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Diffan
Great Reader
USA
4429 Posts |
 Posted - 24 Sep 2011 : 16:51:48
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quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
quote:
Originally posted by MrHedgehog
I chose beholder because it sticks out the most in my mind, and I found them fascinating. Its for sure the most iconic creature that was entirely invented for D&D, most of the others were taken from past mythologies. Beholders (and displacer beasts, but I don't really think they are iconic) are truley unique to D&D. They came from D&D and exist in other media like Heroes of Might and Magic, and possibly elsewhere I don't know about!
Uh.... If it exists elsewhere, it's not unique to D&D.
Considering that it originated from D&D and only the IP owners can allow it to branch into other media makes it unique to my sensibilities. And while there are similiarities between the Beholder and THIS monster, they're not the same. Outside of D&D, I can't remember ever seeing a creature resembling a Beholder.
Dragons on the other hand.......are everywhere in all forms and with no "owner" for their specific usage. While they're generally iconic to D&D, I wouldn't say D&D springs to mind when I instantly see one.
Another truely Iconic creature in D&D are Drow. When I see those, I instantly think of D&D and Drizzt. So I'd say Beholders, Drow, then Dragons for iconic symbols of Dungeons and Dragons. |
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Seethyr
Master of Realmslore
USA
1151 Posts |
Posted - 24 Sep 2011 : 17:43:36
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quote:
Originally posted by Diffan
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
quote:
Originally posted by MrHedgehog
I chose beholder because it sticks out the most in my mind, and I found them fascinating. Its for sure the most iconic creature that was entirely invented for D&D, most of the others were taken from past mythologies. Beholders (and displacer beasts, but I don't really think they are iconic) are truley unique to D&D. They came from D&D and exist in other media like Heroes of Might and Magic, and possibly elsewhere I don't know about!
Uh.... If it exists elsewhere, it's not unique to D&D.
Considering that it originated from D&D and only the IP owners can allow it to branch into other media makes it unique to my sensibilities. And while there are similiarities between the Beholder and THIS monster, they're not the same. Outside of D&D, I can't remember ever seeing a creature resembling a Beholder.
Dragons on the other hand.......are everywhere in all forms and with no "owner" for their specific usage. While they're generally iconic to D&D, I wouldn't say D&D springs to mind when I instantly see one.
Another truely Iconic creature in D&D are Drow. When I see those, I instantly think of D&D and Drizzt. So I'd say Beholders, Drow, then Dragons for iconic symbols of Dungeons and Dragons.
Drow have developed quite a bit of popularity from D&D but their origin, or at least something similar, has its roots in Scandinavian folklore.
Reading all these posts makes me think it's more of a select group of abberations that are iconic...not just beholders.
Again, I'd certainly pick Dragons as my favorite, but not the most iconic. |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36779 Posts |
Posted - 24 Sep 2011 : 18:45:30
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Here's something to consider, folks, that others have already brought up, but is worth restating: a lot of the suggested "iconic" critters are rarely, if ever, found outside of D&D. Many of them, in fact, if seen by someone not familiar with D&D, might be mistaken as something out of sci-fi.
Thinks I that if something truly iconic for D&D, it's going to be something that people not familiar with D&D will look at and think, "oh, that must be something D&D-related." |
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jordanz
Senior Scribe
553 Posts |
Posted - 24 Sep 2011 : 20:55:30
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quote:
Originally posted by entreri3478
What do you think is the most iconic Dungeons & Dragons monster/race of all time? If your choice is not listed please let us know.
Solars just for their sheer rarity, majesty, and power. I don't think I have ever seen solar in a forgotten realms Novel... |
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Seethyr
Master of Realmslore
USA
1151 Posts |
Posted - 24 Sep 2011 : 21:11:52
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quote:
Originally posted by jordanz
quote:
Originally posted by entreri3478
What do you think is the most iconic Dungeons & Dragons monster/race of all time? If your choice is not listed please let us know.
Solars just for their sheer rarity, majesty, and power. I don't think I have ever seen solar in a forgotten realms Novel...
come to think of it, have there been any good outsiders? The Sannyasi from Faces of Deception is all I can think of. |
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Ayrik
Great Reader
Canada
7969 Posts |
Posted - 25 Sep 2011 : 02:40:42
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| I'm rather partial towards genasi ... they've even almost managed to become regular inhabitants of my pre-3E Realms setting. Cambions and Alu-demons are always fine beasts; somehow being half human makes them more fearsome than pureblooded fiends. Tieflings are too diluted for my tastes, just another superficial makeover on humanity, basically just an ethnic group (albeit one with rather unusual ethnicity) struggling to find acceptance in society - got enough of those to choose from already. |
[/Ayrik] |
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Chosen of Asmodeus
Master of Realmslore
1221 Posts |
Posted - 25 Sep 2011 : 10:08:33
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| Gotta go with dragons, red dragons specifically. |
"Then I saw there was a way to Hell even from the gates of Heaven"
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Nilus Reynard
Learned Scribe
Canada
137 Posts |
Posted - 06 Oct 2011 : 04:46:50
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I went with Other. And that other is the Rust Monster.
While it may not be able to inflict much (if any) harm on the character, it has no problem destroying your weapons, armor & other gear. Some of these items were hard to get, others players came across by mere chance (and most likely never would again), and some they have had for a long time. I have seen groups of heavily armed (and high level) players run in fear from one of these creatures, players that could easily have slain an elder beholder.
All of my characters carried a bag of rough iron spikes with them in case they came across a Rust Monster. I learned the first time, after my fighter had his magical chainmail & both of his short swords consumed by one of these beasts. |
Nilus Reynard
Doom Master of Beshaba, Hand of Despair.
P24 Hm CN
(2nd Edition AD&D) |
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BARDOBARBAROS
Senior Scribe
Greece
581 Posts |
Posted - 06 Oct 2011 : 08:46:00
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| Dragon |
BARDOBARBAROS DOES NOT KILL.
HE DECAPITATES!!!
"The city changes, but the fools within it remain always the same" (Edwin Odesseiron- Baldur's gate 2) |
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Therise
Master of Realmslore
1272 Posts |
Posted - 06 Oct 2011 : 09:05:21
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For "most iconic" I'd have to vote beholder. I'm a little sad no one has yet said "gelatinous cube" or "flumph", though. 
Dragons are ubiquitous in general fantasy, like parsley in Italian cooking.
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Female, 40-year DM of a homebrew-evolved 1E Realms, including a few added tidbits of 2E and 3E lore; played originally in AD&D, then in Rolemaster. Be a DM for your kids and grandkids, gaming is excellent for families! |
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Artemas Entreri
Great Reader
USA
3131 Posts |
Posted - 06 Oct 2011 : 14:01:08
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quote:
Originally posted by Therise
For "most iconic" I'd have to vote beholder. I'm a little sad no one has yet said "gelatinous cube" or "flumph", though.
Dragons are ubiquitous in general fantasy, like parsley in Italian cooking.
I mentioned the Rust Monster, does that count? Besides, when i think of the Gelatinous Cube it just reminds me of my roommate back in college |
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Therise
Master of Realmslore
1272 Posts |
Posted - 06 Oct 2011 : 16:03:50
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quote:
Originally posted by entreri3478
quote:
Originally posted by Therise
For "most iconic" I'd have to vote beholder. I'm a little sad no one has yet said "gelatinous cube" or "flumph", though.
Dragons are ubiquitous in general fantasy, like parsley in Italian cooking.
I mentioned the Rust Monster, does that count? Besides, when i think of the Gelatinous Cube it just reminds me of my roommate back in college
Rust Monster definitely gets props, but many roommates better fit the ochre jelly. Maybe a gray pudding. Especially if they're addicted to Eve Online. "Heyo! Bring meh the Doritos and spray cheez!"
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Female, 40-year DM of a homebrew-evolved 1E Realms, including a few added tidbits of 2E and 3E lore; played originally in AD&D, then in Rolemaster. Be a DM for your kids and grandkids, gaming is excellent for families! |
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Artemas Entreri
Great Reader
USA
3131 Posts |
Posted - 06 Oct 2011 : 16:09:52
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quote:
Originally posted by Therise
quote:
Originally posted by entreri3478
quote:
Originally posted by Therise
For "most iconic" I'd have to vote beholder. I'm a little sad no one has yet said "gelatinous cube" or "flumph", though.
Dragons are ubiquitous in general fantasy, like parsley in Italian cooking.
I mentioned the Rust Monster, does that count? Besides, when i think of the Gelatinous Cube it just reminds me of my roommate back in college
Rust Monster definitely gets props, but many roommates better fit the ochre jelly. Maybe a gray pudding. Especially if they're addicted to Eve Online. "Heyo! Bring meh the Doritos and spray cheez!"
LOL good one |
Some people have a way with words, and other people...oh, uh, not have way. -Steve Martin
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Alystra Illianniis
Great Reader
USA
3750 Posts |
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Thauranil
Master of Realmslore
India
1591 Posts |
Posted - 23 Feb 2012 : 11:55:10
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I have to go with the Drow. They are an original and extremely iconic creation of the realms. When you think of the realms one of the most prominent images in anyone's mind will be Drizzt or a Drow matron mother.
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Thauranil
Master of Realmslore
India
1591 Posts |
Posted - 23 Feb 2012 : 12:02:02
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quote:
Originally posted by Kilvan
quote:
Originally posted by entreri3478
What is so special about a dragon? You seem them in 99% of fantasy literature. Beholders and Mind Flayers are found in only one place.
I don't agree with this argument. There are hundreds of creature unique to d&d that few cares about, and we don't call them iconic. I think a beholder or a mind flayer is much more cool and original than a flaming red dragon, but more iconic? Nope, not at all.
I have to disagree with you there. I mean when you think of dragons you think of Smaug or saint George or something. Who thinks about Tchazzar?
So dragons dont really represent the realms the way a monster like a drow does. |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36779 Posts |
Posted - 23 Feb 2012 : 14:08:02
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quote:
Originally posted by Thauranil
I have to go with the Drow. They are an original and extremely iconic creation of the realms. When you think of the realms one of the most prominent images in anyone's mind will be Drizzt or a Drow matron mother.
That would be like saying humans are iconic of the Realms because of Elminster.
Drow are not original to the Realms, and I think that calling them iconic for the setting does a disservice to the setting -- the Realms is so much more than just one or two characters and their race. It doesn't matter if it's Liriel, or Elminster, or Erevis, or Bahb the Fighter -- characters are only one aspect of a setting.
And for me, the images of drow that come most readily to mind are from a Dragon cover and an old Greyhawk supplement/module (I don't actually own it, so I don't know which it is). Images of the Realms that come most readily to mind for me are the covers of Azure Bonds, FR5 The Savage Frontier, FR9 The Bloodstone Lands, Forgotten Realms Adventures, Spellfire, and the cover of the Shadowdale book in the 2E FRCS. Not one of those books has a drow on the cover. |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36779 Posts |
Posted - 23 Feb 2012 : 14:20:55
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quote:
Originally posted by Thauranil
quote:
Originally posted by Kilvan
quote:
Originally posted by entreri3478
What is so special about a dragon? You seem them in 99% of fantasy literature. Beholders and Mind Flayers are found in only one place.
I don't agree with this argument. There are hundreds of creature unique to d&d that few cares about, and we don't call them iconic. I think a beholder or a mind flayer is much more cool and original than a flaming red dragon, but more iconic? Nope, not at all.
I have to disagree with you there. I mean when you think of dragons you think of Smaug or saint George or something. Who thinks about Tchazzar?
So dragons dont really represent the realms the way a monster like a drow does.
There's a lot of dragons I think of before Smaug, and not all of them are D&D dragons... But the fact remains that the game is named Dungeons & Dragons, and you can't get more iconic than the name of the game itself.
And the original question wasn't about the Realms, it was about D&D in general.
Drow can be found on just about any D&D world you can name -- but not all of them (Krynn and Athas are drowless). Dragons, on the other hand, can be found on any D&D world.
And no D&D player is going to remember killing his first drow nearly as readily as his first dragon...
So dragons are far more iconic than just another common D&D race. |
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Edited by - Wooly Rupert on 23 Feb 2012 14:23:14 |
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Fellfire
Master of Realmslore
1965 Posts |
Posted - 23 Feb 2012 : 14:31:11
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| I voted Other. For me, Mind Flayers or Rust Monsters. |
Misanthorpe
Love is a lie. Only hate endures. Light is blinding. Only in darkness do we see clearly.
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Jorkens
Great Reader
Norway
2950 Posts |
Posted - 23 Feb 2012 : 14:50:07
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For me its the Beholder. It is completely illogical, original to D&D and a part of the game since the early days. I love them. especially the grinning Fabian versions.
The Rust Monster would be a good choice also of course. |
No Canon, more stories, more Realms. |
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Wolfhound75
Learned Scribe
USA
217 Posts |
Posted - 23 Feb 2012 : 15:16:16
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I'm inclined to agree with Wooly.
While I agree that dragons are also used in many other fantasy settings, it's very hard to claim that any other beast, unique to D&D or not, is more iconic than the one chosen by the creator to be part of the game's name.
They are in fact so iconic that I once had a highschool teacher with a doctorate degree leave a hand-scrawled note on a paper I had written in which I took the time to describe a fight between the characters and a 'blue lightning-breathing dragon' figuring that anyone who was not a D&D fan wouldn't automatically know that blue dragons have a lightning breath. At no time did I ever mention the relationship to D&D either pre-writing discussion or in the paper which makes it amazing that the note that he wrote on the top of my paper said, "You must be a Dungeons & Dragons fan!"
I later approached him to discuss his note and admitted that I was a D&D fan and player. I asked him if he was a fan and played D&D as well. He replied that he had heard of the game in passing due to the 'satanic' discussion but had never played it or read any of the game-related literature, either sourcebooks or novels. I went on to query him about how he was able to match my description of a 'blue lightning-breathing dragon' to the D&D game line and his response was quite easy. It's the only thing I've ever heard of where Dragons have distinctive colors and different forms of breathing [breath weapons]. Furthermore he went on to state that every other dragon you run across in literature from St. George's to Tolkien's Smaug all breathe fire and since this was a class based upon English Literature, you could assume he was somewhat of a subject matter expert.
It's interesting to note that this anecdote occured in the late 1980s before CRPGs became popular and thereby brought dragons with varying breath weapons into mainstream culture. Colored (Chromatic or Metallic) dragons could therefore be considered so iconic that someone who had never read any D&D literature was able to associate a purposefully vague description of a blue lightning breathing dragon with the game we all love, Dungeons & Dragons.
This just reinforces many scribes thoughts that Dragons are definately the most iconic creature as evidenced by Gygax choosing to make them part of the name. I would submit that varying colors of chromatic and metallic dragons are truly what makes them icons. Without this variation brought about by D&D, it doesn't matter what game you are playing, it would just be another fire-breathing dragon marauding a village.
Good Hunting!
EDIT: ...evidenced...not evidence. *sigh* Quick reply strikes again. |
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"If at first you do succeed, you must've rolled a natural 20!" |
Edited by - Wolfhound75 on 23 Feb 2012 15:19:40 |
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Seravin
Master of Realmslore
Canada
1265 Posts |
Posted - 23 Feb 2012 : 16:39:23
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Beholders, Displacer Beasts, and Mind Flayers are all my picks (though I went with Beholder).
The only other would be a Rust Monster, because I think of the one in the Red Box set from the early 80s that would destroy your metal armor. To me that little thing represents the first interesting beast I fought in D&D.
Dragons are too generic...I think of them as fantasy not D&D specific. |
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Eladrinstar
Learned Scribe
USA
196 Posts |
Posted - 23 Feb 2012 : 18:38:59
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| When I think of "D&D monsters" I think Beholders. I think of others, but Beholders pop to mind first. |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36779 Posts |
Posted - 23 Feb 2012 : 19:11:43
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| Beholders are certainly iconic for those that know the game... But if you don't know D&D, seeing a beholder won't make you think of it. It might make you think of that critter in Big Trouble in Little China... |
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Wolfhound75
Learned Scribe
USA
217 Posts |
Posted - 23 Feb 2012 : 20:30:55
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It might boil down to how familiar an individual is with D&D. Greater knowledge of the game the more one might favor the unique monsters. But for average person out and about who doesn't know that Beholders are a unique monster to D&D and were invented specifically for D&D, they won't picture that monster. IMO, they're going to likely picture something akin to a knight and a wizard battling a dragon if you ask them, "When you hear the words "Dungeons & Dragons" what do you think of?
Good Hunting! |
"Firepower - if it's not working, you're not using enough." ~ Military Proverb
"If at first you do succeed, you must've rolled a natural 20!" |
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Artemas Entreri
Great Reader
USA
3131 Posts |
Posted - 23 Feb 2012 : 20:44:36
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quote:
Originally posted by Wolfhound75
IMO, they're going to likely picture something akin to a knight and a wizard battling a dragon if you ask them, "When you hear the words "Dungeons & Dragons" what do you think of?
Good Hunting!
I am sure many people would answer: "Nerds" |
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Seravin
Master of Realmslore
Canada
1265 Posts |
Posted - 23 Feb 2012 : 21:00:53
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| There was a Beholder in Futurama :) Which, probably those who watch Futurama know D&D... |
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Wolfhound75
Learned Scribe
USA
217 Posts |
Posted - 23 Feb 2012 : 21:13:35
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quote:
Originally posted by entreri3478
quote:
Originally posted by Wolfhound75
IMO, they're going to likely picture something akin to a knight and a wizard battling a dragon if you ask them, "When you hear the words "Dungeons & Dragons" what do you think of?
Good Hunting!
I am sure many people would answer: "Nerds"
You just made me snort my coffee out of my nose! I haven't laughed that hard in a while! Thanks for the sense of humor!
Good Hunting! |
"Firepower - if it's not working, you're not using enough." ~ Military Proverb
"If at first you do succeed, you must've rolled a natural 20!" |
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Artemas Entreri
Great Reader
USA
3131 Posts |
Posted - 23 Feb 2012 : 21:21:35
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| Ha ha my pleasure. I couldn't resist when I read your question. |
Some people have a way with words, and other people...oh, uh, not have way. -Steve Martin
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TBeholder
Great Reader
2384 Posts |
Posted - 23 Feb 2012 : 22:17:51
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quote:
Originally posted by Therise
For "most iconic" I'd have to vote beholder. I'm a little sad no one has yet said "gelatinous cube" or "flumph", though.
I was surprised it's not in options.
quote:
Originally posted by entreri3478
I mentioned the Rust Monster, does that count?
Or a mimic? |
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Topic |
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Most Iconic D&D Monster
