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Zeromaru X
Great Reader
Colombia
2442 Posts |
 Posted - 02 Mar 2020 : 16:19:37
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quote:
Originally posted by LordofBones
Nerull was only a 'loth in the Gygax novels. 3e's Nerull hates everyone and everything. He's the one power who lives in Carceri because he likes the place. He hates everything so much that he lets fiends eat the souls in his realm for funsies. The idea of him falling in love is so utterly alien that it's incomprehensible.
4e thoroughly retcons this, since the entire pantheon has been upended.
Then 5e upends this more, since Nerull is alive and well.
Well, I guess you didn't read the final 4e Dragon and Dungeon articles, so you may not know, but the Raven Queen was not a regular soul. She was specifically created by a group of gods who wanted to unseat Nerull, with all the traits that appeal to him the most. That's why he fell "in love" with her. And it was not a loving relation what they had. It's heavily implied their only son was born from a non-consensual act, and that Nerull was an abusive husband.
Is also implied that Nerull was not truly dead, just unable to enter the world (of the Dawn War pantheon) by the power of the Raven Queen. There was an aspect of him still active in Pluton, for instance. And he was not among the dead gods in the article about the... well, dead gods of the Dawn War pantheon.
This leads me to believe that only his (major) aspect on the Dawn War's world was killed, but the "main" Nerull was still alive and well in Oerth. In fact, I remember there is a source that mentioned that no matter if a god dies in one world, his "version" on other worlds will be unaffected by such an event.
Anyways, we know all the stories about the origins of the gods and what happened before mortals began to accurately record stuff are myths. They may have a kernel of truth, but aren't actual truths. And that is something that is specifically stated in all 4e sources, at least. In many 4e sources you will read that those stories are just a version of what may have happened and that the source may be taken with a grain of salt. That's why the Bane of the Dawn War has like 3 or 4 different origin myths.
So, there is a high chance the stories about the death of Nerull may just be a tale made up by the sages and priests of the Nentir Vale to try to explain why suddenly Nerull lost interest in their world and then the Raven Queen appeared from somewhere to take the portfolio of death. And this explanation is perfectly canon within 4e lore.
quote:
Originally posted by LordofBones where you got this, since we know that Hextor and Heironeous were born gods. The elder powers of the Forgotten Realms were born from the war between Shar and Selune. The Krynnish pantheon is made of born gods.
From a Planescape source, but I don't remember which one. I also remember reading in an FR novel that all FR gods originated as mortals (I don't remember it well, but I guess it was Stardeep). And also, Mike Mearls said it in a podcast. But this can be a 5e thing. |
Instead of seeking change, you prefer a void, merciless abyss of a world... |
Edited by - Zeromaru X on 02 Mar 2020 16:23:36 |
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Irennan
Great Reader
Italy
3802 Posts |
Posted - 03 Mar 2020 : 01:01:42
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quote:
Originally posted by Zeromaru X
I also remember reading in an FR novel that all FR gods originated as mortals (I don't remember it well, but I guess it was Stardeep). And also, Mike Mearls said it in a podcast. But this can be a 5e thing.
This is obviously false, though, no matter how you (or better: they) try to spin it. It's pretty clear that entities like Selune and Shar predate any mortal--and they're not the only ones. If it's stated in Stardeep, then it's either the PoV being clueless or--if stated by an omniscient narrator--a blatant (and quite nonsensical) retcon. Given the novel in which it was stated (tail end of 3e) it was possibly part of the 4e reimagining of the pantheon (like the series of the "Selune=Sehanine" kind of retcons). |
Mathematics is the art of giving the same name to different things. |
Edited by - Irennan on 03 Mar 2020 01:08:29 |
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LordofBones
Master of Realmslore
1477 Posts |
Posted - 03 Mar 2020 : 07:45:58
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It becomes funnier when you realize that, if all gods are ascended mortals, then Asmodeus, god of sin, has had his entire backstory retconned. The former anaphanct is now a bog standard mortal.
Then you have dudes like Raxivort and Kanchelsis, who were never mortal. Kanchy started off as a mass of corrupt divine blood; Raxivort was in Graz'zt's direct employ. Then there's Urdlen. |
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cpthero2
Great Reader
USA
2285 Posts |
Posted - 05 Mar 2020 : 05:37:34
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Master LordofBones,
The whole thing is ridiculously funny to be honest. The stuff that gets thrown out now days can be so contradictory it is hard to make any sense of it at times. I personally enjoy the idea of Moander as a mortal at some point in time. You know, the local garbage truck driver...
Best regards,
quote:
Originally posted by LordofBones
It becomes funnier when you realize that, if all gods are ascended mortals, then Asmodeus, god of sin, has had his entire backstory retconned. The former anaphanct is now a bog standard mortal.
Then you have dudes like Raxivort and Kanchelsis, who were never mortal. Kanchy started off as a mass of corrupt divine blood; Raxivort was in Graz'zt's direct employ. Then there's Urdlen.
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Higher Atlar
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Why the Wall of the Faithless?
