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Alaundo
Head Moderator
United Kingdom
5692 Posts |
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Ranak
Learned Scribe
USA
190 Posts |
 Posted - 15 May 2008 : 19:04:54
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The writing remained great throughout, the ending is like the beginning though, you might have to read everything twice to get you bearings on what exactly is going on. This is partially because there are two sets of actions being played out, some in Bustan's mind and some in the present and it makes for a challenging read.
The exact purpose and effect of the Word are never revealed, which is extremely irritating. Yes it is portal to the nine hells, yes you can sell your soul to Levistus, but what precisely does it do? The Magewarden falters at the last minute and the Word somehow puts out all the fires and kills the invaders, but it is still largely left a mystery.
I was glad to see the Durthan show her true colors, and sad to see Duras die. The complex relationship between the Hathran, Duras and Bustan plays out perfectly, but I was sad to see Duras die, choking out the bitter truth of Bustan's sister.
All together a bittersweet ending for a sad story.
quote:
Originally posted by Alaundo
Well met
This is a Book Club thread for The Shield of Weeping Ghosts (Book 3 of The Citadels), by James P. Davis. Please discuss the chapters 20 - 26 herein.
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Strife026
Acolyte
USA
11 Posts |
Posted - 21 May 2008 : 08:57:50
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I have so far been impressed with the writing in Citadels series so far, but this book is definitely the gem of the series so far. The author really did his research before writing this book and it shows throughout the entire novel. The reason i truly liked this book, and dont get me wrong the story is exceptional, was that the author put Rashemen into the pages of the book. The culture, unique monsters and type of character classes were all from Rashemen. Anyways, great job Mr. Davis.
Ranak, I think the Word is a type of magical weapon that uses the planar energy of Stygia itself as a weapon. I could be wrong, but that would explain the ice that is found all over the place, also some of the dialog when Bastun is in Stygia leads me to this conclusion as well. |
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Ranak
Learned Scribe
USA
190 Posts |
Posted - 21 May 2008 : 09:28:09
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I came to the same conclusion, it seems strongly implied that by accepting the power (unlike the magewarden) he gave up part of his soul or something for it. It is really hard to nail down.
But overall I agree with you, this is the cream of the Citadels crop. I also really enjoyed Bladesinger which was also dealt largely with Rashemen. I recommend highly if you are a fan of that setting.
quote:
Ranak, I think the Word is a type of magical weapon that uses the planar energy of Stygia itself as a weapon. I could be wrong, but that would explain the ice that is found all over the place, also some of the dialog when Bastun is in Stygia leads me to this conclusion as well.
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James P. Davis
Forgotten Realms Author
USA
244 Posts |
Posted - 21 May 2008 : 10:34:32
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Strife026 and Ranak:
First of all, thank you for your comments! I'm glad the story and the Rashemen culture came through like I intended. Of all the Realms' cultures, the Rashemi is by far my favorite (with Narfell a close second).
And you are quite correct regarding the nature of the Word, though what exactly is exchanged between the user and Levistus I left a bit mysterious, the planar energy of Stygia is indeed the primary weapon (not to mention eager devils anxious for a bit of 'playtime' in the mortal realm). I had originally intended to be more specific as to its purpose, but I really pushed the word-count on the manuscript and mysterious worked out pretty well in the end.
Cheers!
--James |
"Everybody is a book of blood; wherever we're opened, we're red."--Clive Barker
FR: RotD2:"Possessions"
Wizards:Bloodwalk
Citadels: The Shield of Weeping Ghosts
Wilds: The Restless Shore
Ed Greenwood Presents Waterdeep: Circle of Skulls (May 2010)
Book trailers: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jC-ska7ohVk
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZfvFdQ8bLp0 |
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The Red Walker
Great Reader
USA
3563 Posts |
Posted - 23 May 2008 : 22:58:12
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Loved this book, one of just a handfull that have left me satisfied with everything in it's ending.
Duras's death was well done, if a bit less than he deserved because the secret he kept from Bastun. Keeping the truthfrom his friend consumed Bastun and forced him to make choices that he would not have otherwise.
The hathran having to return to Rasheman without her "guardian" is a fitting punishment for her as well, and was well earned for her treatment of Bastun.
The durthan's fate, having exist in the shields version of "ground hog day" could only be better if the shield kept some part of the prince alive and he decided to kill her everyday for her part in his not getting the breath. Her theft of the scrolls and murder of Kefrass turned Bastun's people against him and set his path to exhile.
Bastun, I expected to die and was pleased that not only was I wrong, while changed in some ways we are unsure of, has came away with a measure of power and contentment. |
A little nonsense now and then, relished by the wisest men - Willy Wonka
"We need men who can dream of things that never were." -
John F. Kennedy, speech in Dublin, Ireland, June 28, 1963
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Edited by - The Red Walker on 23 May 2008 23:00:35 |
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James P. Davis
Forgotten Realms Author
USA
244 Posts |
Posted - 24 May 2008 : 09:43:57
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quote:
Loved this book, one of just a handfull that have left me satisfied with everything in it's ending
Many thanks for sharing your thoughts Red Walker, glad you enjoyed!
quote:
Duras's death was well done, if a bit less than he deserved because the secret he kept from Bastun. Keeping the truthfrom his friend consumed Bastun and forced him to make choices that he would not have otherwise.
A good point, but keep in mind that Bastun is the sacrificial sort. Had he known about Duras beforehand he might well have kept the secret himself in order to keep Duras out of trouble and free of what could have been (knowing the witches) a severe punishment. In the end though, Duras knew that Bastun's life and state of mind had been shaped by what he'd done and he considered the telling of his shame and the sacrifice of his own life (in true Rashemi fashion) a fitting and honorable price to pay.
quote:
Bastun, I expected to die and was pleased that not only was I wrong, while changed in some ways we are unsure of, has came away with a measure of power and contentment.
I will admit Bastun's fate was up in the air for a bit during the writing, but the mystery as to what actually happened was too hard to pass up. If an opening ever shows itself to expand on his story I will certainly take it.
And here I will humbly ask, if anyone feels inclined to do so, please share your opinion of the book at http://www.amazon.com/ as well. And that shall serve as my one shameless request for off-site reviews for the remainder of the book club.
Thanks again!
--James |
"Everybody is a book of blood; wherever we're opened, we're red."--Clive Barker
FR: RotD2:"Possessions"
Wizards:Bloodwalk
Citadels: The Shield of Weeping Ghosts
Wilds: The Restless Shore
Ed Greenwood Presents Waterdeep: Circle of Skulls (May 2010)
Book trailers: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jC-ska7ohVk
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZfvFdQ8bLp0 |
Edited by - James P. Davis on 26 May 2008 06:20:48 |
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dwarvenranger
Senior Scribe
USA
428 Posts |
Posted - 06 Jul 2008 : 04:11:05
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| An enjoyable story, thank you very much. It makes me want to run a game set in Rashemen. |
If I waited till I knew what I was doing, I'd never get anything done.
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Amraz one arm
Acolyte
Netherlands
42 Posts |
Posted - 07 Jul 2008 : 16:28:04
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OK loved the storyline. On the whole I dont find many of the novels very that captivating or very originally written. But this book, (which I found to be a nice blend of clive barker weirdness mixed with a good sauce of unapproachable east) was a true suprise to me. I know im addicted to reading these books. But this one, needed to be finished before I could lay it to rest. I'm looking forward to more work of this author in the realms.
I wonder where he got the whole idea of this city stuck horror & time.
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"You smell human to me." |
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The Red Walker
Great Reader
USA
3563 Posts |
Posted - 07 Jul 2008 : 18:24:29
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quote:
Originally posted by Amraz one arm
OK loved the storyline. On the whole I dont find many of the novels very that captivating or very originally written. But this book, (which I found to be a nice blend of clive barker weirdness mixed with a good sauce of unapproachable east) was a true suprise to me. I know im addicted to reading these books. But this one, needed to be finished before I could lay it to rest. I'm looking forward to more work of this author in the realms.
I wonder where he got the whole idea of this city stuck horror & time.
If you liked this one, You will love James's previous FR Novel Bloodwalk. It is one of my all time favorite novels.
City stuck in horror and time reminded me of the old Twilight Zone episode where the guy who loved books was the only survivor of the world ending, and the library survived as well. Unfortunetlry for him his is blind as a bat without his glasses......which promplty get broken!! What Horror!!
edit:Sp |
A little nonsense now and then, relished by the wisest men - Willy Wonka
"We need men who can dream of things that never were." -
John F. Kennedy, speech in Dublin, Ireland, June 28, 1963
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Edited by - The Red Walker on 07 Jul 2008 18:25:29 |
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Rinonalyrna Fathomlin
Great Reader
USA
7106 Posts |
Posted - 08 Jul 2008 : 22:45:46
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quote:
Originally posted by The Red Walker
City stuck in horror and time reminded me of the old Twilight Zone episode where the guy who loved books was the only survivor of the world ending, and the library survived as well. Unfortunetlry for him his is blind as a bat without his glasses......which promplty get broken!! What Horror!!
Yeah, that was a classic episode. |
"Instead of asking why we sleep, it might make sense to ask why we wake. Perchance we live to dream. From that perspective, the sea of troubles we navigate in the workaday world might be the price we pay for admission to another night in the world of dreams."
--Richard Greene (letter to Time) |
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James P. Davis
Forgotten Realms Author
USA
244 Posts |
Posted - 09 Jul 2008 : 06:20:34
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Thanks dwarvenranger and Amraz one arm, glad you enjoyed the story!
(and thanks Red Walker for the Bloodwalk plug )
The stuck in time/ repetition idea actually developed almost on its own during the first draft phase. It just fit well really, then I remembered the Lord Byron poem (quoted on the first page) and just had to include that first bit as it further helped me to develop the mood of the book.
As far as the Twilight Zone episode goes, that one show seems to be my own time-loop as no matter when I catch the show on TV, that is inevitably the episode being aired. It's a favorite no doubt, but a bit creepy, like it's waiting for me...
Best,
--James |
"Everybody is a book of blood; wherever we're opened, we're red."--Clive Barker
FR: RotD2:"Possessions"
Wizards:Bloodwalk
Citadels: The Shield of Weeping Ghosts
Wilds: The Restless Shore
Ed Greenwood Presents Waterdeep: Circle of Skulls (May 2010)
Book trailers: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jC-ska7ohVk
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZfvFdQ8bLp0 |
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The Red Walker
Great Reader
USA
3563 Posts |
Posted - 09 Jul 2008 : 14:35:40
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quote:
Originally posted by James P. Davis
Thanks dwarvenranger and Amraz one arm, glad you enjoyed the story!
(and thanks Red Walker for the Bloodwalk plug )
The stuck in time/ repetition idea actually developed almost on its own during the first draft phase. It just fit well really, then I remembered the Lord Byron poem (quoted on the first page) and just had to include that first bit as it further helped me to develop the mood of the book.
As far as the Twilight Zone episode goes, that one show seems to be my own time-loop as no matter when I catch the show on TV, that is inevitably the episode being aired. It's a favorite no doubt, but a bit creepy, like it's waiting for me...
Best,
--James
No problem James, I am usually a pretty laid back guy but that book was "Kick Ass"!! |
A little nonsense now and then, relished by the wisest men - Willy Wonka
"We need men who can dream of things that never were." -
John F. Kennedy, speech in Dublin, Ireland, June 28, 1963
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Xoriat
Acolyte
4 Posts |
Posted - 28 Aug 2008 : 18:01:50
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The last few chapters confused me...I still did not understand what purpose Bastun had with seeking the Breath and Word.
I didn't follow what the significance of the Breath was...nor did I understand the purpose of the ghost children.
Who was the Prince? That was not clear.
Why would the Durthan want the Word? Didn't she die during the last attack?
I guess the entire second half of the book was very confusing to me. I think one needs some extensive understanding of Rashemi culture to grasp what is going on.
Very frustrating. Not a book for newbie D&D fans. :( |
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James P. Davis
Forgotten Realms Author
USA
244 Posts |
Posted - 28 Aug 2008 : 23:09:25
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Sorry the ending didn't work out for you Xoriat, but thanks for giving the book a read! I'll try to address some of your concerns/questions here:
quote:
The last few chapters confused me...I still did not understand what purpose Bastun had with seeking the Breath and Word.
Once Bastun was aware of the danger that they might be discovered, he sought them out to protect them from misuse by the Nar and/or Anilya.
quote:
I didn't follow what the significance of the Breath was...nor did I understand the purpose of the ghost children.
The Breath actually completes the Word and activates its power, though Anilya misunderstood this relationship, thinking the Breath would merely open the black door and only acted like a key. The ghost children, used like a sorcerous Trojan Horse, were bound to the Shield by power unleashed by the Word, a power that began the cycle of one day repeating itself over and over.
quote:
Who was the Prince? That was not clear.
Prince Serevan, the youngest son of the first Nentyarch of Narfell, led the final (and somewhat victorious) attack on Shandaular. His story (and connection to the Shield) was mentioned first in the Prologue and then by name in the scene of the tower collapse, just before Bastun encounters the varrangoin (also in the scene just after the nighthaunts on the wall, Bastun explains to Thaena and Duras the story of Shandaular and Prince Serevan).
quote:
Why would the Durthan want the Word? Didn't she die during the last attack?
To the first question: Power, plain and simple. A contract/covenant with Levistus of Stygia in exchange for the power she could unleash using the Word, without a doubt a weapon that would be used first against the wychlaren...if Anilya were able to control that power.
To the second question: Answer on page 260.
quote:
I guess the entire second half of the book was very confusing to me. I think one needs some extensive understanding of Rashemi culture to grasp what is going on.
Sorry you were confused, but I can guarantee you won't find much about Rashemi culture (relevant info anyway) that isn't covered in the book. And I don't believe I used anything specific to D&D jargon, I even avoid using actual spell names when possible, preferring rather to describe the effect.
(However if you are interested in learning more about Rashemen, the sourcebook UNAPPROACHABLE EAST is a treasure-trove of info and lore-goodies.)
I hope these answers clear up some of your confusion, though I believe I could track down all the page numbers with the info, the bit regarding Anilya (page 260) was the only one that comprised an entire scene.
Again, thanks for giving the book a shot! I hope you'll give BLOODWALK a read, if you haven't already, and in May 2009, perhaps give RESTLESS SHORE a read as well.
Best,
--James |
"Everybody is a book of blood; wherever we're opened, we're red."--Clive Barker
FR: RotD2:"Possessions"
Wizards:Bloodwalk
Citadels: The Shield of Weeping Ghosts
Wilds: The Restless Shore
Ed Greenwood Presents Waterdeep: Circle of Skulls (May 2010)
Book trailers: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jC-ska7ohVk
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZfvFdQ8bLp0 |
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The Red Walker
Great Reader
USA
3563 Posts |
Posted - 02 Sep 2008 : 18:43:47
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| Since James plugged it, I want to heartliy endorse Bloodwalk. I myself loved both it and Shield of Weeping Ghosts, but I think their are two totally differently types of bbooks and you could very easily love Bloodwalk even if this one didn't work for you! |
A little nonsense now and then, relished by the wisest men - Willy Wonka
"We need men who can dream of things that never were." -
John F. Kennedy, speech in Dublin, Ireland, June 28, 1963
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Kyrene
Senior Scribe
South Africa
733 Posts |
Posted - 27 Oct 2008 : 06:58:52
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James,
I had a look recently at the Bloodwalk book club scrolls, and the "Questions for James P Davis" scroll, and I see Bloodwalk was the reason I actually finally de-lurked. My first post was in the "Questions" scroll.
On to this book: what kept me reading was the depth of the characters, how we got a glimpse into how they felt, thought and reacted to the exterior influence of their trip to and through the city and the Shield. I loved how we were given the 'filtered' versions of each ones 'truth' concerning and reacting to events.
I must admit I got a little lost after Bastun's trip to Stygia, so I will ask some questions to help clarify things for myself:- Did Prince Serevan also go to Stygia and thereby set in motion the original destruction of the city? The reason I ask is the colour of Bastun's eyes after his visit being the same as Prince Serevan's.
- Was Prince Serevan really finally destroyed, or is he also still doomed to relive the past, like all the other undead/ghosts?
- Is the little girl's ghost the only one left of the seven?
As for some general questions:- What caused the wheeps and bleakborn? Were they created by Prince Serevan to delay 'pursuit' or perhaps by Anilya?
- Why did the varrangoin 'nest' in the tower? Is that typical behaviour for them, or were they just remnants of the Nar attack frozen in place by the Breath's activation?
- What were the 'bone snake' and 'corpse wolf'?
- What was the cause/reason for the nighthaunts? Were they simply gargoyles, as part of the original protection mechanisms of the Shield, gone bad, or something else?
I guess that's it for now. I really enjoyed it, and it would be difficult for me to choose between it and Bloodwalk as me second most favourite Realms novel. |
Lost for words? Find them in the Glossary of Phrases, Sayings & Words of the Realms
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James P. Davis
Forgotten Realms Author
USA
244 Posts |
Posted - 28 Oct 2008 : 09:48:13
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quote:
Originally posted by Kyrene
James,
I had a look recently at the Bloodwalk book club scrolls, and the "Questions for James P Davis" scroll, and I see Bloodwalk was the reason I actually finally de-lurked. My first post was in the "Questions" scroll.
On to this book: what kept me reading was the depth of the characters, how we got a glimpse into how they felt, thought and reacted to the exterior influence of their trip to and through the city and the Shield. I loved how we were given the 'filtered' versions of each ones 'truth' concerning and reacting to events.
I must admit I got a little lost after Bastun's trip to Stygia, so I will ask some questions to help clarify things for myself:- Did Prince Serevan also go to Stygia and thereby set in motion the original destruction of the city? The reason I ask is the colour of Bastun's eyes after his visit being the same as Prince Serevan's.
- Was Prince Serevan really finally destroyed, or is he also still doomed to relive the past, like all the other undead/ghosts?
- Is the little girl's ghost the only one left of the seven?
As for some general questions:- What caused the wheeps and bleakborn? Were they created by Prince Serevan to delay 'pursuit' or perhaps by Anilya?
- Why did the varrangoin 'nest' in the tower? Is that typical behaviour for them, or were they just remnants of the Nar attack frozen in place by the Breath's activation?
- What were the 'bone snake' and 'corpse wolf'?
- What was the cause/reason for the nighthaunts? Were they simply gargoyles, as part of the original protection mechanisms of the Shield, gone bad, or something else?
I guess that's it for now. I really enjoyed it, and it would be difficult for me to choose between it and Bloodwalk as me second most favourite Realms novel.
Many thanks Kyrene! I'm honored that either of my books would rank highly on your list of favorites.
These characters stuck with me also, I got pretty deep into Bastun's head and even after writing The Restless Shore I keep looking back to Bastun and brainstorming what happens next...
As for your questions (in order)
--Serevan never actually made it to Stygia with the Breath, but he was the closest to its deadly surge of power when Athumrani failed to control the Word. From then on he was marked by that power and locked within the ghostly repetition of events. (more on that repetition below)
--I left Serevan's actual fate a bit open to interpretation, but I will say his physical form was utterly destroyed. If he still participates in the events, it may be only a shadow of his true spirit or soul, like an echo.
--The bleakborn were a product of Serevan's hunger. Since he was the original, all others created were victims slain by his heat-draining aura. The wheeps were a general battlefield undead, brought to ruin by the folly of their commander's ambition and brought to unlife by the hellish curse of Stygia's influence.
--The varrangoin were remnants of the original Nar attack. I pushed the word limit on this book a bit, so the varrangoins' initial appearance in the prologue was cut down for space consideration.
--The bone-snake was a Boneyard (from Libris Mortis page 89) and the corpse wolf was a Charnel Hound (from Monster Manual III page 26). While I liked the Boneyard and had fun with that, the Charnel Hound was a creature I'd wanted to use for a while. The visual of it "eating" had been running through my mind since I first saw the entry in MMIII.
--The nighthaunts were actually the only undead that didn't originate in the Nar attack or the Stygian wave of power. Being that they are drawn to places of evil power and corruption, Shandaular seemed the perfect little roost for them to hang their horns. 
I hope that helps! And thanks again!
Best,
--James |
"Everybody is a book of blood; wherever we're opened, we're red."--Clive Barker
FR: RotD2:"Possessions"
Wizards:Bloodwalk
Citadels: The Shield of Weeping Ghosts
Wilds: The Restless Shore
Ed Greenwood Presents Waterdeep: Circle of Skulls (May 2010)
Book trailers: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jC-ska7ohVk
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZfvFdQ8bLp0 |
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Lady Fellshot
Senior Scribe
USA
379 Posts |
Posted - 07 Feb 2009 : 18:10:57
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And all the masks come crumbling down...
I do have a couple of criticisms to levy.
I would have liked a little bit of expansion of Syrolf's character, since he does do something of an about face in the last few chapters. Granted, I approve of the result but I felt that a bit more character depth for him would have helped it along a good deal. I mean, Wow, he got more interesting in those last few chapters and a bit more on him before the eleventh hour would have been great. 
Along the same lines, something told from Duras's side of the story and some expansion on his side of the Duras-Thaena-Bastun dramatic triangle would have been awesome. There was a lot for both Bastun and Thaena but not so much for him. Poor guy. I can't decide if he should have told Bastun about earlier or not. 
I can't say that Anilya's actions were unexpected, but I thought they were well written. It was such a nice place to stow her too. 
Bastun is by far, still my favorite character. I hope he shows up in subsequent books. I thought his last little section was excellent. Not depressed at the apparent transformation, but wary of the new changes to himself and he has a little ghost to help him. How unexpectedly cute! I loved it ^_^ That she is reacting to him in a more positive way than Serevan is both interesting and heartening.
Thank you for a good read. |
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James P. Davis
Forgotten Realms Author
USA
244 Posts |
Posted - 10 Feb 2009 : 21:25:54
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I'm glad you liked it Lady Fellshot, thanks for hanging out here through the read!
I must say that there were plans to include some of what you mentioned, I probably could have made this into two books, but during editing I always chose on the side of Bastun. I'd like to see him come back sometime (possibly with his ghostly new friends?), we'll see how that works out with the powers-that-be .
I can definitely imagine Bastun on the road, searching for answers, witnessing the Spellplague, and ending up in...well, I'll leave some of his story to the imagination.
Best,
--James |
"Everybody is a book of blood; wherever we're opened, we're red."--Clive Barker
FR: RotD2:"Possessions"
Wizards:Bloodwalk
Citadels: The Shield of Weeping Ghosts
Wilds: The Restless Shore
Ed Greenwood Presents Waterdeep: Circle of Skulls (May 2010)
Book trailers: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jC-ska7ohVk
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZfvFdQ8bLp0 |
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Lady Fellshot
Senior Scribe
USA
379 Posts |
Posted - 11 Feb 2009 : 06:38:58
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*Sigh* I figured there had to have been some sort of length limitations set, because it really seemed like there should have been something there to fill in the gaps :/
I'd like to see Bastun come back as well... maybe something in the Realms of the Dead anthology I keep waiting on? |
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The Red Walker
Great Reader
USA
3563 Posts |
Posted - 11 Feb 2009 : 15:26:01
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quote:
Originally posted by Lady Fellshot
*Sigh* I figured there had to have been some sort of length limitations set, because it really seemed like there should have been something there to fill in the gaps :/
I'd like to see Bastun come back as well... maybe something in the Realms of the Dead anthology I keep waiting on?
It would be great to see James have a story in there. |
A little nonsense now and then, relished by the wisest men - Willy Wonka
"We need men who can dream of things that never were." -
John F. Kennedy, speech in Dublin, Ireland, June 28, 1963
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James P. Davis
Forgotten Realms Author
USA
244 Posts |
Posted - 15 Feb 2009 : 03:51:35
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| Well...(checking e-mail again...nope) no call for a Realms of the Dead story yet, but if it ever happens to come I shall be ready! |
"Everybody is a book of blood; wherever we're opened, we're red."--Clive Barker
FR: RotD2:"Possessions"
Wizards:Bloodwalk
Citadels: The Shield of Weeping Ghosts
Wilds: The Restless Shore
Ed Greenwood Presents Waterdeep: Circle of Skulls (May 2010)
Book trailers: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jC-ska7ohVk
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZfvFdQ8bLp0 |
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alarion
Acolyte
8 Posts |
Posted - 22 Apr 2009 : 05:00:56
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It may be a while since the Shield of Weeping Ghosts was published, but only now I could buy and read this book.
So it was an intriguing novel, with some deep characters that I really enjoy (Bastun, Thaena, Duras, Syrof and the best of them all Anylia!) and a nice style of writing from James.
I will try to write about the beginning of the book forward in this only thread, as I don´t think people will check the other topics about the others chapters of this novel if i write this comments there.
- I really enjoy the Prologue. The children and the chain worked very good to me. The tragedy of the fall of the city in this scene was very well done and captured the feeling of torment and dispair. The leader of Narfell troops with only his blue eyes was a very good link to the upcoming events.
I just wonder how the children were captured since one of them (the smallest one) was Athumrani daughter. The city only fell in this attack and probably they would be safe inside the walls or even already transported to the South like most of the inhabitants of Shaundalar. I think James could tell more about the previews relationship between the MageWarden and Serevan and their deal to elucidate this issue.
- The passage of the felucca in the waters of the Lake of Tears and the introduction of the main characters was a good one. The relationship of Bastun, Thaena and Duras was well pictured with lots of intrigues and mysteries to unfold. And the attack of the rusalka was very nice, since the fang was unprepared to deal with it and after that they blame the vremyonni just because he is an exile.
By the way, in all the realmslore about Rashemen that I´ve already read I don´t recall anything about a vremyonni become an exile after being initiated in the mysteries of The Old Ones. In the Unapproachable East is said that when the boys reach the adulthood they must choose or leave Rashemen under geas to never reveal their secrets. Bastun is already a vremyonni (with more than 20 years) and so how could he be permitted to leave the land in the first place? He knows lots of things about his land and is already a middle-rank mage. In the FRCS in the Plots and Rumors section about Rashemen it is said that the Wychlaran would never permit a vremyonni to leave, instead he would be killed.
So could you, James, talk about this issue just to take it of my mind? I just want to make sure about it.
- I really like to see the details of the culture of Rashemen being described in the novel, like the manners of the Ice Wolf fang and the connection of the Rashemi and their land by simply take some soil with them in pouches to offer to the spirits of Shaundalar. This was a very good idea, James!
- The atmosphere of the City with the moans and cries makes Shaundalar alive. Nice work here!
- I also appreciate the Firedawn Cycle that goes through the entire book. And with each time more information revealed. They have the key to the mystery of the city for generations and the Rashemi didn´t realize that. Or some did. This was a very good stuff in the novel!
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I still have lots of things to talk about, but I will stop here just to not make this thread a huge one! I will come back soon ;-) |
"What we do in life echoes in eternity" - Maximus Decimus Meridius |
Edited by - alarion on 22 Apr 2009 05:03:49 |
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James P. Davis
Forgotten Realms Author
USA
244 Posts |
Posted - 22 Apr 2009 : 06:54:25
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Glad you liked it alarion! Long as it's been since I wrote the book, these characters are still quite alive in my brain, one or two may escape if they're lucky...:::ahem:::...but I'll not tempt fate too much by speculating further on that subject. Fingers crossed, but breath not held (no pun intended). Anyway...
quote:
I just wonder how the children were captured since one of them (the smallest one) was Athumrani daughter. The city only fell in this attack and probably they would be safe inside the walls or even already transported to the South like most of the inhabitants of Shaundalar. I think James could tell more about the previews relationship between the MageWarden and Serevan and their deal to elucidate this issue.
This tale may yet see the light of day sometime, but it does already exist. I'll contact the powers-that-be and get the latest. If there's any news to be told, I'll post it here first.
quote:
In the FRCS in the Plots and Rumors section about Rashemen it is said that the Wychlaran would never permit a vremyonni to leave, instead he would be killed.
Indeed true, my friend, and fortunately that detail doesn't interfere too much with the tale, but unfortunately I neglected to include a sentence or two (or maybe they got edited away? either way, my bad ) in Chapter Five when Bastun asks Thaena if he is to be executed. She answers:
"The othlor have not passed any sentence upon you"
And while this is true, there is an unspoken "yet" at the end of that sentence hanging over Bastun's head. The intention of executing any vremyonni that wished to leave was certainly in my notes, but since I knew that Bastun would never receive a formal hearing (or execution) within the Shield it was a minor detail that slipped by...
...and as a stickler for lore-continuity myself, I know how a literary splinter like that can hang around well after a book is finished, heh! It could have been that perhaps Bastun was doomed to execution, taken away from Rashemen (and the vremyonni) in a bid to obscure his ultimate fate from other vremyonni with similar thoughts of exile in their heads (the witches might well want to maintain some internal peace with Thay breathing down their necks all the time), but circumstance and misadventure intervened, delaying his fate and conveniently (and gruesomely) removing those whose task it was to carry it out. I suppose if blame is to be laid upon anyone for Bastun's survival then Thaena may come under some harsh scrutiny with her superiors...
...but I wouldn't be surprised if Thaena let a detail or two slip her mind as well.
I hope that helps, I'm having a similar issue with a popular television show lately and if the detail I'm waiting for gets forgotten I may just go a bit mad (grrr). But I'm always lurking round the boards, usually late at night/morning, so drop me a question anytime!
(and I'll be checking on that other untold story concerning a certain group of unfortunate children)
Best,
--James |
"Everybody is a book of blood; wherever we're opened, we're red."--Clive Barker
FR: RotD2:"Possessions"
Wizards:Bloodwalk
Citadels: The Shield of Weeping Ghosts
Wilds: The Restless Shore
Ed Greenwood Presents Waterdeep: Circle of Skulls (May 2010)
Book trailers: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jC-ska7ohVk
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZfvFdQ8bLp0 |
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alarion
Acolyte
8 Posts |
Posted - 24 Apr 2009 : 03:49:41
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Thanks for your fast reply, James!
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This tale may yet see the light of day sometime, but it does already exist. I'll contact the powers-that-be and get the latest. If there's any news to be told, I'll post it here first.
I just hope that these "powers" don't take so much time to decide! I'm eager to know this story!
quote:
fortunately that detail doesn't interfere too much with the tale
quote:
...and as a stickler for lore-continuity myself, I know how a literary splinter like that can hang around well after a book is finished, heh!
You´re right, it doesn’t interfere much, but as you said it’s just that I’m a little stickler. In fact, I bought this novel because I read anything about the characters to be from Rashemen. I’m very fond of this place and their surroundings and the fact that the main character is a vremionni and an exile intrigued me. But I really appreciate your comment that probably he would be executed if not for the events in the book.
I feel alright now, thanks for that ;-)
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I got a point now concerning the fang lead by Thaena.
After they finally arrived at the Shield and found out the fate of the Hathran and her berserkers their mission wasn’t finished? I mean, Thaena’s task was to deliver the vremionni to the Hathran in the Shield, but since she couldn’t do that she should go back to Rashemen to tell what happened and get help or send some message to her superiors in Urling, shoudn’t she?
My point is this: what was her motivation to continue alongside a Durthan, an exile and with lots of enemies inside the Shield that were presumably stronger than her (after all, they killed a Hathran that is a high rank than her, and at this point she doesn’t know that Anylia could be involved with the Creel) ?
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I will come back later with more issues. I hope you don't mind. See ya. |
"What we do in life echoes in eternity" - Maximus Decimus Meridius |
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Lady Fellshot
Senior Scribe
USA
379 Posts |
Posted - 24 Apr 2009 : 04:41:00
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quote:
Originally posted by alarion
I got a point now concerning the fang lead by Thaena.
After they finally arrived at the Shield and found out the fate of the Hathran and her berserkers their mission wasn’t finished? I mean, Thaena’s task was to deliver the vremionni to the Hathran in the Shield, but since she couldn’t do that she should go back to Rashemen to tell what happened and get help or send some message to her superiors in Urling, shoudn’t she?
My point is this: what was her motivation to continue alongside a Durthan, an exile and with lots of enemies inside the Shield that were presumably stronger than her (after all, they killed a Hathran that is a high rank than her, and at this point she doesn’t know that Anylia could be involved with the Creel) ?
My read of Thaena was that she was curious about what happened for the most part. Also, submitting a full report to her superiors saying that she had checked the area out and made note of this and that doesn't seem entirely out of character for her.
Just my opinion |
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James P. Davis
Forgotten Realms Author
USA
244 Posts |
Posted - 24 Apr 2009 : 06:12:45
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quote:
Originally posted by Lady Fellshot
quote:
Originally posted by alarion
I got a point now concerning the fang lead by Thaena.
After they finally arrived at the Shield and found out the fate of the Hathran and her berserkers their mission wasn’t finished? I mean, Thaena’s task was to deliver the vremionni to the Hathran in the Shield, but since she couldn’t do that she should go back to Rashemen to tell what happened and get help or send some message to her superiors in Urling, shoudn’t she?
My point is this: what was her motivation to continue alongside a Durthan, an exile and with lots of enemies inside the Shield that were presumably stronger than her (after all, they killed a Hathran that is a high rank than her, and at this point she doesn’t know that Anylia could be involved with the Creel) ?
My read of Thaena was that she was curious about what happened for the most part. Also, submitting a full report to her superiors saying that she had checked the area out and made note of this and that doesn't seem entirely out of character for her.
Just my opinion
This is about it alarion (thanks Lady Fellshot!), but I would also add that with such a brazen attack on a Rashemi outpost, the berserkers might take issue with turning their backs on an enemy (or any enemy for that matter). Thaena knew this (and she's got a bit of that berserker/barbarian spirit herself). She's ambitious, so a full report on what occurred plus a tale of their victory over a long-battled enemy like the Nar (and especially the hostile Creel tribe) would give her quite a few brownie points with the witches (and on top of everything else she was hoping to put a durthan body on the pile of dead for bonus points).
Her ambition drew her in like a moth to a flame, though she was quite unprepared for what they truly found. She had the brute force and strict law of Rashemen in her court, but luckily she had Bastun along as well to deal with the finer points that a wychlaren might miss while trying to crush an intruder.
Thanks for the question! I'll look forward to fielding more queries if you have them!
quote:
This tale may yet see the light of day sometime, but it does already exist. I'll contact the powers-that-be and get the latest. If there's any news to be told, I'll post it here first.
I just hope that these "powers" don't take so much time to decide! I'm eager to know this story!
Soon, but keep an eye on the WotC site's book page, sometime in May. Should see some new beasties from THE RESTLESS SHORE (with sketches by yours truly) and a haunted little tale of seven unfortunate children (including a fun easter egg from BLOODWALK concerning a certain Nar wizard from days of old...) .
Best,
--James |
"Everybody is a book of blood; wherever we're opened, we're red."--Clive Barker
FR: RotD2:"Possessions"
Wizards:Bloodwalk
Citadels: The Shield of Weeping Ghosts
Wilds: The Restless Shore
Ed Greenwood Presents Waterdeep: Circle of Skulls (May 2010)
Book trailers: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jC-ska7ohVk
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZfvFdQ8bLp0 |
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alarion
Acolyte
8 Posts |
Posted - 25 Apr 2009 : 20:28:21
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quote:
This is about it alarion (thanks Lady Fellshot!), but I would also add that with such a brazen attack on a Rashemi outpost, the berserkers might take issue with turning their backs on an enemy (or any enemy for that matter). Thaena knew this (and she's got a bit of that berserker/barbarian spirit herself). She's ambitious, so a full report on what occurred plus a tale of their victory over a long-battled enemy like the Nar (and especially the hostile Creel tribe) would give her quite a few brownie points with the witches (and on top of everything else she was hoping to put a durthan body on the pile of dead for bonus points).
Fair enough. Although it´d been a little imprudence of her. But that´s ok, I can agree that she is ambitions and stubborn.
quote:
Soon, but keep an eye on the WotC site's book page, sometime in May. Should see some new beasties from THE RESTLESS SHORE (with sketches by yours truly) and a haunted little tale of seven unfortunate children (including a fun easter egg from BLOODWALK concerning a certain Nar wizard from days of old...)
I´ll check then the wizards´ site next week. I´m really looking forward these children. By the way, Restless Shore is a 4th edition, isn´t? That´s a pity...
So, Bloodwalk is a tale about Narfell Empire? I read in amazon that it was about two mages, one of them a bloodmage and the other a nar. Can you say a bit of it? If it´s about Narfell I´m interesting about it. Thanks.
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Let´s go back to The Shield of Weeping Ghosts...
Anylia. I´m really fond of her! I´d say that she is the masterpiece of the novel due to her characterization. She is ambiguous and one can´t be sure about what she is thinking. Anilya is really as a durthan might be: infamous, attractive, clever, dissimulate, eager for power and full of surprises! You made a terrific job here, James!!!
On thing that a realized when I was reading the novel is that the masks of the durthan and the wychlaran are really different from one another?
And second, are the wychlaran obliged to wear their masks even out of Rashemen? My point is that by doing this they show themselves to any enemies they might encounter like a Red Wizard for instance (or the case that Thaena finds Anilya and know that she is an enemy). I understand that the mask represents the power, the status, and the leadership of the wychlaran and they are supposed to use it all the time. But it makes them vulnerable too. What are your thoughts about that?
I also enjoyed Bastun, Thaena and Duras. Their previews relationship was very well done, and the fact that each one carries some mystery adds a lot to the tale.
The self penitent Bastun was a good character, but I must say that I was just a bit disappointed by the fact that he could remember the entire map of the Shield, without even had been there before! I was curious about his axeplay, either. He definitely got one or more levels of barbarian, but he was too good to be true! While confronting the Nar berserkers in the streets of Shaundalar, Bastun could only defeated them because they were easy targets (let´s put in this way), however Ohriman was a tough one and probably it would be different. When Syrof and Ohriman tested one another one could see that the tiefling was just playing. He was enjoying to make fun of Syrof and anytime he wants he could simply defeat the big one berserker. But when Bastun and Ohriman fight the vremyonni managed to stand up. Bastun also defeated Sevan Crell with his axe! And the prince killed Duras, who was the leader of the fang and the stronger berserker! I´m just saying that I think Bastun was overpowered in both arcane magic and swordplay, after all he could kill the two most powerful enemies.
That´s all for today. See you around. |
"What we do in life echoes in eternity" - Maximus Decimus Meridius |
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James P. Davis
Forgotten Realms Author
USA
244 Posts |
Posted - 25 Apr 2009 : 23:18:51
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quote:
So, Bloodwalk is a tale about Narfell Empire? I read in amazon that it was about two mages, one of them a bloodmage and the other a nar. Can you say a bit of it? If it´s about Narfell I´m interesting about it. Thanks.
Actually it takes place in the Border Kingdoms, but the primary antagonists originate from Narfell (a cult off-shoot of the Creel tribe). As for the connection with ancient Narfell, I'm afraid NDA keeps me quiet until the new tale is released.
quote:
And second, are the wychlaran obliged to wear their masks even out of Rashemen? My point is that by doing this they show themselves to any enemies they might encounter like a Red Wizard for instance (or the case that Thaena finds Anilya and know that she is an enemy). I understand that the mask represents the power, the status, and the leadership of the wychlaran and they are supposed to use it all the time. But it makes them vulnerable too. What are your thoughts about that?
My take on it is that the wychlaren always wear the mask in the presence of one another and especially the Rashemi people. I suppose if a hathran were to venture beyond Rashemen solo, she could take off the mask whenever she wished. Or perhaps if she is among the Rashemi unmasked, her true identity as a hathran would remain secret and she would have no authority until she donned the mask again.
quote:
He definitely got one or more levels of barbarian, but he was too good to be true! While confronting the Nar berserkers in the streets of Shaundalar, Bastun could only defeated them because they were easy targets (let´s put in this way), however Ohriman was a tough one and probably it would be different. When Syrof and Ohriman tested one another one could see that the tiefling was just playing. He was enjoying to make fun of Syrof and anytime he wants he could simply defeat the big one berserker. But when Bastun and Ohriman fight the vremyonni managed to stand up. Bastun also defeated Sevan Crell with his axe! And the prince killed Duras, who was the leader of the fang and the stronger berserker! I´m just saying that I think Bastun was overpowered in both arcane magic and swordplay, after all he could kill the two most powerful enemies.
Well keep in mind Bastun has the magic as well. Toe to toe with Ohriman with no spells and Bastun might have been toast, heh! (And I think if Syrolf faced Ohriman, there'd be two bodies on the ground afterward, but Syrolf would live a bit longer than Ohriman, but not much). The same goes with Serevan and Bastun, magic plus the fact that Bastun was wielding the Breath, recently infused with the leached power of the Word. He didn't get to keep that power, but it held long enough to defeat the doomed prince (though it did leave its mysterious mark upon him, mwahaha!).
And to be sure Bastun was quite the powerful magic-user, technically a Rage Mage, giving him a distinct advantage when fighting and slinging spells simultaneously. He qualified as one of the youngest vremyonni ever, so the levels (in game terms) floating around in this book were pretty high (I prefer high-level characters usually, as long they aren't invincible and take just as much as they dish out).
quote:
I´ll check then the wizards´ site next week. I´m really looking forward these children. By the way, Restless Shore is a 4th edition, isn´t? That´s a pity...
Well, I've seen that some people aren't too keen on 4th edition and to a degree I understand the resistance to big changes in the Realms, but the books themselves are wonderful. Fun to write, fun to read, with that same Realms spirit that has made the setting great since the beginning. And those beginnings aren't forgotten, all that history still plays a part as it always has. I approach 4th edition with a novel idea the same way I took on 3rd edition. So, I must encourage everyone to give it a shot, see what happens, and likely be pleasantly surprised at what they find.
Best,
--James |
"Everybody is a book of blood; wherever we're opened, we're red."--Clive Barker
FR: RotD2:"Possessions"
Wizards:Bloodwalk
Citadels: The Shield of Weeping Ghosts
Wilds: The Restless Shore
Ed Greenwood Presents Waterdeep: Circle of Skulls (May 2010)
Book trailers: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jC-ska7ohVk
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZfvFdQ8bLp0 |
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Alisttair
Great Reader
Canada
3054 Posts |
Posted - 27 Apr 2009 : 14:36:55
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This book was excellent. I was fortunate to be able to have time to deddicate to reading this novel within a week's span (as opposed to the long time it took to read my last one). My mind was clear enough to grasp the story and the characters (didn't hurt that there were some more familiar elements within though ).
Anyways, it was a great read that I thoroughly enjoyed and I look forward to the next book by Mr.Davis (and my eventual re-read of Bloodwalker - probably even this one as well) |
Karsite Arcanar (Most Holy Servant of Karsus)
Anauria - Survivor State of Netheril as penned by me:
http://www.dmsguild.com/m/product/172023 |
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The Shield of Weeping Ghosts: Chapters 20 - 26
