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jordanz
Senior Scribe
553 Posts |
 Posted - 20 Jul 2011 : 14:29:24
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Do any exist? Does Primus recruit non Modron followers? Ditto for the top Slaadi Lords?
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Edited by - jordanz on 20 Jul 2011 14:41:30
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Kno
Senior Scribe
452 Posts |
Posted - 20 Jul 2011 : 17:01:38
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| Acolytes of the Hidden Flame, they serve Bazim-Gorag |
z455t |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36779 Posts |
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Eltheron
Senior Scribe
740 Posts |
Posted - 20 Jul 2011 : 18:25:09
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quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
Who would worship a geometric shape with limbs? 
Rubik.
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"The very best possible post-fourteenth-century Realms lets down those who love the specific, detailed social, political and magical situation, with its thousands of characters, developed over forty years, and want to learn more about it; and those who'd be open to a new one with equal depth, which there just isn't time to re-produce; and those repelled, some past the point of no return, by the bad-taste-and-plausibility gap of things done to the world when its guardianship was less careful."
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31701 Posts |
Posted - 21 Jul 2011 : 01:45:35
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I'd imagine Primus-worshipping cults among both modrons and non-modrons would be considerably rare.
As I recall, the web enhancement for the 3e Manual of the Planes notes that aside from the secundi, few are even aware of the existence of Primus. |
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Ayrik
Great Reader
Canada
7970 Posts |
Posted - 21 Jul 2011 : 01:59:29
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Modron group "structures" are sometimes active in Sigil and elsewhere across the planes (supplying the PCs with some work), although these groups seem to have their own inscrutably mathematical missions and apparently have little or no desire to bother recruiting followers. When they do employ non-modrons the terms of association are exhaustively defined in rigid contracts you would need a computer programmer, logician, philosopher, and lawyer to figure out. Modrons tend to be so rare outside of Mechanus and neighbouring planes that I find it doubtful many would ever look to the Forgotten Realms ... in fact, the chaos-tainted Primes would likely be as incomprehensible, contrary, and hostile to modron conceptions of the universe as the Far Realms are to natives of the Realms.
I would be unsurprised if our worlds were only known to modrons as little more than properly indexed footnotes in some crosslinked cosmic database with their equivalents of "harmless" and "mostly harmless" appended.
I suppose the modron mindset is so programmed that simply conceiving the notion of followers in non-Lawful places like the Realms (or really, almost the entire cosmos outside of Mechanus) is nearly impossible. Modrons capable of any degree of indepedent thought or action defying their norm (such as Nordom Whistleklik) are invariably contaminated by contact with non-Law (ie, Chaos) and have no lasting authority within modron groups. Perhaps Primus and his immediate subordinates within the modron hierarchy are capable of acting more like individuals, even deities, though it seems equally likely that they are impossibly constrained by the uncompromising requirements of maintaining eternally perfect order.
Slaadi on the other hand are encountered here and there throughout the Realms with surprising frequency. I daresay it often seems like slaads are encountered almost as often as fiends. Every now and then some powerful (or mutated) slaad leads the pack ... so I would speculate that it's quite probable for some of them to have cultivated followers in the Realms. I'm not saying it would necessarily last very long. And assuming the established Faerūnian deities do not interfere, of course. |
[/Ayrik] |
Edited by - Ayrik on 21 Jul 2011 02:24:38 |
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jordanz
Senior Scribe
553 Posts |
Posted - 21 Jul 2011 : 02:39:17
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quote:
Originally posted by Arik
Slaadi on the other hand are encountered here and there throughout the Realms with surprising frequency. I daresay it often seems like slaads are encountered almost as often as fiends. Every now and then some powerful (or mutated) slaad leads the pack ... so I would speculate that it's quite probable for some of them to have cultivated followers in the Realms. I'm not saying it would necessarily last very long. And assuming the established Faerūnian deities do not interfere, of course.
Agreed, I could easily see some human and or demihuman Barbarian tribes following a particularly powerful Slaadi Lord.... |
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Bladewind
Master of Realmslore
Netherlands
1280 Posts |
Posted - 21 Jul 2011 : 15:00:51
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Elves have summoned powerful slaad lords in desperation for defence. The twoheaded Slaad Lord Bazim-Gorag, the Firebringer, helped the struggling realm of Rilithar in the North when it was confronted by a large horde of orcs and trolls led by a troll warlord. {See page 42 in GHotR and Champions of Ruin}
The other slaad lords have each a particular chaotic goal they try to achieve or spread, so anyone that participates in an activity that aims for their particular flavour of madness will get their attention.
1) Ssendam is the Lord of Madness. She is the oldest of the Lords of Chaos, manifesting as a golden amoeba.
- I can see Derro following this crazy entity and summoning him occasionally for 'advice'
2) Ygorl is the Lord of Entropy. He manifests as a black slaad or as a winged skeleton carrying a scythe.
- Some crazy cultists like the Karanok family in Chessenta that promote or worship entropy will definately get some attention from Ygorl
3) Bazim-Gorag is the two-headed Lord of Fire.
- As I mentioned some desperate souls try to summon this fiery 'loose cannon' and try to point him in the right direction
4) Chourst is the Lord of Randomness, manifesting as a white slaad. He once invaded Mechanus.
- Gamblers and some dice gamers might try to ascertain wisdom from Chourst's words. Some might seek him for tactical knowledge of the plane of Mechanus
5) No one knows what Wartle is the lord of. He's banished anyway, last seen in Mount Celestia of all places.
- Totally unguided fools might revere this one
6) Rennbuu is the Lord of Colors, appearing as a rainbow-colored slaad with an enormous mane of hair.
- Bards and artist displeased with the meddling of the Sunite clergy could definately turn to Rennbuu to 'revolutionize' art |
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Creature Feature: Giant Spiders |
Edited by - Bladewind on 21 Jul 2011 15:03:27 |
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Bladewind
Master of Realmslore
Netherlands
1280 Posts |
Posted - 21 Jul 2011 : 16:52:13
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Of all the examples given in this thread I think Primus is the only one capable of granting divine spells. He is very self absorbed though, so he does so exclusively to his modron subordinates.
A realmsian planeswalker that has visited Mechanus or has seen one of the Great Modron Marches might have reason to start worshipping Primus. He could believe the exacting order Primus wants to create should be exported across the planes. Or psion with astral travel powers might have witnessed the device Primus is working on inside his cathedral (a ginormous needle like structure that's a perfect model for the multiverse). Most mortals that view it go partially insane, but plane savvy psions might have gained great respect for Primus in the Orrery's discovery.
Mechanus is called Nirvana by some sages, and so some believers in law and order might accidentaly give Primus worship indirectly. I think monks fit for this best. Monks ascend mortal forms when going epic, Nirvana fits as a concept for them and they also apply a certain mechanical order to the chaos of combat. The secundi modrons under Primus apear to mortals as monk-like metallic humans [think silver surfer] and share almost all of their abilities but are powerfull psionic clerics aswell. |
My campaign sketches
Druidic Groves
Creature Feature: Giant Spiders |
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MrHedgehog
Senior Scribe
688 Posts |
Posted - 21 Jul 2011 : 20:04:58
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| I personally don't think Slaadi or Modrons would have cults that they organized themselves. They are too alien, and have no motivation to do so. They don't seem to care what happens on prime worlds, don't need to harvest souls, etc. I also don't think people would necessarily be aware of them unless they were very knowledgeable planar scholars. |
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Ayrik
Great Reader
Canada
7970 Posts |
Posted - 21 Jul 2011 : 23:32:43
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| I disagree that Primus alone from all those named here could possess divine power, Bladewind. Mortals from the Realms could ascend into the exalted ranks of divinity in the Realms, or at least they could in previous D&D editions, with or without Ao. They certainly could do so in other D&D settings. Many are planars, half-planars, fiends, celestials, liches, whatever ... modrons aren't impossible and slaadi seem almost inevitable. Of course any such entities who do exist might remain entirely unknown within the Realms, having planar and worldly interests far far removed from Toril. |
[/Ayrik] |
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Bladewind
Master of Realmslore
Netherlands
1280 Posts |
Posted - 22 Jul 2011 : 00:36:09
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Hey, I didn't rule out any ascensions among the examples. I meant that, of the examples given, only Primus is 'currently' known to have divine power. I might be mistaken though in that the Slaad Lords are not able to grant divine spells; it certainly would be within the realm of possibility.
I think having a rogue modron ascending would make for a very interesting story! Usually Primus destroys any modron that behaves beyond the laws Primus has layed out. So modron advancing in levels/HD that develop skills beyond their function need to hide them from their fellow modrons.
Most rogue modron that develop 'abberant personalities' are deemed imperfect and are weeded out by their superiors. They'll get sentenced by the Hexton modrons that function as judges and are destroyed without remorse. Any indiviualistic modron that would want to advance their personal skills further would need to become very good lyers or need to leave Mechanus. Most do so with all the modrons they directly give orders to (which can be quite a lot if they are one of the 'higher caste' modron forms - a Secundus going rogue would be an outright disaster as it commands slighty less than a quarter of all modron forms on Mechanus).
Primus would definately be upset about such events and set in motion his backup plan for just these instances: sending droves of inevitables after the rogue modron to stop it before it could achieve divinity. He'll start out sending mainly Zelekhuts, the fugitive hunter inevitable, and end with Varakhuts, those that protect greater powers, as the rogue modron becomes increasing close to Primus' own power. It would need a rogue modron of considerable power to survive this whole scenario, as Primus is the one with acces to Mechanus lifesource for modrons. The energywell that absorbs all modrons and can create new ones is firmly fortified in Regulus, giving Primus acces to an unlimited supply of modrons and inevitables...
In any case there can be only one Primus! He'll eventually seek to challenge the 'viral' modron power. If he's destroyed it'll sent Mechanus into a temporary Chaos as a Secundus will immediately replace him. This new Primus will likely also try to stamp out the rogue divine modron untill order is restored in the Multiverse (in its mind anyway). Quite the epic set of events that'll likely have 'planar space and time' spinning out of contol for quite a while! |
My campaign sketches
Druidic Groves
Creature Feature: Giant Spiders |
Edited by - Bladewind on 22 Jul 2011 00:52:23 |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31701 Posts |
Posted - 22 Jul 2011 : 02:08:39
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quote:
Originally posted by Bladewind
Of all the examples given in this thread I think Primus is the only one capable of granting divine spells. He is very self absorbed though, so he does so exclusively to his modron subordinates.
From the web enhancement for 3e Manual of the Planes:-
quote:
Primus grants divine spells, domain powers, and domain spells to all the hierarchs.
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Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)
"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood
Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage |
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Slaadi and Modron Cults/ Worshippers
