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Portella
Learned Scribe
United Kingdom
247 Posts |
 Posted - 25 Jul 2014 : 22:02:24
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but what if you didnt need to use weave power. after all if the energy is stored somewhere else... something that wasnt taken... endless possibilities
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Purple you say?!
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Firestorm
Senior Scribe
Canada
826 Posts |
Posted - 26 Jul 2014 : 02:30:06
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quote:
Originally posted by Lilianviaten
quote:
Originally posted by The Arcanamach
Indeed, I'd say he could best any lesser deity in open combat (with the help of artifacts). I'm not saying he could actually SLAY just any lesser deity, just that he could best them.
I think he's had the means of ascension for some time and has chosen not to do it. He just decided the opportunity presented in the Herald was too good to pass up. I'm also not convinced he actually 'failed' at anything. Larloch is a 'wheels within wheels' sort of genius. What if he faked trying to become a god and 'failed' on purpose to throw the Chosen off his TRUE plans? I've said this in another thread, I think he set Tam up to fail (because his long game is MUCH longer than most) with his still being none the wiser about it.
I will say that I think El is smart enough to know that Larloch didn't actually fail but succeeded at whatever he was trying to REALLY do.
As far as setting Tam up to fail, I agree with that. It is curious how that ancient ritual mysteriously turned up. But in terms of besting any deity in combat, I would sorely doubt it. Did you read the Twilight War books? Kesson Rel was a demigod, and he was a BEAST. I would give Larloch a good chance against him, but he can't best anything above a demigod. There's no reason to think any wizard could.
I too, would like it if Larloch's seemingly uncharacteristic blunder was some "plot within a plot", but that's unlikely. I think his failure was a real thing.
Yeah Kesson was a beast. However, Larloch showed up at Telamont's ritual and literally wiped the entire enclave of Arcanists into learning how to retie their shoes and barking at the sky. Except Telamont, who he left sane just to freaking taunt him lol.
1 Archlich being able to demolish a city full of arcanists like Shade in seconds is pretty badass.
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Lilianviaten
Senior Scribe
489 Posts |
Posted - 26 Jul 2014 : 21:21:37
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quote:
Originally posted by silverwolfer
While I love the conversation, I would like to repoint out what I posted.
That even Shar admitted that the wards of candlekeep were enough to make him into a local demi-god.
Which is a good point, and one I had forgotten. However, Shar has also shown that she doesn't understand a whole lot about magic. She thought she could keep the Shadow Weave and take over the Weave when Cyric killed Mystra. She ended up with nothing, and had no clue why.
Within the book, Shar was shocked when Telamont explained Larloch's plan to her (absorbing the wards of Candlekeep, and then using that power to absorb Myth Drannor's mythal). It had never occurred to her that this could be done, which was a rather poor showing for the Goddess of Secrets.
Shar was also unprepared for the Srinshee and the Chosen using the Weave to pull down the flying enclave, and she was unaware of the process they were using to strengthen the Weave. My confidence in Shar's knowledge of anything magical is shaky. |
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Lilianviaten
Senior Scribe
489 Posts |
Posted - 26 Jul 2014 : 23:38:16
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quote:
Originally posted by Arcanus
From the herald-
“For a long time I contented myself with studying the Art, taking it further than any one entity had done before,” he purred, “and letting Toril attend to itself. I cared for no realm nor ruler nor cabal, and was content to be left alone. And the world grew no better, and petty tyrants meddled ever more recklessly with magic, from the dupes of Shar to those fools in Zhentil Keep and Thay, and now these arrogant returned bumblers of Thultanthar. It is time, and long past time, to intervene. Not to rule the high and the low, trying to make laws and enforce them in matters ever so petty— but to slap down the worst parasites and vandals, and let commoners and oxen alike breathe once more! A city should have a ruler pitted against guilds and street gangs and the wealthiest families— but above that, there should be no one but the gods, and their priesthoods lockedever in opposition. Let there be an end to kings. Let there be only … Larloch.”
Seems that big L is content to exist as he is, somewhere between god and mortal.
Yay! 400 posts 
The comment about Thay makes me wonder why Larloch did not intervene with Szass Tam. And if you'll remember, there was a comment (from Shar to Telamont) that Elminster has meddled in every major affair on Faerun for the last 400 years, with the SOLE EXCEPTION of Szass Tam taking over Thay. That made 2 things immediately come to mind:
1) That's why a lot of people find Elminster annoying. If he's played a part in taking down every villain for 400 years, that's just too much. To be realistic, every RSE will have to do what ROTA did and create an explanation for why Elminster doesn't simply come destroy the villain himself.
2) Why is Szass Tam the sole exception? Is there any particular reason that Elminster won't come smack Tam down the way he did to Telamont? For that matter, if Larloch wants to take over the Weave, why not just go kill Tam and take all the Chosen he has collected, then attain godhood and absorb the Weave? Or take Tam's Unmaking ritual and use it himself? |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36779 Posts |
Posted - 27 Jul 2014 : 00:31:10
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Two possibilities immediately come to mind:
1) Shar was mistaken or exaggerating... It's possible Elminster did interfere in some subtle way, and she just didn't see it. It's also possible that Elminster hasn't been interfering as much as Shar said, and that she was either exaggerating because that's what it seems like, or because she wanted Telly to think Elminster had more involvement than he really had.
2) The other possibility is that Elminster had a specific reason for holding back. Perhaps he knew of a third party that was going to interfere, or perhaps he knew what Szassy was doing and why it would ultimately fail. |
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sleyvas
Skilled Spell Strategist
USA
11695 Posts |
Posted - 27 Jul 2014 : 01:20:10
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quote:
Originally posted by The Sage
quote:
Originally posted by George Krashos
If it was that easy to become a god, he would have done it years ago.
-- George Krashos
Agreed.
And, besides, from what Ed has told us in the past about Larloch's ambitions... I'd very much assume that the great mage could very well have found some other "avenues" toward amassing great almost-deity-level power.
Also, the one thing I don't see many people think about is "how" does being a god affect your advancement. For instance, if you "take on the god mantle feat", does all of your XP all of a sudden only go into leveling your "godness". This could be very disastrous for someone who wanted to grow their "personal and not linked to their divinity" level of power, as they suddenly become a god and get assaulted by other gods. Now, they're spending all their earned xp on maintaining their divinity. |
Alavairthae, may your skill prevail
Phillip aka Sleyvas |
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sleyvas
Skilled Spell Strategist
USA
11695 Posts |
Posted - 27 Jul 2014 : 01:28:05
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quote:
Originally posted by Lilianviaten
quote:
Originally posted by Arcanus
From the herald-
“For a long time I contented myself with studying the Art, taking it further than any one entity had done before,” he purred, “and letting Toril attend to itself. I cared for no realm nor ruler nor cabal, and was content to be left alone. And the world grew no better, and petty tyrants meddled ever more recklessly with magic, from the dupes of Shar to those fools in Zhentil Keep and Thay, and now these arrogant returned bumblers of Thultanthar. It is time, and long past time, to intervene. Not to rule the high and the low, trying to make laws and enforce them in matters ever so petty— but to slap down the worst parasites and vandals, and let commoners and oxen alike breathe once more! A city should have a ruler pitted against guilds and street gangs and the wealthiest families— but above that, there should be no one but the gods, and their priesthoods lockedever in opposition. Let there be an end to kings. Let there be only … Larloch.”
Seems that big L is content to exist as he is, somewhere between god and mortal.
Yay! 400 posts
The comment about Thay makes me wonder why Larloch did not intervene with Szass Tam. And if you'll remember, there was a comment (from Shar to Telamont) that Elminster has meddled in every major affair on Faerun for the last 400 years, with the SOLE EXCEPTION of Szass Tam taking over Thay. That made 2 things immediately come to mind:
1) That's why a lot of people find Elminster annoying. If he's played a part in taking down every villain for 400 years, that's just too much. To be realistic, every RSE will have to do what ROTA did and create an explanation for why Elminster doesn't simply come destroy the villain himself.
2) Why is Szass Tam the sole exception? Is there any particular reason that Elminster won't come smack Tam down the way he did to Telamont? For that matter, if Larloch wants to take over the Weave, why not just go kill Tam and take all the Chosen he has collected, then attain godhood and absorb the Weave? Or take Tam's Unmaking ritual and use it himself?
Who says Tam isn't doing exactly what Larloch wanted? After all, Larloch gave Tam the cursed magic item which has effectively turned him crazy and power mad. |
Alavairthae, may your skill prevail
Phillip aka Sleyvas |
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The Arcanamach
Master of Realmslore
1842 Posts |
Posted - 27 Jul 2014 : 07:17:37
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The fact that El doesn't show up and 'deal with' the baddies has been covered in the novels. Simply put, Mystra doesn't want him to. She has her own plans in motion and El is there to assist her with them...not police all of Faerun unless 1) she tells him to or 2) on those rare occasions that he goes his own way and handles something (which Mystra wants him to do at times as stated in El the Making of a Mage).
El is a meddler who tries to steer things towards 'good' ends...if he showed up on every ebil mages' doorstep and stomped them into the ground he'd be no better than they are (at least that's how El sees it). He also wouldn't really be a true believer in Mystra's work (spreading magic). Her (and thus his) goal is to spread the use of magic. Slaying evil mages would not only stop them from developing magic, but also give less reason for goodly wizards to create magic to curtail them.
Stopping Telamont (and really it was Shar that was being dealt with moreso than Telly) was needful...thus El stomped him. Shade needed to be stopped and their end goal (as a result of devotion to Shar) was the destruction of magic (at least from the point of view of a devoted follower of Mystra). |
I have a dream that one day, all game worlds will exist as one. |
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Nicolai Withander
Master of Realmslore
Denmark
1093 Posts |
Posted - 27 Jul 2014 : 13:45:55
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When it comes to Larloch, Srinshee and the rest of the über archmages out there, who are all beyond mortal intelligence, I think its safe to assume that they all have backup plans and contingenceis that take effect when ever...
Srinshee being ca 4300 years old is robably the most knowledgable of the art and I refuse to belive she is realy dead and gone for good. The same goes for Larloch. He have had time to prepare for soany situations that I find it hard to believe that his "failure" was not at least part of the plan. And BTW someting a negative result is just as important as a succesful one.
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Is Larloch a DemiGod now?
