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Ellen the Ex-Drow
Acolyte
USA
9 Posts |
 Posted - 02 Apr 2007 : 05:59:13
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Does anyone have any advice on dealing with a group with conflicts of gameplay interest?
I would go into the whole huge story about the campaign in question, but suffice it to say there are currently two sides. On the one side are me and the DM (who's rather new at DMing but has played DnD longer than the rest of us and is a lot more focused on mechanics and combat--incidentally he's also my long-distance boyfriend) and on the other side are my sister and her very good friend, who are convicved that the DM's campaign is a mindless dungeon crawl which their interesting characters are "wasted" on. The DM has assured us multiple times that the crawling will stop and that the fact that we've killed eight zombies so far is only one piece of the puzzle, but the Other Side not only remains unconvinced but also keeps making up excuses to not play the campaign due to this belief.
My question to y'all is how best to resolve this? Should I beg them to stay with it just a little longer? Should the DM be more focused on what the group wants as a whole? Is gaming with significant others a bad idea, and if so how can we work around that? How can I make it more interesting for the others until it picks up for them? I'm getting really frustrated with the whole thing.
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"Hey, did you hear about that ancient Lovecraftian city they just discovered off New Zealand?"
"Really?"
"No, R'lyeh." |
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Jorkens
Great Reader
Norway
2950 Posts |
Posted - 02 Apr 2007 : 08:27:19
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To give you some rather useless advise; there are no set answers to these questions. But I will at least try to give you some thoughts. A DM should in my opinion try to form his campaign in a way that gives the style the players wish. If the players want to play in a style the DM is not comfortable with DM'ing it could be a good idea for one of those not happy to try it in his place.
Now, if the DM is the only one comfortable with the job or if he really wants to take the part you should try to come to some sort of compromise. If he promises that the dungeon-crawling will stop he could at least give you an indication of how long this will take, so as to convince the players that gaming more to their taste will soon come. Begging people to game when they are not having fun is not a good idea, so some sort of change must obviously be made.
As for gaming with significant others as you say, in my experience this works well as long as outside elements don't sneak into the gaming (jealousy, dominance, patronising, favoritism etc). In other words, as long as each person functions in-game as you would expect any other gamer.
As I said, there is little concrete I can say when it comes to your group in particular as it depends on the individuals involved. The best of luck to your group though. |
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Conlon
Learned Scribe
Canada
132 Posts |
Posted - 02 Apr 2007 : 09:19:06
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Since you seem to be a little more understanding of the way your DM is running things, I would suggest that the DM focus on making the other two players happy as soon as possible, or he risks losing them. Again, it seems to me that you understand that the game builds on itself, and eventually everyone can get what they want, but the other players, having not played before, don't understand this. If it takes your DM switching things around for a bit, just so the other players can "get into character" and have some fun, then maybe he should do that.
After the other players have role-played a bit and start to wonder what else D&D can offer, then they may be excited to start being "action heroes".
This is just my opinion. Good luck! |
My hopes are ashes, my dreams are dust. All my intentions mean nothing unless they are followed by action. |
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Lemernis
Senior Scribe
378 Posts |
Posted - 02 Apr 2007 : 11:19:42
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Just remember it's a game, and something you're coming together to do for fun. Players need to give the DM some room and time to develop what he has in mind. And the DM needs to respond as best he can to their tastes.
I wouldn't think it should matter that you're dating the DM unless the other players are bugged about it. If they are, and its baseless, that's unfortunate but probably not much to be done about it (their own 'issues'). Your boyfriend should be mindful about the possibility of showing you unconscious favoritism, though. |
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Ellen the Ex-Drow
Acolyte
USA
9 Posts |
Posted - 03 Apr 2007 : 04:47:47
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| Thanks for your help guys. I talked with my sister today and she seemed a lot more enthusiastic, at least about playing her characters in it. As to the DM, he's told me that the first stage will be over soon and we'll be able to progress to the less conventional part of the dungeon, so I'm holding out for some play time this week. Hope for the best and all that. |
"Hey, did you hear about that ancient Lovecraftian city they just discovered off New Zealand?"
"Really?"
"No, R'lyeh." |
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Kentinal
Great Reader
4685 Posts |
Posted - 03 Apr 2007 : 05:48:48
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Well still trying to figure out how Ellen became an Ex-Drow, I get the impression that this game is being played on-line.
I mean there are only 8 dead zombies and already some platers are unhappy? Depending on level of party those 8 should have died quickly in less then a day of game time. There always is a risk that the DM will have a bias for a SO's character that can be a game buster. It is not always bad, however online I have seen friendships broken because the DM was too kind to one PC or too mean in the view of the player. Sometimes a thrid party watching the play can see a bias, sometimes it appears per the dice- facts however does not matter if a person invests too much of themselves into the PC or the player expects a break from the DM becaue the DM wants a kiss after the game. This depends on how the players interact and how much they invest of themselves into their character.
It becomes really hard to offer the best answer, because a DM's job is to provide a fun campaign for all. The DM to do this does need to understand how much the players want puzzle solving, combat, NPC interaction, craftig or whatever. And each player likely wants a little more of an element then others do. It is the task of the DM to provide elements of fun stuff for all the players as equal s posible, but also protect himself from not having fun (the players having fun, while the DM spends 6 tedious hours perparing for a session that might last an hour that detail matters, is not fun for a DM.) |
"Small beings can have small wisdom," the dragon said. "And small wise beings are better than small fools. Listen: Wisdom is caring for afterwards."
"Caring for afterwards ...? Ker repeated this without understanding.
"After action, afterwards," the dragon said. "Choose the afterwards first, then the action. Fools choose action first."
"Judgement" copyright 2003 by Elizabeth Moon |
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Asgetrion
Master of Realmslore
Finland
1564 Posts |
Posted - 03 Apr 2007 : 08:50:27
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Ellen,
Kentinal, Jorkens, Conlon and Lemernis all offered some sound advice and opinions on this subject. I just want to say that it is essential that *everyone* is having fun (players and DM alike). This is a very tricky subject, and Dungeon Master's Guide II has a lot of information for DMs on how to analyze the needs of their players and communicate with them on this subject. |
"What am I doing today? Ask me tomorrow - I can be sure of giving you the right answer then."
-- Askarran of Selgaunt, Master Sage, speaking to a curious merchant, Year of the Helm |
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Ellen the Ex-Drow
Acolyte
USA
9 Posts |
Posted - 03 Apr 2007 : 16:45:54
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@Kentinal: Yeah, it's an online game. As to the DM, the others haven't said a thing about any unequal treatment of our characters (and believe me, if my sister had noticed this she'd have said so by now.) I'll certainly ask the others if they see any of this, but I think the main problem just lies in our different views on what's fun in DnD. My sister is our usual DM and while she has wonderfully crazy plots which I love, a lot of them involve so much sneaking around and being diplomatic that it sometimes doesn't even feel like we're playing DnD, just sitting around and talking. So to me the more classic style of DnD is a breath of fresh air, but I just wish the others could see it that way.
PS: Ellen was a farm girl from the Sword Coast with quite a bit of talent for thievery, but who kept getting passed up by adventuring groups due to her youth, incompetence and (she thought) ugliness. Eventually she bribed a travelling wizard to make her look older and more "exotic." The wizard, who had a pretty sick sense of humor, made her look like a Drow. After several subsequent years of travelling around with various seedy parties, people avoiding her in the street and several near-lynchings, the PCs helped her break the curse and she's been with them ever since. |
"Hey, did you hear about that ancient Lovecraftian city they just discovered off New Zealand?"
"Really?"
"No, R'lyeh." |
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warlockco
Master of Realmslore
USA
1695 Posts |
Posted - 03 Apr 2007 : 16:55:08
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The suggestions that everyone else has given on how to resolve the conflict are good and can't really add much more to them.
On the subject of gaming with significant others though, in my experience if they are both players its not much of an issue, but everytime I have been in group that had one as the DM/GM there has always been some form of favortism, even if it is just inside information.
DM/GMs tend to bounce ideals off of those around them at times when they are working on their campaign.
I have yet to be in a game where, there isn't some form of favortism towards a significant other or even a roommate, when one is running the game. And have been in about 8 games that were this way, and all have been the same in that regard. |
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Rinonalyrna Fathomlin
Great Reader
USA
7106 Posts |
Posted - 03 Apr 2007 : 18:27:55
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My experience is not everyone else's experience, but I've played some online games before (play-by-post), and they always involved a lot more character interaction and non-combative skill use than actual combat. I think online gaming simply lends itself to that. Just saying that just "sitting around and talking" IS a legitimate part of D&D. And you CANNOT make other people see things your way, nor should you wish to--people have opinions that are as near and dear to them as your opinions are to you, so you need to try to respect that.
As for the question at hand--it probably wouldn't hurt for the DM to introduce enough of a variety in the gameplay so everyone is happy. But still, if people are complaining after killing only 8 zombies...well, consider that these individuals may be difficult to please and may not be the most ideal players. That may sound mean, but ask yourself if you would be surprised if they complained every time the game took a turn they didn't like. |
"Instead of asking why we sleep, it might make sense to ask why we wake. Perchance we live to dream. From that perspective, the sea of troubles we navigate in the workaday world might be the price we pay for admission to another night in the world of dreams."
--Richard Greene (letter to Time) |
Edited by - Rinonalyrna Fathomlin on 03 Apr 2007 18:47:55 |
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Rinonalyrna Fathomlin
Great Reader
USA
7106 Posts |
Posted - 03 Apr 2007 : 18:41:05
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quote:
Originally posted by warlockco
I have yet to be in a game where, there isn't some form of favortism towards a significant other or even a roommate, when one is running the game. And have been in about 8 games that were this way, and all have been the same in that regard.
Last time I played an online play-by-post game, the game had two DMs, and each DM was also playing a character in-game (in fact, one of the DMs was playing two characters).
I won't go into details, but that experience pretty much put me off online gaming for good. |
"Instead of asking why we sleep, it might make sense to ask why we wake. Perchance we live to dream. From that perspective, the sea of troubles we navigate in the workaday world might be the price we pay for admission to another night in the world of dreams."
--Richard Greene (letter to Time) |
Edited by - Rinonalyrna Fathomlin on 03 Apr 2007 18:42:26 |
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Faraer
Great Reader
3308 Posts |
Posted - 03 Apr 2007 : 20:15:06
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quote:
Originally posted by Ellen the Ex-Drow
My question to y'all is how best to resolve this?
This may be obvious, but you can deal with this the way you resolve any conflict between people in a shared enterprise. Some people mentally file game difficulties in a different category because 'it's a game'. You're the go-between, so tell the truth to both parties slanted to what they need to know and will incline them to what you want to happen.quote:
Should the DM be more focused on what the group wants as a whole?
Either that, or he should get players more on his wavelength. Talk to him about the campaign, make sure he understands what the other players want out of it, and judge whether he can provide that; let him know that the other players are losing interest and might leave if it doesn't change, and suggest that he brings forward the other pieces of the puzzle.quote:
Should I beg them to stay with it just a little longer?
If you think it can work, you'll have to if you want the campaign to continue.quote:
Is gaming with significant others a bad idea, and if so how can we work around that?
It can be, but the only way to be sure is to try. Be aware of the pitfalls and agree (with all the players) to try and avoid them.quote:
How can I make it more interesting for the others until it picks up for them?
Understand that you players aren't just passively going through the DM's predefined plot, and you can roleplay in combat situations -- you don't stop playing your character when a fight starts. Talk in character with the other players about what's going on -- are you familiar with Faerūnian adventurers' banter? If your character finds herself somewhere boring, go somewhere and do something more interesting.
I haven't roleplayed much online, so this is mostly from tabletop experience. |
Edited by - Faraer on 03 Apr 2007 20:18:29 |
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Kentinal
Great Reader
4685 Posts |
Posted - 03 Apr 2007 : 20:25:16
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On-line can be very difficult with a DM, I recall to mind one event where the DM played also a character. The contest was high level. My character was a friend of a friend and went along to protect her, more then concerned about the quest. Did my share of dealing with problems and combat, the end result the Friend of the Friend got an artifact, friend got some joy out of her friend and herself staying alive, my character got something less then 5 gold pieces and only other reward being friend survived.
At the end of that adventure I was somewhat inclined to kill the player/DM if I could have gotten hands on him. OK not really wanted to kill the player, but was very unhappy with the Results of that game. |
"Small beings can have small wisdom," the dragon said. "And small wise beings are better than small fools. Listen: Wisdom is caring for afterwards."
"Caring for afterwards ...? Ker repeated this without understanding.
"After action, afterwards," the dragon said. "Choose the afterwards first, then the action. Fools choose action first."
"Judgement" copyright 2003 by Elizabeth Moon |
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Lemernis
Senior Scribe
378 Posts |
Posted - 03 Apr 2007 : 22:00:15
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| I'm lovin' the PbP game I'm currently in. It's a blast. |
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Politics, arguments and dungeon crawling.
