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Originally posted by Rinonalyrna Fathomlin

Larloch doesn't have Silverfire, that's correct. This is addressed in the story "Tears So White" in Realms of the Elves.

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Originally posted by Firestorm

Larloch has been mentioned in a novel or short story?

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Can you elaborate on specifics?

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Originally posted by Rinonalyrna Fathomlin

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Originally posted by Firestorm

Larloch has been mentioned in a novel or short story?

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Yes, in the story I just mentioned.

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Can you elaborate on specifics?

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With all due respect, I'd rather not try to do that, if only because it's been a while since I read that story (and Realms of the Elves should still be easy to obtain). However, the part that sticks out in my mind is how badly Larloch would like a "taste" of Silverfire. If he were a Chosen of Mystra, I doubt he would have that problem.

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Originally posted by Firestorm

Bah. No book store around here has realms of the elves, and the Chapters says its not on their ordering lists:(

Can anyone give me a breakdown on what happened regarding Larloch?

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Originally posted by Dagnirion

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Originally posted by Firestorm

Bah. No book store around here has realms of the elves, and the Chapters says its not on their ordering lists:(

Can anyone give me a breakdown on what happened regarding Larloch?

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-Amazon.com is your friend.

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Originally posted by Firestorm

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Originally posted by Rinonalyrna Fathomlin

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Originally posted by Firestorm

Larloch has been mentioned in a novel or short story?

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Yes, in the story I just mentioned.

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Can you elaborate on specifics?

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With all due respect, I'd rather not try to do that, if only because it's been a while since I read that story (and Realms of the Elves should still be easy to obtain). However, the part that sticks out in my mind is how badly Larloch would like a "taste" of Silverfire. If he were a Chosen of Mystra, I doubt he would have that problem.

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Bah. No book store around here has realms of the elves, and the Chapters says its not on their ordering lists:(

Can anyone give me a breakdown on what happened regarding Larloch?

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Originally posted by The Sage

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Originally posted by Firestorm

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Originally posted by Rinonalyrna Fathomlin

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Originally posted by Firestorm

Larloch has been mentioned in a novel or short story?

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Yes, in the story I just mentioned.

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Can you elaborate on specifics?

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With all due respect, I'd rather not try to do that, if only because it's been a while since I read that story (and Realms of the Elves should still be easy to obtain). However, the part that sticks out in my mind is how badly Larloch would like a "taste" of Silverfire. If he were a Chosen of Mystra, I doubt he would have that problem.

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Bah. No book store around here has realms of the elves, and the Chapters says its not on their ordering lists:(

Can anyone give me a breakdown on what happened regarding Larloch?

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I think it would be best for you to just purchase the book itself. Aside from the particular tale being discussed here, there are others included in the book that are well worth the read as well.

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Originally posted by HawkinstheDM

Or Amazon.ca seeing as he is in Canada.

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Originally posted by Wooly Rupert

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Originally posted by Sailusj


So Waukeen was foolish enough to "shed" her divinity just to get out ot the realms and try to get home? didnt she think Ao was powerful and wise enough to expect sumthing of that nature and knew how to prevent it? Or at least she should have known since HE took their power only he could give it back? Sounds kinda fishy to me.

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Like I said, the deities were desparate and humiliated. It's like taking a favored toy away from a spoiled child: even if the end result will surely be more trouble for the child, they are still going to try to get the toy back.

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Originally posted by Firestorm

After reading "Tears so white", it seems that the Sisters think Larloch has no protection against Silver fire and that Silver fire would be the end all of any fight with Larloch?

They assume nobody, not even Larloch, could make any sort of Barrier against Silver fire because it is unblockable, and that it would destroy him if it touched him.

Ill assume this story was set before Blackstaff and 4 of the Sisters fought Telamont Tanthul in the city of Shade and learned that Lord Shadow was capable of raising a spell shield powerful enough to block silverfire.

In any case, Larloch literally walked right up to Storm as she was channelling silverfire in her hand and stuck his face close enough to sniff it. Hardly the actions of a man afraid of the stuff, despite what they think.

I also don't understand why they think it would destroy him. Nothing short of taking out his Phylactery can destroy him, and Larloch has aranged matters so that his spirit takes over one of his dominated liches instead of going back to his phylactery for a day anyways.

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Originally posted by The Red Walker

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Originally posted by Firestorm

After reading "Tears so white", it seems that the Sisters think Larloch has no protection against Silver fire and that Silver fire would be the end all of any fight with Larloch?

They assume nobody, not even Larloch, could make any sort of Barrier against Silver fire because it is unblockable, and that it would destroy him if it touched him.

Ill assume this story was set before Blackstaff and 4 of the Sisters fought Telamont Tanthul in the city of Shade and learned that Lord Shadow was capable of raising a spell shield powerful enough to block silverfire.

In any case, Larloch literally walked right up to Storm as she was channelling silverfire in her hand and stuck his face close enough to sniff it. Hardly the actions of a man afraid of the stuff, despite what they think.

I also don't understand why they think it would destroy him. Nothing short of taking out his Phylactery can destroy him, and Larloch has aranged matters so that his spirit takes over one of his dominated liches instead of going back to his phylactery for a day anyways.

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I think you need to re-read the last three pages or so. As Storm steps towards him with the silver fire he steps back not once, but twice before finally holding his ground. Only after it becomes apparent Storm is not threatening him with does lean forward to lust after the thing he cannot have. That is part of what makes him so dangerous, he is Ultra-Powerful , but not too arrogant to realize his weakness.

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Originally posted by Firestorm

Ill assume this story was set before Blackstaff and 4 of the Sisters fought Telamont Tanthul in the city of Shade and learned that Lord Shadow was capable of raising a spell shield powerful enough to block silverfire.

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Originally posted by Rinonalyrna Fathomlin

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Originally posted by Firestorm

Ill assume this story was set before Blackstaff and 4 of the Sisters fought Telamont Tanthul in the city of Shade and learned that Lord Shadow was capable of raising a spell shield powerful enough to block silverfire.

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The story was set in the summer (I believe) of 1374 DR. That's definitely after the Shade debacle, but a few months before Blackstaff.

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Originally posted by Firestorm

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Originally posted by Rinonalyrna Fathomlin

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Originally posted by Firestorm

Ill assume this story was set before Blackstaff and 4 of the Sisters fought Telamont Tanthul in the city of Shade and learned that Lord Shadow was capable of raising a spell shield powerful enough to block silverfire.

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The story was set in the summer (I believe) of 1374 DR. That's definitely after the Shade debacle, but a few months before Blackstaff.

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Well, weird then. Its been proven that extremely powerful Archwizards like Telamont Tanthul could spell shield Silverfire(Return of the Archwizards book 3. Tanthul spell shields a silverfire blast from Khelben Blackstaff)

Seems off that the sisters would overlook that Larloch is powerful enough to shield from Silverfire, or that a Lich cannot be destroyed short of taking out his phylactery. He really was in no true Danger, yet all parties seemed to act as if it was otherwise.

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Originally posted by Firestorm
Well, weird then. Its been proven that extremely powerful Archwizards like Telamont Tanthul could spell shield Silverfire(Return of the Archwizards book 3. Tanthul spell shields a silverfire blast from Khelben Blackstaff)

Seems off that the sisters would overlook that Larloch is powerful enough to shield from Silverfire, or that a Lich cannot be destroyed short of taking out his phylactery. He really was in no true Danger, yet all parties seemed to act as if it was otherwise.

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Originally posted by ShadezofDis

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Originally posted by Firestorm
Well, weird then. Its been proven that extremely powerful Archwizards like Telamont Tanthul could spell shield Silverfire(Return of the Archwizards book 3. Tanthul spell shields a silverfire blast from Khelben Blackstaff)

Seems off that the sisters would overlook that Larloch is powerful enough to shield from Silverfire, or that a Lich cannot be destroyed short of taking out his phylactery. He really was in no true Danger, yet all parties seemed to act as if it was otherwise.

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I'm not going to get into the Shades, don't know much about them and care less.

But, as for Silverfire destroying Larloch, I don't find it implausible that Silverfire would devour his soul, along with his body. Doesn't mean that it would happen, just saying it's not impossible. Silverfire is the essence of the Weave and is quite versatile in it's uses.

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Originally posted by Firestorm

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Originally posted by ShadezofDis

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Originally posted by Firestorm
Well, weird then. Its been proven that extremely powerful Archwizards like Telamont Tanthul could spell shield Silverfire(Return of the Archwizards book 3. Tanthul spell shields a silverfire blast from Khelben Blackstaff)

Seems off that the sisters would overlook that Larloch is powerful enough to shield from Silverfire, or that a Lich cannot be destroyed short of taking out his phylactery. He really was in no true Danger, yet all parties seemed to act as if it was otherwise.

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I'm not going to get into the Shades, don't know much about them and care less.

But, as for Silverfire destroying Larloch, I don't find it implausible that Silverfire would devour his soul, along with his body. Doesn't mean that it would happen, just saying it's not impossible. Silverfire is the essence of the Weave and is quite versatile in it's uses.

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I have read almost every single DnD sourcebook and never have I seen anything that even implies Silverfire has the power to obliterate souls. Its section indicates that it delivers tremendous damage to any being struck by it, and details all of its other powers.

In his profile in Lords of Darkness, it states that Larloch has silver vulnerability and takes double damage from Silverfire and the like, but nowhere does it state that it can obliterate souls. Among other things, he has a quickened teleport and time stop contingency cast upon himself which would instantly move him to his sanctuary if he was harmed badly enough.

We can Ask Ed greenwood I guess. Where is this section you speak of walker?

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Originally posted by Wooly Rupert

It's also possible that Larloch has done so many different things to himself that he would be vulnerable to silver fire -- either by having progressed beyond having a phylactery, or by having a matrix of spells on himself that would be disastrously undone by silver fire.

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Originally posted by The Hooded One

Hello again, all. This time I set before interested scribes a Realmslore reply from Ed to scribe Firestorm, addressing this query: “. . . Currently, we are discussing powerful Spellcasters. Larloch, etc, and the story Tears So White came up.
Larloch acts visibly afraid of Storm when she advances with Silverfire, and I personally maintain that this was a placating act on his part to show he meant no harm, etc.
My reasoning being, Even if she smoked him with Silverfire, he would simply return to his Phylactery safely within whatever crazy pocket Dimension he hid it in and he truly had nothing to fear permanently.”

[[THO: scribes’ converse from a thread here at the Keep was then included, but I have snipped it here for brevity’s sake]]

“Lol. So I guess in the end, What i am asking is: Could Storm have obliterated his Soul on the spot, despite usual lich Soul returning to Phylactery stuff (Or to another lich of his), Contingency spells teleporting him away, etc? Did he have genuine reason to immediately fear for his existence other than making powerful enemies of several Chosen who could together pose a greater threat??
Sorry about the long add ons and Quotes. Its just a weird question. It bothered me that Larloch the Ultra Lich would show fear to Storm, who a Manshoon clone could handle if she didn’t have Elminster’s help (Spellfire book 2 seems to indicate that Storm thinks she would not match up well vs. Manshoon without El's help).”

Ed replies:



You have divined matters correctly, Firestorm. Larloch is trying to seem seem unthreatening, and so retreats a few steps, but he also DOESN’T want to get struck by the silver fire, not out of fear, but because it would burn away many layers of his interwoven magics, causing a “snowballing” deterioration of his lichnee condition AND forcing him to spend much time and trouble fighting this, and restoring all of his magics (if certain magics are destroyed, he would lose control over some of the liches who serve him, and they would certainly try to seize this opportunity [Larloch weakened? Our best chance!] to try to destroy him. I’m not saying they would necessarily succeed, I’m saying Larloch can foresee these problems and would prefer to avoid them. To do otherwise would be wasteful, and would also let others witness and remember (or hear of, from witnesses) this vulnerability and so perhaps foster future attacks on him.

The Sisters also know from experience and Mystra’s teachings something that Larloch hasn’t thought of, and the Princes of Shade never faced.
The silver fire is the raw energy of the Weave (and thus, effectively limitless; it’s the channeled vitality of the WORLD), and by its nature tends to sear both existing spell effects and living things - - and whereas spells can block and foil the silver fire of one source, and a mythal or powerful ward can be crafted so as to “drink” (absorb) silver fire and therefore be strengthened by it rather than destroyed by it, no known magic can withstand the concentrated strikes of six or more sources of silver fire (six or more Chosen and/or avatars of deities of magic who know how to derive and wield silver fire, such as Mystra and Azuth).

Larloch can never “have” silver fire to wield unless he submits to Mystra, abandoning his lichdom and becoming one of her servitor creatures, alive in a vastly lesser body and subject to her authority. He doesn’t know if she would accept him or destroy him, if he asked; all he knows is that she suffers him to continue to exist as he is now, a kingpin among liches, commanding many lichnee. Thus, as it’s a form of magical energy he can’t have and daren’t (as a lich) have overmuch contact with, he’s fascinated by it and hungers to have it (“human nature,” if you will). He approached Storm’s silver fire almost reverently, wanting to see it at very close quarters, yearning to have it - - and yet controlling himself iron-hard, to keep himself from touching it.

Yes, that was “the” (true) Larloch, by the way, not the lich lord inhabiting (controlling and speaking through) the body of another lich from afar (though he can and often does do this).

By the way, in response to “Nobody is going to try to go into the Warlock’s Crypt fighting 60 high level liches” (et cetera), that’s not Larloch’s fear. He fears revolt from within, if he is weakened or incapacitated; his own dominated undead, who so intimately know his powers, where his magic lies, and their ways around his domain, turning upon him.

As for silver fire destroying souls: I don’t know. Certainly no mortal has witnessed this happening (or if they have, understood what they were seeing correctly). Mystra and Azuth would of course know; her Chosen obviously do not.

In this case, with all of Larloch’s contingencies and his phylactery being elsewhere (though there are some special forms of undead that result when liches are magically prevented from contact with their phylacteries, when their lich bodies are destroyed; sorry, NDA on these) I doubt Storm could have destroyed Larloch’s soul on the spot, no. Nor do I think she would ever think she could. Liches are creatures of magic, and Mystra frowns on destroying them without good reason . . . and Larloch was NOT attacking her.



Whew. So saith Ed, master of all things lichnee from way back. Hmmm, “Expert on Lichdom” doesn’t appear that often on resumés, does it?
love to all,
THO

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