| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| Dracons |
Posted - 13 Nov 2010 : 11:25:33
I know that 4th edition makes it more streamlined, but I just do not care for it. So I'd like anything before that please.
Also sorry for the spelling mistakes. Just like I cannot even guess how to say half the names in Forgotten Realms, I can't remember how to spell the bulk of them ether.
In lords of madness, they state that Aboleths do not care for gods. At best they may be thought as equal. They even proclaimed they were here before the gods.
My only concern with that, is that AO made the world. Well, Shar and Selune, who made Toril (Chantua), who needed Sun, so Lathander etc etc.
Basically the Gods were already around before anything was living on Toril. Now some of them treat Ghaunduar as equal, the drow god of slime and ooze and such. Do Aboleths see gods differently in Forgotten Realms? Obviously not so much as something to worship or fear,but to be a partner with. Are there any known Aboleth cities? Famous Aboleths?
I'd like what people know. I do own every 3.0/3.5 books, but not quite sure where to really dig through. Any lore from earlier editions would be greatful, as I do not have access to any other edition game.
My main thoughts are, besides cities and famous ones, are their relationships with gods. I can almost see Shar being a mother type, and one that raised them since the beginning of Toril time? With their perchance to remember everything their parents knew, and their parents knew, means they could potentionally know alot.
Sorry for rambling. Even though I finally got my hip replaced, they're still keeping me doped up on various pills. |
| 11 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| Dracons |
Posted - 15 Nov 2010 : 02:29:21
SHape of Water is in Underdark, but thanks. |
| The Sage |
Posted - 15 Nov 2010 : 01:51:38
quote:
Originally posted by Seethyr
It's just a little tidbit, but surprisingly Xxiphu, the primary aboleth city from 4e has its origins in a brief mention in a 3e product and therefore might work out for you. Imo, the Abolethic Sovereignty is the only part of 4e FR lore that I could say I flat out love.
There's also some further 3e grounding for it in Cordell's Darkvision and Stardeep novels as well.
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| Seethyr |
Posted - 15 Nov 2010 : 01:20:28
It's just a little tidbit, but surprisingly Xxiphu, the primary aboleth city from 4e has its origins in a brief mention in a 3e product and therefore might work out for you. Imo, the Abolethic Sovereignty is the only part of 4e FR lore that I could say I flat out love.
I will get back to you on this but I believe the city gets its mention in a short adventure called Shape of Water, but I don't remember which product its in (perhaps Lost Empires of Faerun). |
| Quale |
Posted - 14 Nov 2010 : 23:53:38
quote:
Originally posted by Dracons
Basically the Gods were already around before anything was living on Toril. Now some of them treat Ghaunduar as equal, the drow god of slime and ooze and such. Do Aboleths see gods differently in Forgotten Realms? Obviously not so much as something to worship or fear,but to be a partner with. Are there any known Aboleth cities? Famous Aboleths?
The Sargauth Swimmer (below Waterdeep) is famous
check this thread http://forum.candlekeep.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=10466&whichpage=1 |
| Dracons |
Posted - 14 Nov 2010 : 11:31:21
There are severeal Aboleth in Waterdeep near skullport. Part of the Savants of the Dark Tide.
As for why I don't like the forth edition, is because of how they made everything the same. All the monsters are from the exact same plane as in every other campaign world. No more uniqueness. All undead are from Raven Queen, regardless if your in Forgotten Realms, Eberron, Dragonlance, are your own world. (Extreme example, but it's why I can't stand reading any articles from Wizards).
In short, while making everything easier to remember and know, they took out the uniqness of each campaign setting to make it more accessible to people who who can't read, regardless of what setting.
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| Zireael |
Posted - 14 Nov 2010 : 09:57:29
I seem to recall that there was an entire scroll of aboleth lore, which was to be put on Candlekeep, but it hadn't happened yet. |
| Markustay |
Posted - 13 Nov 2010 : 20:21:54
Ah, my bad.
Is it because you have an aversion to the lore itself, or you just refuse to go along with anything that was changed in 4e?
Just curious - I don't want this thread to degrade. Like I said, I find a lot of 4e's lore useful, and placing aberrations in some sort of 'before time' makes sense for me (as in, 'for MY game').
I still don't have any plans of ever using Aboleths, but I don't want to limit my future alternatives by writing them off, either. Someone posted a link to an article awhile back about 'additive' and 'subtractive' lore, and how it is much better to be vague then simply say it doesn't exist (which then ties your hands on that a particular subject from then-on).
In other words, always write lore from the perspective of making note of what is there, but NEVER what is not there.
Anyhow, aside from two I read about in novels, I can't seem to recall any sourcebook details regarding them.
There was the one that worked with the Kraken Society, and there was that other that messed with the party in WotSQ. In both instances, Drow were involved (obviously - what other characters are going to run into something that lives in the Underdark?)
I also vaguely remember something about one near Skullport, but I could be way off the mark on that one. |
| Dracons |
Posted - 13 Nov 2010 : 20:07:26
But from what I gathered, is mostly 4th edition lore, not something I wish to use even in the least. |
| Kno |
Posted - 13 Nov 2010 : 19:39:17
Aboleths have racial memory, they remember their origins from when Piscaethces of the Far Realm brushed herself against the Material Plane |
| Markustay |
Posted - 13 Nov 2010 : 19:25:34
In Lords of madness, their are some hints that there were 'things' around before the universe even formed; perhaps even 'leftovers' from a prior universe.
THAT is where the Aboleths fit-in.
In FR lore, the only evidence we have of these 'prior beings' are the original Shadevari*.
Note also at the end of the Avatar Crisis Ao addresses a being who is apparently more powerful then he. While I have heard some (rather stupid) meta-gaming explanations for that, the fact is we have canon that Ao has a 'superior', and therefore one can assume that the universe itself is older then Realmspace.
Ergo, Ao is part of some 'higher order' that transcends Realmspace itself, while anyone who 'came after' would most-likely be Realms-specific beings. At least, that's how I always thought of it before 4e.
I was about to go into another long-winded diatribe, but it contributes nothing to this conversation. Suffice it to say I've changed my mind about some of the other beings in Realmspace now.
Anyhow, there isn't a lot to go on, except perhaps in some of Bruce Cordell's latest novels. I haven't read them myself, but IIRC correctly I think the Aboleths are featured in the newest ones.
Anyhow, it appears that history did NOT begin when we thought it did, and the War of Light & Darkness didn't happen 'at the beginning' either (that's now canon), and there were some creatures (like the Aboleths) who apparently pre-date the Creator Races.
My best guess is that they are a race that 'swam through the primal chaos' before the world began. They may be part of an even larger race themselves (that is how I spin it, but that's HB), because certain other things like Illithids appear to have equally ancient origins.
Or are the Illithids what the Aboleths were destined to become? 
*I say "original Shadevari" because I do not want them confused with the Shades of Shade (how redundant is THAT?). There was also a monster listed in one of the books - I forget which - which was supposedly one of those Shadevari, but it falls way off the mark for a powerful, pre-Genesis entity. Assume that creature is a fairly weak Avatar of the original Shadevari. |
| The Sage |
Posted - 13 Nov 2010 : 12:09:29
I don't have the time at the moment, but if you perform a forum search for previous scrolls on abolethic lore, you'll find several detailed by myself and other scribes which cover this topic somewhat.
I'll try to add more later. |
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