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Thraskir Skimper
Learned Scribe

191 Posts

Posted - 10 Jun 2018 :  16:03:03  Show Profile Send Thraskir Skimper a Private Message  Reply with Quote  Delete Topic
How does a Souless creature, aka one that doesn't fall into the theist trap of faith, the churches and category mistake making ghost in the machine misnomer fit into the Realms?

A soul for a person after all is just the threshold pattern of their DNA blue printed RNA transfered brain experience 'memories'. Easyish to copy, easyish to make or remake.

As an Atheist considering Philosopher, DnD's whole 'soul' system seems so juvenile. A wall trapped forever, Ha ha ha... good one. No soul no wall no afterlife or immortal forever purchase through faith one way or another. No intolerance or constraint or moral high ground. No goody two shoes consideration of any weight. No gods of Magic. Magic is just the final technology level, the one that results from or comes after nanotechnology.

Gods are just Aliens from other places (realms) in our dimension, or other dimensions (planes) or just mind bogglingly smart Super AI.

When you find out that technology was abandoned, although some Gnomes still make use of it because it interferes with the Magic tech; aka just Magic. Magic is the final answer to the technological line of things. It isn't a primitive before technology time but rather replaces it as a clunky inelegant 'poor mages magic'. Magic is so much better.

Magic doesn't come from specific Aliens or AI. It is rather just a far reaching tech that is quantum based (smaller than nano) spooky stuff. Magic is just the way we interact and manipulate it.

In a Universe that had no beginning, has no end and exists in every way and every dimension, realm, and understanding endlessly... There is no need for a soul.

Some ask what the Red Weave is. Well it is hard to explain. Even harder for them to grasp that a Red Wizard has no Soul or that their magic requires no 'gods'. Even with the influence of Kossuth or the name of the element of life giving fire as some like to mistake is 'worshipped' in Thay a place of "magick" so powerful that it stands apart and on top of all else in the Realms. Where some ascribe to the Zulkirs and Arch Zulkir a 'faith' in something other than 'magic'.

You may think you have a soul but you are not from Thay. You certainly will never rule Thay. You may think Thay crazy. You may never understand, curtailed by your Walled off mind.

Arch Zulkir Tam, we say demi god to appease you. But he just knows what Thay is. We let you think other dead 'gods' influence him. Guide perhaps but not influence. As for other planar beings, we use them. They are not soul crushing demons or devils they just are another type of being. As for worship, that is your big joke. Sure it is a great unifier and perhaps best explains why we can't get everything done in Thay as we are not unified in a 'faith'. Why we think you are silly and let you think silly things about us as written by those we spin tales to. Ever wonder why your spell plagues don't ever ruin Thay?

Sure we play along outside Thay. Not always but pay lip service to this being or that. Beshaba doesn't collect souls. She may spin quantum's one way or another but souls? Yeah yeah right. As your 'gods' say you just have to believe. We get a good laugh out of that. We just say, it never rains in Thay.

Sure Thay has problems some of which some are able to confay to the rest of you 'soul fearing' peoples. (confay or Confer from Thay) Never trust anything one from Thay might Thay. We lie a lot! You heard about a civil war? Nothing civil about it when 8 become 1+12. You just can't divide 7 into 12 without replacing them all.

Thay is a land of Magic not Worship. While some so called gods are welcome even revered, none are revered great than the Zulkirs and and our Arch Zulkir. Even in Thay not all have magic. Those without magic are left to their own devices aka 'gods'. The weave or weaves. Ours is red. We rarely take it out of Thay as it interacts poorly with your Silver weave which dilutes it. Much like the Shadow Weave outside of Shadow.

By the way the spell plague is not the magic plague. Yes I Thay three weaves when we know of at least four. Go wild in your speculation.

No hope for the Souless? or just the ramblings of a lying Chaotic Evil Thraskir?

Yes Phylacteries do exist, no they are not what you think they are. Yes the undead are souless.

Thay Red.

Thay Red

Ayrik
Great Reader

Canada
6672 Posts

Posted - 10 Jun 2018 :  21:41:51  Show Profile Send Ayrik a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Realmslore has strongly asserted that souls, gods, and magic do indeed exist in the Realms. The presence and interactions (and conflicts) of these things are central and recurring themes in many Realms novels.

Explaining souls as genetic memory, gods as alien beings, and magic as quantum technology doesn't change what they are and what they do and how they're understood by the people of the Realms. We each have our own sophistries to understand/explain these things in our own individual terms, but regardless of the rhetoric (or metaphysical/theoretical philosophy), the "souls" and "gods" and "magic" of the Realms continue to exist and continue to function in certain known (observable, consistent, predictable, reproducible) ways. Even for Red Wizards.

So maybe a phylactery is "not what I think it is" in the strictest and most technical definition ... but that doesn't change what it is or what it does or what can be done with/to it in practice. Fine arguments over definitions and terminology seem pedantic when dealing with a lich.

[/Ayrik]

Edited by - Ayrik on 10 Jun 2018 22:09:01
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Irennan
Great Reader

Italy
2980 Posts

Posted - 10 Jun 2018 :  23:14:57  Show Profile Send Irennan a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Idk if this is an in-character consideration or an OOC one (it seems so, given that you mention AIs and nanotech, but then you talk as a Thayan?). If you're talking OOC, well D&D surely wasn't meant to provide answers like science, nor it should be scientifically analyzed (because you will obviously find tons of nonsense, given that is all made-up stuff). It's like analyzing a fairytale to understand how gravity works. Wrong place to look for answers.

As for the rest, 'Tam is just your next uber archmage who thinks he can reshape the world. Others have done that before, and Tam's plan went nowhere just like theirs (he only made Thay into zombieland. If that's a positive change, then, well, more power to you, but I don't see it as an achievement).

The gods exist, as in: they do stuff, you might even observe them. No need to believe.

The concept of soul is vague indeed, but that's because the RL concept of soul is ultra vague too. Personally, in D&D, I'd say that a soul is like a piece of planar matter associated with you, that changes and assumes different traits while you live, make choices, pursue goals. It's a sort of outsider associated with you (similarly to how demons and other outsiders are actually born because certain concepts are important to people, and people believe in them, act following them, etc... Not canon, but canon is extremely nebulous about it, so *shrugs*

To all Facebook-using FR fans, you might be interested in checking out this page: https://www.facebook.com/groups/450517575051806/

Edited by - Irennan on 10 Jun 2018 23:21:36
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The Masked Mage
Master of Realmslore

USA
1977 Posts

Posted - 10 Jun 2018 :  23:59:57  Show Profile  Send The Masked Mage an AOL message  Click to see The Masked Mage's MSN Messenger address Send The Masked Mage a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Yep, in FR, there are very few atheists, and upon their deaths they are "the faithless." Basically a unique type of being damned.
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LordofBones
Senior Scribe

823 Posts

Posted - 11 Jun 2018 :  02:53:47  Show Profile Send LordofBones a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I imagine athiests don't particularly enjoy their afterlives.

Hell, a Red Wizard achieved godhood. I imagine Velsharoon is touted as a kind of folk hero among the Red Wizards, much to Tam's displeasure.
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Seethyr
Senior Scribe

USA
485 Posts

Posted - 11 Jun 2018 :  21:27:55  Show Profile  Visit Seethyr's Homepage Send Seethyr a Private Message  Reply with Quote
What was the Planescape faction again that thought the gods were all frauds and just really powerful beings? Athar ? I also remember something called an Ur-priest or something like that (from the Libram of Ineffable Damnation 3e) which actively sought to slay the gods. They might be right up your alley.

All "Maztica Alive" products can be found below, linked to the campaign guide.

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Also, please come join us on the Maztica Alive Yahoo Group:
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Edited by - Seethyr on 11 Jun 2018 21:30:04
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Irennan
Great Reader

Italy
2980 Posts

Posted - 11 Jun 2018 :  21:36:45  Show Profile Send Irennan a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Yes, the Athar. And then there are the Godsmen, who believe that everyone has the potential for divinity.

To all Facebook-using FR fans, you might be interested in checking out this page: https://www.facebook.com/groups/450517575051806/
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Thraskir Skimper
Learned Scribe

191 Posts

Posted - 12 Jun 2018 :  17:57:10  Show Profile Send Thraskir Skimper a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by LordofBones

I imagine athiests don't particularly enjoy their afterlives.

Hell, a Red Wizard achieved godhood. I imagine Velsharoon is touted as a kind of folk hero among the Red Wizards, much to Tam's displeasure.



Velsharoon is despised in Thay and his followers are hunted down and exterminated.

Thay Red
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sleyvas
Great Reader

USA
7387 Posts

Posted - 12 Jun 2018 :  19:07:07  Show Profile Send sleyvas a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Thraskir Skimper

quote:
Originally posted by LordofBones

I imagine athiests don't particularly enjoy their afterlives.

Hell, a Red Wizard achieved godhood. I imagine Velsharoon is touted as a kind of folk hero among the Red Wizards, much to Tam's displeasure.



Velsharoon is despised in Thay and his followers are hunted down and exterminated.



Only in modern Thay where Tam rules. Given Tam was the Zulkir of Necromancy and he was an enemy of the GOD of necromancy when said god was still mortal... is it any wonder that Leira in the form of the book of Fastrin the Delver made Szass Tam look like a fool when he fed the energy from his botched spell to bring Mystra back to life.

But, of course, the red wizards of the United Tharchs of Toril love Velsharoon for how he helped protect them and found their society on Abeir.

Alavairthae, may your skill prevail

Phillip aka Sleyvas
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Thraskir Skimper
Learned Scribe

191 Posts

Posted - 13 Jun 2018 :  10:43:06  Show Profile Send Thraskir Skimper a Private Message  Reply with Quote
The Zulkirs of Thay never have even a hint of divine essence. Mainly Divine spells. Yet they pay lip service to the various religions, mainly Kossuth or one of the others. Never Velsharoon, Mystra or Mulhorand, those are strictly forbidden.

Red Wizards can worship so called gods or even some demons or devils but it is more a respect of power rather than a worship. Religion and state is strictly separate. Red Wizards are the State and not overtly religious. There are no high level dual class Red Wizard Clerics. Even low level is highly discouraged. Clerics are respected by the populace as are non Red Wizards but Red Wizards rule Thay. Even After House Tam became the main house of Thay and Zulkir Szass Tam the Arch Zulkir, other non House Tam Red Wizards are still in charge and still may not agree with each other or House Tam.

The whole Szass Tam power play wasn't quite what you think it was. Nor is he the only Lich in Thay. It may be that nobility in Thay is a Mulan thing but nobles do not rule in Thay. Red Wizards do. Within a hierarchy although even that is not as binding as you may think. Many Red Wizards may be linked to noble houses but they either rule those houses or they become separated with other duties. There are not a lot of lazy Red Wizards.


There are many hidden ranks of Red Wizards and they fall in general categories. As Thraskir one tends to be a judge of various laws but not necessarily Lawful of Alignment. Skimper is an investigator with many law / investigation offices across Toril and in a few other realms. Sometimes tied to enclaves sometimes as investigation offices sometimes moving into cities and working with or taking over various guilds or working with their rulers. May even open an office in Candle Keep?

You may say Thay is the only nation with slaves but you would be lying to yourselves. You may say your serfs are not slaves but again you are lying. Many slaves in Thay have better lives than your serfs and certainly have more rights even being able to rule in Thay one day.

Non Humans in Thay,we don't discriminate based on race. Moon Elf, Orc, Drow, Gnoll, Orge, Giant, Dragon, Kobold, Imp, Gensai, even Salamanders or Fire elementals. Sure the only Paladin in Thay is a dead Paladin but that isn't a racial discrimination.

Most of you could visit even setup a tower in Thay as long as you don't pretend to be a Red Wizard or wear the robes of one. If you are interested ask.


Maybe even setup a branch of Candle Keep, either in Thay or one or more of its extended territories.

As for flying castles, with the revival of our own weave we have those too now. The spells and schools of the old Apportation school of Magic and its like. Yes we have something similar too. Not the inverted Flying mountains but something very similar. You never know if that cloud in the sky is a Cloud Giant castle, Titans castle or a Thayan fortress. If you ever see a storm cloud in Thay don't panic the weather net is not down. Barnacus could just be flying in for a visit.



Thay Red
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Lord Karsus
Great Reader

USA
3184 Posts

Posted - 13 Jun 2018 :  17:47:12  Show Profile  Send Lord Karsus an AOL message Send Lord Karsus a Private Message  Reply with Quote
-I, for one, am confused.

(A Tri-Partite Arcanist Who Has Forgotten More Than Most Will Ever Know)

Elves of Faerūn
Vol I- The Elves of Faerūn
Vol. III- Spells of the Elves
Vol. VI- Mechanical Compendium
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Cyrinishad
Learned Scribe

300 Posts

Posted - 13 Jun 2018 :  20:03:33  Show Profile Send Cyrinishad a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Lord Karsus

-I, for one, am confused.



...You are? Weird, I thought you were petrified.

To know, is to know that you know nothing. That is the meaning of true knowledge. -Socrates

Don't cry because it's over. Smile because it happened. -Dr. Seuss
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
Moderator

USA
31406 Posts

Posted - 13 Jun 2018 :  20:21:00  Show Profile Send Wooly Rupert a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Cyrinishad

quote:
Originally posted by Lord Karsus

-I, for one, am confused.



...You are? Weird, I thought you were petrified.



Nicely done!

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sleyvas
Great Reader

USA
7387 Posts

Posted - 14 Jun 2018 :  00:33:13  Show Profile Send sleyvas a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Lord Karsus

-I, for one, am confused.



Ah, lord Karsus, yes, I understand.... twas after all the actions of Leira and Velsharoon in Abeir that led to your revival, if at the loss of your heart. But fear not, for Mystra has made honor of your sacrifice, and Auppenser will help recover thine sanity.


P.S. feel free to help me make up the story of Karsus' revival as we go along here.

Alavairthae, may your skill prevail

Phillip aka Sleyvas
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Lord Karsus
Great Reader

USA
3184 Posts

Posted - 14 Jun 2018 :  02:39:47  Show Profile  Send Lord Karsus an AOL message Send Lord Karsus a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by sleyvas

P.S. feel free to help me make up the story of Karsus' revival as we go along here.


-I have existed as a tri-partite entity stuck in the internet for over a decade now. One aspect we believe was a Beholder Mage and the other was Mad. Both were lost, along with my many Hands of Karsus, during the Spellplague of 2007/2008. I consoled myself with the love of the fair maiden Rinonalyrna, but after about a decade or so we drifted apart and alas, it was not meant to be. Wandering the planes of New York, my attention returned to Realmspace when a friend died way too young. And here we are.

(A Tri-Partite Arcanist Who Has Forgotten More Than Most Will Ever Know)

Elves of Faerūn
Vol I- The Elves of Faerūn
Vol. III- Spells of the Elves
Vol. VI- Mechanical Compendium
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Thraskir Skimper
Learned Scribe

191 Posts

Posted - 14 Jun 2018 :  04:20:43  Show Profile Send Thraskir Skimper a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Now I'm kind of Confused.

In Thay especially amoung The Red Wizards religion is an after thought. Lip service is paid, in my case to Beshaba but we don't worship so much as respect the so called gods. Beshaba has power that needs to be respected and it is hilarious to see the best laid plans fall apart. Still Deities and Demon lords, Princes or Kings ranked Devils and the like are also respected on somewhat equal footings. Lolth for instance isn't worship by Red Wizards but her and her kin are respected and honored.

A Particular Demigod is a well respected Red Wizard and honored throughout Thay.

Santa The Red

Wizard of Thay

Based in the northern reaches

Divination specialist

Common Saying: Santa, He knows when you are sleeping,
He knows when you are awake.
He knows when you have been bad or good
so be loyal to Thay, for your own sake.

Santa has a work camp in the icy North there he crafts multiple items used as a basis for magic items for sale and trade. Once a year Santa seeks out traitors spies and fools and sweeps down and captures them carrying them back to his work shop.

Santa commands a Sleigh with an extradimensional holding prison, it is shaped like a large sack.

The Sleigh can cross any kind of terrain and can fly long distances very fast, able to circle the world in a single hour.

For those that have been good, to Thay, Santa leaves prize magic items, wrapped in woven hair from his slaves. Often tied with a solid gold ribbon. 2 gpv. The hair packing can only be opened on the eve of Thay Mass the Solstice of Winter the longest coldest night of the North. Such gifts only appear to those who honor him with a small or large decorated evergreen tree or any other tree decorated and wrapped in silver ribbon and decorations. It is topped with a shining orb of magic, a knot, some say an Eye of Santa. It is said that especially loyal Red Wizard Apprentice can receive their first Red Robe this way. Gifts or Presents can be anything. A wanted Staff or a Flying Carpet, a Young Mage may receive a first spell book or an Elder Wizard a potion of youth.

Those who scoff either hide away on Thay Mass or sometimes they just are not there in the morning. Some stories tell of Spies and Rogue Wizards carried off into the night by green clad flying elves. Vampiric Elves with Eagle Taloned Legs and feathered Wings of green with a velvet texture. They are said to have sickly sweet smiles and constantly be laughing even when sinking their talons into a future slaves shoulders and carrying them away into the night. The Screams of the damned can be heard throughout the night.

Those who honor Santa if deemed to be lacking are given cursed magical items or just a small pouch of Diamonds.

Presents for the faithful can be received at other times of great need a healing potion or a ring of teleport, to Santa's Workshop. One might need to serve in a Magical role till the next Thay Mass But the honor of returning to Thay alive, rescued with a New Staff of Santa and a pouch full of diamonds is well worth it, to most.

Santa is deemed to be an immortal Demigod or Demon Lord. He trades slaves and souls with the Demon Princes of the Abyss. He rides in a Red Flying Sleigh with a Large screaming squirming sack pulled by 12 Magically flying Antlered Sharp Demonic Night Mares. One is noted to be especially evil and dangerous as noted by his glowing Red Nose, Eyes and 6 inch long teeth. Known to eat small children often playing a gruesome game where they toss the child amoung the antlers between the other "Reign Deer" in a fearsome game of catch.

Santa appears to be a 7 foot jolly Red Wizard of Thay in Red Robes trimmed in Silver. Immune to Ageing, Cold, Heat and Fire, lightning and Sonic effects and ignores poisonous gases and sometimes seen drinking either a green Acid or Goblet of Blood. These as well as sliced Heart and Liver organs cooked are often left for him on Thay Mass. Whether he eats them or the "Deer" is anyones guess. Few have seen him as all who do have to save vs Death or die on the spot their soul taken by Santa for trading. Saved vs Death at DC 27. Those who save or are immune can have a brief conversation with Santa and if impressed Santa may 75% chance leave an extra Present 25% 2d10 Diamonds 90% small 50gpv, 5% medium small 300 GPV, 4% 1,000gpv or 1% chance 5,000 gpv diamonds. For those He likes he will recruit, no chance of refusal, for a years service; bestowing another level of experience, 30 years of age reduction and a Set of Santa Robes while he skips a year and goes on Holiday to one of the Lower planes.

Often after they are returned these Red Wizards will don their Robes and go to various Thay Towns Cities and Enclaves where they will be greeted to curry extra favour through a gift of Items Slaves or Souls. The Items are kept by the Lesser Santa's, the slaves are put to work cutting trees and selling trees and spinning Silver Ribbon. Souls are transfered to Santa through unknown means.

Staff of Santa, This 7 foot Staff is topped in a Gold Star that shines up to 120 feet of light in every direction. This is equal to Sunlight in Strength and will heat any area by 10 degree Celsius 18F over ambient. Cast one 3rd Level Fire, Lightning and Acid based spell 4th Level Sonic and Cold or Ice spell once each per day. The Owner does not age and has DR 1/-. It also acts as a broom of flying twice per night during the winter season for 1 hour duration.

Robes of Santa, These grant Fire, Ice, Electrical, Sonic and acid DR 15 and Regeneration of 1hp/ round The wearer is able to teleport no error once per night in winter and can walk on any surface including water as if it is dry ground. Each hip pocket is also a bag of holding 100 pounds. Any Souls in a bottle or container placed in one of these pockets automatically is teleported to Santa, the Big Guy.

Elves of Santa, LE 10 th level Fighter, S15 D15 CN16 Int9 Wis6 Chr10, Hitpoints 10d10+45. (55-145) AC 25. They appear to be wood elves with red curled boots wearing green felt feathered suits. They can walk as a forest elf even in deep snow as if it is dry ground. They can unfurl their wings and fly at 30 mph carrying up to 300 lbs in a clawed foot with a grasp strength of 25. When Flying their claws come out. They smile all the time and will snicker and laugh if talked to. They are Undead Vampires. They obey Santa without question and may come to lesser Santa's aid once per day (24hrs) 50% chance of Summoning plus 25% if at night and further 25% if in winter. They themselves may summon another 100% chance at will after one turn, once per day. Santa may summon any number at will. (up to 10,000). Elves will stay for One day for lesser Santa's Unlimited for Santa himself.

Santa is a Seven foot ageless old Red Wizard. White Beard and hair, he wears Red Robes and carries a Huge Brown Sack of Holding. Santa has access to any non artifact magic item at will and is able to cast any elemental spell once per round. Santa's Stats are AC33, HP666, S30 D30 CN30 IN40 WS20 CH30. Immune to Death, Elemental effects, Age, Fear and cannot be held against his will. DR 30/- vs physical attacks. Santa is Evil or perhaps Neutral of unknown specific alignment. He is always a happy Jolly fellow. He will laugh off most attacks and only fight back if he has to. If he ever does die he will teleport back to his Workshop pocket dimension and reform next winter.

Happy Thay Mass best hope your plans for betrayal are not discovered or it may be your last.

Ho Ho Ho


Thay Red
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LordofBones
Senior Scribe

823 Posts

Posted - 14 Jun 2018 :  04:57:45  Show Profile Send LordofBones a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by sleyvas

quote:
Originally posted by Lord Karsus

-I, for one, am confused.



Ah, lord Karsus, yes, I understand.... twas after all the actions of Leira and Velsharoon in Abeir that led to your revival, if at the loss of your heart. But fear not, for Mystra has made honor of your sacrifice, and Auppenser will help recover thine sanity.


P.S. feel free to help me make up the story of Karsus' revival as we go along here.



Leira: "So, uh, I kind of need someone to sew Karsus back together again..."

Velsharoon: "I knew putting those points into Profession (Mortician) was a bad idea."

As for Velsharan worship in Thay, I'd imagine he'd be pretty popular among the younger generation of Red Wizards. Nobody worships him in public, of course, but there's always some apprentice or up-and-coming star that sees him as the epitome of Thayvian ambition and power. Defeated by his rival, he goes on to entrench himself in lands close to the enemies of Thay and ascends to godhood right under their collective noses.

Tam has pretty much given up on purging the lower ranks, in part because he's given a surprisingly pleasant depiction as the one the future god of necromancy found worthy of ruling Thay. He's not exactly happy about it, but he finds that being tolerant of Velsharan worship is winning him goodwill with the younger Red Wizards; tolerating his archrival's worship is just another stepping stone in his vision of an enlightened and united Thay.

Team Evil: They're Always Hiring.

Edited by - LordofBones on 14 Jun 2018 05:44:30
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Thraskir Skimper
Learned Scribe

191 Posts

Posted - 15 Jun 2018 :  12:25:28  Show Profile Send Thraskir Skimper a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Lord of Bones seems to like "Dead" gods. Although Szass does too. In Thay so called 'gods' are not there to be worshipped, more as a recognition of equals of sorts. Just like the Demon and Devil's we chat with. They are old and that is fine but they are not greatly feared. Talos and Umberlee are negated for instance. As powerful as they are they have no power in Thay. Kossuth and Waukeen are both greatly respected and have many worshippers. Just not amoung the Red Wizards. Thay isn't only populated by Red Wizards.

Thay Red
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CorellonsDevout
Great Reader

USA
2251 Posts

Posted - 21 Jun 2018 :  03:34:17  Show Profile  Send CorellonsDevout an AOL message Send CorellonsDevout a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I would be careful about applying real world beliefs (or non-beliefs) to the Realms. In the Realms, the gods, the afterlife, and thus souls, are very much real and established fact. As someone else said, there are very few true atheists in the Realms, as they know of their existence, and it isn't based on mere "belief". So, whatever one's religious (or non-religious) views are in the real world, be careful about using them in regards to the Realms. Atheism and the soul being just "memory imprints in the brain" don't work in such a setting.

Sweet water and light laughter
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