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Chosen of Moradin
Master of Realmslore
Brazil
1120 Posts |
 Posted - 09 Aug 2007 : 16:18:38
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Hello, fellow scribes.
I'm starting a new campaign in the Vilhon Reach, but I don't have a good grasp in the Savage Species rules (to be honest, I don't have the book)
So, I'm asking if someone could help me to develop a racial progression for a wemic.
Thanks in advance.
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Ergdusch
Master of Realmslore
Germany
1720 Posts |
Posted - 09 Aug 2007 : 16:46:17
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Mmmh - do I understand you correctly? you would like to develop the Wemic species as a players option? Are we talking 2nd. or 3rd. Edition than?
Sorry that I'm asking for clarification.......
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"Das Gras weht im Wind, wenn der Wind weht." |
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KnightErrantJR
Great Reader
USA
5402 Posts |
Posted - 09 Aug 2007 : 16:49:28
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I double checked the "Savage Progressions" section of WOTC's site to make sure that this wasn't already covered by SKR when he did those articles.
I would check the DragonDex to see if it has come up in Dragon, but I can't do that from work (I thought it would make more sense to make sure it hadn't been done yet). |
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Chosen of Moradin
Master of Realmslore
Brazil
1120 Posts |
Posted - 09 Aug 2007 : 17:08:45
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KEJR: Yes, I've checked Dragondex and here at Candlekeep, and don't have find nothing... 
Ergdusch: yes, you understand correctly: it's for a player character. I'm using the 3.5 rules. |
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turox
Learned Scribe
USA
145 Posts |
Posted - 09 Aug 2007 : 17:17:34
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| CoM, do you have Races of Faerun? On page 149 it covers the Wemic there. They have a +3 Level Adjustment. |
Turox Antas Dragonslayer -
"People will believe anything they want to believe, or fear to believe."
Wizard's First Rule: Chapter 36, Page #397, US Hard Cover (revealed by Zeddicus Zu'l Zorander).
Explanation by Zeddicus Zu'l Zorander: "People are stupid; given proper motivation, almost anyone will believe almost anything. Because people are stupid, they will believe a lie because they want to believe it's true, or because they are afraid it might be true. Peoples heads are full of knowledge, facts, and beliefs, and most of it is false, yet they think it all true. People are stupid; they can only rarely tell the difference between a lie and the truth, and yet they are confident they can, and so are all the easier to fool."
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Ergdusch
Master of Realmslore
Germany
1720 Posts |
Posted - 09 Aug 2007 : 18:28:37
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quote:
Originally posted by turox
CoM, do you have Races of Faerun? On page 149 it covers the Wemic there. They have a +3 Level Adjustment.
Here is what you would find on that page (assuming you don't have that tome already):
- +8 STR, +2 DEX, +2 CON, -2 CHA
- Creature type: Large, wemics suffer a -1 size penalty on attack rolls and AC. also a -4 size penalty on Hide checks. However, keep the other options for large creatures in mind. (esp. weapons and carrying capacity)
- Facing is 10 feet and Reach is 5 feet
- Land speed 40 feet
- +4 nat. Armor
- Darkvision 60 feet
- Proficient with simple weapons and shield
- +8 racial bonus to Jump checks
- Monstrous Hit Dice: 5d8 (following that is a +4 base attack bonus, +1 Fort, +4 Refelx, +4 Will)
- Monstrous Humanuid skills: (2+ INT modifier)x8, Class skills are: Hide, Jump, Listen, Move Silently, Spot, Survival (which was Wilderness Lore in 3.0 IIRC)
- Monstrous Feats: 2 feats (due to his hit dice), typically Alertness and Great Fortitude
- Natural attack: 2 claws - 1d6 dmg; when using one-hand weapons his off-hand claw can attack as well (normal offhand weapon rules apply, -5 penalty to attack & only half STR modifier to dmg)
- Automatic Languages: Sylvan, Common
- Bonus Languages: by region
- Favored Class: Barbarian
- Level Adjustment: +3 (Character level +8)
Now, there you go. Any more infosneeded?!?
Ergdusch
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"Das Gras weht im Wind, wenn der Wind weht." |
Edited by - Ergdusch on 09 Aug 2007 18:35:37 |
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freyar
Learned Scribe
Canada
220 Posts |
Posted - 09 Aug 2007 : 19:29:48
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| It sounds to me like CoM wants to write an 8-level "wemic class" in order to start a wemic character at level 1. I don't have Savage Species myself, but maybe you can figure out how to do this given the normal wemic based on the Savage Progressions feature on the WotC website (go to the archives and then retired articles). I'd be interested to hear how it goes! |
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KnightErrantJR
Great Reader
USA
5402 Posts |
Posted - 09 Aug 2007 : 20:03:53
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Well, without coming up with the proper details yet, the general progression would divide the hit dice into their own levels as well as the level adjustments, meaning that between the hit dice and level adjustment, this would be an 8 level class (as freyar notes above).
Most likely for first level this would mean that the wemic would start out as a medium sized creature, but other than that starting comment, I'd have to scrutinize the rules a bit more to come up with more specific answers. |
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sleyvas
Skilled Spell Strategist
USA
11701 Posts |
Posted - 09 Aug 2007 : 20:04:21
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Yes, with 5 HD and +3 LA, it would be an 8 level class. Thus, you'd take these abilities and spread them out over 8 levels
- +8 STR, +2 DEX, +2 CON, -2 CHA
- Creature type: Large, wemics suffer a -1 size penalty on attack rolls and AC. also a -4 size penalty on Hide checks. However, keep the other options for large creatures in mind. (esp. weapons and carrying capacity)
- Facing is 10 feet and Reach is 5 feet
- Land speed 40 feet
- +4 nat. Armor
- Darkvision 60 feet
- Proficient with simple weapons and shield
- +8 racial bonus to Jump checks
- Monstrous Hit Dice: 5d8 (following that is a +4 base attack bonus, +1 Fort, +4 Refelx, +4 Will)
- Monstrous Humanuid skills: (2+ INT modifier)x8, Class skills are: Hide, Jump, Listen, Move Silently, Spot, Survival (which was Wilderness Lore in 3.0 IIRC)
- Monstrous Feats: 2 feats (due to his hit dice), typically Alertness and Great Fortitude
- Natural attack: 2 claws - 1d6 dmg; when using one-hand weapons his off-hand claw can attack as well (normal offhand weapon rules apply, -5 penalty to attack & only half STR modifier to dmg)
- Automatic Languages: Sylvan, Common
Plus
So, lets give it a try:
1st lvl HD 1d8 BAB +1 Ref +2 Will +2
Ability scores: +4 str -2 Cha
1st feat
size medium
natural attack: 1d4 dmg
land speed: 30
darkvision: 30 feet
+1 racial to jump
proficiency simple weapons and shields
Languages: sylvan and common
2nd lvl Fort +1
Ability scores: +2 dex
+1 natural armor
+2 racial to jump
3rd lvl HD 2d8 BAB +2
Ability scores: +2 con
land speed: 40
+3 racial to jump
4th lvl Ref +3 Will +3
size: large
+2 natural armor
+4 racial to jump
5th lvl HD 3d8 BAB +3
natural attack: 1d6 dmg
+5 racial to jump
6th lvl Ability scores: +2 str
2nd feat
+3 natural armor
+6 racial to jump
7th lvl HD 4d8 BAB +4 Ref +4 Will +4
darkvision: 60 feet
+7 racial to jump
8th lvl HD 5d8
Ability Scores: +2 str
+4 natural armor
+8 racial to jump
Phillip aka Sleyvas |
Alavairthae, may your skill prevail
Phillip aka Sleyvas |
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KnightErrantJR
Great Reader
USA
5402 Posts |
Posted - 09 Aug 2007 : 20:20:10
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| Darn it, Sleyvas you worked it out before I could even get home to look things up . . . looks good from where I'm sitting though. |
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Chosen of Moradin
Master of Realmslore
Brazil
1120 Posts |
Posted - 09 Aug 2007 : 21:18:37
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Hum, it appears interesting... thanks, Sleyvas. I will take a good look later (now I'm at work). ^^
Question: How I manage the skill points? |
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Chosen of Moradin
Master of Realmslore
Brazil
1120 Posts |
Posted - 09 Aug 2007 : 21:20:03
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...and thanks to KEJR, freyar, Ergdush and turox. 
Your help is very apreciated! |
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Ergdusch
Master of Realmslore
Germany
1720 Posts |
Posted - 09 Aug 2007 : 21:41:42
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quote:
Originally posted by Chosen of Moradin
Hum, it appears interesting... thanks, Sleyvas. I will take a good look later (now I'm at work). ^^
Question: How I manage the skill points?
First, impressive work, Sylvas. And looks good to me too, after the first quick glance.
To the the skill points, that is the easiest part of it all.
According to the stats of RoF the wemic gets 2 + INT modifier per Character Level (that is x8 in this case) See also above under Monstrous Humanoid Skills.
Since you would probably devide his level advancement into 8 lvls you give the player 2 + INT modifier per Level.
Do you catch on..........?
.........and you are most welcome! 
Ergdusch
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"Das Gras weht im Wind, wenn der Wind weht." |
Edited by - Ergdusch on 09 Aug 2007 21:43:18 |
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Chosen of Moradin
Master of Realmslore
Brazil
1120 Posts |
Posted - 10 Aug 2007 : 01:51:46
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Yes, that make the things very clear!
Thanks for the help, my friends.
Now, I'll permit a wemic of 2nd level (that one day will be a wemic paladin) in the campaign. 
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Dwarf, DM, husband, and proud of this! :P
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Facebook: yuri.peixoto |
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freyar
Learned Scribe
Canada
220 Posts |
Posted - 10 Aug 2007 : 04:54:52
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Sleyvas, this looks great! Now I know who to ask if I ever want a racial progression done. 
Don't forget to make the PC take all the racial levels first... |
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Ergdusch
Master of Realmslore
Germany
1720 Posts |
Posted - 10 Aug 2007 : 09:26:11
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I just though of something last night concerning the skill points. That is, every first lvl charachter gets his skill point multiplied by 4 (x4). According to the RoF a wemic char does not get this x4 multiplier at first class level due to his monstrous skill points.
Due to this fact and my suggestion your wemic character is only getting his normal amount of skill points at the start of the game. (that is 2 + INT mod) That might result in some difficulties -either balance wise or because the player is frustrated about only having so few skill points while playing with e.g. a human thief (easily 48 skill points at 1st lvl).
That made me reconsider my approach. therefore skillpoints according to the following:
1st lvl: (2 + INT modifier) x4 (which equals the amoint of e.g. a dwarf cleric at first lvl)
Thereafter: every even level (2nd,4th,6th & 8th) additional 2 + INT modifier
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"Das Gras weht im Wind, wenn der Wind weht." |
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Chosen of Moradin
Master of Realmslore
Brazil
1120 Posts |
Posted - 10 Aug 2007 : 15:10:44
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| hmmm... this appears more logic for me too, Ergdusch. I take a look in the DM Guide, concerning this matter, and I think that this is the best approach! |
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twitter: @yuripeixoto
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Sian
Senior Scribe
Denmark
596 Posts |
Posted - 10 Aug 2007 : 15:12:13
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| place the skill points together with the HD's i would say ... much easier |
what happened to the queen? she's much more hysterical than usual
She's a women, it happens once a month |
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Halidan
Senior Scribe
USA
470 Posts |
Posted - 10 Aug 2007 : 20:24:34
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| Very impressive work Sleyvas. You gotta admire those Red Wizards, they're good at what they do. |
"Over the Mountains
Of the Moon
Down the Valley of the Shadow,
Ride, boldly ride,"
The shade replied,
"If you seek for Eldorado!"
Edgar Allen Poe - 1849 |
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Ergdusch
Master of Realmslore
Germany
1720 Posts |
Posted - 11 Aug 2007 : 10:36:03
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quote:
Originally posted by Sian
place the skill points together with the HD's i would say ... much easier
mmmhh......... good point there, Sian! That would of course work as well too and might be even a better aproach, as skill points are Hit dice related anyhow.
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"Das Gras weht im Wind, wenn der Wind weht." |
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Chosen of Moradin
Master of Realmslore
Brazil
1120 Posts |
Posted - 11 Aug 2007 : 18:48:06
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quote:
Originally posted by Ergdusch
quote:
Originally posted by Sian
place the skill points together with the HD's i would say ... much easier
mmmhh......... good point there, Sian! That would of course work as well too and might be even a better aproach, as skill points are Hit dice related anyhow.
Really makes more sense. Thanks, Sian! |
Dwarf, DM, husband, and proud of this! :P
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Facebook: yuri.peixoto |
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Kyrene
Senior Scribe
South Africa
733 Posts |
Posted - 02 Aug 2008 : 19:13:33
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quote:
Originally posted by Sian
place the skill points together with the HD's i would say ... much easier
Sorry to dredge up an old scroll like this, but while searching for some Savage Progression stuff I came accross this. Just for clarity to anyone not having a good grasp on Savage Species rules:
quote:
Races of Faerūn page 151
Monstrous Humanoid Skills: A wemics monstrous humanoid Hit Dice grant him skill points equal to (2 + Int modifier, minimum 1) x8. Class skills for these skill points are Hide, Jump, Listen, Move Silently, Spot, and Survival.
(emphasis mine)
This equates exactly to (2 + Int modifier) x4 at first racial HD, plus four more allocations of (2 + Int modifier) x1 for the remaining racial HD.
Therefore, Sian's suggestion is not only good but also correct (not detracting from Ergdush's suggestion in any way). The player would still get the x4 skill points at first level, but according to the creature type. This is in fact the reason for...
quote:
Races of Faerūn page 151
A wemic does not get the x4 multiplier for skill points acquired from his first class level.
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Purple Dragon Knight
Master of Realmslore
Canada
1796 Posts |
Posted - 02 Aug 2008 : 20:04:14
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The easiest way to create a high HD humanoid is to say, create a 1st-level version (i.e. in the case of the wemic, 5 monstrous humanoid HD and 1 HD from say, a fighter level).
Fully build the character up, complete with skills and feats allocation for that 6 HD wemic ftr1; then, if the rest of the party is at 1st HD (i.e. a level 1 party), then have the wemic take a -5 penalty on all attacks, saves, and skill checks (which is recommended at the end of PGtoF). Every take you "level up," the wemic goes to -4, -3, etc. until there are no penalties left when the wemic has XPs equivalent to a "regular level 6" adventurer (i.e. a human, dwarf, elf, etc. adventurer). |
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Kyrene
Senior Scribe
South Africa
733 Posts |
Posted - 07 Aug 2008 : 19:52:40
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| A slightly different (33K) take on sleyvas' level progression for the wemic. I tried to follow the Savage Progression rules, with an equal spread of enhancements over all the levels. Also, a wemic starts with +5 BAB, not +4, and that would affect the racial level progression. |
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Help with a Wemic Racial Progression
