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Garen Thal
Master of Realmslore
USA
1105 Posts |
 Posted - 31 Oct 2008 : 13:50:04
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quote:
Originally posted by Ashe Ravenheart
Good points all.
But I don't think Garen can or should answer them. He's giving his interpretation of events based on the (rather skimpy, IMHO) facts that are already present. We've been through all of this before, in many different threads and the answer always comes out the same. So rather than picking up the shovel to beat this dead horse again, why don't we let it rest?
Actually, Ashe, I'm perfectly happy to answer questions or respond to concerns, at least for a while.
I'd like, however, to keep the discussion to what people think about the explanation, not about what I'm explaining. A lot of the discussion of this most-important event seems to center less around questions of "why is the sky blue?" than "why can't the sky be green?" I already know that people are dissatisfied with the death of Mystra, and no amount of explanation is going to reverse that death or people's attitudes about it (although there *is* an out provided, for those that want it). All anyone can do, now that Mystra's death is canon, is try and provide an explanation that's consistent with existing Realmslore and the understanding that folks have of the Realms. |
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Rinonalyrna Fathomlin
Great Reader
USA
7106 Posts |
Posted - 31 Oct 2008 : 16:32:38
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quote:
Originally posted by Garen Thal
At that moment, no. In the instant that she was killed, Mystra was effectively *not* Mystra, but something more vulnerable and mortal. It means a lot more than simply "she had fewer hp." For a brief moment, Mystra was, for all intents and purposes, entirely divorced from the Weave.
I guess I just still don't understand why Mystra would have the desire to suddenly turn mortal upon meeting up with a random "mortal servant of Kelemvor". I'm sorry, Garen, but I just find that bizarre. Or did I not understand it correctly?
quote:
A lot of the discussion of this most-important event seems to center less around questions of "why is the sky blue?" than "why can't the sky be green?"
With all due respect, is that really the best comparison? There is a solid scientific reason for the sky appearing to be blue. In this case we are just talking about fictional characters in a story.* FR canon is no less "made up" than anything written by a fan.
But still, see above. I have to admit I think the explanation for why "it is the way it is" is strange by any measure of the word.
*Which I know prompts the question of "Why do people care so much, then?", but I hope you see my point. |
"Instead of asking why we sleep, it might make sense to ask why we wake. Perchance we live to dream. From that perspective, the sea of troubles we navigate in the workaday world might be the price we pay for admission to another night in the world of dreams."
--Richard Greene (letter to Time) |
Edited by - Rinonalyrna Fathomlin on 31 Oct 2008 16:40:36 |
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Garen Thal
Master of Realmslore
USA
1105 Posts |
Posted - 31 Oct 2008 : 16:46:06
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quote:
Originally posted by Rinonalyrna Fathomlin
I guess I just still don't understand why Mystra would suddenly turn mortal upon meeting up with a "mortal servant of Kelemvor". I'm sorry, Garen, but I just find that bizarre. Or did I not understand it correctly?
Cyric's guise has nothing to do with Mystra's change in this tale. It's just his means of approaching the Lady of Mysteries with an excuse (delivering a message from her former mortal lover), rather than him having to concoct a more elaborate story.
The stripping of Mystra's divinity is something an order of magnitude more complex. I'm still waiting to see the final fate of Mask from Paul Kemp's trilogy before I go into more detail on that matter, but there is an explanation. It's not nearly so simple as "Cyric had cooties" or "Mystra's a sucker," and it involves both their mortal histories and the history of the position as steward of the Weave. |
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Rinonalyrna Fathomlin
Great Reader
USA
7106 Posts |
Posted - 31 Oct 2008 : 17:00:50
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quote:
Originally posted by Garen Thal
Cyric's guise has nothing to do with Mystra's change in this tale. It's just his means of approaching the Lady of Mysteries with an excuse (delivering a message from her former mortal lover), rather than him having to concoct a more elaborate story.
OK, I take it that's what you mean when you said that Mystra was approached with "a final farewell from Kelemvor"?
I still have to admit I find the story to be odd. But I appreciate that you are taking the time to explain it more to me.
quote:
The stripping of Mystra's divinity is something an order of magnitude more complex. I'm still waiting to see the final fate of Mask from Paul Kemp's trilogy before I go into more detail on that matter, but there is an explanation. It's not nearly so simple as "Cyric had cooties" or "Mystra's a sucker," and it involves both their mortal histories and the history of the position as steward of the Weave.
I have no doubt that you have something complex in store for this goddess.
I'm about to be a bit blunt (but honest) here--and of course, everything I say is being said in a respectful tone. Why not just wait until you are able to give us these important (and hopefully clarifying) details? The story we heard in GHotR about Mystra's death obviously struck some people as quite bizarre. Again, no disrespect here, but I think this new (slightly more detailed) explanation is only a tiny bit less bizarre--the net result is that we still have a bizarre story, this time with the explicit caveat that it's not as nonsensical as it might appear to be, as there are highly important (but clandestine) details that will come at an indeterminate time in the future that cause it all to make sense.
I...simply don't see a huge difference there.
Please don't think I'm trying to knock your work or discourage you. I'm just pointing out the "snag" that I see, and I think it's one reason (if not the reason) why this particular musing turned out to be as controversial as you expected it would be.
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"Instead of asking why we sleep, it might make sense to ask why we wake. Perchance we live to dream. From that perspective, the sea of troubles we navigate in the workaday world might be the price we pay for admission to another night in the world of dreams."
--Richard Greene (letter to Time) |
Edited by - Rinonalyrna Fathomlin on 31 Oct 2008 17:03:16 |
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The Red Walker
Great Reader
USA
3563 Posts |
Posted - 05 Nov 2008 : 21:39:46
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Even though I am not on board totally with how you envision Mystra's murder, hearing the rumored "official" version from The Fractured Sky...
Makes me appreciate you talent and what you tried to do even more Brian, keep up the good work. |
A little nonsense now and then, relished by the wisest men - Willy Wonka
"We need men who can dream of things that never were." -
John F. Kennedy, speech in Dublin, Ireland, June 28, 1963
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Rinonalyrna Fathomlin
Great Reader
USA
7106 Posts |
Posted - 06 Nov 2008 : 14:26:30
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quote:
Originally posted by The Red Walker
Even though I am not on board totally with how you envision Mystra's murder, hearing the rumored "official" version from The Fractured Sky...
Makes me appreciate you talent and what you tried to do even more Brian, keep up the good work.
Same here. |
"Instead of asking why we sleep, it might make sense to ask why we wake. Perchance we live to dream. From that perspective, the sea of troubles we navigate in the workaday world might be the price we pay for admission to another night in the world of dreams."
--Richard Greene (letter to Time) |
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Jakk
Great Reader
Canada
2165 Posts |
Posted - 06 Nov 2008 : 19:20:57
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quote:
Originally posted by The Red Walker
<snip>... hearing the rumored "official" version from The Fractured Sky...<snip>
And would this be the "official" version already published, or a new "official" version coming out through DDi or other sources? I'm not subscribing to DDi so I haven't been paying attention in case they do something that makes me subscribe. 
Personally, I like Kyrene's take on the whole thing (see my sig)... |
Playing in the Realms since the Old Grey Box (1987)... and *still* having fun with material published before 2008, despite the NDA'd lore.
If it's comparable in power with non-magical abilities, it's not magic. |
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The Red Walker
Great Reader
USA
3563 Posts |
Posted - 06 Nov 2008 : 23:46:46
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quote:
Originally posted by Jakk
quote:
Originally posted by The Red Walker
<snip>... hearing the rumored "official" version from The Fractured Sky...<snip>
And would this be the "official" version already published, or a new "official" version coming out through DDi or other sources? I'm not subscribing to DDi so I haven't been paying attention in case they do something that makes me subscribe.
Personally, I like Kyrene's take on the whole thing (see my sig)...
It is official I guess, since it is published in The Fractured Sky novel. |
A little nonsense now and then, relished by the wisest men - Willy Wonka
"We need men who can dream of things that never were." -
John F. Kennedy, speech in Dublin, Ireland, June 28, 1963
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36779 Posts |
Posted - 07 Nov 2008 : 01:46:19
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quote:
Originally posted by Jakk
Personally, I like Kyrene's take on the whole thing (see my sig)...
Which page of your sig?  |
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Ashe Ravenheart
Great Reader
USA
3240 Posts |
Posted - 11 Nov 2008 : 15:40:01
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| Will you updated Mystra's entry with what's reported in Fractured Sky? Or will your musings remain outside 'the box'? |
I actually DO know everything. I just have a very poor index of my knowledge.
Ashe's Character Sheet
Alphabetized Index of Realms NPCs |
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Garen Thal
Master of Realmslore
USA
1105 Posts |
Posted - 11 Nov 2008 : 17:02:27
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quote:
Originally posted by Ashe Ravenheart
Will you updated Mystra's entry with what's reported in Fractured Sky? Or will your musings remain outside 'the box'?
Nope. Like the Auril/Akadi thing, once a Musing is posted, that's the tale I'm going with. Some of these Musings have been worked on for some time now, and while I will do my best to keep up with lore as it's released, the rules I bound myself to relate only to existing lore, not things published after a Musing goes up. |
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Monday Musing 10/27: Gods of Magic
