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Eladrinstar
Learned Scribe
USA
196 Posts |
 Posted - 16 Dec 2011 : 06:46:40
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How do you handle sorcerers in your Realms games?
This is all homebrewed headcanon:
I've never liked the "lineage" origin for Sorcerers. For a few feats and prestige classes, sure, but an ancestral origin for an entire main character class is not something I like.
I much prefer the interpretation that anyone who takes the time to train (has the XP to spend) and has the proper force of personality (Charisma score) can become a sorcerer, tapping into the connection the Weave has with all forms of life (and unlife) and drawing spells from it. You see, sorcerers learn the same spells as wizards, which they draw a limited number (insert obvious sorcerer number-of-spells joke) from the Weave's memory of spells created. You see, the Weave is an entity (Mystryl/Mystra/Midnight) as well as a natural force. So it "remembers" magic known and sorcerers draw on that to "learn" those spells.
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Edited by - Eladrinstar on 16 Dec 2011 06:54:29
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Ayrik
Great Reader
Canada
7970 Posts |
Posted - 16 Dec 2011 : 07:28:34
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| I don't. Sorcerers, and any rationale to explain them, simply do not exist in my Realms setting. |
[/Ayrik] |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31701 Posts |
Posted - 16 Dec 2011 : 07:33:47
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I've never really had any opportunity to play a 3e sorcerer however. And I'm not sure I'd want to. I still haven't brought the class into my FR as of yet, mostly because I haven't been able to settle on a suitable 'origin tale' for 3e sorcerers in the Realms. I do have 'sorcerer-like' NPCs, who possess strange "wild talent-like" abilities with magic, much like Ed's interpretation of sorcerers in 2e -- they just weren't called 'sorcerers.'
I suppose my take on 3e sorcerers in my FR would be very similar to what Ed outlined in Temptation of Elminster. I would probably establish a possible link between sorcerers and dragon/draconic bloodlines -- which hints at where the sorcerers get their dragonblood from. In the novel itself, it notes the dragonsblood experiments undertaken by Cordorlar, in the waning days of Netheril. In fact, I'd probably expand the scope a little, and suggest that other highly magical creatures also gained their own sorcerous abilities in much the same way. |
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Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage |
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Thelonius
Senior Scribe
Spain
730 Posts |
Posted - 16 Dec 2011 : 08:01:43
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| In my setting sorcerors are a real rarity, usually linked to extra-natural lineages, planars, dragons, deities and so, they are usually capped in that their spell style is really linked to the lineage they come from, though they get some nice resistances (so do with weaknesses). For example a ranger hero who was spaqwn of a demon sub-lord, his spells were linked to demonic plane, but he had some nice resistance to damage and some healing-factor... |
"If you are to truly understand, then you will need the contrast, not adherence to a single ideal." - Kreia
"I THINK I JUST HAD ANOTHER NEAR-RINCEWIND EXPERIENCE"- Discworld's Death frustrated after Rincewind scapes his grasp... again.
"I am death, come for thee" - Nimbul, from Baldur's Gate I just before being badly spanked
Sapientia sola libertas est |
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Marc
Senior Scribe
657 Posts |
Posted - 16 Dec 2011 : 10:04:16
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| We only have arcanists, under that it depends on the individual how it gains access to magic, pacts, bloodlines, occult research, psionics, faith, alchemy, shamanism, and many other, or combinations of them. |
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Diffan
Great Reader
USA
4430 Posts |
Posted - 16 Dec 2011 : 12:41:31
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I'm with Marc in that there aren't huge differences with the underlining use of Arcane magic. I look at it like Art, in that there are definite forms and teachings that express one way of "painting" (for example) yet there are some that just grab whats there and throw it against the wall. One is structured the other is free-form yet it's both Art. Apply that to Arcane magic where one derives their magical prowess though regimented study of tomes, formula, and their Master's teachings while the other grasps at magical power though emotions and trial-and-error. This is even seen in the game's mechanics as Wizards progress faster in spell-levels (reaching 9th level spells at 17th level instead of 18th), gain more feats, and have more spells known. Sorcerers tend to hold onto their spells longer, as shown by their much smaller "Spells Known" list.
Honestly, with how magical the Realms are overall I don't see how Sorcerery can't be explained with an easy degree. Heritage feats (PH2, Complete Mage) are excellent ways of further explaining some sorcerous power, but that's really not necessary to explain the magical way as a whole. |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36779 Posts |
Posted - 16 Dec 2011 : 12:55:48
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| I've always liked the idea that sorcerers have something in their blood that enables them to access magic in ways different from traditional spellslingers. I like sorcerers, and I like the explanation that they have some fae/divine/draconic blood to enable their magic use. |
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Diffan
Great Reader
USA
4430 Posts |
Posted - 16 Dec 2011 : 13:29:47
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quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
I've always liked the idea that sorcerers have something in their blood that enables them to access magic in ways different from traditional spellslingers. I like sorcerers, and I like the explanation that they have some fae/divine/draconic blood to enable their magic use.
Totally agree. When I run 3e/3.5 games I often give Sorcerers bonus feats at 5th and every 5 levels after (like a wizard) that they can select Heritage feats or Metamagic feats from. Pathfinder does this aspect for me though their Bloodline Powers. Definitly gives the character more "flair" and interesting backgrounds right from the get-go. |
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Hoondatha
Great Reader
USA
2449 Posts |
Posted - 16 Dec 2011 : 15:20:30
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I don't have any problem with sorcerers in very small numbers, so there are a few scattered throughout my Realms. They need some sort of trigger to do what they do, but in addition to the bloodline stuff WotC so loved, I've added prolonged (as in generational) contact with abnormally high levels of magic. This allows you to have perfectly normal people from Raven's Bluff, Thay, Halruaa, or Silverymoon manifest in a pinch.
It's still really rare, though. Only a few dozen probably in all Faerun. |
Doggedly converting 3e back to what D&D should be...
Sigh... And now 4e as well. |
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Erik Scott de Bie
Forgotten Realms Author
USA
4598 Posts |
Posted - 16 Dec 2011 : 16:34:37
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My games have the same assumption as Hoondatha, though sorcerers are somewhat more prevalent. Sorcery can come from one's heritage, contact with powerful magic, or even a particular item/relic the character carries around.
Cheers |
Erik Scott de Bie
'Tis easier to destroy than to create.
Author of a number of Realms novels (GHOSTWALKER, DEPTHS OF MADNESS, and the SHADOWBANE series), contributor to the NEVERWINTER CAMPAIGN GUIDE and SHADOWFELL: GLOOMWROUGHT AND BEYOND, Twitch DM of the Dungeon Scrawlers, currently playing "The Westgate Irregulars" |
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Eladrinstar
Learned Scribe
USA
196 Posts |
Posted - 16 Dec 2011 : 17:32:07
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| I just assume sorcerers are as prevalent as they are said to be in the 3.5 Dungeon Master's Guide rules for drawing up random populations in cities, towns and villages. |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36779 Posts |
Posted - 16 Dec 2011 : 17:47:10
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With tying a sorcerer's power to their bloodline, it's not unreasonable to have smaller numbers of sorcerers than wizards. Not so rare as just a few dozen in the entire setting, but making them as rare as pre-4E genasi is reasonable, to me.
Personally, though, I would have expected the advent of sorcerers in the Realms to have been explained better. The class didn't exist, and then we found out that characters previously described as wizards had always been sorcerers... Going into the series, I honestly expected that the Return of Shade would have been the mechanism to explain this new method of spellcasting, but that's obviously not the direction WotC chose. |
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Edited by - Wooly Rupert on 16 Dec 2011 17:48:27 |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31701 Posts |
Posted - 16 Dec 2011 : 23:48:52
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quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
Personally, though, I would have expected the advent of sorcerers in the Realms to have been explained better. The class didn't exist, and then we found out that characters previously described as wizards had always been sorcerers...
Which is kind of why I'm following Ed's trend on sorcery in the Realms, as I explained above. It makes it clear that the talent has mostly always existed, but was poorly understood at the time.
Deemed "wild talent-like," it was only with the dragonblood experimentations of Cordorlar, that the very notion of sorcerers became somewhat more defined, and, possibly, categorised as an alternate arcane science. |
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Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)
"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood
Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage |
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Charles Phipps
Master of Realmslore
1419 Posts |
Posted - 17 Dec 2011 : 21:23:14
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I tend to use Sorcery as a sort of substitute for trained wizardry and suggest that everyone who is a sorcery can be trained as an Arcane Mage.
It's just those who don't potentially can develop their powers on their own.
It's just a storytelling preference. |
My Blog: http://unitedfederationofcharles.blogspot.com/
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Kris the Grey
Senior Scribe
USA
422 Posts |
Posted - 18 Dec 2011 : 08:32:38
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Pathfinder...cough...cough...bloodlines...cough...cough. Seems an ideal approach!
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Kris the Grey - Member in Good Standing of the Watchful Order of Magists and Protectors, the Arcane Guild of Silverymoon, and the Connecticut Bar Association |
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Therise
Master of Realmslore
1272 Posts |
Posted - 18 Dec 2011 : 18:02:41
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My personal homebrew Realms has been on a shelf for a while gathering dust (we've been playing some other things, lately). But I never had "sorcerers" in it, partly because I diverged from D&D rules a long, long time ago. When AD&D ended and 2E came out, we switched to Rolemaster, which (to us) seemed to fit the magic of the Realms a lot better. In addition, there were lots of things that we never incorporated into my homebrew Realms... no Time of Troubles, no "wild magic" as D&D described it, just a lot of things that we never brought in.
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Female, 40-year DM of a homebrew-evolved 1E Realms, including a few added tidbits of 2E and 3E lore; played originally in AD&D, then in Rolemaster. Be a DM for your kids and grandkids, gaming is excellent for families! |
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Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire
USA
15724 Posts |
Posted - 18 Dec 2011 : 22:50:10
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Going along with what Erik and Hoondatha said - Sorcerers just have 'natural talent', which could be attributed to any number of phenomena (environment, magical accident or encounter, divine intervention, etc).
I also had Sorcerers long before 3e did - my system was similar, but simpler. I used the term 'mage' (short for hedge-mage) for my version; I used 'sorcerer' for elementalists. My Sorcerers (Mages) were more along the lines of wiccans (and I am still annoyed at what D&D did to the word 'Warlock'), complete with familiars that are actually summoned creatures forced to take a material form. |
"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone
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Wolfhound75
Learned Scribe
USA
217 Posts |
Posted - 19 Dec 2011 : 17:23:09
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quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
With tying a sorcerer's power to their bloodline, it's not unreasonable to have smaller numbers of sorcerers than wizards.
quote:
Originally posted by Markustay
Going along with what Erik and Hoondatha said - Sorcerers just have 'natural talent', which could be attributed to any number of phenomena (environment, magical accident or encounter, divine intervention, etc).
Perhaps I am over-thinking this but, after ruminating on this subject while working on my 'honey-do' list this weekend, I find myself coming down straddling the fence, so to speak.
I absolutely believe that certain sorcerers can tie the manifestation of their powers to bloodline but, I am having trouble rectifying a couple of points in my mind. The first of which I will call describe as Dilution and the second as Disconnected.
Using the Bloodline theory, I see an inherant flaw in the premise - Dilution. One of my side businesses involves breeding horses and, if you have an animal with a highly desired trait (we'll call that sorcery for this discussion) which could be passed on (a prerequisite of the Bloodline theory), subsequent generations would receive less and less of that heritage. This eventually makes it very unlikely that a great-x-grandson/daughter would manifest that trait in its phenotype, even though it might theoretically be present in genotype. So over time, it seems to me, that a specific sorcerer's bloodline would eventually die out making it necessary (and apparently fun) for the gods/demons/devils/celestials to renew or start new bloodlines.
The second ambiguity that I'm having trouble wrapping my mind around is that the backstory appears disconnected. If sorcerers, using the Bloodline theory, have some sort of divine/celestial/devilish/demonic heritage, and looking at the various writeups in the MM/MC books, it occurs that while some can cast arcane spells as a class or supernatural/extrodinary ability, that sorcerers would be more likely to inherit the ability to tap divine energies - more akin to the Favored Soul class.
Conversely, using the Natural Talent premise, there is some credible canon to support it. Bards cast arcane magic through the use of Charisma - force of personality - and their voice. Charisma is also the ability for Use Magic Device. So clearly, it's possible that the right combination in an individual may open the door of possibility. However, the magic combination required to do this would likely be very rare so I have trouble rectifying how sorcerers are suddenly so much more prevalent in the realms.
Wrapping up, both of these prevailing theories can explain the presence of sorcerers in the Realms. What they cannot explain, taking each theory individually, is the sudden abundance that we are seeing spread throughout the Realms in a relatively short time span. That is why I find myself straddling the fence between both theories. If both are in play, coupled with the catastrophic canon events throughout Faerun (ToT, Spellplague, etc.) it might explain the how and the how many.
As always, more thoughts and discussion welcome.
Good Hunting!
Edit: Added quote from Markustay |
"Firepower - if it's not working, you're not using enough." ~ Military Proverb
"If at first you do succeed, you must've rolled a natural 20!" |
Edited by - Wolfhound75 on 19 Dec 2011 17:32:47 |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36779 Posts |
Posted - 19 Dec 2011 : 19:11:40
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I, personally, think that the Return of the Archwizards, spun a different way, could have explained why we suddenly have sorcerers when we didn't before. Ditto for the Time of Troubles (with a delayed effect, obviously).
I don't think dilution is as much of a concern, though. Dilution is only a concern if there's only one outsider who only gets into the family tree, one time. With the plethora of outsiders that have come to the Realms, with the availability of portals leading to where the outsiders come from, and with the immortal nature of outsiders, it's quite likely that there are large numbers of people with at least a trace of outsider blood. It's possible, in fact, for an outsider to mate with several generations of one family.
It's also possible that outsider genes don't breed out all the way, but only get to a certain level and then remain. Yeah, that's not the way real-world genetics work, but real-world genetics wouldn't work the way it works in canon for the elven races, either.
And plenty of outsiders work arcane magic, so that angle isn't a concern for me, either. |
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Edited by - Wooly Rupert on 19 Dec 2011 19:13:31 |
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Therise
Master of Realmslore
1272 Posts |
Posted - 19 Dec 2011 : 20:07:52
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I never liked the concept of sorcerers, and haven't implemented them, because they really were meant as a "fix" or alternative to the wizard. In many ways, I felt they served to dilute the wizard. Suddenly, you have arcane casters who didn't have to spend years of study to learn their magic; and not only that, they were more versatile in terms of spells. No longer was intelligence an issue, or wisdom... rather, charisma?
Who, honestly, is going to choose to play a class that is perceived as being "gimped" (my spell is one-shot, then I have to rely on a crossbow(?!) for combat) when you have the sorcerer and its benefits? In one stroke, arcane magic is turned into pew-pew with no ties to the original "study and be intelligent/wise" concept.
No thanks. It's a major reason I switched systems to Rolemaster back in the day, rather than get deep into 2E. Since I hated the entire set of changes that came along with the Time of Troubles (switching Myrkul, Bane and Bhaal for that chump Cyric? And also losing Mystra for Midnight?! COME ON!) and wanted to skip that junk, the decision was easy.
With Rolemaster and its arcane spell lists, I got to keep the wizard concept as one of study and clever smarts, and the idea of Essaence as "the Weave" also matched nicely. It even served the Realms' approach to divine magic and psionics quite well.
I'm no fan of Vancian spellcasting, but sorcerers don't fix the "problem" of Vancian-style wizards at all.
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Female, 40-year DM of a homebrew-evolved 1E Realms, including a few added tidbits of 2E and 3E lore; played originally in AD&D, then in Rolemaster. Be a DM for your kids and grandkids, gaming is excellent for families! |
Edited by - Therise on 19 Dec 2011 20:09:11 |
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Wolfhound75
Learned Scribe
USA
217 Posts |
Posted - 19 Dec 2011 : 20:09:26
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quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
I don't think dilution is as much of a concern, though. Dilution is only a concern if there's only one outsider who only gets into the family tree, one time. With the plethora of outsiders that have come to the Realms, with the availability of portals leading to where the outsiders come from, and with the immortal nature of outsiders, it's quite likely that there are large numbers of people with at least a trace of outsider blood. It's possible, in fact, for an outsider to mate with several generations of one family.
Agreed! Which is why I said "...making it necessary (and apparently fun) for the gods/demons/devils/celestials to renew or start new bloodlines."
(OOC: Cripes, I've totally become a Scribe - and a long-winded one at that! Hmm...note to self...Outsider is a lot shorter to type and gets the point across just as well as all the slash-work. Thanks Wooly!)
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
And plenty of outsiders work arcane magic, so that angle isn't a concern for me, either.
Ah, yes. But being able to work arcane magic, either through study or supernatural/extrodinary ability, doesn't mean that you can pass that on through breeding. Admittedly, if it's an ability it's more likely to be passed on. It's like knowledge or an injury IMO. If I lose my arm in combat, it doesn't mean my children will be born without an arm. Or, if I learn a skill (IRL - Fly a helicopter) it doesn't mean my kids will learn the same skills. I view wizardry the same way, as a learned skill. Though I admit if we applied RL genetics to it, they may be genetically predisposed to excel at wizardry....
A very interesting discussion at any rate and hopefully we can all generate some ideas on how to handle Sorcerers in our Realms like the OP asked. Ideas we can all draw on to help handle the sudden influx of this class.
Good Hunting! |
"Firepower - if it's not working, you're not using enough." ~ Military Proverb
"If at first you do succeed, you must've rolled a natural 20!" |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36779 Posts |
Posted - 19 Dec 2011 : 21:57:17
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quote:
Originally posted by Therise
I never liked the concept of sorcerers, and haven't implemented them, because they really were meant as a "fix" or alternative to the wizard. In many ways, I felt they served to dilute the wizard. Suddenly, you have arcane casters who didn't have to spend years of study to learn their magic; and not only that, they were more versatile in terms of spells. No longer was intelligence an issue, or wisdom... rather, charisma?
Who, honestly, is going to choose to play a class that is perceived as being "gimped" (my spell is one-shot, then I have to rely on a crossbow(?!) for combat) when you have the sorcerer and its benefits? In one stroke, arcane magic is turned into pew-pew with no ties to the original "study and be intelligent/wise" concept.
No thanks. It's a major reason I switched systems to Rolemaster back in the day, rather than get deep into 2E. Since I hated the entire set of changes that came along with the Time of Troubles (switching Myrkul, Bane and Bhaal for that chump Cyric? And also losing Mystra for Midnight?! COME ON!) and wanted to skip that junk, the decision was easy.
With Rolemaster and its arcane spell lists, I got to keep the wizard concept as one of study and clever smarts, and the idea of Essaence as "the Weave" also matched nicely. It even served the Realms' approach to divine magic and psionics quite well.
I'm no fan of Vancian spellcasting, but sorcerers don't fix the "problem" of Vancian-style wizards at all.
I've never considered sorcerers to be a fix for wizards. Sorcerers have the advantage of not having to plan ahead, but the flipside of this is fewer spells. I think that's a fair exchange.
I personally prefer sorcerers, but I don't see them as a replacement for wizards, and I'd favor a wizard in some situations. |
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Erik Scott de Bie
Forgotten Realms Author
USA
4598 Posts |
Posted - 19 Dec 2011 : 22:09:38
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quote:
Originally posted by Kris the Grey
Pathfinder...cough...cough...bloodlines...cough...cough. Seems an ideal approach!
The Pathfinder sorcerer bloodlines are one of my favorite things about that spin on 3.5.
I do think it's somewhat limited conceptually, so I expand the flavor in my own games to include power derived from some magical source (i.e., take the demon bloodline but instead of being descended from a demon, you just had a run-in with a demon, and it tainted you with its power, etc).
In fact, spellscars work kinda like this, in my mind.
Cheers |
Erik Scott de Bie
'Tis easier to destroy than to create.
Author of a number of Realms novels (GHOSTWALKER, DEPTHS OF MADNESS, and the SHADOWBANE series), contributor to the NEVERWINTER CAMPAIGN GUIDE and SHADOWFELL: GLOOMWROUGHT AND BEYOND, Twitch DM of the Dungeon Scrawlers, currently playing "The Westgate Irregulars" |
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Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire
USA
15724 Posts |
Posted - 20 Dec 2011 : 15:34:04
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I did not rule-out Bloodlines, I simply added to the list of reasons their powers manifested -
quote:
Originally posted by Markustay
Going along with what Erik and Hoondatha said - Sorcerers just have 'natural talent', which could be attributed to any number of phenomena (environment, magical accident or encounter, divine intervention, etc).
The way I see it (which means we are entering homebrew territory here), humans do NOT have natural magical ability - it is derived from external sources. Some beg for spells (priests), others imprints arcane patterns in their minds to be released at the right moment (Vancian/Arcane magic), while yet others (mostly giants & dwarves, but Orientals use a form of it as well) imprint these patterns on physical objects to release the power (Rune magic).
Other races have many 'gifts' bestowed upon them - abilities humans do not have (this is canon). However, humans have the ultimate gift - the ability to adapt. If they see others using magic, they figure-out a way of doing it themselves, even though they are not naturally prone to it.
Wizardry - as the word is used in D&D - is the purposeful undertaking of an individual to bestow themselves with 'magical ability', and requires a LOT of work. 'Sorcery' - as the word is used in D&D - is a natural affinity toward magic, which could be derived from any number of external sources, including - but not limited to - Bloodlines.
As to your question about genetics - there are such things as 'throwbacks', and sometimes a gene from long-ago 'pops-up' from time to time. There are also dominant and recessive genes, and I would hazard to guess that paranormal creatures (including things like fiends, angels, deities, Fey, etc) would have a more 'primal' DNA code, and therefor be dominant (just a shot in the dark there - I am no geneticist, but we are talking about fantasy genetics now).
Also, you have the situation where a person with a long-ago 'magical' ancestor (probably a great many people in a world like FR), meets and breeds with a person with a similar background. presto, the two dormant bloodlines meet and something unusual is the result. This is why two very ordinary parents can have an Archmage for a child (as Elminster's parents were... as far as we know). Or why a such a child may have horns... or wings... or whatever. I site MANY RW cases where persons of color have 'white' children, and 'white' parents give birth to children of color (there was even a movie about one such case - a famous one - in South Africa).
Genetics is a crapshoot; throw in magic and divine intervention, and anything is possible. |
"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone
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Wolfhound75
Learned Scribe
USA
217 Posts |
Posted - 21 Dec 2011 : 18:34:39
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And that is exactly why I find myself coming down straddling the line between both theories. Both of them are plausible.
I completely concur with your homebrew territory interpretation that humans do not have natural magical ability and find it curious that the extra starting and leveling skill points that humans get, I nicknamed 'Human Adaptability' in my notes. That goes hand-in-hand with your ultimate gift, the ability to adapt, idea.
I should have differentiated better when using the word ability. I apologize for any confusion this caused. I used ability to mean the supernatural/extrodinary type - what you could consider as instinct or genetics to apply RL science.
And yes, you always have the possibility of dominant and recessive alleles, mutations and mutation rate, etc. Which is why I mentioned the difference between genotype (what alleles the genes are capable of supplying) and phenotype (what traits the individual actually manifests) and that meshes up with your "presto, the two dormant bloodlines meet and something unusual is the result."
I've been a science guy since I was little and I think we're saying the same things in two different ways. You're speaking common and I'm speaking a sub-dialect known as geek-speak.
Good Hunting! |
"Firepower - if it's not working, you're not using enough." ~ Military Proverb
"If at first you do succeed, you must've rolled a natural 20!" |
Edited by - Wolfhound75 on 21 Dec 2011 18:35:45 |
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sleyvas
Skilled Spell Strategist
USA
11701 Posts |
Posted - 22 Dec 2011 : 20:06:23
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| 3E sorcerors sucked, so I never wanted one as an NPC unless I was going to multi-class it with something else. However, if a player wanted one, I was going to pretty much let them write their own "origin". Maybe they had dragon blood. Maybe their great grandmother mated with a genie. Maybe they were caught in some blast or fell in some magical wishing well and it "irradiated" them with magic. That all being said, I only had one player that ever wanted one, and he only played a few games before having to move. |
Alavairthae, may your skill prevail
Phillip aka Sleyvas |
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Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire
USA
15724 Posts |
Posted - 23 Dec 2011 : 02:49:17
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@Wolfhound - I'm a 'science guy' myself, but I've also spent most of my life as a construction worker. Its quite a trick explaining string-theory in 'Brooklynese'.
So yeah, I write the way I talk - in plain English. Big Words make Hulk's head hurt. 
And I believe 'human adaptability' comes directly from the 3e Player's Guide, if I am not mistaken. Its not a case of 'great minds thinking alike', but rather, people who have read so many rule books they don't know where half the stuff in their head comes from.
Now getting back to the subject: I think that most humans in a setting like FR have the 'magic gene', thanks to thousands of years of intermingling, with other humans and other species (isn't fantasy grand?) Many people have the capability of 'doing magic', but just never bother to learn or try. i think with Sorcerers, there is a trigger, which could be as simple as someone casting a spell in their presence, or touching (and setting-off) a magical device by accident, or even getting too close to Faerzress. It doesn't matter - once the catalyst is brought into proximity, it triggers the latent ability (like puberty in Marvel mutants).
So while Sorcerers may brag about their 'dragon heritage', some local farmer may be the grandson of a fiend, and the local blacksmith the great, great grand-nephew of a demigod, and the miller's daughter may not know her 'lost' mother was actually a doppleganger. Sorcerers are flashy by nature - they tell these tales - be they true or not - to impress. only problem is, in the Realms, this sort of thing happens all the time.
After 35K+ years, I think you'd be hard-pressed to find any FR human that doesn't have some non-human blood in them. Sorcerers have merely learned to tap into it.
At least, that is how I have worked things out (once again, HB from my own Realms games). |
"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone
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Ayrik
Great Reader
Canada
7970 Posts |
Posted - 23 Dec 2011 : 03:03:24
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| If sorcery is a thing inherited through bloodlines then it could just as likely be some sort of "magus enabler" added to human lineage as some sort of "magus inhibitor" removed from it. |
[/Ayrik] |
Edited by - Ayrik on 23 Dec 2011 03:38:16 |
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Wolfhound75
Learned Scribe
USA
217 Posts |
Posted - 23 Dec 2011 : 03:55:56
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@MT & Ayrik
Great points by both of you. I love these 'academic' discussions. I use it as a springboard for getting the creativity gene running in overdrive. Plus it's always interesting to me to hear ideas about how other people have done things in their game.
*wistful look* Wish I could find a local game group with room for one more here. Only found one game shop so far too. I guess no one plays FR in AZ...terrain is closer to Al-Qadim I guess.
Anyway, back to the point. I have been having a lot of trouble working this class into my planning so some of the ideas here have been of great help!
Good Hunting! |
"Firepower - if it's not working, you're not using enough." ~ Military Proverb
"If at first you do succeed, you must've rolled a natural 20!" |
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Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire
USA
15724 Posts |
Posted - 23 Dec 2011 : 17:51:14
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quote:
Originally posted by Ayrik
If sorcery is a thing inherited through bloodlines then it could just as likely be some sort of "magus enabler" added to human lineage as some sort of "magus inhibitor" removed from it.
In The Wheel of Time series, a group of 13 (usually) could 'snip' the connection someone has to 'The Source'. This is similar to what you suggest, except in the WoT case, they are channeling, rather then internalizing the magic.
Also, IIRC, Chosen of Mystra had the ability to 'cut off' someone from their magic, as a punishment. It was definitely a 'final warning' sort of thing, because this actually goes against Mystra's teachings. As I recall, it was temporary - a year I think.
Also, we have dead magic zones, and wild magic zones. These are obviously fluctuations in the Weave (tears and 'snags' of power). This means the field of arcane energy (The Weave) is also necessary for the magic to work. Even in another Crystal Sphere, one must assume some version of this exists.
The 'magic gene' would give a person the ability to access this energy field, in much the same way Metachlorines (I hear the SW fans throwing-up a little) enable folks to tap-into The Force. For all we know, it could be some sort of Arcane material present in the cell-structure itself - perhaps something naturally present in Fey and others. Or it could be as simple as accessing a part of your brain that most people don't have access to (since I have already made the point that nearly every human - unless extremely isolated - should have this 'magic gene' by now).
This works well within the D&D framework. The 'Arcane Patterns' that need to be imprinted in your memory in Vancian magic allows this access, as do the Dragonmarks of Eberron (Dragons/Dragonshards have this as well). In 4e, the Plaguescars serve the same function, but only in a limited capacity (which is used the same exact way in the Mystara/Red Steel setting, with Cinnabar). In this case, the scar/mark/Inheritor allows very limited access to a very specific portion of the weave - think of these as passwords on a server, but only the Admins (Sorcerers, wizards, WuJen, etc) have full access.
So nearly everyone should have the potential, but depending on how they tap into the magic determines what sort of character they become. So sorcerers may love to brag, but the truth is, they probably had the easiest route to go. |
"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone
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Wolfhound75
Learned Scribe
USA
217 Posts |
Posted - 23 Dec 2011 : 18:55:23
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Interesting points.
This generated a question for me that is off topic so I translated it to another scroll in order to avoid hijacking the OP's discussion.
Good Hunting! |
"Firepower - if it's not working, you're not using enough." ~ Military Proverb
"If at first you do succeed, you must've rolled a natural 20!" |
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Sorcery in YOUR Realms.
