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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31701 Posts |
 Posted - 22 Jul 2008 : 03:24:38
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quote:
Originally posted by Kuje
But, it seems that the last Lost Chronicles novel might actually be published after all, for those of us who care and were disappointed that it was canceled. However, that book was canceled because of a whole different reason.
Indeed. The release of Dragons of the Hourglass Mage has now been confirmed. |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)
"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood
Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage |
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RodOdom
Senior Scribe
USA
509 Posts |
Posted - 22 Jul 2008 : 06:59:14
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| Publishers lining up to license? Drizzt, certainly. The other stuff, including Ed's characters (which I love), no. |
Edited by - RodOdom on 22 Jul 2008 06:59:33 |
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Alaundo
Head Moderator
United Kingdom
5692 Posts |
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Rosemary Jones
Forgotten Realms Author
USA
148 Posts |
Posted - 27 Jul 2008 : 12:14:43
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Let's remember that the writer is always the last to know (or at least in my case, because I've been off in a fog for the last few months), but what I'm taking away from the press release is that FR line is supporting D&D and thus will be one of the lines that continues. And I'm making that assumption from the paragraph about Mirrorstone continuing its FR kids books while pulling back on other titles.
The Discovery line was a very interesting experiment in dark fantasy fiction. And it really was fantastic that WOTC was willing to open themselves up to new writers that way. But it is not unusual for a publisher to experiment with a line like that and then drop it after a year or so. You should hear my friends who write for Harlequin constantly grumble about line changes. Just goes with the territory of publishing -- always a competitive business with very narrow profit margins.
Or as another publisher friend tells me, "If you want to make a SMALL fortune in publishing, then start with a LARGE fortune to invest."
Again, my personal assumption and hope is that as long as the FR line continues to sell, WOTC will continue to publish. Which is why I make a point of voting with my dollars for the authors that I like.
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Rosemary Jones
www.rosemaryjones.com |
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RodOdom
Senior Scribe
USA
509 Posts |
Posted - 27 Jul 2008 : 12:54:55
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"I'm not sure what WotC are actually stating here."
And it's obvious they don't want us to be sure. My prediction is that they'll continue with Drizzt, shelve FR, DL, and Eberron, and replace them with a "D&D" branded series. They'll have new stories take place in those settings, with main characters hopping between worlds. It will be the "Magic" model, where settings are a seasonal sort of marketing gimmick rather than an integral part of the game.
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Edited by - RodOdom on 27 Jul 2008 12:57:52 |
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Richard Lee Byers
Forgotten Realms Author
USA
1814 Posts |
Posted - 27 Jul 2008 : 13:46:51
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| As I mentioned previously, I am under contract to do a new FR trilogy, and it hasn't been cancelled. The same is true of Paul Kemp. From this I would infer that FR fiction is seen as supportive of D&D and is not going away. |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31701 Posts |
Posted - 27 Jul 2008 : 13:50:26
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quote:
Originally posted by Alaundo
If EB and DL novels are cancelled as they don't support the D&D product directly, then surely FR falls into that category as well. Are we to see an end to all campaign-specific novels in favour of D&D core novels?
Not necessarily. The FRCG is, as I recall, now referenced as a D&D campaign setting supplement... so it supports the core D&D system. Which may mean the same for FR fiction as well.
And I don't think the DL novels have been cancelled. If you read the announcement I posted above back on the 22nd, you'll note that Dragons of the Hourglass Mage is scheduled for a summer '09 release. |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)
"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood
Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage |
Edited by - The Sage on 27 Jul 2008 13:51:51 |
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JamesLowder
Forgotten Realms Author & Game Designer
USA
310 Posts |
Posted - 27 Jul 2008 : 16:10:02
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Some Dragonlance novels have been canceled, as have some Eberron novels and, I believe, some Ravenloft novels, all books that were slated for 2009. We'll have to see if Realms novels eventually get cut.
There is one thing to take away from the press release--the company has now made an explicit statement that books are considered game support. This was suggested a couple years back when the book division was dissolved and the fiction editors were moved under the game R&D management structure. This impacts how the books are scheduled, how they are edited, how they are advertised, their entire identity within the company.
Cheers,
Jim Lowder
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31701 Posts |
Posted - 27 Jul 2008 : 16:19:44
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quote:
Originally posted by JamesLowder
Some Dragonlance novels have been canceled...
Aye. I'll note that I was actually suggesting that the entire line of DL novels had not been cancelled.
As we discussed earlier in this scroll, some of the novels of the "Tracy Hickman Presents" series have now been cancelled.
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Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)
"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood
Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage |
Edited by - The Sage on 27 Jul 2008 16:21:20 |
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The Red Walker
Great Reader
USA
3563 Posts |
Posted - 27 Jul 2008 : 16:52:47
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Wotc statement could almost be interpreted so it is possible FR will be the D&D core.
Just have to wait and see |
A little nonsense now and then, relished by the wisest men - Willy Wonka
"We need men who can dream of things that never were." -
John F. Kennedy, speech in Dublin, Ireland, June 28, 1963
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Darth_Azalin
Acolyte
26 Posts |
Posted - 27 Jul 2008 : 18:13:14
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With any hope maybe Hasbro/WoTC will do what LA did with Star Wars and let writers write in any of the 6 time lines.
I still think there is much to write about in pre-spellplague that has yet to be fleshed out.
I also would love another Azalin and Strahd book. Asmodeus, Graz'zt, etc to get some love as well. |
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Rinonalyrna Fathomlin
Great Reader
USA
7106 Posts |
Posted - 28 Jul 2008 : 00:39:30
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quote:
Originally posted by RodOdom
And it's obvious they don't want us to be sure.
LOL, agreed.
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"Instead of asking why we sleep, it might make sense to ask why we wake. Perchance we live to dream. From that perspective, the sea of troubles we navigate in the workaday world might be the price we pay for admission to another night in the world of dreams."
--Richard Greene (letter to Time) |
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Erik Scott de Bie
Forgotten Realms Author
USA
4598 Posts |
Posted - 29 Jul 2008 : 04:47:18
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My interpretation of that press release is just to say that they're discontinuing Discoveries, as it is in no-way-shape-or-form related to D&D or Magic.
I see nothing to indicate that they are redefining DL or Ravenloft as non-D&D supportive or the like . . . my suspicion is that the orders came down from on-high, at the end of a business quarter (which was when the cancellations were made), and they included discontinuing the entire Discoveries line and axing a few novels in other lines.
I've yet to see any Realms fiction affected and don't expect to. There's also a difference between "core" as they mean it here and "core" as it applies to the game. Here, they mean "main," as in their main brands--Magic (and its worlds) and D&D (and its worlds). In gaming lingo, "core" might mean base-setting for D&D products, but that isn't necessarily what they mean here.
Just my interpretation! 
Cheers |
Erik Scott de Bie
'Tis easier to destroy than to create.
Author of a number of Realms novels (GHOSTWALKER, DEPTHS OF MADNESS, and the SHADOWBANE series), contributor to the NEVERWINTER CAMPAIGN GUIDE and SHADOWFELL: GLOOMWROUGHT AND BEYOND, Twitch DM of the Dungeon Scrawlers, currently playing "The Westgate Irregulars" |
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wwwwwww
Learned Scribe
116 Posts |
Posted - 29 Jul 2008 : 12:34:11
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quote:
Originally posted by JamesLowder
Coupled with the shared-world cuts, it's more of a red flag for the health of all the book lines, but the cancellations of even some of the Eberron and other shared world books are, again, not a surprise. The company recently dropped a large number of older books--including Realms titles--out of print. Part of the whole 4E marketing plan seems to be to simplify the lines, so this all seems to play into that. Fewer books. Marketing focused on a few authors.
Here’s my gut feeling on the situation.
FR will become the core setting of D&D, and we’ll still see novels the with FR logo at the top, but it won’t be the FR we know and love. They’ve created a new setting, but kept a few iconic FR locations and characters (Waterdeep, Elminster, etc.) as if to say “See, it’s still the realms.” Seriously, look at the series of novels entitled, “Ed Greenwood Presents Waterdeep.” It reeks of an attempt to convince hardcore fans to stay. But, I have a feeling that there’s very little we’ll recognize about the new FR.
If they had just cancelled the series entirely, and started a generic setting as the core of D&D, it would have been far better. That way, FR could always be picked up again at a later time. Instead, they’ve destroyed what took years, and many hands, to develop. All because of the concept that a simpler, less developed setting will make more money if it carries the FR name. Ridiculous. They’ve sold out their past writers, sold out their hardcore fans, and they expect us to blindly purchase whatever they spit out because “it’s still FR . . . in name anyway.”
That’s what I fear will happen . . . |
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monknwildcat
Learned Scribe
USA
285 Posts |
Posted - 29 Jul 2008 : 14:39:59
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I'm confused by something *else* in Alaundo's link to the WOTC press release.
The release mentions a new FR Stone of Tymora trilogy for young adults, as if the main FR novels are no longer for young adults. Am I misinterpreting, or are the main FR novels no longer categorized as young adult fiction?
Since this thread's a bit of an author magnet, I figured I'd post the question here.  |
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Alisttair
Great Reader
Canada
3054 Posts |
Posted - 29 Jul 2008 : 14:53:40
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| Wow - sales of Ebberon novels must be low indeed to cause this...which is unfortunate even though I don't really read them (I do have on in my library somewhere) - too many realms novels to read first at least anyways. |
Karsite Arcanar (Most Holy Servant of Karsus)
Anauria - Survivor State of Netheril as penned by me:
http://www.dmsguild.com/m/product/172023 |
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The Red Walker
Great Reader
USA
3563 Posts |
Posted - 29 Jul 2008 : 16:04:13
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And I thought a reason cited for this cancellation (and canceling of Gleemax as well) were due to losses ??
Then what is up with this: News That Hasbro Profits are Soaring?
Looks like not just losers are being axed, smeels like they may be axeing things that are making smaller profits, to boost the stock. I have seen it in all other types of business.....so why should this surprise us?
The only question is.......where do they stop chopping?
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A little nonsense now and then, relished by the wisest men - Willy Wonka
"We need men who can dream of things that never were." -
John F. Kennedy, speech in Dublin, Ireland, June 28, 1963
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Kuje
Great Reader
USA
7915 Posts |
Posted - 29 Jul 2008 : 17:04:31
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| BTW, over on ENworld, Ari has confirmed that some, if not all, but he's not positive, except for his novel, that the new Ravenloft novels have been canceled. |
For some of us, books are as important as almost anything else on earth. What a miracle it is that out of these small, flat, rigid squares of paper unfolds world after world, worlds that sing to you, comfort and quiet and excite you... Books are full of the things that you don't get in real life - wonderful, lyrical language, for instance, right off the bat. - Anne Lamott, Bird by Bird
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium |
Edited by - Kuje on 29 Jul 2008 21:05:23 |
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WhrenKehrsyn
Acolyte
USA
23 Posts |
Posted - 29 Jul 2008 : 20:43:12
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quote:
Originally posted by monknwildcat
I'm confused by something *else* in Alaundo's link to the WOTC press release.
The release mentions a new FR Stone of Tymora trilogy for young adults, as if the main FR novels are no longer for young adults. Am I misinterpreting, or are the main FR novels no longer categorized as young adult fiction?
Since this thread's a bit of an author magnet, I figured I'd post the question here.
They werent categorized as young adult before. Go into Borders or B&N, the FR books are shelved with the Sci-fi/Fantasy, not with the young adult books which is where these new young adult books will be. Its the difference between the Dragonlance line (shelved in Sci-fi/Fantasy), and the Knights of the Silver Dragon line (Dragonlance line shelved in the YA section). |
My candle burns at both ends, it will not last the night. But oh, my foes and ah, my friends, it gives a lovely light. |
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monknwildcat
Learned Scribe
USA
285 Posts |
Posted - 29 Jul 2008 : 21:06:14
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Thanks, Whren!!!!
When I last saw them at the local public libes, all those series were shelved as young adult, but that's been at least 2-3 years now.
I order wayyy too much online. |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31701 Posts |
Posted - 30 Jul 2008 : 01:16:50
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quote:
Originally posted by Kuje
BTW, over on ENworld, Ari has confirmed that some, if not all, but he's not positive, except for his novel, that the new Ravenloft novels have been canceled.
That's a shame. Despite the premise of the new RAVENLOFT books, I was actually kinda looking forward to the series. |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)
"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood
Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage |
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Kuje
Great Reader
USA
7915 Posts |
Posted - 30 Jul 2008 : 01:53:45
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So was I. :( Blargh.
quote:
Originally posted by The Sage
quote:
Originally posted by Kuje
BTW, over on ENworld, Ari has confirmed that some, if not all, but he's not positive, except for his novel, that the new Ravenloft novels have been canceled.
That's a shame. Despite the premise of the new RAVENLOFT books, I was actually kinda looking forward to the series.
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For some of us, books are as important as almost anything else on earth. What a miracle it is that out of these small, flat, rigid squares of paper unfolds world after world, worlds that sing to you, comfort and quiet and excite you... Books are full of the things that you don't get in real life - wonderful, lyrical language, for instance, right off the bat. - Anne Lamott, Bird by Bird
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium |
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Purple Dragon Knight
Master of Realmslore
Canada
1796 Posts |
Posted - 30 Jul 2008 : 04:02:30
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Part of me is saddened as this will prevent some young authors to write and flourish, using Eberron as training grounds for greater future endeavours;
However...
I'd be lying if I'd say that I'm entirely saddened at seeing Eberron tank... I've stayed 100% true to the Realms and I haven't even looked once at Eberron, disagreeing with the production of this setting from the get go...
One has to wonder though: why didn't they send that Spellplague in Eberron instead, since Eberron is obviously more expendable than the Realms? (i.e. they cancelled Eberron's books, not the Realms line...)
Finally, methinks the Realms are next to go on the chopping block. Don't ask me why: it's just a bad feeling I have right now... 
(I just wish Paizo would buy the Realms off WotC...  ) |
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silverwizard
Seeker
Greece
76 Posts |
Posted - 30 Jul 2008 : 10:52:38
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The Realms are the most popular D&D setting, it won't be easy to just cut off novel support... There are people who have nothing to do with gaming and only buy Realms novels.
quote:
Originally posted by Purple Dragon Knight
(I just wish Paizo would buy the Realms off WotC... )
Most definitely seconded! |
Edited by - silverwizard on 30 Jul 2008 10:53:50 |
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Alisttair
Great Reader
Canada
3054 Posts |
Posted - 30 Jul 2008 : 11:32:07
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| Just thinking about the realms stopping production sends a chill down my spine. |
Karsite Arcanar (Most Holy Servant of Karsus)
Anauria - Survivor State of Netheril as penned by me:
http://www.dmsguild.com/m/product/172023 |
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Kiaransalyn
Senior Scribe
United Kingdom
762 Posts |
Posted - 30 Jul 2008 : 11:51:51
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quote:
Originally posted by Alaundo
Well met
So here's the official news on the matter:
http://ww2.wizards.com/books/Wizards/default.aspx?doc=main_discoveries07252008&=RSS-BOOKS
I'm not sure what WotC are actually stating here. If EB and DL novels are cancelled as they don't support the D&D product directly, then surely FR falls into that category as well. Are we to see an end to all campaign-specific novels in favour of D&D core novels?
Having read that Press Release, it looks as though WotC are trying to get a share of the same market occupied by JK Rowling, Philip Pulmann and even Christopher Paolini.
quote:
"There is still so much more to discover in the rich fantasy worlds of Magic and D&D," said Casey Reeter, VP of Marketing for Wizards of the Coast. "Refocusing our publishing resources allows us to tell those untold stories and expand the reach of our core brands."
This is just business-speak for saying the sales figures are down so we're cutting costs and sticking to our main work-horses.
quote:
Beginning in 2009, any novel or series that does not support these core brands will be removed from the publishing schedule. The 2008 publishing schedule will remain unchanged.
This sounds pretty clear to me. However, the question is does the Forgotten Realms setting count as a core brand?
Hmm, I don't feel positive after reading this press release.
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Death is Life
Love is Hate
Revenge is Forgiveness
Ken: You from the States?
Jimmy: Yeah. But don't hold it against me.
Ken: I'll try not to... Just try not to say anything too loud or crass. |
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Nkoda
Acolyte
USA
40 Posts |
Posted - 30 Jul 2008 : 20:15:46
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| I actually haven't read any official word that the entire eberron series is going to be cancelled. Which would be a shame. Their books are very fast paced and entertaining. Good filler for when I'm waiting for new DL and FR books. I did notice the next drizzt novel is not on the list of upcoming products... however. |
Welcome to Jamrock |
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Iluvrien
Acolyte
United Kingdom
49 Posts |
Posted - 30 Jul 2008 : 20:58:34
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If, as an utter newbie, I might offer a point for consideration.
Not axing current FR novel lines is not the same as maintaining or increasing the number of commissioned novels in the future.
I am not saying that WotC would or are attempting this... but would not the quietest way to edge out novel lines be to slowly decrease the numbers of new novels? People will complain about an announced novel being axed. Will they complain so much about the failure to commission something they have never heard of?
I don't know. The press release just made me consider the Long Game, the one that WotC must play if they still want to be in this business 10 years from now. |
Edited by - Iluvrien on 30 Jul 2008 20:59:33 |
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Faraer
Great Reader
3308 Posts |
Posted - 31 Jul 2008 : 00:34:25
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In the past we've discussed the pros (mainly distribution and production values) and cons of Wizards of the Coast as a publisher for Realms source material and fiction. Now we know that it won't publish Realms source material after the three scheduled books.
Settings were also subjugated to game in 3E, with the Realms forced to adapt to D&D norms rather than keep its own styles of play or art. This is a big further step in that direction, and 'Forgotten Realms' certainly is not one of the 'core brands':quote:
Wizards of the Coast today announced the decision to refocus publishing efforts on the company's two core brands -- Magic: The Gathering and Dungeons & Dragons.
Elsewhere:quote:
Wizards of the Coast today announced the decision to discontinue its Gleemax social networking site in order to focus on digital initiatives for core brands Magic: The Gathering and Dungeons & Dragons.
It's hard to see good world-building, shared-world fiction, breakout novel hits, or creative work in general flourishing in such a situation.
Doesn't this look a lot like the Disney that mistook what it had in John Lasseter, and the Hollywood that tried to repeat the success of Star Wars and then the Lord of the Rings films (see Steve Tompkins's 'Pan Versus Peter Pan' blog entry at thecimmerian.com) by apeing their surfaces?
quote:
Beginning in 2009, any novel or series that does not support these core brands will be removed from the publishing schedule.
So Realms fiction is liable to be cancelled or drastically cut down the moment it's deemed not to support D&D enough, or abandoning specifically Realms creative integrity and marketing drops its sales too far, or whenever the company's profits fall far enough below Hasbro levels to trigger the next rationalization. |
Edited by - Faraer on 31 Jul 2008 00:59:43 |
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The Red Walker
Great Reader
USA
3563 Posts |
Posted - 31 Jul 2008 : 03:03:47
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I would love to see the sales figures,but I cannot imagine any of the other lines outsells FR, I think FR will become the core of D&D and if any changes in FR books at all we might see more.
I would also bet a gp that the same crew will not be running Wotc within 2 years and we will see changes for the better. |
A little nonsense now and then, relished by the wisest men - Willy Wonka
"We need men who can dream of things that never were." -
John F. Kennedy, speech in Dublin, Ireland, June 28, 1963
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Cancellation of Eberron and Discovery novel line
