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Ethriel
Learned Scribe
USA
272 Posts |
 Posted - 24 Feb 2006 : 00:15:35
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You're absolutely write, Erik, my apologies...got a bit overenthusiastic....but for the goat legs, I meant a certain demon lord has 'em.
Now, for Ghostwalker...did you always have it in mind for Greyt to be killed by Meris and the Ghostly Lady being the 'final boss' so to speak? I actually found myself liking Greyt a bit at the end, despite seeing him casually having Meris murdering the elf woman earlier |
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Erik Scott de Bie
Forgotten Realms Author
USA
4598 Posts |
Posted - 24 Feb 2006 : 16:40:43
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quote:
Originally posted by Ethriel
You're absolutely write, Erik, my apologies...got a bit overenthusiastic....but for the goat legs, I meant a certain demon lord has 'em.
Not at all, my good chap! I was merely pointing that out for the sake of readers who hadn't had the pleasure yet, and for the moderators' perpetual headaches. 
Now, for Ghostwalker...did you always have it in mind for Greyt to be killed by Meris and the Ghostly Lady being the 'final boss' so to speak? I actually found myself liking Greyt a bit at the end, despite seeing him casually having Meris murdering the elf woman earlier
[/quote]
It was absolutely fully planned. Greyt was never intended to be a full-out villain -- him and Meris, Gylther'yel, practically all the villains. I simply made him a real person, with real flaws (HUGE flaws). I went for a sort of "tragic hero" who ultimately falls short (the "tragic" part). I'm glad you sympathized with him! He was one of my favorite characters to write. 
Since Gylther'yel was the manipulator all along, it made sense for her to be the "final boss" -- you don't REALLY realize that she's done all this until the beginning of the climax. Alternately, I could have had Meris kill her and be the final struggle himself, but the reader would be expecting that.
Thanks for the praise -- I'm glad you enjoyed.
Cheers |
Erik Scott de Bie
'Tis easier to destroy than to create.
Author of a number of Realms novels (GHOSTWALKER, DEPTHS OF MADNESS, and the SHADOWBANE series), contributor to the NEVERWINTER CAMPAIGN GUIDE and SHADOWFELL: GLOOMWROUGHT AND BEYOND, Twitch DM of the Dungeon Scrawlers, currently playing "The Westgate Irregulars" |
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The Red Walker
Great Reader
USA
3563 Posts |
Posted - 30 Aug 2006 : 21:43:09
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I was curious as to if Gylther'yel really did bring Walker back as he believes and she tells him. I was thinking that maybe the ring actually saved him, and she saw that claiming to have brought him back from the dead was the perfect way to begin her "creation' of Walker as her champion. (I am not sure if the ring must be on your finger to work, as it seems to be more than standard regeneration ring.)
Secondly, I can't wait to read about Walker and Arya in the future, I just hope that Bars and Derst get a few scenes when I do.
I am leary of making such a big leap of faith, but I think you all but said he survives. If I remember right it, every death that you described in any amount of detail was some variation of "a fade to black", except Walker. Seems like you made sure that we noticed that his "demise" was a passing into light. A complete 180 from the deaths that we know ended in death!
But, what really gave me hope even before the Finale was the trip through "Shadow". When Arya saw him as a being of light, when he had before only been a being of darkness or shadow. It seemed that signafied that Ayra's love and his understanding of who he really was (not what he was), transformed him into a whole being for the first time.
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A little nonsense now and then, relished by the wisest men - Willy Wonka
"We need men who can dream of things that never were." -
John F. Kennedy, speech in Dublin, Ireland, June 28, 1963
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Erik Scott de Bie
Forgotten Realms Author
USA
4598 Posts |
Posted - 30 Aug 2006 : 22:50:57
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Glad the ending worked for you!
I shall answer a couple of your questions.
quote:
Originally posted by The Red Walker
I was curious as to if Gylther'yel really did bring Walker back as he believes and she tells him. I was thinking that maybe the ring actually saved him, and she saw that claiming to have brought him back from the dead was the perfect way to begin her "creation' of Walker as her champion. (I am not sure if the ring must be on your finger to work, as it seems to be more than standard regeneration ring.)
Other than also serving as a ring of sustenance, the ring is pretty standard. Have to be wearing it when you receive the wounds in order to heal them.
Remember, at the end of the prologue, Rhyn was not WEARING the ring. Meris had removed it. It fell, like a silver tear, on his cheek. Thus, when they killed him, he didn't come back. That's where Gylther'yel stepped in. Speaking in terms of game mechanics again, 'twas the "Last Breath" spell she used (which is from Complete Divine or Spell Compendium, as I recall) to bring Rhyn back, only seconds after he had died.
Those seconds made all the difference.
quote:
Secondly, I can't wait to read about Walker and Arya in the future, I just hope that Bars and Derst get a few scenes when I do.
Trust me -- if I get to write about them (and I really want to), Bars and Derst will NOT go neglected.
quote:
I am leary of making such a big leap of faith, but I think you all but said he survives. If I remember right it, every death that you described in any amount of detail was some variation of "a fade to black", except Walker. Seems like you made sure that we noticed that his "demise" was a passing into light. A complete 180 from the deaths that we know ended in death!
Ah, that's the mystery, isn't it?
You can be sure I want to resolve this question, and if I get the chance -- perhaps in a subsequent story about Arya -- I will. Though not necessarily conclusively. 
quote:
But, what really gave me hope even before the Finale was the trip through "Shadow". When Arya saw him as a being of light, when he had before only been a being of darkness or shadow. It seemed that signafied that Ayra's love and his understanding of who he really was (not what he was), transformed him into a whole being for the first time.
Again, glad you enjoyed.
Thanks for reading! Feel free to write a review, if you like, to post on Amazon or whatever you feel like. You're very expressive with your thoughts and I've found our interactions quite insightful.
Do you have other questions? I'd be happy to answer them.
Also, have you read "Wayfarer" on the wizards' site? It's a short webstory I wrote to accompany Ghostwalker. Perspective character is Meris, and it happens a couple hours after the prologue, roughly 15 years before chapter 1:
http://wizards.com/default.asp?x=books/fr/wayfarer
Cheers |
Erik Scott de Bie
'Tis easier to destroy than to create.
Author of a number of Realms novels (GHOSTWALKER, DEPTHS OF MADNESS, and the SHADOWBANE series), contributor to the NEVERWINTER CAMPAIGN GUIDE and SHADOWFELL: GLOOMWROUGHT AND BEYOND, Twitch DM of the Dungeon Scrawlers, currently playing "The Westgate Irregulars" |
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The Red Walker
Great Reader
USA
3563 Posts |
Posted - 30 Aug 2006 : 23:37:42
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quote:
Originally posted by Erik Scott de Bie
Glad the ending worked for you!
I shall answer a couple of your questions.
Other than also serving as a ring of sustenance, the ring is pretty standard. Have to be wearing it when you receive the wounds in order to heal them.
Remember, at the end of the prologue, Rhyn was not WEARING the ring. Meris had removed it. It fell, like a silver tear, on his cheek. Thus, when they killed him, he didn't come back. That's where Gylther'yel stepped in. Speaking in terms of game mechanics again, 'twas the "Last Breath" spell she used (which is from Complete Divine or Spell Compendium, as I recall) to bring Rhyn back, only seconds after he had died.
Those seconds made all the difference.
I did remember that it landed on his cheek, but I was not sure it had to be worn. I will mark that up as a hazard of only experiencing the Realms through novels and having never participating in gaming. (Mayhaps another reason to try? )
quote:
Trust me -- if I get to write about them (and I really want to), Bars and Derst will NOT go neglected.
Glad to hear it straight from the horses.....errr , Illustrious Authors mouth . Oh and by the by......wouldst thou needest a proofreader??
quote:
Ah, that's the mystery, isn't it?
You can be sure I want to resolve this question, and if I get the chance -- perhaps in a subsequent story about Arya -- I will. Though not necessarily conclusively. [/quote}
Umm....pardon me Sir.....But could yo be any more vague please, I almost gleaned an answer out of you!
It's almost like when you come to the direct answer...you slip into Shadow. Hmmm.... very reminiscent of a character I am fond of.
quote:
Again, glad you enjoyed.
Thanks for reading! Feel free to write a review, if you like, to post on Amazon or whatever you feel like. You're very expressive with your thoughts and I've found our interactions quite insightful.
Thank you for the compliments and I will certain consider that, I just need to make sure I am wide awake when I do though! This whole Farming biz is Tiring with the harvest just around the corner you know! I would not want to be any less articulate or effusive in my opinions than your work deserves.
Do you have other questions? I'd be happy to answer them.
Yes to borrow from your previous post to Dhomal in fact: a) Whence the ghostfire elemental?
b) What's the deal with the locket?
c) Why does Meris work with Gylther'yel?
d) Is Walker really dead?
e) What are Gylther'yel's "ghost powers"?
I will be happy with an answer to any or all! I feel that since you listed them....that you wanted to answer them???
B most intrigues me the most as you may guess from my prior question about it.
quote:
Also, have you read "Wayfarer" on the wizards' site? It's a short webstory I wrote to accompany Ghostwalker. Perspective character is Meris, and it happens a couple hours after the prologue, roughly 15 years before chapter 1:
http://wizards.com/default.asp?x=books/fr/wayfarer
Cheers
I have not, and I would love to read it. The link seems to take me to the main page of Wizards FR books, and I can not seem to navigate to your story from there. I did try searching , and alas no luck either.
A little help please? Anyone? |
A little nonsense now and then, relished by the wisest men - Willy Wonka
"We need men who can dream of things that never were." -
John F. Kennedy, speech in Dublin, Ireland, June 28, 1963
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Erik Scott de Bie
Forgotten Realms Author
USA
4598 Posts |
Posted - 31 Aug 2006 : 03:20:45
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quote:
Originally posted by The Red Walker
I did remember that it landed on his cheek, but I was not sure it had to be worn. I will mark that up as a hazard of only experiencing the Realms through novels and having never participating in gaming. (Mayhaps another reason to try? )
I won't dissuade you. It's fun, with the right DM. Myself, I'm running two campaigns set in 1372, and Arya, Bars, and Derst have appeared in both. (Of course, the two campaigns are interlaced: one party is the enemy of the other, and the players are the same in both parties.) I wrote an adventure with a cameo by Walker, and by. . . heh. . . Talthaliel's wife.
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Glad to hear it straight from the horses.....errr , Illustrious Authors mouth . Oh and by the by......wouldst thou needest a proofreader??
Wizards keeps me well stocked, but I appreciate the offer.
quote:
Umm....pardon me Sir.....But could yo be any more vague please, I almost gleaned an answer out of you!
I possess within me access to pits of vaguery as yet unplumbed.
quote:
Almost gleaned an answer
To quote the expert at evasion: "Almost nothing. "
quote:
It's almost like when you come to the direct answer...you slip into Shadow. Hmmm.... very reminiscent of a character I am fond of.
Hmm. Shadow. . . so comfy. . . .
quote:
I just need to make sure I am wide awake when I do though! This whole Farming biz is Tiring with the harvest just around the corner you know!
I can believe it. One of my best friends grew up on a farm, and I myself am from a little agricultural town.
quote:
I would not want to be any less articulate or effusive in my opinions than your work deserves.
Why thank you.
quote:
a) Whence the ghostfire elemental?
Gylther'yel.
quote:
b) What's the deal with the locket?
It's small, gold, and it has one of the themes of the book written on the back, in Elvish.
quote:
c) Why does Meris work with Gylther'yel?
Four reasons:
1. Obsessive hatred of father + opportunity to kill father.
2. Obsessive hatred of Walker + opportunity to kill Walker.
3. [bleep] Spoiler for "Wayfarer."
4. To quote another Derst, "I did it all for the nookie, so you can take that. . . ." ahem. Gylther'yel can be rather attractive when she wants.
(I should also point out that there was originally a scene that explained this in more detail that was cut for length reasons, not PG-13/R reasons. But yes. As far as I'm concerned, it did happen.)
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d) Is Walker really dead?
I give up. Is he?
Seriously, this I cannot say. I may or may not be able to explore the story more with Wizards at a later date, and would hate to bind myself in some way.
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e) What are Gylther'yel's "ghost powers"?
Other than her druid powers (of which she is roughly 15th level, gamerspeak-wise), her spells affect corporeal/incorporeal/ghost targets equally (mechanic: transdimensional spell), she assumes incorporeal animal forms, and the creatures she summons are also incorporeal if she wants them to be, but NOT undead. Plus, she can really freak people out -- like Amra Clearwater.
quote:
I have not, and I would love to read it. The link seems to take me to the main page of Wizards FR books, and I can not seem to navigate to your story from there. I did try searching , and alas no luck either.
A little help please? Anyone?
I believe the wizards site is being a little under the weather. Perhaps I'll work on getting permission to post the story on my blog or something as well.
Cheers |
Erik Scott de Bie
'Tis easier to destroy than to create.
Author of a number of Realms novels (GHOSTWALKER, DEPTHS OF MADNESS, and the SHADOWBANE series), contributor to the NEVERWINTER CAMPAIGN GUIDE and SHADOWFELL: GLOOMWROUGHT AND BEYOND, Twitch DM of the Dungeon Scrawlers, currently playing "The Westgate Irregulars" |
Edited by - Erik Scott de Bie on 31 Aug 2006 15:52:03 |
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Dremvek
Seeker
70 Posts |
Posted - 31 Aug 2006 : 15:19:43
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| It seems that the short stories stay at their original link for a month or so, then they get moved to a new location. The same happened with the short story companion to Bloodwalk. |
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Erik Scott de Bie
Forgotten Realms Author
USA
4598 Posts |
Posted - 31 Aug 2006 : 15:54:34
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quote:
Originally posted by Dremvek
It seems that the short stories stay at their original link for a month or so, then they get moved to a new location. The same happened with the short story companion to Bloodwalk.
Yeah, something like that.
I went in and checked, and the link to "Wayfarer" does not appear to function. I found the Ghostwalker product page and clicked on the short story link, and it just sent me to the main page.
If it's still like that through the weekend, I'll check with my editor and see what's going on. The wizards site goes through blips like this.
Cheers |
Erik Scott de Bie
'Tis easier to destroy than to create.
Author of a number of Realms novels (GHOSTWALKER, DEPTHS OF MADNESS, and the SHADOWBANE series), contributor to the NEVERWINTER CAMPAIGN GUIDE and SHADOWFELL: GLOOMWROUGHT AND BEYOND, Twitch DM of the Dungeon Scrawlers, currently playing "The Westgate Irregulars" |
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Chosen of Moradin
Master of Realmslore
Brazil
1120 Posts |
Posted - 31 Aug 2006 : 15:58:58
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I´m not Wooly, but I too have some links upon my sleeve.
Wayfarer, and the other short story and sample chapters of The Fighters series. |
Dwarf, DM, husband, and proud of this! :P
twitter: @yuripeixoto
Facebook: yuri.peixoto |
Edited by - Chosen of Moradin on 31 Aug 2006 16:00:05 |
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Erik Scott de Bie
Forgotten Realms Author
USA
4598 Posts |
Posted - 31 Aug 2006 : 17:07:04
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quote:
Originally posted by Chosen of Moradin
I´m not Wooly, but I too have some links upon my sleeve.
Wayfarer, and the other short story and sample chapters of The Fighters series.
That sneaky o-love dastard. I love it!
Cheers |
Erik Scott de Bie
'Tis easier to destroy than to create.
Author of a number of Realms novels (GHOSTWALKER, DEPTHS OF MADNESS, and the SHADOWBANE series), contributor to the NEVERWINTER CAMPAIGN GUIDE and SHADOWFELL: GLOOMWROUGHT AND BEYOND, Twitch DM of the Dungeon Scrawlers, currently playing "The Westgate Irregulars" |
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The Red Walker
Great Reader
USA
3563 Posts |
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Erik Scott de Bie
Forgotten Realms Author
USA
4598 Posts |
Posted - 31 Aug 2006 : 22:28:05
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quote:
Originally posted by The Red Walker
Some Bloke left an interesting Customer review for Ghostwalker Aug 30th.
What a review! Heart felt, vehement, and powerful. Whew!
Make sure if you see "Some Bloke," you thank him for me.
quote:
P.S. Thanks for Killing Meris..........
Finally
Sure, you say that. . . hee.
I think instead, I'll say:
Or DID I?
DUN DUN DUN!!!
Cheers |
Erik Scott de Bie
'Tis easier to destroy than to create.
Author of a number of Realms novels (GHOSTWALKER, DEPTHS OF MADNESS, and the SHADOWBANE series), contributor to the NEVERWINTER CAMPAIGN GUIDE and SHADOWFELL: GLOOMWROUGHT AND BEYOND, Twitch DM of the Dungeon Scrawlers, currently playing "The Westgate Irregulars" |
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The Red Walker
Great Reader
USA
3563 Posts |
Posted - 01 Sep 2006 : 12:54:05
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quote:
What a review! Heart felt, vehement, and powerful. Whew!
Make sure if you see "Some Bloke," you thank him for me.
I was hoping that "bloke" didn't go overboard
quote:
Sure, you say that. . . hee.
I think instead, I'll say:
Or DID I?
DUN DUN DUN!!!
Cheers
Not funny.
And yes, he is dead.
On a seperate theme, was curious if I was the only one who read this and heard Evanescence doing the soundtrack throughout?(When I read I actually "see" everything just like a movie) especially the battle with Arya & Walker vs. Meris and the Family Rangers.(tourniquet was playing) and the "Wedding" and consumation fade out.(My Immortal)
P.S. What a Great Movie! |
A little nonsense now and then, relished by the wisest men - Willy Wonka
"We need men who can dream of things that never were." -
John F. Kennedy, speech in Dublin, Ireland, June 28, 1963
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Edited by - The Red Walker on 01 Sep 2006 12:56:05 |
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Erik Scott de Bie
Forgotten Realms Author
USA
4598 Posts |
Posted - 01 Sep 2006 : 15:46:50
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quote:
Originally posted by The Red Walker
On a seperate theme, was curious if I was the only one who read this and heard Evanescence doing the soundtrack throughout?(When I read I actually "see" everything just like a movie) especially the battle with Arya & Walker vs. Meris and the Family Rangers.(tourniquet was playing) and the "Wedding" and consumation fade out.(My Immortal)
Interesting you should say that. I write to music, and each of my books often gets a soundtrack of its own (or is written with a specific CD in mind). Evanescence's "Fallen" CD kind of makes a secondary soundtrack for the book, but here's the one I compiled:
Won’t Back Down – Fuel – Daredevil soundtrack
The Hollow – A Perfect Circle – Mer de Noms
So Far Away – Stabbing Westward – Stabbing Westward
Getting Away with Murder – Papa Roach – Getting Away with Murder
Downfall – Trust Company – The Lonely Position of Neutral
Counting Bodies like Sheep to the Rhythm of the War Drums – A Perfect Circle – eMOTIVE
Unforgiven II – Metallica – Reload
Passive – A Perfect Circle – eMOTIVE
Conflict – Disturbed – The Sickness
Demonoid Phenomenon – Rob Zombie – Hellbilly Deluxe
Until It Sleeps – Metallica – Load
Numb – Linkin Park – Meteora
The Noose – A Perfect Circle – Thirteenth Step
Carnival – Tori Amos – Mission Impossible 2 Soundtrack
Here without You – Three Doors Down – Away from the Sun
Evanescence, interestingly enough, is more of a Twilight kind of band. And you would not do yourself injustice listening to "Fallen" while reading that novel.
quote:
P.S. What a Great Movie!
Thank you! I think Ghostwalker would be neat as a movie.
One of my favorite anecdotes is the battle between Torlic and Walker, at the climax, when things shift and you see Walker "step out" of the sword. My editor said she could just SEE the camera angles on that one.
Cheers |
Erik Scott de Bie
'Tis easier to destroy than to create.
Author of a number of Realms novels (GHOSTWALKER, DEPTHS OF MADNESS, and the SHADOWBANE series), contributor to the NEVERWINTER CAMPAIGN GUIDE and SHADOWFELL: GLOOMWROUGHT AND BEYOND, Twitch DM of the Dungeon Scrawlers, currently playing "The Westgate Irregulars" |
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The Red Walker
Great Reader
USA
3563 Posts |
Posted - 01 Sep 2006 : 17:56:32
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quote:
Thank you! I think Ghostwalker would be neat as a movie.
One of my favorite anecdotes is the battle between Torlic and Walker, at the climax, when things shift and you see Walker "step out" of the sword. My editor said she could just SEE the camera angles on that one.
Cheers
Hmmm...well I know this bloke who is working on a screen adaptation!
Since my game mechanics are lacking, I humbly ask the following:
Walker obviously exists in the "real" world. He can see and cross into the ethereal, and he can also shift into and travel through shadow? Is that something that would be typical of his classification or is this "triple threat" unique to him? Or did you waggle your fingers and "Magick" that up? |
A little nonsense now and then, relished by the wisest men - Willy Wonka
"We need men who can dream of things that never were." -
John F. Kennedy, speech in Dublin, Ireland, June 28, 1963
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Edited by - The Red Walker on 01 Sep 2006 17:57:46 |
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Erik Scott de Bie
Forgotten Realms Author
USA
4598 Posts |
Posted - 01 Sep 2006 : 18:11:53
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Basically, Walker can exist in any of the three planes.
The first plane of existence he discovered beyond his own (and the first one that a character gets access to with the Ghostwalker PrC) is the ethereal plane. He uses that as a gateway into the shadow world. Everytime he shifts into shadow, he goes through the ethereal. Mechanically speaking, on the shadow world he is not ethereal (unless he chooses to use both powers at the same time, in which case he can turn briefly ethereal in shadow), but he has the traces of etherealness about him, such that they attract ghosts in the shadow world.
That's my interpretation of how the class features of the gw work.
Cheers |
Erik Scott de Bie
'Tis easier to destroy than to create.
Author of a number of Realms novels (GHOSTWALKER, DEPTHS OF MADNESS, and the SHADOWBANE series), contributor to the NEVERWINTER CAMPAIGN GUIDE and SHADOWFELL: GLOOMWROUGHT AND BEYOND, Twitch DM of the Dungeon Scrawlers, currently playing "The Westgate Irregulars" |
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The Red Walker
Great Reader
USA
3563 Posts |
Posted - 07 Sep 2006 : 01:28:34
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Two more things before I put Ghostwalker on the bookshelf and move to the next book in the stack.
1) In Walker and Gylther'yel's "Showdown at the OK Corral" she says that he cannot choose between his loyalties between her and to "she who would carry your child, she whom you love". When I read that It stood out, then slipped away whilst I read the climax. I wanted to ask you then If that was what you were talking about to Rinonalyrna when you told her
"P.S. And mayhap we'll see some of the extent of Walker's impact on Arya. Only time, as the cliche runs, will tell."
Does his impact on her include Rhyn Jr. ?? DUN DUN DUN!!!*tried to do an evil laugh but just doesnt feel so evil right now*
2) Good job making that damnable locket appear so Important that a Knight in Silver would pilfer it, then totally downplay it here at the Keep whilst pretending it still may be important. Thus making us think it was not important after all. Only lastly to hide one of the books most important themes on its back, in plain sight the whole time.
P.S. I feel for your wife if you are this sly very often!!
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A little nonsense now and then, relished by the wisest men - Willy Wonka
"We need men who can dream of things that never were." -
John F. Kennedy, speech in Dublin, Ireland, June 28, 1963
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Edited by - The Red Walker on 07 Sep 2006 01:32:13 |
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Erik Scott de Bie
Forgotten Realms Author
USA
4598 Posts |
Posted - 07 Sep 2006 : 15:50:52
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quote:
Originally posted by The Red Walker
1) In Walker and Gylther'yel's "Showdown at the OK Corral" she says that he cannot choose between his loyalties between her and to "she who would carry your child, she whom you love". When I read that It stood out, then slipped away whilst I read the climax. I wanted to ask you then If that was what you were talking about to Rinonalyrna when you told her
"P.S. And mayhap we'll see some of the extent of Walker's impact on Arya. Only time, as the cliche runs, will tell."
Does his impact on her include Rhyn Jr. ?? DUN DUN DUN!!!*tried to do an evil laugh but just doesnt feel so evil right now*
You want to make a good, deep laugh from the diaphram -- really project. As though you're meaning to send a chill down the spine of every living creature within earshot.
As for an actual answer. . . Maybe, maybe not. Gylther'yel IS a druid, so she might know -- and a "ghost druid" at that, very keen to the auras of life and death. Walker and Arya did, indeed, do their part, at least. Who can say what the future may hold?
Other than me, that is.
I guess we can see if/when Arya reappears, whether she's bouncing a child on her knee.
The better question, really, would be whether a child would be a blessing for Arya (a reminder) or a curse (a reminder). 
What if she were to become pregnant from the events in Ghostwalker, then miscarry or produce a stillborn child? What do you imagine THAT would do to her? 
Feel free to speculate -- as if you needed my permission.
quote:
2) Good job making that damnable locket appear so Important that a Knight in Silver would pilfer it, then totally downplay it here at the Keep whilst pretending it still may be important. Thus making us think it was not important after all. Only lastly to hide one of the books most important themes on its back, in plain sight the whole time.
The locket is, basically, just another reminder of the theme, that creation is a tougher and more rigorous process than destruction (does this have to do with your former question? Who knows? That is, who other than. . . ahem ). " 'Tis easier to destroy than to create" is simply Lyetha's saying, and Ghostwalker -- to some extent -- shows exactly what she means.
(As for where I got the line, it hearkens back to Desperado, actually, where El Mariachi says to the boy, in the hospital, "I guess it is easier to destroy than to create.")
I should also point out that there WAS a scene, which I cut for length reasons and because it was part of the original postlude (before I fixed the ending), where Arya discovered the locket in her pocket and it reminded her of Walker and the last few days. It was kinda one of those "everything clicks" scenes. As it is, I used the ring instead, which I thought more fitting anyway.
quote:
P.S. I feel for your wife if you are this sly very often!!
Always.
Cheers |
Erik Scott de Bie
'Tis easier to destroy than to create.
Author of a number of Realms novels (GHOSTWALKER, DEPTHS OF MADNESS, and the SHADOWBANE series), contributor to the NEVERWINTER CAMPAIGN GUIDE and SHADOWFELL: GLOOMWROUGHT AND BEYOND, Twitch DM of the Dungeon Scrawlers, currently playing "The Westgate Irregulars" |
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turox
Learned Scribe
USA
145 Posts |
Posted - 13 Feb 2007 : 18:32:36
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Hi Erik,
Last night I finished Ghostwalker. First let me say BRAVO, BRAVO! The way the fight scenes were described to me was one of the best ways as I could visually see it happening in my mind.
I did have a major issue with the book but that could be my inexperience with the Realms. What was with all the spirits? I was under the impression that when someone died they went to the fugue plain to await either the god they worshipped to come and get them, or for their trail from Myrkul or now Kelemvor. And why was Tarm down there? Did he resist the pull of the fugue plain to wait for his love to die, or did Tyr send him back down there to wait? This may also be the fact that in life I don’t believe in ghosts. My belief is when we die we see nothing but an eternal blackness. But with what I do know about the fugue plain then the whole part with the spirits was confusing.
Also how old was Rhyn in the prelude? When I first read that statement all I could imagine was my nephew in that situation. This helped but now for some reason I really want to know how old he was. I read it twice and it didn’t say his age just that he was a youth. To me that is anywhere from 2 to 13.
I don’t care what others say. I liked the term roguish knight. Derst seemed to me one of those types that are a knight because that is what his father wanted.
Do you have any questions for me?
P.S. Can’t wait for Depths but as it’s a trilogy will wait for them to all come out. (Blame that on Robert Jordan and Terry Goodkind. )
P.P.S. Pick me in your contest for the honor of you being the first author to sign one of my books. |
Turox Antas Dragonslayer -
"People will believe anything they want to believe, or fear to believe."
Wizard's First Rule: Chapter 36, Page #397, US Hard Cover (revealed by Zeddicus Zu'l Zorander).
Explanation by Zeddicus Zu'l Zorander: "People are stupid; given proper motivation, almost anyone will believe almost anything. Because people are stupid, they will believe a lie because they want to believe it's true, or because they are afraid it might be true. People’s heads are full of knowledge, facts, and beliefs, and most of it is false, yet they think it all true. People are stupid; they can only rarely tell the difference between a lie and the truth, and yet they are confident they can, and so are all the easier to fool."
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Erik Scott de Bie
Forgotten Realms Author
USA
4598 Posts |
Posted - 13 Feb 2007 : 23:05:02
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quote:
Originally posted by turox
Hi Erik,
Last night I finished Ghostwalker. First let me say BRAVO, BRAVO! The way the fight scenes were described to me was one of the best ways as I could visually see it happening in my mind.
Thank you much! I'm glad you enjoyed.
quote:
I did have a major issue with the book but that could be my inexperience with the Realms.
I shall do my best to answer your questions!
quote:
This may also be the fact that in life I don’t believe in ghosts. My belief is when we die we see nothing but an eternal blackness.
That is indeed possible. Does it even make sense to “see” anything, as you no longer have any connection to your eyes? Or maybe there’s an afterlife. I don’t know, and I’m not interested in doing what’s necessary to find out (i.e. dying).
I myself am entertaining a theory about the echoes of people or feelings, much like a shout bouncing off two mountains. If the conditions are right, this sort of echo could be trapped and never truly go away. Even if we can’t hear it, because it’s so tiny as to exist only as a shuddering of molecules. Is this not a ghost of whatever caused it in the first place? A kind of barely-perceptible ripple?
But that’s all very interesting theoretical physics/philosophy. We were talking about fantasy.
quote:
What was with all the spirits? I was under the impression that when someone died they went to the fugue plain to await either the god they worshipped to come and get them, or for their trail from Myrkul or now Kelemvor. And why was Tarm down there? Did he resist the pull of the fugue plain to wait for his love to die, or did Tyr send him back down there to wait?
My own knowledge of D&D/FR metaphysics is far from perfect, so bear with me.
To put it in basic terms, yes, that’s what happens. According to Complete Divine, the spirit of a character who dies in the game lingers around his body for a little while (a few seconds, i.e. a couple rounds), then departs to go onward, wherever that onward will be (perhaps nowhere). In the Realms, that’s the Fugue Plane, where they wait around for a deity (or a deity’s servants) to come collect them. From there, they do whatever the deity says – become petitioners, cease to exist, become part of the deity’s plane of existence, get “reborn” into new bodies, etc. If they’re faithless or false, they go to Kelemvor’s judgment and get put in the wall. It’s possible (and no one really knows *why* it might happen) for a spirit to stick around and become a ghost or some other undead creature. These generally attach themselves to the place they were killed, or some other place that’s of especial importance to them. It’s also possible for certain spells (trap the soul, for instance, or magic jar) to manipulate the disposition of the soul of a “dead” creature.
In the case of Ghostwalker, I left it purposefully unexplained why the spirits (not powerful enough to be real ghosts) are there. There are hints, of course, as to why they might remain – the spirits are drawn to Walker (as a creature that exists between their worlds). Perhaps they are captured by his aura. This is certainly the case with those he kills (you noted Greyt, Drex, et al, around him in the last scene?).
As I said, these creatures aren’t ghosts or some other powerful undead forms – they are mere “echoes” of the lives that spawned them.
Tarm is an interesting case – did he get trapped in his the aura of his “son”? Doesn’t seem possible, as the old priest died long before Rhyn (so the boy didn’t have any sort of connection to the spirits – or did he?). Did Tyr send Tarm back, to act as a sort of silent guide for Walker? Did Tarm become a ghost/spirit on his own, waiting for Lyetha, or perhaps for Greyt to get his just desserts? What do *you* think?
It’s worth noting that I am a *big* Ravenloft fan. My original conception of Walker even had some feats from the 3e Ravenloft book (specifically those dealing with ethereal resonance). His object reading, for instance, is much like something that some modern psychics claim to do (and in Walker’s case is a manifestation of wild psionic talent, released by his connection to the ethereal). Ravenloft also has the concept of “Ethereal Resonance,” which dictates the strength of ghosts (amongst other things) – Walker exudes his own resonance.
quote:
Also how old was Rhyn in the prelude? When I first read that statement all I could imagine was my nephew in that situation. This helped but now for some reason I really want to know how old he was. I read it twice and it didn’t say his age just that he was a youth. To me that is anywhere from 2 to 13.
Twelve years of age. Making him 27 when he appears in chapter 1.
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I don’t care what others say. I liked the term roguish knight. Derst seemed to me one of those types that are a knight because that is what his father wanted.
A friend from the WotC boards, I see!
An excellent explanation. Knighthood chafes at Derst, who was born on the streets, poor as all get out, without knowing who his father was (or even his mother for that matter). He made a life for himself in service to an old rogue of Everlund, who eventually came to think of him as a son. He paid for Derst’s sword-training, which the halfelf only really did because it allowed him to meet and impress girls. He met Arya (whom he adores) and Bars (with whom he competes for her, and has been doing it so long it has nothing to do with Arya anymore), and became a knight himself.
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Do you have any questions for me?
How are you today?
No seriously – I find thinking about ghosts an interesting exercise. What do you think of my “echo” theory?
Have you ever read any Ravenloft yourself? I can recommend some good ones. (I’d start with Vampire of the Mists, by Christie Golden.)
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P.S. Can’t wait for Depths but as it’s a trilogy will wait for them to all come out. (Blame that on Robert Jordan and Terry Goodkind. )
Ah, it’s only a trilogy in that it’s the first novel of the Dungeons novels, which are related to each other much like the Fighters novels.
Which is to say, it isn’t a trilogy at all.
Each of the Dungeons novels is a standalone adventure, none of which have anything to do with one another other than all being in the Realms. (And Jaleigh and Rosemary and I were all Young Dragons, from the RotD2 anthology.)
No, I’m sorry, no Fox-at-Twilight trilogy . . . at least not yet. Maybe WotC will publish one in the future. I suppose that depends, for a large part, on the success of Depths. It is a story I’d very, very much like to continue.
You can, however, read about her (Fox, that is) in her first appearance: “The Greater Treasure,” a short in the Realms of the Elves anthology.
quote:
P.P.S. Pick me in your contest for the honor of you being the first author to sign one of my books.
Oh, you’re going to make me feel bad that it’s a random pool!
Cheers
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Erik Scott de Bie
'Tis easier to destroy than to create.
Author of a number of Realms novels (GHOSTWALKER, DEPTHS OF MADNESS, and the SHADOWBANE series), contributor to the NEVERWINTER CAMPAIGN GUIDE and SHADOWFELL: GLOOMWROUGHT AND BEYOND, Twitch DM of the Dungeon Scrawlers, currently playing "The Westgate Irregulars" |
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Rinonalyrna Fathomlin
Great Reader
USA
7106 Posts |
Posted - 13 Feb 2007 : 23:56:40
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quote:
Originally posted by Erik Scott de Bie
An excellent explanation. Knighthood chafes at Derst, who was born on the streets, poor as all get out, without knowing who his father was (or even his mother for that matter). He made a life for himself in service to an old rogue of Everlund, who eventually came to think of him as a son. He paid for Derst’s sword-training, which the halfelf only really did because it allowed him to meet and impress girls.
Heh--silly as it may sound, up until now I didn't know Derst was a half-elf.
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No seriously – I find thinking about ghosts an interesting exercise. What do you think of my “echo” theory?
You didn't ask me but...
Personally, when I think of a "ghost" I think of someone's consciousness as being somehow detached from the body. So, even if someone leaves behind an echo of themselves (which is possible, but I can't say if that's true), is it really a ghost in the most commonly understood sense of the term? Also, like many people here I make no claims of knowing what actually happens to someone's consciousness after death (and yes, if we aren't sentient, we can't see anything whether it's blackness or not), but I'm inclined to exhaust any natural explanations for things before considering supernatural explanations.
Just my opinion--I like these discussions. |
"Instead of asking why we sleep, it might make sense to ask why we wake. Perchance we live to dream. From that perspective, the sea of troubles we navigate in the workaday world might be the price we pay for admission to another night in the world of dreams."
--Richard Greene (letter to Time) |
Edited by - Rinonalyrna Fathomlin on 13 Feb 2007 23:58:13 |
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turox
Learned Scribe
USA
145 Posts |
Posted - 14 Feb 2007 : 00:00:25
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| Thanks for the answers and I wasn't really trying to make you feel bad with the P.P.S. I was just having a little bit of fun. When I get home I will re-read this again and give you my reply from there where I have more time to contemplate life, love, and the universe. I will also have my books at home to research info that may be needed. |
Turox Antas Dragonslayer -
"People will believe anything they want to believe, or fear to believe."
Wizard's First Rule: Chapter 36, Page #397, US Hard Cover (revealed by Zeddicus Zu'l Zorander).
Explanation by Zeddicus Zu'l Zorander: "People are stupid; given proper motivation, almost anyone will believe almost anything. Because people are stupid, they will believe a lie because they want to believe it's true, or because they are afraid it might be true. People’s heads are full of knowledge, facts, and beliefs, and most of it is false, yet they think it all true. People are stupid; they can only rarely tell the difference between a lie and the truth, and yet they are confident they can, and so are all the easier to fool."
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turox
Learned Scribe
USA
145 Posts |
Posted - 14 Feb 2007 : 03:16:19
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quote:
Originally posted by Erik Scott de Bie
That is indeed possible. Does it even make sense to “see” anything, as you no longer have any connection to your eyes? Or maybe there’s an afterlife. I don’t know, and I’m not interested in doing what’s necessary to find out (i.e. dying).
I myself am entertaining a theory about the echoes of people or feelings, much like a shout bouncing off two mountains. If the conditions are right, this sort of echo could be trapped and never truly go away. Even if we can’t hear it, because it’s so tiny as to exist only as a shuddering of molecules. Is this not a ghost of whatever caused it in the first place? A kind of barely-perceptible ripple?
But that’s all very interesting theoretical physics/philosophy. We were talking about fantasy.
Ok you got me, I was at work and typing "see" was alot quicker than "When we die we enter nothing but eternal darkness." Point de Bie
quote:
Originally posted by Erik Scott de Bie
My own knowledge of D&D/FR metaphysics is far from perfect, so bear with me.
Yours is probably better than mine at this.
As for this being set in fantasy I couldn't tell you what a ghost really is. I'm not there, can only interpret what is written and according to the MMI it says "Ghosts are the spectral remnants of intelligent beings who, for one reason or another, cannot rest easily in their graves." Then it goes on to say some don't have anything to do with the living and others are mean who loathe all. But to me FR overrides that with their statement of all spirits going to the fugue plain. Now I could see an evil deity sending some spirits back down to FR as spectre's to help with their agenda. And Tyr might have sent Tarm back down because Tarm requested it. Rhyn could have been born with the ability to have a connection with the Astral plane, which is why Gylther'yel was able to bring him back from the edge and train him to be a ghost walker. That is how I interpreted the story Rhyn didn't really die he was always alive, but with his power, she was able to manipulate him to thinking he was and to get him to do her dirty work.
quote:
Originally posted by Erik Scott de Bie
Twelve years of age. Making him 27 when he appears in chapter 1.
Well I guess then I will never get the image of my nephew in that scene. He is 11 now. No worries I can accept it just wanted to see so I can try to imagine someone else getting tortured.
quote:
Originally posted by Erik Scott de Bie
A friend from the WotC boards, I see!
I hang out there from time to time, but I am no regular. Just right place, right time on that one. And like Rinonalyrna I too didn't even see that he was a half-elf. Did you mention that in the book at all?
quote:
Originally posted by Erik Scott de Bie
How are you today?
No seriously – I find thinking about ghosts an interesting exercise. What do you think of my “echo” theory?
Have you ever read any Ravenloft yourself? I can recommend some good ones. (I’d start with Vampire of the Mists, by Christie Golden.)
Never a good question to ask me. It is just another day in the river of life that I float down waiting (and hoping) for the great waterfall at the end.
Echo is a good term to put it as. Too me it is really our subconscious. We do only use 10% of our brains so one of the 90% could be the subconscious detecting things from the past, (either from within or from the surronding.)
No the majority of my reading when I was growing up were Tom Clancy or Clive Cussler novels and comic books with the ocasional gaming book. Now I only read fantasy books from Goodkind or that say Forgotten Realms on them. I have never been a person to pick up a book and read it without knowing a little bit about it before hand. Or someone who knows my reading habits recommends one to me. I own the Ravenloft boxed set but don't think I have even opened it to look at it. Next time I am at a bookstore I will look into Vampire of the Mists, by Christie Golden.
quote:
Originally posted by Erik Scott de Bie
Which is to say, it isn’t a trilogy at all.
That is good to know! I didn't realize that it was like the Fighters or Wizards. I will get it as soon as I can. As well as RotE.
Originally posted by turox
Thanks for the answers and I wasn't really trying to make you feel bad with the P.P.S. I was just having a little bit of fun. When I get home I will re-read this again and give you my reply from there where I have more time to contemplate life, love, and the universe. I will also have my books at home to research info that may be needed. |
Turox Antas Dragonslayer -
"People will believe anything they want to believe, or fear to believe."
Wizard's First Rule: Chapter 36, Page #397, US Hard Cover (revealed by Zeddicus Zu'l Zorander).
Explanation by Zeddicus Zu'l Zorander: "People are stupid; given proper motivation, almost anyone will believe almost anything. Because people are stupid, they will believe a lie because they want to believe it's true, or because they are afraid it might be true. People’s heads are full of knowledge, facts, and beliefs, and most of it is false, yet they think it all true. People are stupid; they can only rarely tell the difference between a lie and the truth, and yet they are confident they can, and so are all the easier to fool."
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Erik Scott de Bie
Forgotten Realms Author
USA
4598 Posts |
Posted - 14 Feb 2007 : 17:54:01
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quote:
Originally posted by turox
Thanks for the answers and I wasn't really trying to make you feel bad with the P.P.S. I was just having a little bit of fun.
Oh no -- I didn't feel bad. No worries.
quote:
Originally posted by turox
"When we die we enter nothing but eternal darkness." Point de Bie
Ha! Wasn't trying to "get you," or anything. that was really just me rambling on philosophical (philosophy minor, you know).
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But to me FR overrides that with their statement of all spirits going to the fugue plain.
Indeed so, however there are noted exceptions, not the least of which being that if "all spirits go to the Fugue plane," then it's impossible for a ghost to materialize on Faerun, because it would go to the Fugue plane. Obviously, there *are* ghosts and the like in FR, so clearly it must be possible for spirits *not* to go the Fugue plane.
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Now I could see an evil deity sending some spirits back down to FR as spectre's to help with their agenda. And Tyr might have sent Tarm back down because Tarm requested it.
Indeed. Or perhaps Tarm never left in the first place -- perhaps Tarm is a ghost in the proper sense of the word, only not an evil one. Who knows?
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Rhyn could have been born with the ability to have a connection with the Astral plane, which is why Gylther'yel was able to bring him back from the edge and train him to be a ghost walker. That is how I interpreted the story Rhyn didn't really die he was always alive, but with his power, she was able to manipulate him to thinking he was and to get him to do her dirty work.
You might well be right. Whatever happened to Rhyn, he certainly didn't go "beyond the veil," and didn't have a chance to go to the Fugue plane.
quote:
Originally posted by Erik Scott de Bie
Well I guess then I will never get the image of my nephew in that scene. He is 11 now. No worries I can accept it just wanted to see so I can try to imagine someone else getting tortured.
That's still a very disturbing scene for me to think about. I wonder if it isn't too gruesome. I've had a number of people write to me about that scene. I also tell parents buying the book for their kids to read it first, before giving it.
If anything, that's the biggest push against PG-13 that I did.
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And like Rinonalyrna I too didn't even see that he was a half-elf. Did you mention that in the book at all?
That was my original conception, but it might not have ended up in the final draft. Probably would've been a better label than "roguish knight."
Indeed, you guys are right. I did a quick check, and I'm not finding any "Derst = half-elf" reference. Hmm.
Why was I thinking that?
Maybe I was thinking of Torlic. Hmm.
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Never a good question to ask me. It is just another day in the river of life that I float down waiting (and hoping) for the great waterfall at the end.
That's a bit depressing. Something in particular the matter, or is life generally this way?
quote:
Next time I am at a bookstore I will look into Vampire of the Mists, by Christie Golden.
It was reprinted recently (or will be), and it should be pretty easy to find. I hope you enjoy!
quote:
quote:
Originally posted by Erik Scott de Bie
Which is to say, it isn’t a trilogy at all.
That is good to know! I didn't realize that it was like the Fighters or Wizards. I will get it as soon as I can. As well as RotE.
Hope you like it!
And that is not to say you shouldn't read the other Dungeons books too. For seconds, Jaleigh's got some serious talent, and you should definitely pick up the Howling Delve when it comes out.
Cheers |
Erik Scott de Bie
'Tis easier to destroy than to create.
Author of a number of Realms novels (GHOSTWALKER, DEPTHS OF MADNESS, and the SHADOWBANE series), contributor to the NEVERWINTER CAMPAIGN GUIDE and SHADOWFELL: GLOOMWROUGHT AND BEYOND, Twitch DM of the Dungeon Scrawlers, currently playing "The Westgate Irregulars" |
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turox
Learned Scribe
USA
145 Posts |
Posted - 14 Feb 2007 : 20:35:31
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quote:
Originally posted by Erik Scott de Bie
quote:
Originally posted by turox
Thanks for the answers and I wasn't really trying to make you feel bad with the P.P.S. I was just having a little bit of fun.
Oh no -- I didn't feel bad. No worries.
YAY!
quote:
Originally posted by turox
"When we die we enter nothing but eternal darkness." Point de Bie
Ha! Wasn't trying to "get you," or anything. that was really just me rambling on philosophical (philosophy minor, you know).
Didn't know about the minor, guess I will have to put deeper thought into anything I say to you now?
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But to me FR overrides that with their statement of all spirits going to the fugue plain.
Indeed so, however there are noted exceptions, not the least of which being that if "all spirits go to the Fugue plane," then it's impossible for a ghost to materialize on Faerun, because it would go to the Fugue plane. Obviously, there *are* ghosts and the like in FR, so clearly it must be possible for spirits *not* to go the Fugue plane.
quote:
Now I could see an evil deity sending some spirits back down to FR as spectre's to help with their agenda. And Tyr might have sent Tarm back down because Tarm requested it.
Indeed. Or perhaps Tarm never left in the first place -- perhaps Tarm is a ghost in the proper sense of the word, only not an evil one. Who knows?
quote:
Rhyn could have been born with the ability to have a connection with the Astral plane, which is why Gylther'yel was able to bring him back from the edge and train him to be a ghost walker. That is how I interpreted the story Rhyn didn't really die he was always alive, but with his power, she was able to manipulate him to thinking he was and to get him to do her dirty work.
You might well be right. Whatever happened to Rhyn, he certainly didn't go "beyond the veil," and didn't have a chance to go to the Fugue plane.
quote:
Originally posted by Erik Scott de Bie
Well I guess then I will never get the image of my nephew in that scene. He is 11 now. No worries I can accept it just wanted to see so I can try to imagine someone else getting tortured.
That's still a very disturbing scene for me to think about. I wonder if it isn't too gruesome. I've had a number of people write to me about that scene. I also tell parents buying the book for their kids to read it first, before giving it.
If anything, that's the biggest push against PG-13 that I did.
Well if I didn't have a nephew then it wouldn't have been so disturbing to me. He is getting to that age where he could be in that scene so I shall just blame him for growing up.
quote:
And like Rinonalyrna I too didn't even see that he was a half-elf. Did you mention that in the book at all?
That was my original conception, but it might not have ended up in the final draft. Probably would've been a better label than "roguish knight."
Indeed, you guys are right. I did a quick check, and I'm not finding any "Derst = half-elf" reference. Hmm.
Why was I thinking that?
Maybe I was thinking of Torlic. Hmm.
Rut-roh reorge. Did somebody get their characters mixed up? No worries however now we are all going to picture Derst differently now. Least anyone that reads this part of the book reveiw.
quote:
Never a good question to ask me. It is just another day in the river of life that I float down waiting (and hoping) for the great waterfall at the end.
That's a bit depressing. Something in particular the matter, or is life generally this way?
I will leave this as simple as I can make it. Life is generally that way. Take anything else about this to PM or email as I am not one to air this kind of stuff for anyone to read. My interfere with my chances to become President. 
quote:
Next time I am at a bookstore I will look into Vampire of the Mists, by Christie Golden.
It was reprinted recently (or will be), and it should be pretty easy to find. I hope you enjoy!
quote:
quote:
Originally posted by Erik Scott de Bie
Which is to say, it isn’t a trilogy at all.
That is good to know! I didn't realize that it was like the Fighters or Wizards. I will get it as soon as I can. As well as RotE.
Hope you like it!
And that is not to say you shouldn't read the other Dungeons books too. For seconds, Jaleigh's got some serious talent, and you should definitely pick up the Howling Delve when it comes out.
I more than likely will I have all the fighter books. One of these days I do want to own all the FR Novels that were printed. So any author that writes in the setting will pretty much take the royalty check to the bank. Although with just me buying they will be very, very small.
Cheers
Have a good one.
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Turox Antas Dragonslayer -
"People will believe anything they want to believe, or fear to believe."
Wizard's First Rule: Chapter 36, Page #397, US Hard Cover (revealed by Zeddicus Zu'l Zorander).
Explanation by Zeddicus Zu'l Zorander: "People are stupid; given proper motivation, almost anyone will believe almost anything. Because people are stupid, they will believe a lie because they want to believe it's true, or because they are afraid it might be true. People’s heads are full of knowledge, facts, and beliefs, and most of it is false, yet they think it all true. People are stupid; they can only rarely tell the difference between a lie and the truth, and yet they are confident they can, and so are all the easier to fool."
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Erik Scott de Bie
Forgotten Realms Author
USA
4598 Posts |
Posted - 14 Feb 2007 : 21:19:21
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quote:
Rut-roh reorge. Did somebody get their characters mixed up? No worries however now we are all going to picture Derst differently now. Least anyone that reads this part of the book reveiw.
Meh. No, not really. You guys are right. Not a half-elf.
. . .
OR IS HE?
Dun dun DUN!!!
Cheers |
Erik Scott de Bie
'Tis easier to destroy than to create.
Author of a number of Realms novels (GHOSTWALKER, DEPTHS OF MADNESS, and the SHADOWBANE series), contributor to the NEVERWINTER CAMPAIGN GUIDE and SHADOWFELL: GLOOMWROUGHT AND BEYOND, Twitch DM of the Dungeon Scrawlers, currently playing "The Westgate Irregulars" |
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Rinonalyrna Fathomlin
Great Reader
USA
7106 Posts |
Posted - 14 Feb 2007 : 22:18:16
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I like half-elven characters...but it can be difficult to imagine a character as a half-elf when you thought of him throughout a novel as a human.
And by the way, the "roguish knight" phrase never bothered me either, because I understood it in the general sense to mean "mischievious fellow", and I don't always assume a "knight" is a paladin or is paladin-like. |
"Instead of asking why we sleep, it might make sense to ask why we wake. Perchance we live to dream. From that perspective, the sea of troubles we navigate in the workaday world might be the price we pay for admission to another night in the world of dreams."
--Richard Greene (letter to Time) |
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Kyrene
Senior Scribe
South Africa
733 Posts |
Posted - 19 Mar 2007 : 09:04:49
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I took three books with me on holiday this last week. One was The Realms of Shadow anthology, since I had about three or so stories left to read when we departed. The other two were Master of Chains and of course Ghostwalker. I'm going to try to keep it short by purposely using this thread for my whole and overall impression of the book.
Preamble
I read Wayfarer before Ghostwalker so was familiar with 'the bad guys' before the start of the prologue. I also enjoyed Wayfarer a lot, but let me say at the onset, this actually caused me to be a little bit dissapointed in Ghostwalker. I'll list my thoughts in a good to bad order.
The Excellent
Rhyn/Walker's journey from pure (and often self-destructive) vengeful motives to that of protector/nurturer.
Dharan Greyt’s journey from – well let’s face it – selfish bastard to selfish bastard realising he’ll never be what he wants to be.
Meris’ circling the drain of self-destruction being ultimately realised, even as he seemingly grew in power.
The Good
Arya's journey from selfish, rebellious daughter/cousin to that of tempered and adult womanhood.
The unfolding of the layers of the plot.
The unconventional, but true to rules, use of class abilities. Prime axamples of this being Dharan's use of Bard abilities and Rhyn's use of Ghostwalker abilities.
The Bad
The constant banter between Derst and Barrs in every single scene they were in.
The Ugly
Too many characters, not allowing for much development or backstory of most.
The weapons of choice of some of the characters.
The ghostfire/ghostwhatever elemental.
In General
I must admit, I'm not a very astute reader most of the time, and often miss out on crucial plot elements as they are presented, but I found Ghostwalker a little too easy to predict. I realised quite early on that Meris was the one removing the ring in the prologue and that Gylther'yel was somehow also involved in that scene. Good reveals were the family ties between her, Leytha and Rhyn, and the Rhyn Greyt surprise. A lot of the stuff I didn't quite understand, like Rhyn's meditation, or ability to read the immediate past and Gylther'yel's non-druidic powers, but overall it wasn't jarring to the story.
Some of My Questions
1. Apart from the recurring plot motive, why did Arya take her uncle's gold ring and did it have any powers like the silver one?
2. Did Gylther'yel have Ghostwalker levels, or was she something else entirely?
3. If the head of the druidic order (I forget her name now) is presumably a high level druid, how did Gylther'yel manage to beat her so easily?
4. Did Gylther'yel already make contact with Meris in Wayfarer? Was she the whispering spirit of the woods or was it the onset of his madness?
5. Was Greyt Sr. (Dharan's father) really mad? If so, is madness a hereditary illness the Greyts suffer from? There seemed to be clear indications of it progressing in both Dharan and Meris.
6. Did Rhyn meditate in the ethereal (thereby reducing number of uses per day) or shadow realm, and why?
Conclusion
Overall, I really enjoyed Ghostwalker, even if it was at the same time a very difficult and very easy story to keep track of. I found the unique description of when and how Rhyn's Ghostwalker abilities came into play - for instance only being able to use Painful Reckoning once he remembered who his specific foes were and it almost kicking in too late in the later battles - very entertaining. I didn't like the use of so many characters, but I suppose further writing with some of them will help (this novel just didn't have enough screen-time for all of them). I didn't like the un-typical use of some weaponry - for instance what's a barbarian doing with a gyrspike and why would he ever have taken up such a weapon - but the in-fight mechanics and physics* were at least well conceived and/or researched. The characters were all very interesting, even some of the very minor ones. You could truly relate to at least one of the many characters, since they were that diverse. The ending didn't backtrack on what preceded it - Rhyn's quest was over and 'final' death could take him. I'm looking forward to Depths of Madness and the promotional short - a la Wayfarer.
* A good example being most of the bad physics in the terrible movie Torque I had the misfortune of seeing part of recently. For instance, in the climactic good-girl-must-defeat-bad-girl scene, both women would have had to remove their hands from the throttle for numerous of the stuff they got up to on the backs of their 'super' bikes. If you do that your bike will immediately decelerate no matter what gear you are in and you would not remain next to your opponent to land that punch/bitch-slap/knife-stab/whatever. |
Lost for words? Find them in the Glossary of Phrases, Sayings & Words of the Realms
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Erik Scott de Bie
Forgotten Realms Author
USA
4598 Posts |
Posted - 19 Mar 2007 : 14:58:42
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Thank you for your valuable feedback, sir! And may I compliment you on such a thoughtful and well-constructed post.
quote:
Originally posted by Kyrene
Preamble
I read Wayfarer before Ghostwalker so was familiar with 'the bad guys' before the start of the prologue. I also enjoyed Wayfarer a lot, but let me say at the onset, this actually caused me to be a little bit dissapointed in Ghostwalker.
Interesting. I'm glad you liked the story!
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Arya's journey from selfish, rebellious daughter/cousin to that of tempered and adult womanhood.
I'm glad that was a plus for you -- in the original draft of the book, I had about 5,000 more words to develop that. They just got cut upon conversion to the final form.
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The unconventional, but true to rules, use of class abilities. Prime axamples of this being Dharan's use of Bard abilities and Rhyn's use of Ghostwalker abilities.
I very much enjoyed doing that -- the ghostwalker PrC was one I had to think long and hard about. The etherealness and shadow walking don't seem to make sense (as they are separate planes), so I went for as organic an explanation as I could manage.
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The constant banter between Derst and Barrs in every single scene they were in.
Hmm. That's their schtick, though -- they're the comedy relief. But I can appreciate that they didn't work for you. Some readers don't need comedy relief.
I should note that there is one notable exception to their "constant banter" -- the scene when they are both fighting Meris, it gets real serious, real fast. Particularly subsequent to Derst's significant injuries.
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Too many characters, not allowing for much development or backstory of most.
I have heard that comment, and I sympathize. As I said about Arya, above, I originally had a lot more space to develop the various characters. My first draft was 115k -- I had to cut 15k of it. 15,000 words is a lot to cut, and not without its costs, believe you me.
In the end, I had to put my focus on the characters I thought mattered the most to the actual plot: Walker, Gylther'yel, Greyt, and a little of Meris and Arya.
If I get the chance to follow up Ghostwalker, you better believe I'll take advantage of the opportunity to develop those characters who survived.
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The weapons of choice of some of the characters.
That's a really interesting comment -- can you give me a specific case? Perhaps it's just a taste thing, but if you don't think the weapon matches the character (i.e. "works" for the character), I'd be interested to hear who you mean.
Bars and Bilgren are the only ones I can think of who go beyond the "unconventional" -- most of the others have swords or axes.
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The ghostfire/ghostwhatever elemental.
Heh. Yeah, I can see that. Of all the elements of the book, that's the biggest risk vis a vis the D&D rules, I think.
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I must admit, I'm not a very astute reader most of the time, and often miss out on crucial plot elements as they are presented, but I found Ghostwalker a little too easy to predict.
Different readers pick up on different clues at different rates. I don't think any two people have had the same experience with the book.
quote:
I realised quite early on that Meris was the one removing the ring in the prologue and that Gylther'yel was somehow also involved in that scene. Good reveals were the family ties between her, Leytha and Rhyn, and the Rhyn Greyt surprise.
There were some clues I tried to hide and some I didn't, really. Knowing that Meris and Gylther'yel were involved in the prologue doesn't spoil the end, I don't think -- in a sense, you're supposed to figure that out at some point, at least.
As you say, the family ties revelations were more important to the book, and I'm glad you liked how those worked out.
(And I tell you, how tempted I was to write a "Rhyn -- I am your father" scene -- but no, such was not to be.)
And now onto questions:
quote:
1. Apart from the recurring plot motive, why did Arya take her uncle's gold ring and did it have any powers like the silver one?
I don't believe Arya took her uncle's ring -- she ended up with Walker's, which he put on her finger before the battle with Gylther'yel.
She did, from earlier in the book, take Greyt's/Lyetha's locket. Which may or may not be significant to a followup novel.
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2. Did Gylther'yel have Ghostwalker levels, or was she something else entirely?
She does *not* have Ghostwalker levels. I don't think there is a game mechanic presently out there that describes exactly *what* she was, but basically she was a high level druid (about 15th) who could summon ghost animals/elementals and her wildshape was ethereal itself. She may or may not have been a ghost in the first place -- I leave that up to the reader.
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3. If the head of the druidic order (I forget her name now) is presumably a high level druid, how did Gylther'yel manage to beat her so easily?
Amra Clearwater isn't a high level druid. According to the Silver Marches supplement, Amra is around the 7th-9th level range, so she's really no match for a hierophant-level druid (sorry, I still think in 2e terms sometimes). Gylther'yel is an old, nay ancient presence -- one of the heavy hitters of the world, almost -- and Amra is just a frontier-town druid.
And even if Gylther'yel *had* been about the same level as Amra, it's entirely possible that the right trap, laid at the right time, and right after a battle that consumed most of Amra's energies, could easily have ensnared the half-elf druid.
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4. Did Gylther'yel already make contact with Meris in Wayfarer? Was she the whispering spirit of the woods or was it the onset of his madness?
Meris, no matter how sociopathic he is, isn't mad in the sense that he hears voices. He may have *thought* he heard voices, but Gylther'yel is, indeed, talking to him in "Wayfarer."
Or, alternately, perhaps he really *is* mad.
That's really up to you.
However, the friendly interaction (and in my first draft, it was very friendly indeed) between Meris and Gylther'yel in Ghostwalker seems to indicate that they had a past relationship, and it would make sense for those relations to have started in the "Wayfarer" story.
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5. Was Greyt Sr. (Dharan's father) really mad? If so, is madness a hereditary illness the Greyts suffer from? There seemed to be clear indications of it progressing in both Dharan and Meris.
I leave that open to interpretation. Gharask Greyt never actually appears in either story -- was he truly a homicidal maniac, or just an innocent scapegoat? Was he framed, or did Dharan just take advantage of a true situation (i.e. Gharask was murdering children anyway, so Dharan thought he could get away with just one more)? In a way, it would be *more* creepy if Dharan manufactured the whole thing: he ended up killing Rhyn, then went through the town and killed a dozen or so children in order to cover it up.
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6. Did Rhyn meditate in the ethereal (thereby reducing number of uses per day) or shadow realm, and why?
I don't believe I ever had him meditate in the ethereal -- remember that even while physical he could see the ethereal world just as easily as you or I see the physical world. He does do the majority of his traveling through Shadow, but the PrC gives a lot more flexibility with that.
quote:
I found the unique description of when and how Rhyn's Ghostwalker abilities came into play - for instance only being able to use Painful Reckoning once he remembered who his specific foes were and it almost kicking in too late in the later battles - very entertaining.
Excellent! Glad you enjoyed.
quote:
I didn't like the use of so many characters, but I suppose further writing with some of them will help (this novel just didn't have enough screen-time for all of them).
Well put. I worked with what I had. I think character development is a little bit of a taste thing, as well -- if an author goes in very deeply, some readers love it, others toss the book away in disgust because the characters bore them. I strove for just enough connection, and just enough development for the format (a 320 page novel). That said, I really try to focus on characters, so the feedback is very valuable.
If there is a followup book, I reckon it will be Arya, and you'll get to see her developed in more detail (and Bars and Derst as well).
quote:
I didn't like the un-typical use of some weaponry - for instance what's a barbarian doing with a gyrspike and why would he ever have taken up such a weapon - but the in-fight mechanics and physics* were at least well conceived and/or researched.
Heh. Ok, here's a little story about the gyrspike and how it came to be:
When I first got the commission from Wizards to write Ghostwalker, I said, "ok, I want to make it a *Fighters* book" and since some of my favorite rules at the time were from Complete Warrior, I went all out to put together an assortment of weapons, styles, and techniques that would have verisimilitude and still be really cool. And one that I thought of was the Gyrspike -- I mean, who uses such a thing? And *how*? It was something of a writing challenge for me -- describing a combat with such a bizarre weapon.
Of course, in a fantasy setting, there are people who specialize in odd (or even mundane) weapons, and are known for such a thing -- "weapon of choice," I believe you called it. I thought that, if you gave him an axe, Bilgren would just be some old barbarian type -- boring and cliche. Then again, if you gave him just that little touch of uniqueness, then you did a mess of character development right there, making him distinctive.
Anyway, that was my plan. I appreciate your feedback on the subject.
quote:
The ending didn't backtrack on what preceded it - Rhyn's quest was over and 'final' death could take him.
Indeed. Initially, I wrote a "happy ending," or at least one that's more hopeful . . . then I recanted and wrote the ending the novel needed.
quote:
I'm looking forward to Depths of Madness and the promotional short - a la Wayfarer.
Well, "That Time of the Tenday" is indeed up and available on the wizards site. Check it out in the book club thread: http://forum.candlekeep.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=8984
quote:
* A good example being most of the bad physics in the terrible movie Torque I had the misfortune of seeing part of recently.
Ha! You know, I think I've seen that movie too. And that my opinion largely matches yours.
Cheers |
Erik Scott de Bie
'Tis easier to destroy than to create.
Author of a number of Realms novels (GHOSTWALKER, DEPTHS OF MADNESS, and the SHADOWBANE series), contributor to the NEVERWINTER CAMPAIGN GUIDE and SHADOWFELL: GLOOMWROUGHT AND BEYOND, Twitch DM of the Dungeon Scrawlers, currently playing "The Westgate Irregulars" |
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Gruen
Acolyte
12 Posts |
Posted - 19 Mar 2007 : 19:33:41
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Absolutely loved the novel. GREAT job!!! I was very much reminded of how I felt after reading the Black Bouquet (where I thought, "Hmm... this Byers guy may just be the next big thing"). Of course, now he is.
I saw a post some time back where someone thought Derst was a half-elf? That's funny because I thought of them as dwarves, on several occasions. Not 100% certain why, but I kept having to remind myself they were human. Shrug.
Gruen |
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Ghostwalker: Chapter 22 - Postlude
