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Dennis
Great Reader
9933 Posts |
 Posted - 18 Apr 2011 : 08:49:44
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The phaerimm's magic is useless against the antimagic of the beholders, as shown in the following quote [taken from The Siege]. But how do they remain in control of their beholder slaves? Is their mind control impervious to the beholders' antimagic?
quote:
Unable to use their own magic within the antimagic zones created by their beholder slaves, the phaerimm hung back.
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Every beginning has an end. |
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Sandro
Learned Scribe
New Zealand
266 Posts |
Posted - 18 Apr 2011 : 09:04:57
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This topic is very thankfully not what the title led me to be believe it would be.
I assume it has to do with the beholders not being able to place themselves within the anti-magic zone, or controlling them through some other (psionics? unlikely) method. |
"Gods, little fishes, and spells to turn the one to the other," Mordenkainen sighed. "It's started already..." |
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Dennis
Great Reader
9933 Posts |
Posted - 18 Apr 2011 : 09:48:35
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Perhaps. However, even if they can't place themselves within their own antimagic zones, the magic [or psionic power] that tied them to their masters would have been severed. Think of the mind control magic as a thread tying their minds to the phaerimm's, and their antimagic as the scissors. Either their scissors are not sharp enough, or the thread is too hard for the scissors to cut through. And I'm leaning towards the latter. But then again, that begs the question what exactly makes the thread granitic? Even if the pharimm employ clerical magic [which is very unlikely], such magic is still prey to the beholders' magic-negating zones.
***I'm curious what's that thing you believed the topic would be?
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Every beginning has an end. |
Edited by - Dennis on 18 Apr 2011 09:49:35 |
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Alisttair
Great Reader
Canada
3054 Posts |
Posted - 18 Apr 2011 : 11:55:20
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| I'm thinking Psionics. I'm about to start re-reading The Siege, so I might have some better insight then. |
Karsite Arcanar (Most Holy Servant of Karsus)
Anauria - Survivor State of Netheril as penned by me:
http://www.dmsguild.com/m/product/172023 |
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Bladewind
Master of Realmslore
Netherlands
1280 Posts |
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Dennis
Great Reader
9933 Posts |
Posted - 18 Apr 2011 : 15:31:13
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Kinda off topic, but in the same book, anyway:
Does the Evareskan mythal also protect against the illithids' mind blast? |
Every beginning has an end. |
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Ayrik
Great Reader
Canada
7969 Posts |
Posted - 18 Apr 2011 : 19:25:47
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A supernatural effect which doesn't follow rules of magic ... one which happens to also involve mental control ... obviously psionics.
I imagine that the beholder antimagic gaze is not automatic; they must keep their big eye closed most of the time, if simply to avoid de-levitating each other whenever they're grouped. So, if this antimagic is a voluntary action it's quite easy for the phaerimm to issue command paramaters specifying the power is not used on other controlled beholders.
Of course, it might just be that beholders are naturally immune to their species antimagic gaze, perhaps also their charm eyestalk powers. Otherwise, (LE) beholder society would probably always be a numbers game. |
[/Ayrik] |
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Halidan
Senior Scribe
USA
470 Posts |
Posted - 18 Apr 2011 : 21:32:45
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| In addition to what Arik mentioned IIRC, the beholdr's anti-magic field is a 90 degree angle off of the front eye. The phaerimm simple dominate one from behind, and the tell him to summon a few of his friends and then dominate them from behind as well. Once dominated, if the charm neeeds to be renewed, the pharrimm simply command their beholder slaves to shut their eyes and renew the domination. |
"Over the Mountains
Of the Moon
Down the Valley of the Shadow,
Ride, boldly ride,"
The shade replied,
"If you seek for Eldorado!"
Edgar Allen Poe - 1849 |
Edited by - Halidan on 18 Apr 2011 21:33:23 |
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althen artren
Senior Scribe
USA
780 Posts |
Posted - 18 Apr 2011 : 23:50:38
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I don't think that the mythal's powers have ever been
categorized like Myth Drannor and Myth Glaurach have. |
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Lord Karsus
Great Reader
USA
3737 Posts |
Posted - 19 Apr 2011 : 05:57:23
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quote:
Originally posted by Dennis
The phaerimm's magic is useless against the antimagic of the beholders, as shown in the following quote [taken from The Siege]. But how do they remain in control of their beholder slaves? Is their mind control impervious to the beholders' antimagic?
-Plot armor. |
(A Tri-Partite Arcanist Who Has Forgotten More Than Most Will Ever Know)
Elves of Faerūn
Vol I- The Elves of Faerūn
Vol. III- Spells of the Elves
Vol. VI- Mechanical Compendium |
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Lord Karsus
Great Reader
USA
3737 Posts |
Posted - 19 Apr 2011 : 06:07:36
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quote:
Originally posted by Dennis
Does the Evareskan mythal also protect against the illithids' mind blast?
-Things Evereska's mythal could do:
Governs the weather and physical conditions within the Evereskan vale.
Worked against blights and diseases
Defend the city with Meteor Swarm
-Since the mythal was almost destroyed and then re-worked with the Shadow Weave, who knows what the mythal can and cannot do anymore. |
(A Tri-Partite Arcanist Who Has Forgotten More Than Most Will Ever Know)
Elves of Faerūn
Vol I- The Elves of Faerūn
Vol. III- Spells of the Elves
Vol. VI- Mechanical Compendium |
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Dennis
Great Reader
9933 Posts |
Posted - 19 Apr 2011 : 06:16:30
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Psionics? I thought the phaerimm are purely arcane spellcasters, as stated in Monsters of Faerun. Or did I miss something?
---
Plot armor? Isn't that applied to Drizzt and to him alone?
quote:
Originally posted by Dagnirion
quote:
Originally posted by Dennis
Does the Evareskan mythal also protect against the illithids' mind blast?
-Things Evereska's mythal could do:
Governs the weather and physical conditions within the Evereskan vale.
Worked against blights and diseases
Defend the city with Meteor Swarm
-Since the mythal was almost destroyed and then re-worked with the Shadow Weave, who knows what the mythal can and cannot do anymore.
I was referring to the time when it was attacked by the phaerimm's army. If it's not invincible against the illithids's mind blasts, the phaerimm should have sent their illithid servants to attack the mythal's defenders, while the beholders worked their disintegration magic against the Evareskans' volleys of arrows. |
Every beginning has an end. |
Edited by - Dennis on 19 Apr 2011 07:26:59 |
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Quale
Master of Realmslore
1757 Posts |
Posted - 20 Apr 2011 : 20:17:18
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| Theoretically a mythal can grant effects like mind blank to protect the inhabitants, just not this one |
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Dennis
Great Reader
9933 Posts |
Posted - 20 Apr 2011 : 23:55:35
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So it's still susceptible to the illithids' mind blast? And Troy didn't use them because......it's rather convenient? |
Every beginning has an end. |
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Ayrik
Great Reader
Canada
7969 Posts |
Posted - 21 Apr 2011 : 05:06:48
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It could be that the phaerimm have such mastery of arcane power that they're able to circumvent or neutralize the beholder powers. Perhaps not every time, perhaps not all individuals, but often enough.
Phaerimm aren't described as possessing psionics in any of the monster entries, though they're very intelligent so it doesn't seem impossible. Then again, they're aberrations and they originate from "somewhere else" so normal rules don't have to apply.
Sneak up behind a beholder? lol, how? |
[/Ayrik] |
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Dennis
Great Reader
9933 Posts |
Posted - 21 Apr 2011 : 05:15:28
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Some of them might be so intelligent as to bypass the beholders' antimagic. But I'm more inclined to believe that they learned the art of psionics [maybe by eating a psionicist whole?], which they employed on their beholder slaves as their arcane magic was neutralized. |
Every beginning has an end. |
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Quale
Master of Realmslore
1757 Posts |
Posted - 21 Apr 2011 : 12:27:11
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quote:
Originally posted by Dennis
So it's still susceptible to the illithids' mind blast? And Troy didn't use them because......it's rather convenient?
yea, illithids and beholders in that book were almost cannon fodder
maybe it's some biological form of domination, with their stings, considering they're all aberrations |
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Dennis
Great Reader
9933 Posts |
Posted - 21 Apr 2011 : 12:47:51
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That's an interesting theory.
I asked Troy about this. No answer yet. |
Every beginning has an end. |
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Dennis
Great Reader
9933 Posts |
Posted - 22 Apr 2011 : 00:14:28
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Finally, an answer from Troy himself.
quote:
Dennis,
It's been over ten years since I wrote those books, so the truth is that I'm pretty fuzzy on the details. As I recall, however, my rationale was that their mind control was exerted through their telepathic powers, which were non-magical. (I don't want to say psionic, because as I recall, they weren't psionicists -- but I think I considered their telepathy quasi-psionic in origin.)
Hope that helps -- it's the best I can do after so long!
-- Troy
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Every beginning has an end. |
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Quale
Master of Realmslore
1757 Posts |
Posted - 22 Apr 2011 : 15:04:26
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well, if you look into Ooltul, as far as I remember, the beholders serve the Triumvirate there fearing their power, no charms needed. And a lot of them are turned into death tyrants to ease the control, also one of the phaerimm is an expert on the beholder physiology
maybe they can possess from other times like Lovecraft's Yithians |
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Kerryth Silver
Acolyte
8 Posts |
Posted - 22 Apr 2011 : 19:11:52
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Dood, beholders can't use their anti-magic cone on theyselves! 
quote:
Originally posted by Dennis
The phaerimm's magic is useless against the antimagic of the beholders, as shown in the following quote [taken from The Siege]. But how do they remain in control of their beholder slaves? Is their mind control impervious to the beholders' antimagic?
quote:
Unable to use their own magic within the antimagic zones created by their beholder slaves, the phaerimm hung back.
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Ayrik
Great Reader
Canada
7969 Posts |
Posted - 22 Apr 2011 : 21:06:25
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| Yeah, but can beholders use it on each other? |
[/Ayrik] |
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Dennis
Great Reader
9933 Posts |
Posted - 23 Apr 2011 : 03:00:44
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quote:
Originally posted by Kerryth Silver
Dood, beholders can't use their anti-magic cone on theyselves!
quote:
Originally posted by Dennis
The phaerimm's magic is useless against the antimagic of the beholders, as shown in the following quote [taken from The Siege]. But how do they remain in control of their beholder slaves? Is their mind control impervious to the beholders' antimagic?
quote:
Unable to use their own magic within the antimagic zones created by their beholder slaves, the phaerimm hung back.
As Arik noted. That's why Troy's explanation sort of makes sense. The phaerimm's telepathic power, which is quasi-psionics, makes it impossible (or extremely difficult) for the beholders to free themselves from their masters's hold, who must have sent a message like, "Dispel all magic around you except the one I put on you and on your brethen." |
Every beginning has an end. |
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Topic |
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How do the phaerimm do it?
