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Dalor Darden
Great Reader

USA
3593 Posts

Posted - 29 Jan 2018 :  15:39:37  Show Profile Send Dalor Darden a Private Message  Reply with Quote  Delete Topic
So I was looking through the DMs Guild and just realized that Magic the Gathering and D&D have finally crossed paths with each other...

I've been thinking it for a long time, but was wondering when they would get around to it.

What does everyone else think?

Will the Forgotten Realms ever become a MtG card supplement? Will the Forgotten Realms be pretty much dropped to make way for a generic kitchen sink MtG setting?

AD&D for me!

Ayrik
Great Reader

Canada
6626 Posts

Posted - 29 Jan 2018 :  16:14:50  Show Profile Send Ayrik a Private Message  Reply with Quote
"I have a bad feeling about this."

WotC has long favoured MtG over FR, MtG is their most overwhelmingly successful revenue-stream while FR is only one subcomponent of their fickle and sporadic revenue-trickling D&D franchise. D&D is just a drop in the bucket, especially after all of WotC's unpopular bunglings of the brand, and FR in particular has always been complicated/restricted by the sheer number of authors and owners it's accumulated. Plus WotC remains ever fearful and kneejerky about "rampant" digital piracy of D&D materials, but if you play/collect MtG then there's no way around physically obtaining the cards they sell.

So ... given WotC's penchant for re-purposing artwork and ideas ... I think it's evident the theme and tone and flavour of the Realms will gradually but irrevocably shift more and more towards the generic and flashy fantasy imagery of the Gathering. Take a look at those MtG characters, they'll probably all be featured on the next Realms NPC rosters, along with their weapons and items and spells and powers and one day it just won't even be recognizable as the Realms anymore except in name (and logo).

I know I certainly won't rush out to buy pack after pack of cards for a Realms campaign. But, as usual, Wizbro will judge the "success" of products on nothing but sales figures and profit margins, so a thing which isn't selling well must obviously be an unpopular thing (in short, they tend to always blame product failure on poor reception from the fans, never on their own mismanagement or flawed ideas). I can easily imagine this hybrid product not doing so well (for whatever reason) and getting chopped as a result ... meaning that in the end MtG will continue to prevail and in the end FR will receive less and less priority, less and less "actual" Realmslore.

Just my opinion as one long-time fan of D&D and FR with no interest at all in MtG. I like collecting "all" Realmslore but that doesn't mean I'm willing to subscribe to an addictive lifelong shopping obligation. From what I've seen online at various wikis and forums, it's a fairly common (though not at all unanimous) opinion among fans of MtG with no interest in FR, expressing the same result approached from the other side of the equation. But opinion is just opinion, lol, and I do objectively realize my opinion about this is biased (pro-FR, pro-D&D, anti-MtG, anti-CCC, prejudiced vs Wizbro) and ignorant (unaware and uninformed about possibly relevant WotC internal/external product initiatives). It's fair to say that you're not the only one who's "been thinking about this a long time".

[/Ayrik]

Edited by - Ayrik on 29 Jan 2018 16:58:57
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Zeromaru X
Master of Realmslore

Colombia
1076 Posts

Posted - 29 Jan 2018 :  17:21:18  Show Profile Send Zeromaru X a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Well, for the moment they are just making the MtG into their own D&D worlds. None has ever crossover with the Realms or any other D&D world, for that matter. I don't think they will make a full D&D/MtG fusion, however. If they wanted, they would already have done it, because the popularity of the Plane Shifts conversions to 5e (starting with Zendikar, that was their first one; they have been making like 5 others before Ixalan)

Long ago, in the distant past, they fell into decay. The philosopher’s path... The river of glory... Even the saints resting in the darkness rise up without response and block the way...
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
Moderator

USA
31303 Posts

Posted - 29 Jan 2018 :  17:25:29  Show Profile Send Wooly Rupert a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I'm inclined to think they've learned their lesson, there... The Spellfire CCG focused on D&D settings for many of its supplements, and it's no longer around.

And the Spellplague also showed WotC just how dedicated the fans of the Realms are -- they backed off from a lot of those changes.

I don't know a lot about Magic: The Gathering, but I'm fairly certain that it would be easier to create a new setting from scratch, for it, rather than try to force any of the D&D settings into that mold.

Honestly, I think the crossovers have been more about trying to get fans of just one property interested in the other. If people dropping their money on just the RPGs started buying the CCG as well, that's an increase in sales -- and vice versa.

It also makes more of an entry point for people that may like both Magic and RPGs in general, but not D&D -- putting the material out there means it can be adapted to other RPGs, with the hope of it leading these folks back to D&D. Admittedly, though, I think they'd bank more on the general D&D fans than trying to pull in fans of other RPGs -- though they'd certainly be happy to get some more of the Pathfinder crowd away from Paizo.

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Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire

USA
15675 Posts

Posted - 29 Jan 2018 :  18:47:53  Show Profile Send Markustay a Private Message  Reply with Quote
My first thoughts are that FR would have made a great MtG world, but unfortunately, they've already done the 'adventurer's world' (Zendikar), so at this point FR would probably be redundant (unless they set it during the Spellplague century, which might be kinda neat - play-up the mutations and spellscars aspects).

It really is a no-brainer. With D&D, MtG has more worlds they can add (although they've already done quite a few of the flavors already, including Ravenloft). But with the MtG stuff, it gives D&Ders access to new worlds that have specific themes, and by combining that with Planescape (which is where I see this going - they do seem to be hitning a new Manual of the Planes with all this talk of githyanki, etc.) its pure win. They can add the Outlands and Sigil to MtG with nary a wrinkle - it can be the 'homebase' for many Planeswalkers.

Now, what to use from us? They should AVOID the big names, like drizzt and Elminster (well, maybe Drizzt as some sort of leader, but certainly no Planeswalker... he is already waaaaaay too much like Elric) There are some other Planeswalkers we have that are not 'big names', like that guy down in southern Mulhorand (Nezram). You know who would be an interesting choice for one of 'our' (D&D?) Planeswalkers? Doc - the guy from Egg of Phoenix who later wound-up in The North. I think he'd make an interesting Planeswalker as well, since he's already been in two settings. they should bring Blackmoor into it. Even though its not FR, its been part of three other official settings, and there could be a group of 'Blackmoorians' still operating somewhere (I picture them with high magitech, and I also picture them dark-skinned, despite prior lore (they are an ancient, perhaps primeval, race of humans).

Not sure about others - Vecna could probably work. He's always been one of core D&D's 'big bads'. But if they did GH, then it might be better to use iuz, because he has an empire, and you can make a lot of cards around that. And that's the whole thing - I think for a full-on expansion, they'd have to do Planescape, rather than D&D, and then just give us a few juicy bits from several settings. I think the biggest reason why they've waited so long to make this rather obvious move is that the two magic systems are completely incompatible. I think they've been trying for years to come-up with a single-book splat that could add the MtG rules on top of D&D, and they just haven't been able to do it. Maybe now, they have. I think they'd have to make it its own unique form of 'Planes' magic, where you draw from the power of particular planes for your energy, so, like defiling, but also like elementalism and 4e/5e's 'pact' magic. I know I haven't been able to come-up with a workable solution, and I have put my mind to it a couple of times (not much effort, mind you, but just enough to make me realize it wasn't worth the effort).

I used to be a MtG player, but I sold all my cards years ago. At the time I thought I got a good price for them (I sold the entire collection - which included THREE entire complete sets, for $300), but I now see I could have retired just on my Sierra Angels alone (I think I had around seven of those). There was only like three expansions out at the time.

Anyhow, there is still a lot of great ideas and artwork there for us to cherry-pick from, and that's never a bad thing.

"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone


Edited by - Markustay on 29 Jan 2018 18:51:22
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Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire

USA
15675 Posts

Posted - 29 Jan 2018 :  19:00:39  Show Profile Send Markustay a Private Message  Reply with Quote
As an aside, I have heard rumors that Hasbro has been looking to sell-off WtC. But what if they want to just sell parts of it? What if they want to get rid of D&D and just keep MtG? Could these books and this 'push' be a way for the desperate employees to make the two inseparable?

Just a thought, mind you. We may want to consider buying whatever hybrid materials they offer, just to help them plead their case to Hasbro. Paizo does NOT want D&D/FR (they've made that clear) - and they probably couldn't afford it - which only really leaves Disney, and we've seen what Disney does to IP's.

Although... Alusair as a 'Disney Princess' tickles me no end.

"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone


Edited by - Markustay on 29 Jan 2018 19:01:00
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hashimashadoo
Master of Realmslore

United Kingdom
1114 Posts

Posted - 29 Jan 2018 :  19:06:46  Show Profile  Visit hashimashadoo's Homepage  Click to see hashimashadoo's MSN Messenger address Send hashimashadoo a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Hasbro doesn't separate it's announced revenues among it's subsidiaries so it's very difficult to say exactly how much more MtG makes in comparison to D&D without actually working for either company. Hasbro did however put out a list of it's top 8 earning properties 10 months ago and D&D wasn't in the list (despite D&D's leaps and bounds in popularity since 5th ed came out) so they don't consider the FR to be a particularly profitable property. We already know that WotC have only announced that they will be publishing 3 D&D books in 2018.

I sincerely doubt that we'll see an FR/MtG crossover any time soon and if the rumours in the financial sector are true, Hasbro will be selling WotC some time in the next 5 years, which could mean we'll be seeing asset stripping taking place.

The success or failure of the movie will be a major determining factor in the future of the franchise but IMO, even if the movie is successful, an FR/MtG crossover is not "in the cards".

When life turns it's back on you...sneak attack for extra damage.

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dazzlerdal
Great Reader

United Kingdom
4014 Posts

Posted - 29 Jan 2018 :  19:36:31  Show Profile Send dazzlerdal a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Markustay

As an aside, I have heard rumors that Hasbro has been looking to sell-off WtC. But what if they want to just sell parts of it? What if they want to get rid of D&D and just keep MtG? Could these books and this 'push' be a way for the desperate employees to make the two inseparable?

Just a thought, mind you. We may want to consider buying whatever hybrid materials they offer, just to help them plead their case to Hasbro. Paizo does NOT want D&D/FR (they've made that clear) - and they probably couldn't afford it - which only really leaves Disney, and we've seen what Disney does to IP's.

Although... Alusair as a 'Disney Princess' tickles me no end.



Well i think it can only be a good thing if they sell it on, but thats me being selfish because i dont buy anything wotc sell anymore and im willing to take a gamble on someone buying FR and releasing products i will buy, even if the new owners release nothing im not buying anything now anyways

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Zeromaru X
Master of Realmslore

Colombia
1076 Posts

Posted - 29 Jan 2018 :  21:30:35  Show Profile Send Zeromaru X a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Markustay

They should bring Blackmoor into it. Even though its not FR, its been part of three other official settings, and there could be a group of 'Blackmoorians' still operating somewhere (I picture them with high magitech, and I also picture them dark-skinned, despite prior lore (they are an ancient, perhaps primeval, race of humans).


The problem with Blackmoor, and also the why the 4e line died before it fully started, and why there has been no plans to make a 5e line, its because licenses. After Dave Arnesson died, the licenses became such a legal mess that nobody can use the setting until that mess is resolved. And they have been trying to resolving it since 2010 without any success. I guess we have lost Blackmoor as a setting for new iterations of D&D.

quote:
Originally posted by Markustay

I think the biggest reason why they've waited so long to make this rather obvious move is that the two magic systems are completely incompatible. I think they've been trying for years to come-up with a single-book splat that could add the MtG rules on top of D&D, and they just haven't been able to do it. Maybe now, they have. I think they'd have to make it its own unique form of 'Planes' magic, where you draw from the power of particular planes for your energy, so, like defiling, but also like elementalism and 4e/5e's 'pact' magic. I know I haven't been able to come-up with a workable solution, and I have put my mind to it a couple of times (not much effort, mind you, but just enough to make me realize it wasn't worth the effort).


Well, they came up with a way to use "color magic" with 5e rules in one of the Plane Shifts (don't remember which one, but I lean to Kaladesh or Amonkhet).

Long ago, in the distant past, they fell into decay. The philosopher’s path... The river of glory... Even the saints resting in the darkness rise up without response and block the way...
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Ayrik
Great Reader

Canada
6626 Posts

Posted - 29 Jan 2018 :  22:18:01  Show Profile Send Ayrik a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Well it is interesting that the President of WotC was hired by Hasbro, a former Microsoft/Xbox executive with a strong background in technical sales and management. Since then, WotC seems to have been quietly hiring a steady stream of technical people, even now they're advertising technical positions (for a systems engineer, product design manager, digital marketing director, digital product marketer, software devs) while seemingly not hiring any other kinds of positions.

Wizbro has been weak on tech-savvy since its inception. Their website, forums, and download sites are a tragic kludge. Their paranoia about real digital piracy is distorted to unreal extremes. They've outsourced or licensed a lot of their digital media over the years, effectively creating their own competition.

I don't know much about the publishing industry. I do know some things about the software industry. WotC is basically (re)hiring all the people they need to (re)create a complete software division, a whole team or two padded with some manager bloat (a necessary interface in large organizations which function through delegation and scapegoats). Probably enough talent to launch some kind of major project. Looking through the details I see that - along with the usual fluff about "why working here is great" and "what you bring to the company" - the recurring topics are Magic the Gathering in specific and CCGs in general - along with technical knowledge about internet, cloud, social media, PCs, and mobile apps. (But nothing to do with Steam or Xbox, phfft, Wizbro's loss.)

Hasbro has been "losing" revenue (more accurately, making less profit than before) for a few years now. I admit I can't really make much sense out of the obfuscations and denials and market analysis econobabble, but it seems they have indeed been selling off a few "unprofitable" subsidiaries, and it seems that WotC is not deemed "unprofitable" by anyone (indeed, it would be stupid for Hasbro to divest it now, after years of investing into building it up). I've read the Hasbro-plans-to-sell-WotC rumours too ... but they seem to cite each other and all trace back to no particular source, just a circle of unsupported claims and speculations, along with their growing wake of discussions which "support" (and grow) the rumour by calling more attention to it. All with no "official" source, no comment by anyone anywhere in Hasbro or WotC.

[/Ayrik]

Edited by - Ayrik on 29 Jan 2018 22:23:17
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
Moderator

USA
31303 Posts

Posted - 29 Jan 2018 :  22:32:10  Show Profile Send Wooly Rupert a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Ayrik

Wizbro has been weak on tech-savvy since its inception. Their website, forums, and download sites are a tragic kludge. Their paranoia about real digital piracy is distorted to unreal extremes. They've outsourced or licensed a lot of their digital media over the years, effectively creating their own competition.


I recall when the piracy of 4E books caused them to pull all digital content, from all editions... It was, without a doubt, one of the most boneheaded, knee-jerk, and indefensible decisions they've made. I try really hard, myself, to give WotC the benefit of the doubt -- but I can't call that decision anything but moronic.


quote:
Originally posted by Ayrik


Hasbro has been "losing" revenue (more accurately, making less profit than before) for a few years now. I admit I can't really make much sense out of the obfuscations and denials and market analysis econobabble, but it seems they have indeed been selling off a few "unprofitable" subsidiaries, and it seems that WotC is not deemed "unprofitable" by anyone (indeed, it would be stupid for Hasbro to divest it now, after years of investing into building it up). I've read the Hasbro-plans-to-sell-WotC rumours too ... but they seem to cite each other and all trace back to no particular source, just a circle of unsupported claims and speculations, along with their growing wake of discussions which "support" (and grow) the rumour by calling more attention to it. All with no "official" source, no comment by anyone anywhere in Hasbro or WotC.



Yeah, that was why I didn't pay much attention to it, when I saw it. I'd love to see WotC get free of Hasbro, but that article was a whole lot of nothing.

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Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
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Cyrinishad
Learned Scribe

300 Posts

Posted - 29 Jan 2018 :  22:40:06  Show Profile Send Cyrinishad a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I like what they've done so far with the MtG/D&D crossover mini-settings, which seem to basically be trying to get MtG players to start rolling d20s...

I don't think the Realms will get pulled into MtG... I can see scenarios where Dark Sun, or Dragonlance, or Planescape get pulled into MtG... Perhaps even having an official D&D Planescape AP being "the crossing of the streams" so-to-speak, that tries to synergise D&D with MtG somehow... I can also see them marketing or including "official" D&D characters and/or monsters as MtG cards, even if they don't hijack a D&D setting and turn it into MtG...

I like the idea the more MtG players could start picking up some dice and get bitten by the D&D bug instead...

To know, is to know that you know nothing. That is the meaning of true knowledge. -Socrates

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Gyor
Master of Realmslore

1309 Posts

Posted - 29 Jan 2018 :  23:15:57  Show Profile Send Gyor a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Cyrinishad

I like what they've done so far with the MtG/D&D crossover mini-settings, which seem to basically be trying to get MtG players to start rolling d20s...

I don't think the Realms will get pulled into MtG... I can see scenarios where Dark Sun, or Dragonlance, or Planescape get pulled into MtG... Perhaps even having an official D&D Planescape AP being "the crossing of the streams" so-to-speak, that tries to synergise D&D with MtG somehow... I can also see them marketing or including "official" D&D characters and/or monsters as MtG cards, even if they don't hijack a D&D setting and turn it into MtG...

I like the idea the more MtG players could start picking up some dice and get bitten by the D&D bug instead...



Why not the FR, but the other settings instead?
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Lord Karsus
Great Reader

USA
3170 Posts

Posted - 29 Jan 2018 :  23:44:09  Show Profile  Send Lord Karsus an AOL message Send Lord Karsus a Private Message  Reply with Quote
-I don't see the downside. I never really understood Magic, but the artwork on the cards generally seems really nice, and the characters and things portrayed seem fantasy cool, so

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Ayrik
Great Reader

Canada
6626 Posts

Posted - 30 Jan 2018 :  00:22:56  Show Profile Send Ayrik a Private Message  Reply with Quote
WotC have engaged in some lawsuits over recent years which revolved around Magic the Gathering being used in unauthorized or unlicensed fashions. Basically MtG is WotC's property and they get aggressively territorial when anyone else is making money (or taking money) out of it. It seems they always win these suits, even when lines of battle look a little blurry, although invariably victory is through sealed out of court settlements (private "mind your own business" payouts/bribes/extortions).

Yet at the same time, while browsing through some MtG artwork on google, I see many examples (like this) which to me look very much like MtG happily cashes in on other "properties" belonging to someone else. Very amusing how the world works when you've got a big brother named Hasbro.

[/Ayrik]
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idilippy
Senior Scribe

USA
417 Posts

Posted - 30 Jan 2018 :  00:51:30  Show Profile Send idilippy a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Er, Ayrik, that isn't an official card. It's a card some fan made at a website for making custom cards called MtGCardsmith.com, not at all affiliated with WotC or MtG from what I can tell, just people doing fan stuff.
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sleyvas
Great Reader

USA
7253 Posts

Posted - 30 Jan 2018 :  01:17:26  Show Profile Send sleyvas a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Ayrik

Well it is interesting that the President of WotC was hired by Hasbro, a former Microsoft/Xbox executive with a strong background in technical sales and management. Since then, WotC seems to have been quietly hiring a steady stream of technical people, even now they're advertising technical positions (for a systems engineer, product design manager, digital marketing director, digital product marketer, software devs) while seemingly not hiring any other kinds of positions.

Wizbro has been weak on tech-savvy since its inception. Their website, forums, and download sites are a tragic kludge. Their paranoia about real digital piracy is distorted to unreal extremes. They've outsourced or licensed a lot of their digital media over the years, effectively creating their own competition.

I don't know much about the publishing industry. I do know some things about the software industry. WotC is basically (re)hiring all the people they need to (re)create a complete software division, a whole team or two padded with some manager bloat (a necessary interface in large organizations which function through delegation and scapegoats). Probably enough talent to launch some kind of major project. Looking through the details I see that - along with the usual fluff about "why working here is great" and "what you bring to the company" - the recurring topics are Magic the Gathering in specific and CCGs in general - along with technical knowledge about internet, cloud, social media, PCs, and mobile apps. (But nothing to do with Steam or Xbox, phfft, Wizbro's loss.)

Hasbro has been "losing" revenue (more accurately, making less profit than before) for a few years now. I admit I can't really make much sense out of the obfuscations and denials and market analysis econobabble, but it seems they have indeed been selling off a few "unprofitable" subsidiaries, and it seems that WotC is not deemed "unprofitable" by anyone (indeed, it would be stupid for Hasbro to divest it now, after years of investing into building it up). I've read the Hasbro-plans-to-sell-WotC rumours too ... but they seem to cite each other and all trace back to no particular source, just a circle of unsupported claims and speculations, along with their growing wake of discussions which "support" (and grow) the rumour by calling more attention to it. All with no "official" source, no comment by anyone anywhere in Hasbro or WotC.



So, either they'll be pushing for an online game (they already have Neverwinter), or maybe they'll be pushing for something that always ended up outsourced by TSR and WotC... a character generator that actually worked and kept up with the rules (and for which you'd have to buy the "add on" to get it to work with each new book out). I'll shamelessly say I spent hours in codemonkey's version of etools, and gave them a lot of money too. An online tabletop too might be in the cards, possibly even with "purchasable" virtual minis that you can add to your game.

Alavairthae, may your skill prevail

Phillip aka Sleyvas
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Ayrik
Great Reader

Canada
6626 Posts

Posted - 30 Jan 2018 :  01:33:30  Show Profile Send Ayrik a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Software which provides references and tools (for DM and players) would be smart. Especially if they kept it updated with the latest errata/revisions. And basically convert the entire game from hardcopy to softcopy, you can't really share your unique product/DLC keys on torrent sites, lol. I think the ultimate dream (from Wizbro's perspective) would be a truly "paperless" D&D RPG system, everything you need to plan and prepare and play (and buy more of) the game all a few clicks away after you login to your account on their cloud. Combine with a "match-making" system, a variety of tiers and tournaments, achievements and awards, etc ... and suddenly you've got yourself a virtual RPG which sucks lives away as well as "true" MMORPGs like WoW.

But for all we know, they're just putting together a team to do a high-visibility makeover on their website. It's clear that their attention is focussed on MtG, though, so I don't seriously expect to (ever) see any official D&D software of a useful nature.

[/Ayrik]
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idilippy
Senior Scribe

USA
417 Posts

Posted - 30 Jan 2018 :  01:52:45  Show Profile Send idilippy a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Doesn't D&D already have a fantasy grounds partnership for VTT?
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Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire

USA
15675 Posts

Posted - 30 Jan 2018 :  02:14:40  Show Profile Send Markustay a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Can't agree more with Wooly more about some of the bizarro responses out of WotC during the 4e era. Not sure if someone wasn't taking their meds, or someone took the whole bottle.

I wonder if they ever learned that stopping piracy (which they'll never do) won't actual make more people BUY their products? The kind of people who steal that stuff wasn't going to buy them regardless. Its a wash. All your doing there is making it harder for your customers to get the products - the ones who are actually trying to give you money.

quote:
Originally posted by Ayrik

Well it is interesting that the President of WotC was hired by Hasbro, a former Microsoft/Xbox executive with a strong background in technical sales and management. Since then, WotC seems to have been quietly hiring a steady stream of technical people, even now they're advertising technical positions (for a systems engineer, product design manager, digital marketing director, digital product marketer, software devs) while seemingly not hiring any other kinds of positions.

Wizbro has been weak on tech-savvy since its inception. Their website, forums, and download sites are a tragic kludge. Their paranoia about real digital piracy is distorted to unreal extremes. They've outsourced or licensed a lot of their digital media over the years, effectively creating their own competition.

I don't know much about the publishing industry. I do know some things about the software industry. WotC is basically (re)hiring all the people they need to (re)create a complete software division, a whole team or two padded with some manager bloat (a necessary interface in large organizations which function through delegation and scapegoats). Probably enough talent to launch some kind of major project. Looking through the details I see that - along with the usual fluff about "why working here is great" and "what you bring to the company" - the recurring topics are Magic the Gathering in specific and CCGs in general - along with technical knowledge about internet, cloud, social media, PCs, and mobile apps. (But nothing to do with Steam or Xbox, phfft, Wizbro's loss.)

Hasbro has been "losing" revenue (more accurately, making less profit than before) for a few years now. I admit I can't really make much sense out of the obfuscations and denials and market analysis econobabble, but it seems they have indeed been selling off a few "unprofitable" subsidiaries, and it seems that WotC is not deemed "unprofitable" by anyone (indeed, it would be stupid for Hasbro to divest it now, after years of investing into building it up). I've read the Hasbro-plans-to-sell-WotC rumours too ... but they seem to cite each other and all trace back to no particular source, just a circle of unsupported claims and speculations, along with their growing wake of discussions which "support" (and grow) the rumour by calling more attention to it. All with no "official" source, no comment by anyone anywhere in Hasbro or WotC.
Well, I did say, "I heard a rumor..."

Given what you just said, and taking into account 'recent phenomena', my best (pure) guess would be an MtG phone app that you play against others, so anywhere you go you spark-up a game with someone. I think they may have been impressed with pokemon Go's initial roll-out (which fizzled almost as quickly as it skyrocketed), and they now know there is a market for "idiot wandering around in public with their cellphones out" style games.

Now, as for Hasbro itself. They are a Toy company, and nobody plays with toys anymore. Even 5yr olds are holding tablets and smart phones. They need something thats going to keep them fluid for years to come, since Toys just aren't going to cut it anymore. That means long-range plans. Like 'taking over whatever replaced the Toy market' type plans. They need to take the most antisocial thing in the world - cellphones (and tablets) - and turn them into a social event ('go out and meet people'), the way D&D turned 'gaming' into 'hanging out with your friends' (for a group that traditionally wasn't very good at making friends).

On the upside, they own a SLEW of IPs - some damn good ones. They just need to know in which format to market those to today's audience.

Look at me... soundin' all growned-up and stuff! Someone get me my binky!
quote:
Originally posted by Zeromaru X

Well, they came up with a way to use "color magic" with 5e rules in one of the Plane Shifts (don't remember which one, but I lean to Kaladesh or Amonkhet).
WAIT... there's more than just the two i know about?

"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone


Edited by - Markustay on 30 Jan 2018 02:20:09
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The Masked Mage
Master of Realmslore

USA
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Posted - 30 Jan 2018 :  02:58:56  Show Profile  Send The Masked Mage an AOL message  Click to see The Masked Mage's MSN Messenger address Send The Masked Mage a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I loved MTG when I was a kid, and I wish to god I still had my Alpha and Beta decks, but it has long since crossed into the realm of the absurd. All the best cards cost a fortune, so its pretty much impossible for new players to take down the old ones. Someone bought a lotus for like 30000 I hear. That's plain crazy. I looked at the running value of the cards I do still have and its like 5000, with not a single card older than unlimited. Went straight into the little fire-proof safe :P

Also, its not so much a card game any more as it is a digital internet phenomenon. I remember when someone would play a new card and everyone would gather around the table to see what it was and what it did. It took years to guess how rare cards were. I traded a mox emerald for a Shivan once and everyone thought that was reasonable. Now everyone knows before they open the first pack what the cards are and how rare they are. Just not the same.

As for mixing the Realms into it, why would you? There are too many cards already. They don't need to deal with copywrite issues and financial rights of authors when they can just put a different name instead. Would be stupid if you ask me.
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sleyvas
Great Reader

USA
7253 Posts

Posted - 30 Jan 2018 :  03:04:03  Show Profile Send sleyvas a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Ayrik

Software which provides references and tools (for DM and players) would be smart. Especially if they kept it updated with the latest errata/revisions. And basically convert the entire game from hardcopy to softcopy, you can't really share your unique product/DLC keys on torrent sites, lol. I think the ultimate dream (from Wizbro's perspective) would be a truly "paperless" D&D RPG system, everything you need to plan and prepare and play (and buy more of) the game all a few clicks away after you login to your account on their cloud. Combine with a "match-making" system, a variety of tiers and tournaments, achievements and awards, etc ... and suddenly you've got yourself a virtual RPG which sucks lives away as well as "true" MMORPGs like WoW.

But for all we know, they're just putting together a team to do a high-visibility makeover on their website. It's clear that their attention is focussed on MtG, though, so I don't seriously expect to (ever) see any official D&D software of a useful nature.



Oh, I didn't catch the part that it was MtG focused... yeah, that would make sense. Hmmm, I know they at one point release a MtG videogame. Do they have an online card game? What about an MMORPG? Honestly, that might be able to get some people, kind of like how WoW did originally because everyone really got into the storyline playing the strategy games.

Alavairthae, may your skill prevail

Phillip aka Sleyvas
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sfdragon
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2216 Posts

Posted - 30 Jan 2018 :  03:20:48  Show Profile Send sfdragon a Private Message  Reply with Quote
mtg: well its sucks. I only ever bought a few cards of it and only because I liked the art on them.

would not buy any crossover cards of realms and mt:G. they are as said obsurd and still in obsurdity like pokemon was back when it had some unbelievable monsters in it.


why is being a wizard like being a drow? both are likely to find a dagger in the back from a rival or one looking to further his own goals, fame and power


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Magister's GAmbit
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
Moderator

USA
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Posted - 30 Jan 2018 :  03:47:32  Show Profile Send Wooly Rupert a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Markustay

Can't agree more with Wooly more about some of the bizarro responses out of WotC during the 4e era. Not sure if someone wasn't taking their meds, or someone took the whole bottle.

I wonder if they ever learned that stopping piracy (which they'll never do) won't actual make more people BUY their products? The kind of people who steal that stuff wasn't going to buy them regardless. Its a wash. All your doing there is making it harder for your customers to get the products - the ones who are actually trying to give you money.


That was what was so bizarre about it -- okay, sure, I can see taking steps to get pirated stuff from the newest ruleset out of the picture. But taking down the stuff from older, no longer supported rulesets? That didn't make sense -- those sales were pure profit for them, especially since Paizo was the company hosting the files and handling the transactions.

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Starshade
Learned Scribe

Norway
201 Posts

Posted - 30 Jan 2018 :  09:33:36  Show Profile Send Starshade a Private Message  Reply with Quote
If they print MtG cards and bundle them with D&D, it's a sure way to sell product. The other way? hmm. Time will tell! Maybe D&D gets more players..

Edited by - Starshade on 30 Jan 2018 09:34:03
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sleyvas
Great Reader

USA
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Posted - 30 Jan 2018 :  13:33:24  Show Profile Send sleyvas a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Yeah, I am intrigued to see the Ixalan article someone recently posted about which crosses over into the 5e ruleset. Granted, I'm not watching MtG to see this kind of stuff, but it may bring MtG players into D&D. I feel like we all know that the originators of MtG were big D&D fans (enough so that they bought the company and then introduced 3e/3.5e). Honestly, for all the talk of 5e being successful, I honestly feel like it was that edition that was more successful than most, especially since in my view the quickly realized their faults and introduced the 3.5e ruleset to fix them. It was much later that the flaws at the epic levels started to be realized by themselves and the players as well (enough so that a lot of us followed those same flaws into pathfinder.... and by flaws I mean simple math issues along with the odds of things happening).

Anyway, it would be intriguing to see some "alternate universe" wherein the rules work slightly differently in which the universes of MtG are explored from a roleplaying perspective. Given the idea that magic comes from the land, if said universe had ties to the same universe as Athas with its defilers of the land, that might be very intriguing.

Alavairthae, may your skill prevail

Phillip aka Sleyvas
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