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Shadowsoul
Senior Scribe

Ireland
691 Posts

Posted - 24 Jan 2018 :  15:30:15  Show Profile Send Shadowsoul a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Im my opinion success is measured by how much it's given to their customers which is why Paizo will always be the better gaming company. They don't do this for profit margins, they do what they do because it's a gaming company run by gamers, not a big corp. They give their customers gaming material. Their business model is better for their customers and not just their pockets. They've managed to find the right balance which is something WoTc will never find.

“Fantasy is escapist, and that is its glory. If a soldier is imprisioned by the enemy, don't we consider it his duty to escape?. . .If we value the freedom of mind and soul, if we're partisans of liberty, then it's our plain duty to escape, and to take as many people with us as we can!”
#8213; J.R.R. Tolkien

*I endorse everything Dark Wizard says*.
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ElaineCunningham
Forgotten Realms Author

2312 Posts

Posted - 25 Jan 2018 :  18:43:01  Show Profile  Visit ElaineCunningham's Homepage Send ElaineCunningham a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Shadowsoul

Im my opinion success is measured by how much it's given to their customers which is why Paizo will always be the better gaming company. They don't do this for profit margins, they do what they do because it's a gaming company run by gamers, not a big corp. They give their customers gaming material. Their business model is better for their customers and not just their pockets. They've managed to find the right balance which is something WoTc will never find.



And yet Paizo, too, has discontinued its fiction line.
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CorellonsDevout
Great Reader

USA
2170 Posts

Posted - 25 Jan 2018 :  18:59:51  Show Profile  Send CorellonsDevout an AOL message Send CorellonsDevout a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by ElaineCunningham

quote:
Originally posted by Shadowsoul

Im my opinion success is measured by how much it's given to their customers which is why Paizo will always be the better gaming company. They don't do this for profit margins, they do what they do because it's a gaming company run by gamers, not a big corp. They give their customers gaming material. Their business model is better for their customers and not just their pockets. They've managed to find the right balance which is something WoTc will never find.



And yet Paizo, too, has discontinued its fiction line.



Have they actually discontinued it? I've been reading some of the PF novels, and I'm disappointed the novels have stopped, but I heard that was because they were looking for a new publisher.

Sweet water and light laughter
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
Moderator

USA
30987 Posts

Posted - 25 Jan 2018 :  19:22:41  Show Profile Send Wooly Rupert a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by ElaineCunningham

quote:
Originally posted by Shadowsoul

Im my opinion success is measured by how much it's given to their customers which is why Paizo will always be the better gaming company. They don't do this for profit margins, they do what they do because it's a gaming company run by gamers, not a big corp. They give their customers gaming material. Their business model is better for their customers and not just their pockets. They've managed to find the right balance which is something WoTc will never find.



And yet Paizo, too, has discontinued its fiction line.



That's unfortunate. They had some good stuff.

I have to admit, though, that I discontinued my fiction subscription with Paizo -- I was getting more to read every month than I had time to read.

I like Paizo, but I'm sometimes concerned that they're doing the same thing WotC and TSR both did -- being more concerned with getting something published on a very regular schedule, rather than easing back on the schedule a bit to focus on better offerings. I've liked a lot of their stuff, but there's been more than a few supplements that I've looked at and wondered who could possibly have a need for them.

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ElaineCunningham
Forgotten Realms Author

2312 Posts

Posted - 26 Jan 2018 :  18:20:40  Show Profile  Visit ElaineCunningham's Homepage Send ElaineCunningham a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by CorellonsDevout

quote:
Originally posted by ElaineCunningham

And yet Paizo, too, has discontinued its fiction line.



Have they actually discontinued it? I've been reading some of the PF novels, and I'm disappointed the novels have stopped, but I heard that was because they were looking for a new publisher.



I don't know whether the discontinuation is permanent or temporary.
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Mirtek
Senior Scribe

523 Posts

Posted - 27 Jan 2018 :  09:57:05  Show Profile Send Mirtek a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Zeromaru X

This is not so accurate. While killing the comics of the Fantastic 4 killed the movie line as well
I don't think that is accurate. Most people who saw those movies or were in the target audience to potentielly see those movies have never ever read a F4 comic nor are they even aware whether those are still being published or have discontinued.

The F4 line failed because they were not good movies. The reboot failed because it was even worse. Simple as that.

Had they been later MCU quality movies, they would still be going strong with >90% of their audience completely unaware that the comic line has been ended.
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
Moderator

USA
30987 Posts

Posted - 27 Jan 2018 :  16:08:52  Show Profile Send Wooly Rupert a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Mirtek

quote:
Originally posted by Zeromaru X

This is not so accurate. While killing the comics of the Fantastic 4 killed the movie line as well
I don't think that is accurate. Most people who saw those movies or were in the target audience to potentielly see those movies have never ever read a F4 comic nor are they even aware whether those are still being published or have discontinued.

The F4 line failed because they were not good movies. The reboot failed because it was even worse. Simple as that.

Had they been later MCU quality movies, they would still be going strong with >90% of their audience completely unaware that the comic line has been ended.



Indeed. As I've said more than once, people who read for pleasure -- whether it's comic books, straight fiction, tie-in fiction, or anything else -- are the minority, when it comes to the movie-going public. A best-selling book can be one that sells just 10,000 copies -- if only 10,000 people see a movie, it'll be out on DVD in a month.

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Richard Lee Byers
Forgotten Realms Author

USA
1784 Posts

Posted - 27 Jan 2018 :  18:05:48  Show Profile  Visit Richard Lee Byers's Homepage  Reply with Quote
The comments above are not wrong, but we can add that when evaluating whether to adapt written works, Hollywood does consider simple name recognition. For example, it's a plus if people recognize the name "Fantastic Four" whether or not anybody is currently reading the comics. Of course, if you invest money making movies that then bomb, perhaps that name recognition becomes less of a factor in your decision making thereafter.
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
Moderator

USA
30987 Posts

Posted - 28 Jan 2018 :  04:32:56  Show Profile Send Wooly Rupert a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Richard Lee Byers

The comments above are not wrong, but we can add that when evaluating whether to adapt written works, Hollywood does consider simple name recognition. For example, it's a plus if people recognize the name "Fantastic Four" whether or not anybody is currently reading the comics. Of course, if you invest money making movies that then bomb, perhaps that name recognition becomes less of a factor in your decision making thereafter.



Agreed. In their endless quest to avoid any originality, Hollywood will certainly look at the popularity of any given thing before deciding to make a movie on it... So while a bestselling book isn't guaranteed to be a summer blockbuster movie, that bestselling book certainly has better odds than something no one has ever heard of.

Though it's not that popularity in one media means popularity in another -- it's that something that makes something popular in one media can often do the same in another.

The Fantastic Four comics have been around for decades, and it's because Marvel hit on a good formula for a superhero group. The failure of Hollywood to make that formula work for them is not related to the current sales of the comic.

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Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
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Spectralballoons
Seeker

Pakistan
48 Posts

Posted - 02 Feb 2018 :  12:31:35  Show Profile Send Spectralballoons a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Personally, Wh40k has replaced FR, as far as I'm concerned.
>They give their customers gaming material.
So does WoTC. There may be less material, but the average quality is better.
I'm skeptical with regards to whether a movie will actually happen. If it does, let's face it, it probably won't be decent.

Edited by - Spectralballoons on 02 Feb 2018 12:35:23
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