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BrokenRulz
Acolyte
USA
29 Posts |
 Posted - 04 May 2004 : 18:49:59
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Had a question concerning games that have been out for awhile.
I've played the Baldur's Gate and Icewind Dale games (BG a few times) and find that the replay-ability of BG is high and Icewind Dale is about medium.
I've never played Neverwinter Nights...being as it is this game has been out awhile...is it worth getting and playing? I mean, with all the newer stuff coming out, is it worth dropping the money to play a game that's been on the shelf for awhile?
Does anyone have any other comments on any other RPG games?
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Senbar Flay
Learned Scribe
185 Posts |
Posted - 04 May 2004 : 21:53:36
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I recently purchased Neverwinter nights and the game it self is alright however the controls are diffrent and you do not get your own party . Only allowed one character but it comes with a toolset |
Imagination is more important than knowledge for knowledge is limited imagination encircles the world.- Albert Einstein |
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Yasraena
Senior Scribe
USA
388 Posts |
Posted - 05 May 2004 : 02:47:10
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I've said it before and I'll say it again. This game is one of the best CRPG's ever made. It has AD&D locations that you recognize, 3E rules, and a toolset that has created a community of literally thousands of players that use it to create their own adventures and/or recreate old PNP modules. Plus it has two decent add-ons that allow your PC's to reach epic levels (40th).
Between the addons, and all the player made stuff (that's free BTW) this game will never get old.
And it's probably only $15 or $20 now too, so even better. |
"Nindyn vel'uss malar verin z'klaen tlu kyone ulu naut doera nindel vel'bolen nind malar."
Yasraena T'Sarran
Harper of Silverymoon |
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Wood Elf Ranger
Senior Scribe
USA
627 Posts |
Posted - 05 May 2004 : 05:48:40
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I believe there is a set out that includes all of the add-ons. To me the only con about this game is you only have one character and not a party although you can add 2 "henchmen". There are a ton of player-made mods though even some that allow you to have a full party. Really that is the gem of this game allowing for infinite replayability  |
~Lee N.
"Breaktime yes?!.. Yes?.. Maybe?.. Noo, baaack to work.." -Grovel the Goblin from NWN: HotU |
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Winterfox
Senior Scribe
895 Posts |
Posted - 05 May 2004 : 09:06:02
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The NWN OC is a travesty. Awful henchman AI, blocky graphics, tedious story with repetitive main quests (fetch four pieces of this artifact, defeat boss, move on to the next chapter). It was pure torture playing it. The voiceacting is unimpressive, the characters unmemorable, the story laughably predictable.
The SOU OC is slightly better and offers more class-specific roleplaying options, but ultimately, didn't hold my interest.
The HotU OC is the best of the lot. Not only does it have improved graphics, its story, characters and writing are light-years ahead of its predecessors. The plot is a little underwhelming, but it's got some illusions of non-linearity and multiple endings. The number of party becomes bigger. You can have two henchmen at once, plus a shield golem if you're a wizard, in addition to summons.
It's supposedly replayable due to the toolset and the sheer number of user-made mods, but here's the cold hard truth: out of several thousand mods, maybe about 50 of them are actually good. The rest range between "palatable" to "bloody godawful." Thanks to the use of tilsets, the graphics end up looking pretty much the same everywhere, unless you're downloading a lot of tileset hakpacks. (And placeable, and character model... you get the point.) And the NWVault's Hall of Fame isn't always reliable, either. It's got the Sex & The Single Adventuress mod up there, for peanut's sake. |
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Narad Bladesinger
Learned Scribe
Finland
170 Posts |
Posted - 05 May 2004 : 14:44:47
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The thing I HATE in NWN is the areas. Everything looks the same! And 90 degree turns everywhere...AARRRGGGHHH!
And Winterfox is right about the mods. Most of them are total ****! |
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Bookwyrm
Great Reader
USA
4740 Posts |
Posted - 05 May 2004 : 18:08:51
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90 degree turns? You sure you have the graphics on right?
Well, most people like this game. Those who don't are usually vehement about it. Since I haven't finished it (due to computer problems), I'll just list pros and cons.
Cons:
Badbadbadbad story. Most computer games have two-dimensional stories, but even this is taking it a bit far. Mostly, though, I could ignore it.
You can live without the sounds. I disabled them on my computer, actually. Listened to lectures on tape while playing it.
You have to have all the right graphics and sound drivers, or it doesn't work right. Even if it's a new computer, expect to visit a few websites first unless you've had to do this for another game.
You can only use one character, as mentioned. While it's possible to do that, you need to hire henchmen at first, especially if you're a wizard or sorcerer. (You'll want to do that anyway; if you complete their quests (which, again, are rather inane) you get some good items, though you can't sell them.)
Pros:
If you have it set up right, you've got some wonderful graphics. Smooth animation, great fight scenes. (Try the monk on Flurry mode. Looks really cool.)
The rules aren't too abreviated, so you can actually learn basic 3e from this game and have a pretty solid grounding to move on to the rest. The only thing is, the game is (by necessity) using uber-munchkin rules. So it can't teach by itself; it's only good as a starting place.
Great flexibility in gameplay. You can experiment pretty easily.
So, in short, if you're looking for a 'distraction' game, this is perfect. If you're looking for actual roleplaying, likely not.
I'm in favor of it. Especially if you combine it with those tapes, like I did. You use different parts of your brain for each, so you can actually do it at the same time. (Until you get to someplace where you have to read; then you'll likely need to pause the playback.)
I highly recomend the tapes I mentioned in this scroll. However, I also listened to the news and talk radio as well. The game's not exactly complicated, and it hardly requires a lot of attention. But if you occupy both eyes/hands and your language comprehension, you can effectively do more than otherwise.
But then, I've a hunger for learning. It might be you don't. But, if you do, your local library ought to stock some Teaching Company tapes. If they don't have the ones I listed there (which are excellent, but not the only ones), ask them to put them in stock. Try them and you'll see. |
Hell hath no fury like all of Candlekeep rising in defense of one of its own.
Download the brickfilm masterpiece by Leftfield Studios! See this page for more. |
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Winterfox
Senior Scribe
895 Posts |
Posted - 06 May 2004 : 07:07:01
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If you're bent on picking up NWN, with or without SoU and HotU, here are some modules I'd like to recommend. All of them, in my opinion, surpass the SoU and the original OC in writing, fun factor, and overall quality.
Bone Kenning I -- Art of the Thanaturge doesn't require either expansion, and has some very, very creative scripting. Playing this will actually make you feel like you're playing a necromancer rather than a generic wizard; the writing is great; the opportunities to be evil/neutral rather than boring goody-two-shoes are many.
Necromancer -- Allegiance is likewise a mod tailored for players who want to engage in the art of necromancy. Creative scripting allows you to actually raise corpses to be your minions. Good story, but it semi-forces you to play a pre-generated character. No big loss, though, IMO. Mostly pushes you toward evil alignment.
Elegia Eternum has a linear story, but an incredible atmosphere. The writing is excellent, and it even comes with original music and voiceacting. The story is very memorable, and it's amazing what a competent modder can do with the default tilesets. Excrucio Eternum continues the story, with better roleplaying opportunities (to be good or evil; some quests have multiple solutions), henchmen, a storyline that's just as good, and a well-crafted villain. The use of custom contents here is simply masterful.
The Book of Shaddowe is a rogue-specific mod, and as such, rewards you for stealth and thieving skills rather than straight hack'n'slash. While it requires a pre-generated character, this aspect adds rather than detracts. Good story, ripe with intrigues.
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Edited by - Winterfox on 06 May 2004 07:08:50 |
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Narad Bladesinger
Learned Scribe
Finland
170 Posts |
Posted - 06 May 2004 : 14:18:18
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| I only have the original NWN, but roads, caves, rivers all have 90 degree turns. |
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Arivia
Great Reader
Canada
2965 Posts |
Posted - 06 May 2004 : 14:33:26
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quote:
Originally posted by Narad Bladesinger
I only have the original NWN, but roads, caves, rivers all have 90 degree turns.
Not exactly. It's true that you do build such at ninety degree angles, but part of the toolset's ability is to change that. I've got an absolutely beautiful area around somewhere, that gets quite a bit of use out of other angles... |
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Narad Bladesinger
Learned Scribe
Finland
170 Posts |
Posted - 06 May 2004 : 19:05:41
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| Hmm.. Didn't know that. I made my statement based on the main NWN story and it doesn't use such things. Or maybe I should look closer? |
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Bookwyrm
Great Reader
USA
4740 Posts |
Posted - 07 May 2004 : 00:51:37
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| Ah, I see. I thought you meant your graphics were only letting your character turn in ninety-degree angles. I didn't think about the roads. Which, by the way, aren't that big a deal! Why make that a reason not to play it? |
Hell hath no fury like all of Candlekeep rising in defense of one of its own.
Download the brickfilm masterpiece by Leftfield Studios! See this page for more. |
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Winterfox
Senior Scribe
895 Posts |
Posted - 07 May 2004 : 03:48:11
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Graphics aren't everything, but NWN's is a leeetle bit on the "blocky, my god, this is so 1990's!" side -- and it lacks the redeeming features of good storytelling. Look at the ramps and the hills -- they're all of sharp angles, unless you have got the "rolling hills" hakpack. Use the toolsets and make some rooms in a "city interior" tileset: the rooms all have 90-degrees corners, unless, again, you install the "round rooms" hakpack.
I much prefer Morrowind's toolset, you know. Sure, it's a lot less user-friendly, but you can mix and match. Cities in Morrowind don't look like each other (though the ancestral tombs and mines and caves do); the terrain runs the gamut from swamp, volcanoes, to snow. |
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Shadowlord
Master of Realmslore
USA
1298 Posts |
Posted - 07 May 2004 : 04:20:34
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Well, I vote in favor of buying Neverwinter Nights. True, the Original Campaign is much more 2 dimensional than I expected, but, as Bookwyrm said, that's practically standard for all computer games. Or maybe because I'm an avid player, it affects my opinion. Being a prominent scripter/builder, and captain of the Xx-][-xX Clan may influence my opinions just a little bit...  |
The Chosen of Vhaeraun
"Nature is governed by certain immutable rules. By virtue of claw and fang, the lion will always triumph over the goat.Given time, the pounding of the sea will wear away the stone. And when dark elves mingle with the lighter races, the offspring invariably take after the dark parent. It is all much the same. That which is greater shall prevail. Our numbers increase steadily, both through birth and conquest. The dark elves are the dominant race, so ordained by the gods." Ka'Narlist of the Ilythiiri. |
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Winterfox
Senior Scribe
895 Posts |
Posted - 07 May 2004 : 05:42:31
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quote:
Originally posted by Shadowlord
True, the Original Campaign is much more 2 dimensional than I expected, but, as Bookwyrm said, that's practically standard for all computer games.
I wouldn't say all computer games, y'know. It's sad that some people's standards have become lower in accordance to the mediocrity of some of the more recent RPGs.
Me, I'm going back to worshipping KotOR and jumping up and down at KotOR2 information. If you want a good, story-driven RPG, this is it. So it's Star Wars. But it's good Star Wars fun; I wasn't particularly interested in the SW brand, but even so, this game absolutely blew me away. This baby improved my hopes so much, and after I'd vowed never to buy anything from Bioware again (thanks to NWN), too. |
Edited by - Winterfox on 07 May 2004 05:43:16 |
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Lina
Senior Scribe
Australia
469 Posts |
Posted - 07 May 2004 : 10:38:48
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I recently just finished playing NWN plus the Expansion, yesterday for those who want details.  I thought it was alright, but not the sort of game I would play repeatedly even with other character classes. Now that I think about it I don't usually play rpg games more than once, even diablo I & II. Except for Avatar 8 for those of you who still remember it, Great game!!
I agree with Bookwyrm's Pros and Cons list. The storyline is very linear so whatever alignment you start with it doesn't affect the storyline to my disappointment  and quests are a little repetative. The graphics are fine when I played it, maybe it was coz I had the later version and my graphics card was up to scratch. But if you are looking for something to kill time with then by all means... NWN away. |
“Darkness beyond twilight, crimson beyond blood that flows! Buried in the flow of time. In thy great name. I pledge myself to darkness. All the fools who stand in our way shall be destroyed…by the power you and I possess! DRAGON SLAVE!!!”
"Thieves? Ah, such an ugly word... look upon them as the most honest sort of merchant."
-Oglar the Thieflord |
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Narad Bladesinger
Learned Scribe
Finland
170 Posts |
Posted - 07 May 2004 : 14:18:50
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quote:
Originally posted by Bookwyrm
Ah, I see. I thought you meant your graphics were only letting your character turn in ninety-degree angles. I didn't think about the roads. Which, by the way, aren't that big a deal! Why make that a reason not to play it?
 No, they aren't that big deal. It's just annoying just as the look-a-like contest between every area.
And not to play? I've played it through (well almost) couple times and though poor story, I wanted to know what I can do with the 3e rules (a lot apparently).
Neverwinter nights is a good game, that every FR fan should at least try. |
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Bookwyrm
Great Reader
USA
4740 Posts |
Posted - 07 May 2004 : 17:37:40
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quote:
Originally posted by Winterfox
If you want a good, story-driven RPG, this is it. So it's Star Wars. But it's good Star Wars fun; I wasn't particularly interested in the SW brand, but even so, this game absolutely blew me away. This baby improved my hopes so much, and after I'd vowed never to buy anything from Bioware again (thanks to NWN), too.
Well, I never said it was true for all games, just most. And it's really, really hard to do a good roleplaying game on computer simply because our technology isn't up to the challenge. When we have computers that can make things up on the fly like a human DM, then we can talk. Until then, you're pretty limited.
However, I've been thinking of trying KotOR, so if I see it at a good price, I'll get it. After all, if Winterfox loves it, it's got to be on the okay side of things. (Hey, admit it: you make me look agreeable.  )
Now, as to NWN itself, as I said, it was something I always listened to tapes while playing. It's not complicated. It's pure hack'n'slash. Of course, you can still make wrong choices in conversations, but I wasn't playing it for the story. I just wanted a distraction, as well as something to occupy my hands and eyes while listening to my backlog of tapes. I do the same thing in classes, too -- I'll fiddle on my laptop in between taking notes. (It's a way to combat ADD: keep both your visual and language senses occupied, and you can concentrate. If one is free to "wander," so to speak, you loose track of the other. Doesn't work perfectly, but it does work.) |
Hell hath no fury like all of Candlekeep rising in defense of one of its own.
Download the brickfilm masterpiece by Leftfield Studios! See this page for more. |
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Winterfox
Senior Scribe
895 Posts |
Posted - 08 May 2004 : 06:12:57
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quote:
Originally posted by Bookwyrm
Well, I never said it was true for all games, just most. And it's really, really hard to do a good roleplaying game on computer simply because our technology isn't up to the challenge. When we have computers that can make things up on the fly like a human DM, then we can talk. Until then, you're pretty limited.
However, I've been thinking of trying KotOR, so if I see it at a good price, I'll get it. After all, if Winterfox loves it, it's got to be on the okay side of things. (Hey, admit it: you make me look agreeable.
Ho, ho, ho. *hides a sharp-looking spork* Don't make me go stabbity stab stab on you.
Seriously, though, KotOR is amazing. It's linear and the story's quite tight, but that doesn't make it any less attractive. (If you liked Planescape: Torment, you'll probably love KotOR.) Granted, in some parts, it's like watching an interactive movie, but still. It's immersive, and I come to care about the characters. Among other things, I have almost never played any other CRPG where being evil is this rewarding and satisfying. The engine it uses shares some common roots with Aurora Engine, but the graphics are much prettier. The voiceacting (all dialogue is voice-acted, and they actually hired professional voice-actors rather than, say, forcing some poor bloke in the house to do the job; yay Jennifer Hale!) is simply top-notch, and it's spoiled me ever since. Unlike most Star Wars games, it's got an original music score. The music is considerably less, ah, "heroic" and cheery-sounding than the SW norm, but that fits with the game's mood. |
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Alruane
Senior Scribe
USA
434 Posts |
Posted - 24 Nov 2013 : 21:22:03
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| Baldur's Gate is so good they made Enhanced Edition for both so, BG still has it! |
" I wonder if you are destined to be forgotten. Will your life fade in the shadow of greater beings?"
~Joneleth Irenicus
"Wisdom? My dear boy, wisdom is knowing that you do not know everything. Wisdom is realizing, a wise man ALWAYS has questions. Not answers."
~Alruane |
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Mapolq
Senior Scribe
Brazil
466 Posts |
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Still Worth Playing?
