unknown
Portfolio blood, vampires, magic (especially blood magic), seduction, debauchery, the night
Domains Beguilement, Chaos, Charm, Corruption, Evil, Magic, Nobility, Night, Spell, Temptation, Trickery
Favored Weapon Sanguine, the Blade of the Vampire King (Rapier)
Pathfinder
Domains Chaos, Charm, Darkness, Evil, Magic, Nobility, Trickery
Subdomains Alchemy, Arcane, Aristocracy, Blood*, Captivation, Corruption, Deception, Demon, Fear, Lust, Night, Revelry
*Kanchelsis only offers the Blood subdomain of the War domain. Clerics of Kanchelsis cannot take use the Blood subdomain to qualify for anything that requires the War domain.
Ah, you ran into the same problem I did: when you adapt FR/D&D gods to Pathfinder, you have to throw out the domain/subdomain assignment rules because they have too many!
e: nice zura easter egg in there too! |
Edited by - Arivia on 26 Apr 2020 17:04:03 |
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TheIriaeban
Master of Realmslore
USA
1289 Posts |
Posted - 26 Apr 2020 : 20:07:45
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I am debating on how or if I should even include his back story in my write up. A couple ideas I have are:
1. Kanchelsis was actually the very first half-elf. Corellon saw this as a great thing and sponsored his elevation to godhood thinking he could have a pantheon of half-elven gods under him as well (in his arrogance, this seemed the proper way to have it). However, the other Seldarine didn't see him as an equal and this turned him into the Seldarine hating figure he is today. They realized their error too late and have decided to just not speak of the incident. This is why there isn't a pantheon of half-elven gods.
2. Araushnee was looking for a way to kill Corellon. Using Eilistraee to kill him was actually plan B. Plan A was to have a child that could do it since she didn't believe any of her current children could. So, she hooked up with Jergal and had Kanchelsis in secret. However, things change and she decided to go with plan B instead of waiting for Plan A. She knew that this meant that Kanchelsis was useless for her so she just dumped him by the side of the road with his favorite teddy bear. Jergal spotted him and decided to see just what he could do with him. That is why he has the portfolio he has AND likes neither the Seldarine or Dark Seldarine and the more elves he can "rescue" from their hypocracy the better. |
"Iriaebor is a fine city. So what if you can have violence between merchant groups break out at any moment. Not every city can offer dinner AND a show."
My FR writeups - http://www.mediafire.com/folder/um3liz6tqsf5n/Documents
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LordofBones
Master of Realmslore
1477 Posts |
Posted - 26 Apr 2020 : 23:17:40
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| Kanchy's current backstory is, well, kind of more awesome. Being a primordial monster born by accident is, well, kind of more cthonic then poor Corellon being blamed or another Lolthite creation. |
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TheIriaeban
Master of Realmslore
USA
1289 Posts |
Posted - 26 Apr 2020 : 23:50:29
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I wasn't sure how to explain that. Just mixing of blood doesn't do anything otherwise there would be millions of him running around (given how violent the Realms are). Also, I am trying to cover the "dreadful secret of the Seldarine" angle. Maybe spontaneous life from blood mingling from sacrifices on an evil alter but the Seldarine typically don't do live sacrifices. Hmmm, maybe an elven High Magic accident? They did the King Killer spell to control dragons. Maybe they tried the same thing with undead and it resulted in Kanchy? Maybe Corellon changed high magic after that so that it can have a cost to the caster to prevent it from happening again?
Edit: I think I have it. I remembered a quote from Bram Stoker's Dracula: "I shall rise from my own death, to avenge hers with all the powers of darkness." That gave me one heck of an idea. |
"Iriaebor is a fine city. So what if you can have violence between merchant groups break out at any moment. Not every city can offer dinner AND a show."
My FR writeups - http://www.mediafire.com/folder/um3liz6tqsf5n/Documents
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Edited by - TheIriaeban on 27 Apr 2020 03:02:18 |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36779 Posts |
Posted - 27 Apr 2020 : 05:11:08
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Maybe Kanchelsis was a lost deity... Born a member of the Seldarine, while still quite young he fell into the hands of some bestial power, who warped the young deity into his own image. Kanchelsis eventually was able to escape and return to the Seldarine, but they were horrified by his now bestial aspect. Feeling betrayed, he turned away, making his own way in the multiverse.
He does his best to act refined and civilized, as a way of showing the Seldarine they were wrong -- but the Beast he was shaped into is always lurking... |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
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I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen! |
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sleyvas
Skilled Spell Strategist
USA
11700 Posts |
Posted - 27 Apr 2020 : 12:06:21
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| If he has no priesthood, then he would make a good patron for warlocks tied to either the fey OR the undying (from SCAG). It might be interesting if he could have both types of warlocks. The Undying get spare the dying, and it might be interesting if they do so by giving someone a pinprick of their own blood. Granted it sounds like you guys are looking into 3.5e or pathfinder rulesets, but... |
Alavairthae, may your skill prevail
Phillip aka Sleyvas |
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LordofBones
Master of Realmslore
1477 Posts |
Posted - 28 Apr 2020 : 13:45:39
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quote:
Originally posted by Arivia
quote:
Originally posted by LordofBones
In case anyone's interested, here's what I have for Kanchy
KANCHELSIS
Lord of Vampires, the First Vampire, the Eternal Elder Vampire, the Beast, the Rake, Folly of the Seldarine
Intermediate Power of the Abyss
Domain Bat with glowing crimson eyes
Domain 487th/Mansion of the Rake or Lair of the Beast
Alignment Chaotic Evil
Aliases Maastracht
Superior none
Allies Abraxas, Afflux, Bhaal (dead), Cas, Evening Glory, Eshebala, Lolth, Malcanthet, Mellifleur, Nocticula, Syrul, Velsharoon
Foes Graz'zt, Lathander, Malar, Pelor, Pholtus, Rao, Selune, Sune, the Seldarine, Zura
Servants Memnul, Dagrobard, and Vonce (proxies); Union of Eclipses
Servitor Creatures bats (all types), blood amniotes, blood elementals, blood golems, bloodmote clouds, crypt chanters, nightshades, spectral lyrists, stirges, tanar'ri (blood fiends, cambions, chasme, incubi, shadow demons, succubi), vampires (all types), werebats, wolves (all types)
Manifestations a pale masculine hand wearing a silver, ruby-encrusted ring, a full-lipped man's mouth with piercing canines
Signs of Favour puddles or trails of bright red blood where there should be none (favour), black, brackish or clotted blood (disfavour)
Worshipers alchemists, vampires and their spawn, vampiric creatures, hedonists, the debauched, thrill-seekers, spellcasters (especially blood magi), those who revere the mystical properties of blood, evil half-elves, drow
Cleric Alignments CN, CE, NE
Specialty Priests unknown
Holy Days unknown
Portfolio blood, vampires, magic (especially blood magic), seduction, debauchery, the night
Domains Beguilement, Chaos, Charm, Corruption, Evil, Magic, Nobility, Night, Spell, Temptation, Trickery
Favored Weapon Sanguine, the Blade of the Vampire King (Rapier)
Pathfinder
Domains Chaos, Charm, Darkness, Evil, Magic, Nobility, Trickery
Subdomains Alchemy, Arcane, Aristocracy, Blood*, Captivation, Corruption, Deception, Demon, Fear, Lust, Night, Revelry
*Kanchelsis only offers the Blood subdomain of the War domain. Clerics of Kanchelsis cannot take use the Blood subdomain to qualify for anything that requires the War domain.
Ah, you ran into the same problem I did: when you adapt FR/D&D gods to Pathfinder, you have to throw out the domain/subdomain assignment rules because they have too many!
e: nice zura easter egg in there too!
Yeah, I figure that Kanchy would hate Zura. He's a refined aristocrat, while she's a slavering beast and everything he preaches against. Kanchy's followers tend to stick to urban areas and centers of civilization, while Zura's are relegated to the moors and forests. Kanchy's true form is a nobleman, Zura's is (Wo)Man-Bat. Kanchy sips from goblets, Zura tears out your throat. Kanchy does not drink 'vine', Zura guzzles it down (the heathen!) |
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TheIriaeban
Master of Realmslore
USA
1289 Posts |
Posted - 28 Apr 2020 : 21:59:25
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Ok, I think I have come up with something for the "born of mingled blood" and the "dreadful secret of the Seldarine". This is a sidebar for Kanchy's entry.
The Shame of the Seldarine
Ages ago, when the general mistrust between humans and elves had mostly been discarded, the half-elf first appeared and then proved to be both hearty and fertile. Many of the elves did not like this mingling of races and looked to their gods for guidance but the Seldarine were silent on the subject. With no divine input, some of the elves decided they needed to address this dilution of elven blood.
Individuals and small groups scattered among the elves tried to “purify” their communities but only had a limited success. There were enough elves that supported (or at least didn’t care enough to oppose) the half-elves that over the centuries they gained more acceptance and grew in numbers. Some of the elves concerned with keeping the elves racially pure realized they were fighting something that could not be stopped and afterwards just kept their opinions to themselves. However, a smaller, core group grew in their convictions and decided to look to magic for a solution.
It took years of research but two high mages came up with a ritual to deal once and for all with half-elves: Uluuth’Tel’Quessir or Cleansing the People. The ritual would remove all half-elves and make it so that elves and humans would not be fertile together. To perform the ritual, it would require two high mages and the support of thirty more regular mages as well as the sacrifice of a half-elf child and thirty-four each of elven males and human females. It took a handful more years to get elven sacrificial volunteers and the number of mages needed who were sympathetic to the cause.
The day soon came where these elves could finally remove the abominations in their midst. They started the ritual which drew all the blood out of the bodies of the sixty-four adult sacrifices and combined it into a large sphere of blood in the center of the circle. Seeing this, the half-elf child cried out to the Seldarine for help but there was no response. Confident of their success, the two high mages turned to their final sacrifice to complete the ritual and in doing so did not see the sphere of blood reshape itself into a vaguely humanoid shape.
Unknown to the high mages, their high magic ritual had drifted into the realm of blood magic. So, when they attempted to complete their ritual, the only result was the birth of a new divine being born of blood and anger. The first act of this new being was to consume the blood of the assembled mages.
Thus, the Shame of the Seldarine was realized that day: not a single one of them raised a hand to help (even to help a child). Afterwards, the Seldarine privately pledged to protect the half-elven from these attitudes but even gods forget after a time. Elves, it seems, only buried these feelings and they have come to rise in some as the Eldreth Vluuthra.
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"Iriaebor is a fine city. So what if you can have violence between merchant groups break out at any moment. Not every city can offer dinner AND a show."
My FR writeups - http://www.mediafire.com/folder/um3liz6tqsf5n/Documents
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sleyvas
Skilled Spell Strategist
USA
11700 Posts |
Posted - 29 Apr 2020 : 14:55:09
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| I like that storyline. I'd add one thing personally. He cried out to the Seldarine and received no response. He then cried out to an anti-Seldarine god, Kiaransalee, for vengeance in exchange for his service. His vengeance was granted when the goddess twisted the High Magic Ritual with a hint of blood magic. Kanchelsis was born as a god by absorbing the combined power of all of these High Mages, along with all of their memories and hate for lesser beings. Although Kanchelsis himself appears often as a rake, it is this hateful side which created "the beast" aspect of him. That "beast" aspect is exceptionally hairy, tousle headed human with talons... so perhaps the High Magic ritual wasn't going to kill the "half-elves" but rather make it such that such unions produce beings that are more neanderthalic…. almost disgustingly orc-like.... or given the beast's ties to wolves, decidedly gnoll like. Which this makes me also kind of think about the origins of the Lythari (the elves that shapechange into wolves). |
Alavairthae, may your skill prevail
Phillip aka Sleyvas |
Edited by - sleyvas on 29 Apr 2020 15:08:18 |
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TheIriaeban
Master of Realmslore
USA
1289 Posts |
Posted - 29 Apr 2020 : 15:30:38
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| I had more but Word was looking like it didn't like multipage sidebars. I am going to add the part about when he drinks someone's blood, he gets access to their memories ("Blood is lives") in the main part of the write up. I also had it that the half-elf child IS Kanchelsis. When the two high mages stabbed him with two mithril daggers, the "blood being" flew into and was absorbed by the child and brought him back to life. I was also thinking that those two mithril daggers are going to be his weapons of choice. |
"Iriaebor is a fine city. So what if you can have violence between merchant groups break out at any moment. Not every city can offer dinner AND a show."
My FR writeups - http://www.mediafire.com/folder/um3liz6tqsf5n/Documents
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sleyvas
Skilled Spell Strategist
USA
11700 Posts |
Posted - 29 Apr 2020 : 17:34:15
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quote:
Originally posted by TheIriaeban
I had more but Word was looking like it didn't like multipage sidebars. I am going to add the part about when he drinks someone's blood, he gets access to their memories ("Blood is lives") in the main part of the write up. I also had it that the half-elf child IS Kanchelsis. When the two high mages stabbed him with two mithril daggers, the "blood being" flew into and was absorbed by the child and brought him back to life. I was also thinking that those two mithril daggers are going to be his weapons of choice.
Yeah, I should have said "reborn as a god" instead of "born as a god". Also, in the process of the ritual, perhaps it was aging him, because I just don't picture him AS a child. It also occurs to me that perhaps in my thing above where he calls out to Kiaransalee for vengeance, it could ALSO be the Raven Queen instead. Also, the "blood being" should represent the beast aspect that he canonically has, and maybe something like a vestige, as he transformed he shared his body with this being. Thus why he has two forms. |
Alavairthae, may your skill prevail
Phillip aka Sleyvas |
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Kanchelsis: God of the Undead?
