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Ayrik
Great Reader
Canada
7970 Posts |
 Posted - 25 Dec 2010 : 04:52:14
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I was under the impression that the quality of the steel was as important as the smithing itself. Smiths used to obtain the purest iron available, forging and working it to remove impurities while (unknowingly) introducing controlled carbon content into the steel alloy in the process. As opposed to the today's method of intentionally mixing measured quantities of refined impurities into refined iron to engineer steel alloys which meet desired specifications.
I've learned that Leufta was one of the "Swedish oregrounds", which produced iron ores consistently containing variable amounts of Vanadium, Manganese, Strontium, Tungsten, Cobalt, Nickel, and Chromium - the exact "impurities" today's industry uses to produce some of the hardest, toughest, most resilient, and corrosion resistant steel alloys. The legendary Damascus steel (alloys) also contained similar concentrations of similar impurities, and the "secret" method of refining Wootz steel was replicated by 18th century crucible forging. Sheffield Steel was, by the late 18th century, more of a "vendor" and supplier of fine steels; they were originally more interested in steel which could be used to produce accurate clocksprings, though they could provide superior steel grades for swords, guns, armour, and machinery. Bessemer "mild" steel was much cheaper and more widely available (and still in use today), but generally recognized as inferior for these sorts of critical craft-intensive applications.
Although metalsmiths didn't have our understanding of chemical metallurgy they could certainly recognize "good" steel. It's no accident that the finest bladesmiths studied and experimented endlessly to determine which steels and which methods produced the best swords. Today we have access to custom-designed superalloys (which can even contain ceramic and synthetic components), the ability to melt and join any kind of metal, and machine tools which can do anything flawlessly - we could easily produce sword metals superior to anything seen in past times - but we don't have wide access to craftsmen who know the "lost" lore of swordsmithing. There are a few modern bladesmiths who dedicate themselves to the craft, though there is also a saturation of factories mass-producing "junk" swords for armies of consumers. |
[/Ayrik] |
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Ayrik
Great Reader
Canada
7970 Posts |
Posted - 25 Dec 2010 : 07:43:58
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Here's my own (not entirely D&D) stupid question:
Some years ago one of my nerd pals was playing a long-forgotten single-player computer RPG. Perhaps Nox or Darkstone or something else from that era. I saw him fighting a pack of (BBEG?) monsters which looked something like this or this or this, but these were fearsomely corporeal undead/lichy/banshee monsters ... I remember being greatly impressed with the originality of the concept and the quality of the 3D models (and greatly amused by my friend's suffering at their operatic savagery), though I cannot remember what the game was called or anything else about them. I want to use the creature type (and some screenshots of the artwork) in a player handout - the horrible new undead threat at Valhingen Graveyard in Phlan - but I cannot ask the player for details. Does anybody know what this computer game was called? |
[/Ayrik] |
Edited by - Ayrik on 25 Dec 2010 07:53:14 |
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Alystra Illianniis
Great Reader
USA
3750 Posts |
Posted - 25 Dec 2010 : 08:10:46
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quote:
[i]Originally posted by Arik[i]
we don't have wide access to craftsmen who know the "lost" lore of swordsmithing. There are a few modern bladesmiths who dedicate themselves to the craft
Aye! Indeed, I should add that Daniel Watson is one of the few who still uses traditional forging methods for many of his blades. He also uses modern methods for some, and has developed techniques combining both for some of his specialty blades. I've personally bought two blades from his forge, and not been disappointed with either of them. (Although I was slightly surprised to discover by accident that the aforementioned stiletto was in fact, silver all the way through... Oops, was the first reaction I had on learning this. When he said it was pure sterling silver, I did not realize he meant it LITERALLY!)
Um, Parasite Eve? That's the only thing I can think of.... |
The Goddess is alive, and magic is afoot.
"Where Science ends, Magic begins" -Spiral, Uncanny X-Men #491
"You idiots! You've captured their STUNT doubles!" -Spaceballs
Lothir's character background/stats: http://forum.candlekeep.com/pop_profile.asp?mode=display&id=5469
My stories:
http://z3.invisionfree.com/Mickeys_Comic_Tavern/index.php?showforum=188
Lothir, courtesy of Sylinde (Deviant Art)/Luaxena (Chosen of Eilistraee)
http://sylinde.deviantart.com/#/d2z6e4u |
Edited by - Alystra Illianniis on 25 Dec 2010 08:14:55 |
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Ayrik
Great Reader
Canada
7970 Posts |
Posted - 25 Dec 2010 : 09:45:58
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| Judging by the screenshots, Parasite Eve is not the game (although she's got great legs). I remember this game had a third-person camera, sort of like Diablo or Dungeon Siege, I'm pretty sure it was medieval and involved hack-n-slash instead of gunfire. |
[/Ayrik] |
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Alystra Illianniis
Great Reader
USA
3750 Posts |
Posted - 26 Dec 2010 : 01:34:49
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Well, sorry- it was the only one I could think of with an opera singer in it.
And now for another question. Does anyone know the actual name (if any) of the Illithid community that was featured in Exile? I looked in the 3.5 Underdark source-book, as well as the map included in Exile, and I can't find a name for it. It's just labeled as "the Illithid cavern" in Exile, and the only Mindflayer community anywhere NEAR Menzo mentioned in Underdark was Ch'Chitl, which is too far away to be it. |
The Goddess is alive, and magic is afoot.
"Where Science ends, Magic begins" -Spiral, Uncanny X-Men #491
"You idiots! You've captured their STUNT doubles!" -Spaceballs
Lothir's character background/stats: http://forum.candlekeep.com/pop_profile.asp?mode=display&id=5469
My stories:
http://z3.invisionfree.com/Mickeys_Comic_Tavern/index.php?showforum=188
Lothir, courtesy of Sylinde (Deviant Art)/Luaxena (Chosen of Eilistraee)
http://sylinde.deviantart.com/#/d2z6e4u |
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Lady Kazandra
Senior Scribe
Australia
921 Posts |
Posted - 26 Dec 2010 : 02:17:42
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quote:
Originally posted by Alystra Illianniis
Well, sorry- it was the only one I could think of with an opera singer in it.
And now for another question. Does anyone know the actual name (if any) of the Illithid community that was featured in Exile? I looked in the 3.5 Underdark source-book, as well as the map included in Exile, and I can't find a name for it. It's just labeled as "the Illithid cavern" in Exile, and the only Mindflayer community anywhere NEAR Menzo mentioned in Underdark was Ch'Chitl, which is too far away to be it.
I vaguely recall a discussion about this one the WOTC boards. I *think* it may have been created for the novel. But I'm not 100% sure on that. |
"Once upon a time the plural of 'wizard' was 'war'." -- The Last Continent, by Terry Pratchett |
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Alystra Illianniis
Great Reader
USA
3750 Posts |
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Lady Kazandra
Senior Scribe
Australia
921 Posts |
Posted - 26 Dec 2010 : 02:49:31
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quote:
Originally posted by Alystra Illianniis
Urggg. I suspected it was, but was hoping that there might be a name for it somewhere.
If you like, I can probably check Sage's archives? As I'm sure he's likely saved that discussion for reasons only he can fathom.  |
"Once upon a time the plural of 'wizard' was 'war'." -- The Last Continent, by Terry Pratchett |
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Alystra Illianniis
Great Reader
USA
3750 Posts |
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Sill Alias
Senior Scribe
Kazakhstan
588 Posts |
Posted - 26 Dec 2010 : 07:02:46
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Somehow I got this question.
It does not sit well in me that clerics of Eilistraee burn the bodies of their enemies as the offering to Her. Isn't it the same as sacrificing? |
You can hear many tales from many mouths. The most difficult is to know which of them are not lies. - Sill Alias
"May your harp be unstrung, your dreams die and all your songs be unsung." - curse of the harper, The Code of the Harpers 2 ed.
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Ayrik
Great Reader
Canada
7970 Posts |
Posted - 26 Dec 2010 : 11:43:36
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| It seems like a sacrifice to me. But fire also has symbolic associations with cleansing, purification, destruction, and change. Then again, in D&D it's not a bad idea to burn the bodies of slain enemies to make it impossible for them to exact their living or unliving revenge against you. |
[/Ayrik] |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36779 Posts |
Posted - 26 Dec 2010 : 15:51:39
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quote:
Originally posted by Sill Alias
Somehow I got this question.
It does not sit well in me that clerics of Eilistraee burn the bodies of their enemies as the offering to Her. Isn't it the same as sacrificing?
It depends on how it's done. If you kill the enemy purely for the benefit of burning it, then that would be a sacrifice. If you're simply disposing of the remains of enemies that you killed while defending yourself and/or had to slay to advance one of Eilistraee's goals, then that's a different story. |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen! |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31701 Posts |
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Alystra Illianniis
Great Reader
USA
3750 Posts |
Posted - 27 Dec 2010 : 03:21:19
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| I think it falls under the umbrella of "honoring the slain", be they one's own or the enemy. And I agree that it might also have purifying significances, as well. And as Wooly said, it is always a good idea to dispose of bodies to prevent them from being animated or simply to prevent diseases from being carried by the rotting corpses. Sage, do you happen to have the info from that discussion Lady K mentioned? I'm doing an excursion to Menzo campaign on another site, and wanted to send the players past the Illithid colony mentioned in Exile- but I can't seem to find a name for it anywhere. |
The Goddess is alive, and magic is afoot.
"Where Science ends, Magic begins" -Spiral, Uncanny X-Men #491
"You idiots! You've captured their STUNT doubles!" -Spaceballs
Lothir's character background/stats: http://forum.candlekeep.com/pop_profile.asp?mode=display&id=5469
My stories:
http://z3.invisionfree.com/Mickeys_Comic_Tavern/index.php?showforum=188
Lothir, courtesy of Sylinde (Deviant Art)/Luaxena (Chosen of Eilistraee)
http://sylinde.deviantart.com/#/d2z6e4u |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31701 Posts |
Posted - 27 Dec 2010 : 03:37:54
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quote:
Originally posted by Alystra Illianniis
Sage, do you happen to have the info from that discussion Lady K mentioned? I'm doing an excursion to Menzo campaign on another site, and wanted to send the players past the Illithid colony mentioned in Exile- but I can't seem to find a name for it anywhere.
I knew she was looking through the archives, but I didn't know for what. Now that I know, I'll take a look myself.  |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)
"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood
Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage |
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Alystra Illianniis
Great Reader
USA
3750 Posts |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36779 Posts |
Posted - 27 Dec 2010 : 03:56:17
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quote:
Originally posted by Alystra Illianniis
And as Wooly said, it is always a good idea to dispose of bodies to prevent them from being animated or simply to prevent diseases from being carried by the rotting corpses.
That was Arik, actually. My stance is whether or not it's sacrifice depends on why the enemies were slain. |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen! |
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Alystra Illianniis
Great Reader
USA
3750 Posts |
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Lily M Green
Learned Scribe
Australia
115 Posts |
Posted - 31 Dec 2010 : 20:40:38
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This is by far my favourite scroll, mostly because I can ask my N00b questions with impunity. As such I'm going to ask one now.
In simple terms, could someone far brighter than I please explain to me how Lawful Evil works (other than manipulating the law to suit ones own nefarious ends) and how gods like Helm (I'm still in 3.5 here) can have realistically have followers of that alignment. I understand this one degree either side of alignment in theory but I can't grasp how it might work in reality given that much of his representation on the material plane leans towards good, and his residence is located in the House of the Triad which is a place that embodies the principles of lawfulness & good. (in my limited understanding).
Thank ye and a happy new year to you all.
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Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons, for you are crunchy, and taste good with ketchup.
A Dark Alliance - Beyond Baldur's Gate |
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Ayrik
Great Reader
Canada
7970 Posts |
Posted - 31 Dec 2010 : 20:59:09
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Ah. Lawful Evil. An area of special study for me.  <mwoohaahaahaaa!>
This wiki article explains LE a little. Are you having a particular situation or character which needs a LE context, Lily? A specific example might help you grasp the concept better than a pile of dusty scrolls.
In summary: LE is a mixture of Lawful (acknowledging rules, order, structure, and group hierarchies) and Evil (doing whatever you want, without any moral compass or any regard for others beyond their usefulness to you). LE characters will act evilly, selfishly, but within the framework of the rules - of course they will also manipulate the rules/laws to serve their best interests and (if they're evil enough) won't particularly mind breaking the rules so long as they can (wrongfully) gain from it and the risks (or consequences) of getting caught aren't significant. LE is the alignment of choice for tyrants; they are evil, they impose totalitarian order upon their underlings (usually through decreeing severe laws and punishments), and they have their rules enforced with an iron fist. The Nazi government of WWII would be an example of LE government (under a tyrant, or circle of tyrants) in our world; Zhentil Keep would be an example of LE government in the Realms. The strong take what is rightfully theirs away from the weak, using the strength of the laws/traditions/structure (ie: the strength of the group) to justify their claim.
To clarify: NE is just Evil, pure and unadulterated, without any regard at all for Law or Chaos. CE is also Evil, but Chaotic here means emphasis on the individual rather than on the group, rules are meaningless because the strong take from the weak and no justification is needed (the strong can do whatever they want and bully the weak into submission, they might decree "laws" but such are of no consequence since they depend entirely upon the strong remaining in a position of strength). |
[/Ayrik] |
Edited by - Ayrik on 31 Dec 2010 22:21:57 |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36779 Posts |
Posted - 01 Jan 2011 : 03:45:09
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quote:
Originally posted by Arik
To clarify: NE is just Evil, pure and unadulterated, without any regard at all for Law or Chaos. CE is also Evil, but Chaotic here means emphasis on the individual rather than on the group, rules are meaningless because the strong take from the weak and no justification is needed (the strong can do whatever they want and bully the weak into submission, they might decree "laws" but such are of no consequence since they depend entirely upon the strong remaining in a position of strength).
I see the neutral alignments, such as NE, differently. In my mind, it's not that they have no regard for Law or Chaos -- it's more of a situational thing. In situation A, they favor a lawful approach. In situation B, they prefer the chaotic approach.
I see the neutral alignments as not ignoring law and chaos, but instead realizing there is a time and place for both of them. |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen! |
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Alystra Illianniis
Great Reader
USA
3750 Posts |
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Ayrik
Great Reader
Canada
7970 Posts |
Posted - 01 Jan 2011 : 07:41:37
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I think stupid city guards would be perplexed by me stating my alignment is "Pragmatic Neutral". While smarter city guards wouldn't let me step past the gate - because in their mind my "above the law" and "self-serving" pragmatism would be perceived as something of a disruptive (Chaotic) influence, or a selfishly ambitious/inconsiderate (Evil) influence, or both.
I think the qualities of pragmatic outlook are independent of alignment: one could be Good or Evil, Lawful or Chaotic, or any combination, or none, and still be entirely (or not at all) pragmatic. Even archons, baatezu, tanar'ri, and giths (and perhaps also modrons) are sometimes forced to make pragmatic decisions which involve tradeoffs and sacrifices.
Besides, pragmatic itself is a rubbery word which is difficult to nail under a concrete universal definition. Optimists see the glass is half full; pessimists see the glass is half empty; engineers see the glass is twice as big as it needs to be. |
[/Ayrik] |
Edited by - Ayrik on 01 Jan 2011 07:51:08 |
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Diffan
Great Reader
USA
4430 Posts |
Posted - 01 Jan 2011 : 13:08:38
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quote:
Originally posted by Arik
Some years ago one of my nerd pals was playing a long-forgotten single-player computer RPG. Perhaps Nox or Darkstone or something else from that era. I saw him fighting a pack of (BBEG?) monsters which looked something like this or this or this, but these were fearsomely corporeal undead/lichy/banshee monsters ... I remember being greatly impressed with the originality of the concept and the quality of the 3D models (and greatly amused by my friend's suffering at their operatic savagery), though I cannot remember what the game was called or anything else about them. I want to use the creature type (and some screenshots of the artwork) in a player handout - the horrible new undead threat at Valhingen Graveyard in Phlan - but I cannot ask the player for details. Does anybody know what this computer game was called?
For a quick second, I was reminded of this fun game I played on the original X-Box called Darkwatch who had these Banshee screaming bad-girls seen Here |
Edited by - Diffan on 01 Jan 2011 13:21:22 |
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Ayrik
Great Reader
Canada
7970 Posts |
Posted - 01 Jan 2011 : 20:03:21
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| Thanx, Diff ... not Darkwatch. Definitely a PC game. |
[/Ayrik] |
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Arielis
Acolyte
Canada
13 Posts |
Posted - 02 Jan 2011 : 00:52:19
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I have my own silly question that didn't fit into my thread, so I thought I'd try it out here.
I remember reading a quote about a female dragon commenting on humans and their insistence to cover their body with clothes. In fact the elves do as well.
Well I've done an entire essay thanks to St Augustine about why WE do it, but what's Forgotten Realm's reason for it?! |
'If you can't be good, be lucky!' |
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Alystra Illianniis
Great Reader
USA
3750 Posts |
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Ayrik
Great Reader
Canada
7970 Posts |
Posted - 02 Jan 2011 : 06:43:43
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Why do people insist on wearing clothes in Forgotten Realms?
I think it's largely because the Realms and most other D&D settings are loosely based largely on medieval European history, in which people certainly (almost) always wore clothes if the paintings and records are to be believed. Other medieval cultures ranging across our entire world also used clothing, as did most ancient cultures and even isolated cultures. The reasons humans wear clothes involve protection from the elements, religious doctrine, observance of laws or traditions, basic propriety, displaying wealth and social status, or vanity and enjoyment.
Ancient Celtic and Spartan warriors fought while completely nude. Barbarians and many modern primitive people only wear clothing which serves functional purposes (loinclothes, belts, footwear, etc). People in California tend to wear little (maybe just an iPod and bikini/speedo) while Russians tend to wear winter parkas and furry caps.
Also - Forgotten Realms is a D&D product. This means it's intended to be suitable for young audiences (and parents of the same). D&D suffered a lot of infamy and poor public image in the first decades, yet it would've been far worse if it depicted people all running around naked. A number of early D&D products were withheld or altered to censor artwork that was (at the time) considered quite lurid and erotic. More recent D&D publications have maintained the policy of generally avoiding content which is controversial or inappropriate for youth. |
[/Ayrik] |
Edited by - Ayrik on 02 Jan 2011 06:51:25 |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36779 Posts |
Posted - 02 Jan 2011 : 14:18:51
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quote:
Originally posted by Arik
The reasons humans wear clothes involve protection from the elements, religious doctrine, observance of laws or traditions, basic propriety, displaying wealth and social status, or vanity and enjoyment.
I'd add protection from stuff other than the elements, too. If you're outside a lot, clothing is going to help protect you from sunburn and/or protect your skin from thorns and such. If you work indoors, there's any number of minor hazards that even a single layer of cloth will protect against. |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen! |
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Arielis
Acolyte
Canada
13 Posts |
Posted - 02 Jan 2011 : 14:56:54
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Aw boo!
Well that's all pretty logical. It's too bad that Forgotten Realms didn't come up with some sort of lore as to why they 'really' do it.
Like circumcision, thought to have originally been done because the people were desert nomadic tribes (aka sand!). But we only know the tale between Abraham, his son and god.
Well thanks guys! That all makes perfect sense. |
'If you can't be good, be lucky!' |
Edited by - Arielis on 02 Jan 2011 20:14:58 |
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Stupid question time...
