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Firestorm
Senior Scribe
Canada
826 Posts |
 Posted - 01 Oct 2013 : 13:54:39
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My review. Had to redo this and may have missed a few things since I lost the original I had typed up on my PC.
Overall, I loved the intro chapters. Meeting Vasen and getting Varra's story. Learning that the son of Regg raised Vasen was great(it showed later with his urgency to heal the little boy who drank the Black rain(brown, whatever, I am half Japanese. The first thing I thought of was Black rain and Hiroshima lol). Seeing the groundwork of Riven, Meph and the abbey was great.
The Oracle's scenes were great. Little Elden thinking of Papa and J and wishing that he could have talked to them like that when they were alive.
OMG. A Blink dog! I so not remember having seen a blink dog since the thing that got me into DnD. An old TSR "Endless quest" choose your own path of adventure book called "The Dungeon of Dread". My brother got it when I was very young, but at age 6, I was drawn to the damn cover. A watery cobra rising from a small pool of water attacking a warrior. Warrior Caric and cowardly Hafling Laurus braving the evil Wizard Kalman's mountain home, which contains all the treasure in the world! I learned more about DnD Monsters in that sort book at age 6 than anything else.
Seeing that Blink dog made my day! That and Elden passing away saying "Papa" and stealing the brothers moment was so well done.
Gerak was a great character. His story arc was a bit hard to read due to the pain you know the character was feeling when he had to make that "Choice", and knowing he was going to be miserable forever after. The scene towards the end with riven giving him the girls got you teary eyed. Overall, he definitely felt a bit like the outsider of the trio. Orsin and Vasen both being different worked towards their character development and initial bonding, but Gerak was more of an average competent man with a vengeance quest.
Vasen is accepted and respected by his brotherhood, but you could tell they always treated him different. Byrne's comments which he apologized for just showed that perfectly.
The Chapters with Brennus, Telamont and Rivalen always had me on the edge of my seat. I did hope Telamont was going to backhand Rivalen just to show he still could. Alas.....
Even his brief scene blasting a source protected Magadon left me wanting a bit more from the big daddy. But overall, I loved his chapters. I love how Brennus let Magadon see through his eyes to explain why he hated Rivalen, and how he transferred those images to the Most high.
I kept thinking to myself that Brennus might become a convert. We always knew about first of five and second of five. I kept thinking eventually a few others would get a formal title. It occurs to me belated that Meph, Vasen and Rivalen were the 3rd, 4th and 5th, although I do not remember them being called that. But they were the 5 keys to Mask's Resurrection.
In the end, Rivalen and Brennus had a very satisfying ending.
Yikes. I had a zillion questions.
-Did you always plan to bring Cale back? Did you always plan to have riven become Mask? or did you flip flop a bit?
Cale getting killed by Meph and then smelling Jak's pipeweed.....One of the few times I ever threw a book on the floor in emotion. If a book can get me that upset over killing someone, you know I love the character lol. I am curious as to how he smelled the pipeweed at the time. Maybe mask was trying to ease him in his trial?
His return did seem rather abrupt though with not much time for chatter with his son. But I suspect the original idea was going to fit into a trilogy! lol.
Overall, The old characters were so far above the new characters in power that i can see why they had separate arcs for the most part. Cale and his son are so different as people that I can see some friction in the future.
-I am kind of assuming Riven absorbed not only the 3 fractions of divinity that Kesson Rel held(Since he was a level 0 divine being), but also as the eye shrank, a good portion of Mask's old power.
-Soooo. Azrrim and Tamlin in future books? lol.
I remembered this was supposed to be a trilogy and it felt like it could have been stretched into a trilogy because of the explosion of incredible amounts of awesome in the last 2/3'ds of the book. When I heard this was a trilogy(Godborn, Godbound, Godslayer I think were the names) before it got swapped, I had this idea in my head that Vasen would undergo this quest over 3 books lol. I figured he would meet up with Mags somehow and that a few new characters would join in, with Riven eventually making more and more appearances. Thought Maybe tamlin would be a first book villain(Maybe he is a bit more competent now), leading to Azrrim joining up somehow(Was on the fence about Azrrim maybe joining their party somehow. (Stranger things have happened. Like Riven's character development from superfoe to brother lol), at which point they might have to trek into the hells for Cale.
Maybe Azrrim is restless and trying to become an Epic white or Black Slaad? lol. Ill admit, I was really interested to see how Tamlin developped and to see him and a precursory villain. I suspect Cale's curiosity will get the better of him too. He is going to want to know what happened to the rest of the Uskevren after he was entombed.
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Firestorm
Senior Scribe
Canada
826 Posts |
Posted - 02 Oct 2013 : 19:55:05
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Got my hardcover copy today :)
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Dennis
Great Reader
9933 Posts |
Posted - 13 Oct 2013 : 16:40:30
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Agreed on the Tanthuls. Telamont should have spanked Rivalen. At least he got to "show off" and proved why he IS the Most High--though Mags is hardly a challenge, really, even with the Source's help.
Oh, you forgot Orsin's last scene. Him kneeling and praying "Lord of Shadows, hear my words”and Riven responding with "Fine, but first get off your damned knees, Shadowalker" is just priceless.
Sad to see Rivalen and Brennus go . . . And sadder still when Telamont actually CRIED. |
Every beginning has an end. |
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CorellonsDevout
Great Reader
USA
2708 Posts |
Posted - 13 Oct 2013 : 22:22:43
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I agree that the last scene with Orsin was great.
Overall, I loved the book. I've waited a long time for it. I felt the ending was a bit rushed--there was a lot of build up and then bam! I would have liked to seen more of Magadon too, but I was happy Cale returned. I would have preferred (as mentioned in the poll you created, Dennis), that Mask had stayed as himself rather than Riven becoming Mask, but then we would have gotten that aforementioned Orsin/Riven scene. Eldan becoming the Oracle was very touching, I think.
This book definitely had a dark/horror element to it, and almost every character spills some sort of bodily fluid. A little disgusting at times, but nothing I'd really complain over. Gore happens lol.
Vasen is a great character. I would like to see more of him in future novels. Orsin was pretty awesome too, and of course there were the old favorites like Cale, Riven, and Mags. All in all, I loved this book, and await the next thing from Kemp! |
Sweet water and light laughter |
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Arcanus
Senior Scribe
485 Posts |
Posted - 14 Oct 2013 : 00:59:43
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I got the impression that Brennus might have survived because as noted by Hadhrune, Brennus's constructs still lived, they should have died if Brennus had perished.
I have to add that Magadon grates on me and I was pleased he had only a small part in the story. |
Edited by - Arcanus on 14 Oct 2013 01:02:10 |
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Tyrant
Senior Scribe
USA
586 Posts |
Posted - 14 Oct 2013 : 03:12:40
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quote:
Originally posted by Arcanus
I got the impression that Brennus might have survived because as noted by Hadhrune, Brennus's constructs still lived, they should have died if Brennus had perished.
I have to add that Magadon grates on me and I was pleased he had only a small part in the story.
I got that vibe as well, though I got it from the note that Brennus began to gather the shadows around him just before they were crushed. In the past that has mainly been to shadow jump.
Overall I really liked the book, just wish it was the trilogy it was supposed to be. Paul did a great job (both here and in the previous trilogy) humanizing the more powerful characters (Telamont, Rivalen, etc.). I kind of felt bad for the impossible situation Telamont found himself in as far as his sons. I also have to wonder how much longer Shar stays the state religion of Shade after what Shar has cost Telamont. |
Peace is a lie, there is only passion. Through passion, I gain strength. Through strength, I gain power. Through power, I gain victory. Through victory, my chains are broken. The Force shall free me.
-The Sith Code
Teenage Sith zombies, Tulkh thought-how in the moons of Bogden had it all started? Every so often, the universe must just get bored and decide to really cut loose. -Star Wars: Red Harvest |
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Dennis
Great Reader
9933 Posts |
Posted - 14 Oct 2013 : 03:52:16
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quote:
Originally posted by Arcanus
I got the impression that Brennus might have survived because as noted by Hadhrune, Brennus's constructs still lived, they should have died if Brennus had perished.
Agreed. And as Hadrhune mentioned, his homunculis survived when they should have perished when Brennus did. So the possibility is there . . . |
Every beginning has an end. |
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Dennis
Great Reader
9933 Posts |
Posted - 14 Oct 2013 : 03:55:55
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quote:
Originally posted by Tyrant
quote:
Originally posted by Arcanus
I got the impression that Brennus might have survived because as noted by Hadhrune, Brennus's constructs still lived, they should have died if Brennus had perished.
I have to add that Magadon grates on me and I was pleased he had only a small part in the story.
I got that vibe as well, though I got it from the note that Brennus began to gather the shadows around him just before they were crushed. In the past that has mainly been to shadow jump.
Overall I really liked the book, just wish it was the trilogy it was supposed to be. Paul did a great job (both here and in the previous trilogy) humanizing the more powerful characters (Telamont, Rivalen, etc.). I kind of felt bad for the impossible situation Telamont found himself in as far as his sons. I also have to wonder how much longer Shar stays the state religion of Shade after what Shar has cost Telamont.
I wholeheartedly agree.
Telamont petting Brennus's homunculis, eyes welling up--that was something.
And as much as I would have liked it if he spanked Rivalen for being naughty, in the end, we get to see that his role as father supercedes his role as emperor. He even refused to help Brennus and Mags kill Rivalen even after seeing how Rivalen killed Alashar. Evil men are still capable of love, it seems. |
Every beginning has an end. |
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CorellonsDevout
Great Reader
USA
2708 Posts |
Posted - 14 Oct 2013 : 03:57:23
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| I too was...touched by Telamont's softer side. It was interesting to see. |
Sweet water and light laughter |
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Dennis
Great Reader
9933 Posts |
Posted - 14 Oct 2013 : 04:08:38
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Aye, all the more that I was not expecting it. At. All. |
Every beginning has an end. |
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sagechan
Acolyte
USA
33 Posts |
Posted - 14 Oct 2013 : 04:15:57
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| While I got the Brennus may have survived vibe too, I also thought it might be a sign that he was much better at the constructs he (and his mother) loved then was given credit for with them surviving his death. |
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Dennis
Great Reader
9933 Posts |
Posted - 14 Oct 2013 : 05:06:15
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Perhaps. And their deaths might be final, if WotC is really serious in de-powering Shade in 5E. Getting rid of two valuable (and irreplaceable) princes of the empire is a big blow. Rivalen led the faith sector, and Brennus handled divination--two components that Telamont would probably take years to "rebuild." |
Every beginning has an end. |
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Arcanus
Senior Scribe
485 Posts |
Posted - 14 Oct 2013 : 09:55:45
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quote:
Originally posted by Dennis
Perhaps. And their deaths might be final, if WotC is really serious in de-powering Shade in 5E. Getting rid of two valuable (and irreplaceable) princes of the empire is a big blow. Rivalen led the faith sector, and Brennus handled divination--two components that Telamont would probably take years to "rebuild."
Agreed. They probably shadowstepped to escape their doom, it is second nature to them after all. |
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Firestorm
Senior Scribe
Canada
826 Posts |
Posted - 14 Oct 2013 : 14:09:33
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I know Volumvax/Kesson Rel was statwise, only a level 0 quasi-Deity in Lords of Darkness write up. However, I prefer to think of him as a divine rank 3 Demigod after reabsorbing the greater part of the divine essence he used to bound Furlinastis.
The characteristics demonstrated by him and Riven later suggest demigodhood traits from faiths and Pantheons as opposed to quasi-godhood.
Overall I also prefer to interpret Riven's absorbing all 3 essence parts as more than it seems. In short, Shar's eye was Mask's complete power trying to suck up the last of it, and Riven absorbed that as well, closing the eye, and ascending to true intermediate deity status like Mask was before.
Divine Level 10, etc |
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Dennis
Great Reader
9933 Posts |
Posted - 14 Oct 2013 : 15:36:01
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quote:
Originally posted by Arcanus
quote:
Originally posted by Dennis
Perhaps. And their deaths might be final, if WotC is really serious in de-powering Shade in 5E. Getting rid of two valuable (and irreplaceable) princes of the empire is a big blow. Rivalen led the faith sector, and Brennus handled divination--two components that Telamont would probably take years to "rebuild."
Agreed. They probably shadowstepped to escape their doom, it is second nature to them after all.
Indeed, not to mention the place where they were at were practically surrounded and suffused with shadows.
On a different note . . . I hate to spoil the fun, but did anyone notice how Gerak turned to be Legolas Extraordinaire with unlimited supply of arrows? It's one of the things that kinda annoyed me, the main reason I rated the book 9 instead of a perfect 10. |
Every beginning has an end. |
Edited by - Dennis on 14 Oct 2013 15:40:30 |
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geok1ng
Acolyte
Brazil
9 Posts |
Posted - 14 Oct 2013 : 15:53:54
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| The Godborn was the best FR novel of 2013 so far. That is not saying much, considering how lame Elmnister and Drizz novels turned out, full of rezzs, reincarnations and Deus ex Machina. At least we have Cale back, the most psychologically developed FR character so far. Lets see what the future reserves. |
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Tamsar
Learned Scribe
United Kingdom
141 Posts |
Posted - 14 Oct 2013 : 20:49:23
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quote:
On a different note . . . I hate to spoil the fun, but did anyone notice how Gerak turned to be Legolas Extraordinaire with unlimited supply of arrows? It's one of the things that kinda annoyed me, the main reason I rated the book 9 instead of a perfect 10.
I liked Gerak as a character, talk about being emotionally desolated though...ouch. I recall at least one scene in the book where he gathered arrows he had used, so it didn't bother me too much, just assumed he gathered his arrows "off camera" so too speak.
"I need to kill the men who did this". "Yes. Yes you do." Who says Paladins can't be bad ass! Although I think my favourite line was Brennus to Rivalen "Your Bitterness is sweet......to me" What a great F#ck you line to throw back at Rivalen. Epic book.
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Do not go gentle into that good night,
Old age should burn and rave at close of day;
Rage, rage against the dying of the light |
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Dennis
Great Reader
9933 Posts |
Posted - 18 Oct 2013 : 17:48:10
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quote:
Originally posted by Tamsar
quote:
On a different note . . . I hate to spoil the fun, but did anyone notice how Gerak turned to be Legolas Extraordinaire with unlimited supply of arrows? It's one of the things that kinda annoyed me, the main reason I rated the book 9 instead of a perfect 10.
I liked Gerak as a character, talk about being emotionally desolated though...ouch. I recall at least one scene in the book where he gathered arrows he had used, so it didn't bother me too much, just assumed he gathered his arrows "off camera" so too speak.
"I need to kill the men who did this". "Yes. Yes you do." Who says Paladins can't be bad ass! Although I think my favourite line was Brennus to Rivalen "Your Bitterness is sweet......to me" What a great F#ck you line to throw back at Rivalen. Epic book.
How many arrows can one person carry without severely impeding his ability to move or run? And remember that scene in Cania, they face horde of demons. Even if he got a dozen handy, that still would not be enough. And keep in mind too that retrieving the arrows was out of the question, unless he wanted to be crushed by the onrushing hungry, mad, demented demons.
As for Brennus's line, all I can say is:  . |
Every beginning has an end. |
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Entromancer
Senior Scribe
USA
388 Posts |
Posted - 19 Oct 2013 : 00:28:55
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| Zeeahd was an excellent villain. I absolutely hated him. There were some big tearjerkers for me, the biggest being Telamont's last scene in the novel. |
"...the will is everything. The will to act."--Ra's Al Ghul
"Suffering builds character."--Talia Al Ghul |
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jordanz
Senior Scribe
553 Posts |
Posted - 19 Oct 2013 : 16:24:59
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Great Novel. Love the plot,action and characters. Question what happens to Mephistopheles now? He teleports back to Cania depowered. Does Asmodeus just send some minions in to squash him?
Also whats up with Gerak's arrows? Wouldn't they have to be magical to harm devils and Arch devils? |
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jornan
Learned Scribe
Canada
256 Posts |
Posted - 19 Oct 2013 : 21:09:46
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| I can't believe how much people are getting up in arms about Gerak and the arrows. lol |
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jordanz
Senior Scribe
553 Posts |
Posted - 19 Oct 2013 : 21:48:23
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quote:
Originally posted by jornan
I can't believe how much people are getting up in arms about Gerak and the arrows. lol
Not upset just something that stood out as not making sense. Didn't see anyone else here mention it. |
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Mirtek
Senior Scribe
595 Posts |
Posted - 20 Oct 2013 : 19:06:40
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quote:
Originally posted by jornan
I can't believe how much people are getting up in arms about Gerak and the arrows. lol
Makes one wonder how many DMs really insist on counting a character's arrows  |
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Dennis
Great Reader
9933 Posts |
Posted - 21 Oct 2013 : 14:15:47
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quote:
Originally posted by jordanz
quote:
Originally posted by jornan
I can't believe how much people are getting up in arms about Gerak and the arrows. lol
Not upset just something that stood out as not making sense. Didn't see anyone else here mention it.
I pointed it out first because it didn't make sense. Remember, he barely had any arrows when he first ventured to the woods, just four, AFAIR. Granted he made some. But how many can one person actually carry without him falling on its sheer weight (if there's too many of them)? And he fired them mostly at demons, in the Abbey of the Rose and in Cania, where he had no way of retrieving them back. We don't have to be a Pulitzer-winning mathetician to be able to count/estimate the arrows he could or should have carried. |
Every beginning has an end. |
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jornan
Learned Scribe
Canada
256 Posts |
Posted - 21 Oct 2013 : 23:54:33
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| Did you not pick up on Gerak secretly being a Level 3 Math-magician. He was simply conjuring them off stage. I imagine this little known, and often missed, aspect of him will be fleshed out in greater detail as the series progresses. |
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The Masked Mage
Great Reader
USA
2420 Posts |
Posted - 22 Oct 2013 : 06:34:07
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I thought it was a good book, and agree that it is easily possible for Brennus to have survived. That does NOT mean he will go back to Shade, though. He has spent 100 years on Sakkors basically ignoring Telemont's instructions... perhaps he used this as an escape route...
I also did not like the endless quiver of arrows.
I did not like the cursed Thayan brothers sub-plot at all. Beyond the sensationalism of butchering people and grotesque transformations it did pretty much nothing in the book except give Gerak motivational hatred, which he seems to move past in a chapter or so anyways. Add to that they are both too stupid to see they are being played. I think everything they brought to the book could have been brought instead by one of the god-touched to give them more personality.
On a more personal - I wish it would have been - level, I wish Selune would have been a part of Shar's comeuppance. They were supposed to be each others main enemies, and Selune and her people do nothing to thwart the cycle of night? |
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Dennis
Great Reader
9933 Posts |
Posted - 22 Oct 2013 : 07:45:15
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quote:
Originally posted by The Masked Mage
I thought it was a good book, and agree that it is easily possible for Brennus to have survived. That does NOT mean he will go back to Shade, though. He has spent 100 years on Sakkors basically ignoring Telemont's instructions... perhaps he used this as an escape route...
I also did not like the endless quiver of arrows.
Possibly. Though I bet he'd give his father a last "visit"--to get his homunculi. And possibly, too, when his homunculi tell him the Most High has been treating them good while he's gone and has shared with them the pain Telamont felt when he thought he lost his two sons, Brennus might reconsider going back the to the fold.
quote:
I did not like the cursed Thayan brothers sub-plot at all. Beyond the sensationalism of butchering people and grotesque transformations it did pretty much nothing in the book except give Gerak motivational hatred, which he seems to move past in a chapter or so anyways. Add to that they are both too stupid to see they are being played. I think everything they brought to the book could have been brought instead by one of the god-touched to give them more personality.
My sentiments exactly. I don't love to hate them. I simply hate them.
quote:
On a more personal - I wish it would have been - level, I wish Selune would have been a part of Shar's comeuppance. They were supposed to be each others main enemies, and Selune and her people do nothing to thwart the cycle of night?
Who's to tell? Gods are supposed to work in mysterious ways. Selune and Amaunator are dieties of "light." They might be working together--via proxies, of course--to thwart the Cycle of Night.
Or the simple answer is, maybe Selune just doesn't interest Paul. |
Every beginning has an end. |
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Elfinblade
Senior Scribe
Norway
377 Posts |
Posted - 23 Oct 2013 : 17:29:23
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Fantastic read. Well worth the 5 year wait or however long it was. Some elements of the book seemed.. rushed, in lack of a better word. It's wasnt bad at all. just, fast paced i guess. Absolutely loved the character story arcs. I, too, hated the cursed brothers. I suspect we're being set up to be emotionally invested in Gerak. His pain and suffering etc would lead to some very interesting stories in future books.
I actually loved that Cale is back. I frowned upon a certain other realms author's choices in these matters, and i sort of hoped it wouldnt happen with Cale. But it did. And it didnt bother me at all! It felt like Cale getting his due, getting to spend time with his son(!).
The lack of Magadon is the reason i dont give this a natural 20 on my review dice. I suspect his part wouldnt have been as slightly diluted in the original trilogy plot.
Riven/mask is something i hadnt thought of actually. It surprised me, and left me feeling unsurprised at the same time. Riven is one of my all time favourite characters in any type of fiction really, it was great to see alot of him in this one. He'll make an awesome Mask.
Also, i have absolutely hated Rivalen since i first read about him. And i guess it's because he is damn well written. I was left feeling satisfied that Brennus got back at Rivalen at the end.
It's a shame it's not longer to be honest. I would have loved to read this as a trilogy, but it worked out great as a single novel as well.
Can't wait to hear about Paul's next realms novels! I have it on good authority that it might contain some known faces :)
I give Godborn a 18 on my review dice:) |
Edited by - Elfinblade on 23 Oct 2013 17:32:36 |
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CorellonsDevout
Great Reader
USA
2708 Posts |
Posted - 24 Oct 2013 : 02:44:12
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I'm glad Cale has returned, and I too was disappointed Mags got such a small part. That, and suddenly he and the Source are "friends", so to speak, after what it did to him in the Twilight Wars.
Godborn was meant to stand on its own while still being part of the Sundering series, but it would have been nice if it had expanded to a trilogy. Still, I too believe we might see more of these characters |
Sweet water and light laughter |
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skychrome
Senior Scribe
713 Posts |
Posted - 26 Oct 2013 : 07:52:17
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Finished the book recently and liked it, but at the same time I am kinda disappointed.
This book should have been a trilogy, it was just too rushed for a single novel. One of the most complex plots on Toril, where all the players have been looking for the big picture and/or Vasen for a century, and then everything unfolds in what feels like 5 minutes.
Mags' appearance was...hm...was what? Probably there would have been more to it in a trilogy.
Did not like Sayeed and Zeeahd as villains. No, actually it was not them, I just hated the gory parts they were associated with. Not my kind of thing, for that I can buy a horror novel if I feel like I need to.
Cale's appearance was so quick/short/weird, there was no time to re-connect to him in any way as he went straight in the fight and then the book was over.
In the end I liked it, because I read the previous books and because Paul is simply one of my favourite authors. But this is the first time, I did not really get enthusiastic about one of his books. Guess that had to happen at one point of time.
I am curious, if there is more Vasen and Cale to come in the future? |
"You make an intriguing offer, one that is very tempting. It would seem that I have little alternative than to answer thusly: DISINTEGRATE!" Vaarsuvius, Order of the Stick 625 |
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Demzer
Senior Scribe
873 Posts |
Posted - 26 Oct 2013 : 09:45:28
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quote:
Originally posted by skychrome
... Sayeed and Zeeahd ...
A tribute to Mass Effect 2/3 NPC Zaeed Massani? |
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Godborn review: ALERT! SPOILERS!!
