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Apex
Learned Scribe
USA
229 Posts |
 Posted - 17 Nov 2008 : 15:11:01
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Are the AD&D comics considered canon? I have 1-15 and they take place in Waterdeep.
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36779 Posts |
Posted - 17 Nov 2008 : 16:16:00
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Indeed!
quote:
Originally posted by JamesLowder
(snip)
The DC comics were part of continuity. At least they were at one time. We reviewed them inhouse at TSR as if they were.
Cheers,
Jim
Not only that, but a lot of the characters and events popped up in 2E sources, and some have even showed up in 3E stuff -- Dwalimar Omen from the FR comic was mentioned in the 3E Shining South, which also had the rattelyr, a monster that appeared in the AD&D comic (the "Everybody Wants to Rule the Realms" issue, I think it was #23). And Kyriani from the AD&D comic not only was statted out and listed as a Lord of Waterdeep in City of Splendors: Waterdeep, but we also saw her in Blackstaff and found out she became a Blackstaff in Blackstaff Tower. |
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MerrikCale
Senior Scribe
USA
947 Posts |
Posted - 18 Nov 2008 : 03:46:33
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the characters from the Forgotten Realms comics have made no further appearance true?
I suppose that comic is canon as well |
When hinges creak in doorless chambers and strange and frightening sounds echo through the halls, whenever candlelights flicker where the air is deathly still, that is the time when ghosts are present, practicing their terror with ghoulish delight. |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31701 Posts |
Posted - 18 Nov 2008 : 04:17:12
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From Steven Schend:-
"As the guy who used to be the liaison and approvals guy for TSR and the AD&D comic with Kim Yale (may she rest in peace) at DC, I can say unequivocally that the events and characters are all canonical.
Steven
who also led the charge to move the characters into the game material as well..."
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36779 Posts |
Posted - 18 Nov 2008 : 07:10:16
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quote:
Originally posted by The Sage
From Steven Schend:-
"As the guy who used to be the liaison and approvals guy for TSR and the AD&D comic with Kim Yale (may she rest in peace) at DC, I can say unequivocally that the events and characters are all canonical.
Steven
who also led the charge to move the characters into the game material as well..."
Ah, yes. He said that before I was making a point of formatting particular quotes for quick reference on my Linkies! page. I have now added this one, and I also notated the thread he said it in: Realmsian Comic Books  |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36779 Posts |
Posted - 18 Nov 2008 : 07:23:24
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quote:
Originally posted by MerrikCale
the characters from the Forgotten Realms comics have made no further appearance true?
I suppose that comic is canon as well
It is indeed canon.
They appeared in a short story in Dragon. There was an article on the Wizards site about the location of deities during the Time of Troubles; a couple of events from the FR comics were mentioned on that page (The Avatar Trilogy: The Gods Walk Toril). There were also mentions in other places, including Demihuman Deities and On Hallowed Ground (a Planescape book). And, of course, the reference in the 3E Shining South.
All of the main characters (save for Connor, from AD&D) of both titles were also statted up in Dragon.
And then there was Jasmine... She was originally introduced in the Triangles story arc of Forgotten Realms (around issue 14). At the end of the arc, she left to join the characters of the Spelljammer comic. She later returned to the Realms, in the novel Finder's Bane, and reappeared in Tymora's Luck.
Oh, and another reference to the AD&D comic: there was a bit character named Osco Salibuck. He was only around for about three pages of one issue, and on two of those pages, he was being disintegrated. His son appears in Blackstaff, and his great great grandson appears in Blackstaff Tower. Named for his ancestor, he even encounters a statue of the original Osco.
The FR comic got less love in non-comic canon, but it is still there. |
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Edited by - Wooly Rupert on 18 Nov 2008 07:23:57 |
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MerrikCale
Senior Scribe
USA
947 Posts |
Posted - 18 Nov 2008 : 16:39:36
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I completely forgot about Osco.
I need to bust out my collection for a reread |
When hinges creak in doorless chambers and strange and frightening sounds echo through the halls, whenever candlelights flicker where the air is deathly still, that is the time when ghosts are present, practicing their terror with ghoulish delight. |
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Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire
USA
15724 Posts |
Posted - 18 Nov 2008 : 19:49:35
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I am a huge D&D fan, and at the time I was a huge comic collector as well, and yet... I only bought two DC/D&D comics ever.
Go figure. 
I wasn't such a 'Realms Junkie' back then, but still... |
"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36779 Posts |
Posted - 18 Nov 2008 : 23:32:07
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quote:
Originally posted by Markustay
I am a huge D&D fan, and at the time I was a huge comic collector as well, and yet... I only bought two DC/D&D comics ever.
Go figure.
I wasn't such a 'Realms Junkie' back then, but still...
You can still find them at a fair price. I rebuilt my collection of the FR and AD&D comics for under $100. I also have to admit to getting lucky finding them so easily: I got them in 2 lots, and then had to track down 1 individual issue to have them all.
I've not replaced the Spelljammer or Dragginglance titles, and at this moment in time, I've no inclination to do so. |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31701 Posts |
Posted - 18 Nov 2008 : 23:38:25
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You can find most of the older comics at nobleknight.com. That's largely from where I purchased the issues I was missing from both my SPELLJAMMER and DRAGONLANCE collections. They're all at reasonable prices, for the most part.
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MerrikCale
Senior Scribe
USA
947 Posts |
Posted - 19 Nov 2008 : 03:21:36
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quote:
Originally posted by The Sage
You can find most of the older comics at nobleknight.com. That's largely from where I purchased the issues I was missing from both my SPELLJAMMER and DRAGONLANCE collections. They're all at reasonable prices, for the most part.
how was that spelljammer comic? |
When hinges creak in doorless chambers and strange and frightening sounds echo through the halls, whenever candlelights flicker where the air is deathly still, that is the time when ghosts are present, practicing their terror with ghoulish delight. |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31701 Posts |
Posted - 19 Nov 2008 : 04:38:59
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They're readable, and that's being honest. Really, there are parts of the SJ comics that I'm not entirely happy with, but they're about what you'd expect for AD&D comics published at the time. Overall, I've got them because they're SPELLJAMMER, but I've only read them twice since their original release. I've not felt the need to re-visit them for quite some time.
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36779 Posts |
Posted - 19 Nov 2008 : 06:27:42
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quote:
Originally posted by The Sage
They're readable, and that's being honest. Really, there are parts of the SJ comics that I'm not entirely happy with, but they're about what you'd expect for AD&D comics published at the time. Overall, I've got them because they're SPELLJAMMER, but I've only read them twice since their original release. I've not felt the need to re-visit them for quite some time.
They started off pretty good, then dropped off. Towards the end, we were getting back into some interesting territory, but the abrupt cancellation of all DC/TSR comics ended that.
Dragginglance also had some good story arcs, but suffered from one of the same symptoms the rest of the setting did: no one could go forward without Weis & Hickman, so they went sideways and backwards, and once into the future, to tell a story set in the past! They also couldn't decide for a while if they wanted to focus on Riva Silvercrown or Myrella. I preferred the latter, so they went with the former. 
And even though I really liked the AD&D and FR titles, there were a few weak spots, here and there (especially that horrid annual with the crossover!). Overall, the stories were quite good, and neither title had the flaws of the non-Realms ones. |
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Steven Schend
Forgotten Realms Designer & Author
USA
1707 Posts |
Posted - 19 Nov 2008 : 15:15:32
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quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
quote:
Originally posted by MerrikCale
the characters from the Forgotten Realms comics have made no further appearance true?
I suppose that comic is canon as well
It is indeed canon.
They appeared in a short story in Dragon. There was an article on the Wizards site about the location of deities during the Time of Troubles; a couple of events from the FR comics were mentioned on that page (The Avatar Trilogy: The Gods Walk Toril). There were also mentions in other places, including Demihuman Deities and On Hallowed Ground (a Planescape book). And, of course, the reference in the 3E Shining South.
All of the main characters (save for Connor, from AD&D) of both titles were also statted up in Dragon.
And then there was Jasmine... She was originally introduced in the Triangles story arc of Forgotten Realms (around issue 14). At the end of the arc, she left to join the characters of the Spelljammer comic. She later returned to the Realms, in the novel Finder's Bane, and reappeared in Tymora's Luck.
Oh, and another reference to the AD&D comic: there was a bit character named Osco Salibuck. He was only around for about three pages of one issue, and on two of those pages, he was being disintegrated. His son appears in Blackstaff, and his great great grandson appears in Blackstaff Tower. Named for his ancestor, he even encounters a statue of the original Osco.
The FR comic got less love in non-comic canon, but it is still there.
The only reason that the AD&D characters got more love in the game product than the FR characters was me. I didn't feel right using Jeff's characters, so I used the ones over which I did have some control and pseudo-ownership (since none of the creators were TSR staffers but freelancers).
And call me crazy, but I think I liked the AD&D comic's Time of Troubles storyline more than any other Godswar story, though what Jeff did in FR was a very close second. I just liked the Shar/Selune stuff in Waterdeep better than the Labelas god stuff.
Come to think of it, the comics probably have as many active appearances of Piergeiron as the rest of the canon, so for those who thought he didn't get enough play (or for those who just miss Khelben and don't mind his silver beard wedge being colored wrong), check out the comics.
Steven
www.steveneschend.com
Five worlds under production at all times! |
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Quale
Master of Realmslore
1757 Posts |
Posted - 19 Nov 2008 : 15:41:35
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| I only have the comic with Labelas, it's ridiculous |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36779 Posts |
Posted - 19 Nov 2008 : 15:43:39
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quote:
Originally posted by Steven Schend
And call me crazy, but I think I liked the AD&D comic's Time of Troubles storyline more than any other Godswar story, though what Jeff did in FR was a very close second. I just liked the Shar/Selune stuff in Waterdeep better than the Labelas god stuff.
The Shar/Selūne stuff was quite good -- it was one of my favorite story arcs, in fact. This story arc also went into the backstory for one of my Lords of Waterdeep. It seems quite reasonable to me to assume that some of Selūne's new converts would have been tweaked off when they found they were worshipping Shar, and taken steps to atone. I doubt that many would have followed Terielle's choice of becoming a priestess, but it's not an unreasonable thing to do. |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36779 Posts |
Posted - 19 Nov 2008 : 15:45:28
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quote:
Originally posted by Quale
I only have the comic with Labelas, it's ridiculous
He appeared in several issues... I didn't care for that storyline as much, but I did like it when he was trying to reconcile with Vartan later, and make good of the things he'd messed up. |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31701 Posts |
Posted - 19 Nov 2008 : 23:38:56
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quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
quote:
Originally posted by Steven Schend
And call me crazy, but I think I liked the AD&D comic's Time of Troubles storyline more than any other Godswar story, though what Jeff did in FR was a very close second. I just liked the Shar/Selune stuff in Waterdeep better than the Labelas god stuff.
The Shar/Selūne stuff was quite good -- it was one of my favorite story arcs, in fact.
Funnily enough, that particular story-arc was partly responsible for generating a lot of the initial interest I had in Selūne at the time. 'Twas also responsible for a great many Selūne-based themes and adventures that popped up in my FR campaigns at the time as well.  |
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wannabesuperman
Acolyte
20 Posts |
Posted - 20 Nov 2008 : 01:10:25
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My FLGS is also a comics shop and has a few of these issues in backstock. Most of them sell for a quarter.
When I read Blackstaff Tower, I knew that rascal Osco sounded familiar. |
"What's so funny about Truth, Justice, and The American Way?" --Clark Kent, Daily Planet. January 2001 |
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MerrikCale
Senior Scribe
USA
947 Posts |
Posted - 20 Nov 2008 : 03:53:51
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quote:
Originally posted by The Sage
They're readable, and that's being honest. Really, there are parts of the SJ comics that I'm not entirely happy with, but they're about what you'd expect for AD&D comics published at the time. Overall, I've got them because they're SPELLJAMMER, but I've only read them twice since their original release. I've not felt the need to re-visit them for quite some time.
ok. thanks |
When hinges creak in doorless chambers and strange and frightening sounds echo through the halls, whenever candlelights flicker where the air is deathly still, that is the time when ghosts are present, practicing their terror with ghoulish delight. |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36779 Posts |
Posted - 20 Nov 2008 : 05:58:02
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quote:
Originally posted by wannabesuperman
My FLGS is also a comics shop and has a few of these issues in backstock. Most of them sell for a quarter.
When I read Blackstaff Tower, I knew that rascal Osco sounded familiar.
While writing the book, Stephen had to stop and ask us which eye the eyepatch was on.
...Though, to be honest, I wish that some other authors paid that much attention to detail! |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31701 Posts |
Posted - 20 Nov 2008 : 06:48:39
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quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
quote:
Originally posted by wannabesuperman
My FLGS is also a comics shop and has a few of these issues in backstock. Most of them sell for a quarter.
When I read Blackstaff Tower, I knew that rascal Osco sounded familiar.
While writing the book, Stephen had to stop and ask us which eye the eyepatch was on.
...Though, to be honest, I wish that some other authors paid that much attention to detail!
Indeed.
Though, I must admit, Osco's inclusion in Blackstaff Tower was among one of my favorite parts of the book.
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36779 Posts |
Posted - 20 Nov 2008 : 14:32:34
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quote:
Originally posted by The Sage
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
quote:
Originally posted by wannabesuperman
My FLGS is also a comics shop and has a few of these issues in backstock. Most of them sell for a quarter.
When I read Blackstaff Tower, I knew that rascal Osco sounded familiar.
While writing the book, Stephen had to stop and ask us which eye the eyepatch was on.
...Though, to be honest, I wish that some other authors paid that much attention to detail!
Indeed.
Though, I must admit, Osco's inclusion in Blackstaff Tower was among one of my favorite parts of the book.
Not only did I really like that, I also really enjoyed Pikar being in Blackstaff. As soon as he was introduced I was commenting aloud on how cool that was for Osco's son to be in there.  |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31701 Posts |
Posted - 20 Nov 2008 : 15:15:53
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quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
Not only did I really like that, I also really enjoyed Pikar being in Blackstaff. As soon as he was introduced I was commenting aloud on how cool that was for Osco's son to be in there.
I forgot about poor ol' Pikar in Blackstaff. 
*The Sage delves into his book piles, hunting for his copy of Blackstaff* |
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Ardashir
Senior Scribe
USA
544 Posts |
Posted - 20 Nov 2008 : 18:35:31
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quote:
Originally posted by The Sage
You can find most of the older comics at nobleknight.com. That's largely from where I purchased the issues I was missing from both my SPELLJAMMER and DRAGONLANCE collections. They're all at reasonable prices, for the most part.
And I sold my collection off to them some time ago, so there should still be a good set*.
* -- I was weak. Forgive me. |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31701 Posts |
Posted - 20 Nov 2008 : 22:39:30
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quote:
Originally posted by Ardashir
quote:
Originally posted by The Sage
You can find most of the older comics at nobleknight.com. That's largely from where I purchased the issues I was missing from both my SPELLJAMMER and DRAGONLANCE collections. They're all at reasonable prices, for the most part.
And I sold my collection off to them some time ago, so there should still be a good set*.
* -- I was weak. Forgive me.
I'm not sure I could ever sell off any comics, regardless of whether I enjoyed them or not. I pride myself on my 13,000+ comic collection -- including all the good titles, the bad titles, and even the very ugly titles! |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36779 Posts |
Posted - 20 Nov 2008 : 23:05:38
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| I've got six or seven long boxes, and I've no desire to keep them. The comics I did want to keep (the DC/TSR stuff, and some other titles) are the ones that were destroyed in the fire! |
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AD&D Comics
