| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| Azar |
Posted - 25 Aug 2022 : 04:47:05
Good evening, folks.
I was wondering...what are some examples of mundane issues/topics or just everyday occurrences on Earth that would be serious business in The Forgotten Realms? One example comes to mind ->
quote:
Earth: Discussions about the weather are typically dull small talk.
The Realms: Discussing the weather is serious business among Talassans (priests of Talos), Aurilians (priests of Auril) and hardcore/fundamentalist Akadians (priests of Akadi).
Inverse examples are also welcome.
quote:
Earth: A floating sphere with a massive eyeball, gaping maw and stalks with little eyeballs is cause for alarm.
The Realms: Just another day in Skullport.
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| 30 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| Azar |
Posted - 19 Oct 2022 : 08:31:23
quote:
Originally posted by sleyvas
quote:
Originally posted by Azar
Ayrik, what happened to your awesome and informative post  ?
--- --- ---
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
quote:
Originally posted by Azar
Earth: Visiting a cemetery is a quiet and often somber affair.
The Realms: Visiting a cemetery may involve a battle with the residents.
The latter can depend on the timing and the locale. The City of the Dead, in Waterdeep, is something of a park, during daylight hours.
A fairly related thought ->
You know the spell Speak with Dead, yeah? Do you think it is possible at the more civilized/regimented cemeteries that family or a friend of the deceased can entreat a sensitive priest (typically a Kelemvorite, but I imagine a Lathanderite or other Good-aligned servant of a god would fit the bill) to question the dead as a way of putting their minds at ease?
This is why I like topics like this... they kind of veer off as one idea spawns another. I can honestly say, I've almost exclusively looked at speak with dead always from the adventurer's or detective's standpoint. I very much could see exactly this sort of thing happening, as well as things like children asking their parent where some simple but necessary thing is kept (like where'd you bury all the gems that you didn't keep in a bank).
In pretty much every D&D Dungeon Master/Master's Guide, there are rules for spellcaster services (specifically, the cost for spells that the Player Characters are likely to call upon on a regular basis); among these rules are divine spells. It makes sense that at least one Player Character will get the idea to visit a temple in order to have Speak with Dead cast on the remains of a deceased in the quest for answers. Anyhow, if a semi-respectable temple regularly receives folks who seek closure, then there would most certainly be areas walled or curtained off for privacy and even appropriate lighting/décor to make the experience as stress-free as possible. |
| sleyvas |
Posted - 20 Sep 2022 : 14:03:02
quote:
Originally posted by Azar
Ayrik, what happened to your awesome and informative post ?
--- --- ---
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
quote:
Originally posted by Azar
Earth: Visiting a cemetery is a quiet and often somber affair.
The Realms: Visiting a cemetery may involve a battle with the residents.
The latter can depend on the timing and the locale. The City of the Dead, in Waterdeep, is something of a park, during daylight hours.
A fairly related thought ->
You know the spell Speak with Dead, yeah? Do you think it is possible at the more civilized/regimented cemeteries that family or a friend of the deceased can entreat a sensitive priest (typically a Kelemvorite, but I imagine a Lathanderite or other Good-aligned servant of a god would fit the bill) to question the dead as a way of putting their minds at ease?
This is why I like topics like this... they kind of veer off as one idea spawns another. I can honestly say, I've almost exclusively looked at speak with dead always from the adventurer's or detective's standpoint. I very much could see exactly this sort of thing happening, as well as things like children asking their parent where some simple but necessary thing is kept (like where'd you bury all the gems that you didn't keep in a bank). |
| Athreeren |
Posted - 19 Sep 2022 : 14:55:14
quote:
Originally posted by Ayrik
Azar ...
Consider that Nameless also interacts with a few other "unreal" characters - the ghost of Deionarra, the "paranoid" "practical" "good" and "evil" incarnations/aspects of himself, a variety of angels and demons which apparently manifest from his own memories, the "true identity" of Ravel hidden within a trinity of living souls, etc.
These all seem to be things brought to life from Nameless himself. Unconsciously, unknowingly, unintentionally. An essential part of his story being told and retold again and again and again. They aren't the sort of thing which happens to "ordinary" planars, primes, and proxies who visit Sigil.
The other incarnation are in the Fortress of Regrets, which is born of the Nameless One (as in, the body taken throughout his life, not this particular incarnation). They have memories that he can't remember without them. So if you mean they were born from this incarnation, that seems false, and if you say they were born from his life, that's trivially true, since they're him at a different time.
Deionarra truly existed, since we get to meet her father, and leaving her ghost behind was part of the plan of the practical incarnation, so this ghost is as real as ghost get. It's just that few people in the mortuary would know about her, so she has no reason to appear.
As for the "other Ravels", this is what she is: her soul is like a tree, and the branches travel through the Planes. We get to meet one of them in each of the Icewind Dale games, and the Nameless One is nowhere to be found.
For the demons and angels, it depends which ones you mean. But it is a fact of the Planes that belief can affect the real world, to the point that it is one of the possible answers to Ravel's riddle as to what can change the nature of a man, and the key to one of the possible ways to defeat the Transcendent One.
"I've seen belief move cities, make men stave off death, and turn an evil hag's heart half-circle. This entire Fortress has been constructed from belief. Belief damned a woman, whose heart clung to the hope that another loved her when he did not. Once, it made a man seek immortality and achieve it. And it has made a posturing spirit think it is something more than a part of me." |
| Ayrik |
Posted - 19 Sep 2022 : 06:14:22
Azar ...
Consider that Nameless also interacts with a few other "unreal" characters - the ghost of Deionarra, the "paranoid" "practical" "good" and "evil" incarnations/aspects of himself, a variety of angels and demons which apparently manifest from his own memories, the "true identity" of Ravel hidden within a trinity of living souls, etc.
These all seem to be things brought to life from Nameless himself. Unconsciously, unknowingly, unintentionally. An essential part of his story being told and retold again and again and again. They aren't the sort of thing which happens to "ordinary" planars, primes, and proxies who visit Sigil. |
| Azar |
Posted - 18 Sep 2022 : 19:25:45
quote:
Originally posted by Ayrik
quote:
Originally posted by Azar
Ayrik, what happened to your awesome and informative post ?
I thought your question was already answered. Nothing more needed to be said.
You did go more in-depth, however. In any case, it would have been nice to see the explanation kept around for posterity. Oh well. |
| Ayrik |
Posted - 17 Sep 2022 : 04:09:11
quote:
Originally posted by Azar
Ayrik, what happened to your awesome and informative post ?
I thought your question was already answered. Nothing more needed to be said. |
| Azar |
Posted - 17 Sep 2022 : 03:56:10
Ayrik, what happened to your awesome and informative post ?
--- --- ---
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
quote:
Originally posted by Azar
Earth: Visiting a cemetery is a quiet and often somber affair.
The Realms: Visiting a cemetery may involve a battle with the residents.
The latter can depend on the timing and the locale. The City of the Dead, in Waterdeep, is something of a park, during daylight hours.
A fairly related thought ->
You know the spell Speak with Dead, yeah? Do you think it is possible at the more civilized/regimented cemeteries that family or a friend of the deceased can entreat a sensitive priest (typically a Kelemvorite, but I imagine a Lathanderite or other Good-aligned servant of a god would fit the bill) to question the dead as a way of putting their minds at ease? |
| Azar |
Posted - 17 Sep 2022 : 03:53:56
Earth: Vacationing at the coast? A capital idea!
The Realms: Vacationing at the Sword Coast? A crazy idea! |
| Wooly Rupert |
Posted - 07 Sep 2022 : 23:55:51
quote:
Originally posted by Azar
Earth: Visiting a cemetery is a quiet and often somber affair.
The Realms: Visiting a cemetery may involve a battle with the residents.
The latter can depend on the timing and the locale. The City of the Dead, in Waterdeep, is something of a park, during daylight hours. |
| Azar |
Posted - 07 Sep 2022 : 21:02:35
Earth: Visiting a cemetery is a quiet and often somber affair.
The Realms: Visiting a cemetery may involve a battle with the residents. |
| Azar |
Posted - 04 Sep 2022 : 17:21:23
Yes, but is that a property of Sigil itself, the "Planescape setting" in general or The Nameless One in particular? |
| Ayrik |
Posted - 04 Sep 2022 : 04:33:47
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
quote:
Originally posted by Eldacar
quote:
Originally posted by Ayrik
It's hard to reject the entire cosmos, even in Planescape.
If I remember rightly, Planescape: Torment has one character who can be convinced to do this, and he promptly pops out of existence in a puff of logic.
Sounds like something out of the Hitchhiker's Trilogy.
If you claim to be "Adahn" in conversations about a dozen times (unique conversations, not just repeats to the same people), then Adahn will actually manifest in the Smoldering Corpse Bar. He's a real person - albeit a confused, absent-minded, distracted, preoccupied, and incomplete one with suspicious gaps of memory - even though he's apparently just a figment of your imagination given reality through the conviction of your improvised claims. He is instantly familiar, somehow, and recognizes you as an "old friend" - he's been waiting for you, he returns some items he's been holding for you - and he fades into nonexistence as the conversation concludes.
There are hints from the game devs (and in the game files) which suggest Adahn might be the Nameless One's original name, a remnant of life lost after untold centuries of immortality. Then again, there are similar hints with several other names.
In any case, the interaction with Adahn rewards the player with some experience (which represents memories being regained or relearned, identity being recovered) and some advantages during the final confrontation with The Transcendent One.
This peculiar phenomenon might happen to anyone in Planescape, in theory. But I think it's extremely rare for most people, in practice.
Nameless has a unique story which involves his flawed immortality. His frayed and tormented soul unravels a little more each time he lives and dies again, parts of himself are left (or lost) everywhere he's been, sometimes these parts cluster together to form other versions of himself he encounters again as dreams, nightmares, strangers, allies, or enemies. He's a composite of countless other people, versions of himself which have been discarded or avoided, embraced and discovered again, taken along countless differently contradictory paths to many now-forgotten destinations. It's plausible (and plausibly-deniable) that he was Adahn in a previous life. |
| Azar |
Posted - 03 Sep 2022 : 20:20:07
Inverse example ->
Earth: Cross-cultural romances are fairly significant (for better and for worse).
The Realms: Cross-cultural romances between a people pale in comparison to cross-species/racial romances (e.g. human <-> elf, human <-> halfling, human <-> orc, human <-> dragon, et cetera). |
| Wooly Rupert |
Posted - 03 Sep 2022 : 19:21:59
quote:
Originally posted by Eldacar
quote:
Originally posted by Ayrik
It's hard to reject the entire cosmos, even in Planescape.
If I remember rightly, Planescape: Torment has one character who can be convinced to do this, and he promptly pops out of existence in a puff of logic.
Sounds like something out of the Hitchhiker's Trilogy. |
| Eldacar |
Posted - 03 Sep 2022 : 15:34:38
quote:
Originally posted by Ayrik
It's hard to reject the entire cosmos, even in Planescape.
If I remember rightly, Planescape: Torment has one character who can be convinced to do this, and he promptly pops out of existence in a puff of logic. |
| Ayrik |
Posted - 03 Sep 2022 : 06:05:15
In our world the afterlife is a promise (or a threat). An article of faith.
Atheists are not convinced by the "evidence" - they lack belief in any god because they see no proof any god exists. The "evidence" always has other (better) explanations which do not even require or support supernatural entities.
In the Realms, the afterlife is assured. The planes are known. The domains of the deities are known. Celestials and fiends - angels and devils, archons and demons - can be contacted or summoned by magics, they can manifest as agents of greater powers, they can grant spells and abilities, they can be fought or bargained with. Priests are granted miraculous powers - they can even communicate with the dead or bring the dead back to life - by invoking the gods they worship.
There is really no question about the existence of gods in the Realms - only a fool would stubbornly deny all the tangible evidence.
(There could be questions about the validity or authenticity of gods. Are they truly supreme and fundamental powers or are they merely immortals more potent and advanced than the mortals who worship them? But such theological analyses probably aren't popular in the Realms, since those who are Faithless get stuffed into the Wall or dragged away by fiends. The distinction between a true god and an ersatz god isn't too meaningful when either one wields real power over the world. It's hard to reject the entire cosmos, even in Planescape.) |
| Azar |
Posted - 03 Sep 2022 : 05:50:02
quote:
Originally posted by Zeromaru X
quote:
Originally posted by Azar
quote:
Originally posted by Delnyn
Earth: Debates between atheists and religious adherents.
Toril: Survived the ToT and has oodles of clerics, druids and other divine spellcasters.
Edit: Toy changed to ToT. Autocorrect is not always your ally.
Was there a surfeit of such discourse during the Time of Troubles?
On the other hand, atheists in the post-Spellplague Realms can be certain that in some places gods actually don't exist. So, atheism in the Realms is about traveling, lol
Boo. Hiss.
 .
I have always thought that atheism and/or agnosticism is an odd stance in a world with gods whose presence is not in question; the closest "reasonable" justification I've seen comes from Planescape (i.e., "There are powerful beings at the top, but they are not the 'true' gods."). |
| Zeromaru X |
Posted - 03 Sep 2022 : 02:36:04
quote:
Originally posted by Azar
quote:
Originally posted by Delnyn
Earth: Debates between atheists and religious adherents.
Toril: Survived the ToT and has oodles of clerics, druids and other divine spellcasters.
Edit: Toy changed to ToT. Autocorrect is not always your ally.
Was there a surfeit of such discourse during the Time of Troubles?
On the other hand, atheists in the post-Spellplague Realms can be certain that in some places gods actually don't exist. So, atheism in the Realms is about traveling, lol |
| Azar |
Posted - 02 Sep 2022 : 23:29:38
The next example isn't precisely mundane and it isn't a regular occurrence (at least, I hope it isn't!), but...
Earth: Book burning - divorced from any other actions (that is to say, uncoupled from ideological impetus) - typically isn't life-threatening.
The Realms: Book burning? Congratulations, you've just started a holy war with the Oghmanytes and/or Deneirrath.
--- --- ---
--- --- ---
quote:
Originally posted by Ayrik
quote:
Originally posted by Azar
quote:
Originally posted by Ayrik
Toril ... all the small minds live in small worlds, they go nowhere and know nothing beyond their locality
They also influence comparatively little, in contrast to our own state of affairs. Between both worlds...which is the lucky one?
A good question.
But given the details in these all-or-nothing world package deals, I'd rather run into internet trolls than run into monster trolls. Earth's trolls can easily be ignored or dismissed. Toril's trolls would likely tear me into screaming shreds.
Yes...I am right there with you  . Much more of a lover than a fighter. That said...if I could hole up in a gnome/halfling/elf retreat, then I still might jump on the offer to depart this world (warty trolls or otherwise).
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
quote:
Originally posted by Azar
Are those occurrences primarily historical footnotes or have any of them ever taken center stage in an adventure/module/supplement? If they were mostly tidbits providing fuel for the imagination and not focal topics, then that would explain why I didn't recall even one such event.
With very few exceptions, the fiction has always been present day (at the time of publication) for the Realms. And the OGB starts things off saying the year 1357 is just ending.
There is that "Arcane Age" line of products, right? The only reason I know about it is because I picked up a random FR novel with the Arcane Age emblem and because I learned that the empire of Netheril existed during said age. |
| Wooly Rupert |
Posted - 02 Sep 2022 : 23:23:24
quote:
Originally posted by sleyvas
On Earth - seeing two people actively having sex involves "accidentally" typing the wrong thing in google.
On Toril - seeing two people actively having sex involves scrying or leaving the house to go to some private club
I've found highly questionable stuff doing legitimate, IT-related research for work. Not oft, but it's happened more than once. |
| Ayrik |
Posted - 02 Sep 2022 : 21:40:00
Just mentioning that I was somewhat surprised the first time I typed "role playing games" into google image search. |
| sleyvas |
Posted - 02 Sep 2022 : 13:33:30
On Earth - seeing two people actively having sex involves "accidentally" typing the wrong thing in google.
On Toril - seeing two people actively having sex involves scrying or leaving the house to go to some private club |
| sleyvas |
Posted - 02 Sep 2022 : 13:29:35
On Earth - Getting a thousand nails, some wood, and running around framing up a house involves about a day of effort for 2 guys with a nail gun, a drill, circular saw, etc...
On Toril - Doing the same thing on Toril (without magic) involves hammering in each nail with strength of arm, cutting the wood to the right size with a hand saw, etc... |
| Ayrik |
Posted - 02 Sep 2022 : 05:32:10
quote:
Originally posted by Azar
quote:
Originally posted by Ayrik
Toril ... all the small minds live in small worlds, they go nowhere and know nothing beyond their locality
They also influence comparatively little, in contrast to our own state of affairs. Between both worlds...which is the lucky one?
A good question.
But given the details in these all-or-nothing world package deals, I'd rather run into internet trolls than run into monster trolls. Earth's trolls can easily be ignored or dismissed. Toril's trolls would likely tear me into screaming shreds. |
| Azar |
Posted - 31 Aug 2022 : 23:58:10
quote:
Originally posted by ericlboyd
Earth: Being individually nosy requires access to the Internet and hacking the camera on a laptop.
The Realms: Being individually nosy requires access to a scrying spell.
Earth: Protecting your privacy from nosy individuals requires tape over the camera on your laptop. Protecting your privacy from Big Brother, Inc. is hopeless.
The Realms: Protecting your privacy from nosy individuals requires a nondetection spell. Protecting your privacy from the Red Wizards of Thay is hopeless.
That is a curiously specific annoyance.
...I hope you haven't suffered the misfortune of being targeted by an especially dedicated hacker  .
quote:
Originally posted by EricMinde
Earth: Food and Water shortages
Toril: There are so many ways to grow, speed up the growth, conjure or otherwise obtain food, there should be no food shortage ever. Can't swing a dead cat without hitting an everful basin or create water being cast.
Is malnutrition/starvation simply a non-factor in the Realms, then ?
quote:
Originally posted by Delnyn
Earth: Debates between atheists and religious adherents.
Toril: Survived the ToT and has oodles of clerics, druids and other divine spellcasters.
Edit: Toy changed to ToT. Autocorrect is not always your ally.
Was there a surfeit of such discourse during the Time of Troubles?
quote:
Originally posted by Ayrik
Earth: Every small-minded idiot can use a smartphone or drive a car, instantly talk to people across the world, instantly consult expert facts and references, easily travel across cities in minutes.
Toril: These things are still easy enough for those who are knowledgeable, powerful, disciplined, talented enough to be selected for education, apprenticeship, initiation. But all the small minds live in small worlds, they go nowhere and know nothing beyond their locality.
They also influence comparatively little, in contrast to our own state of affairs. Between both worlds...which is the lucky one? |
| Azar |
Posted - 30 Aug 2022 : 00:02:55
I will return to the main thrust of this topic soon enough, but, if you folks will allow me to indulge in a tangent...
The Forgotten Realms are "high magic", whereas Eberron is "integrated magic". In the former setting, a Decanter of Endless Water is a mage's family heirloom; in the latter setting, each culinary establishment of note probably features one if not many such endless fonts of water. |
| TheIriaeban |
Posted - 28 Aug 2022 : 15:09:32
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
quote:
Originally posted by Azar
Are those occurrences primarily historical footnotes or have any of them ever taken center stage in an adventure/module/supplement? If they were mostly tidbits providing fuel for the imagination and not focal topics, then that would explain why I didn't recall even one such event.
With very few exceptions, the fiction has always been present day (at the time of publication) for the Realms. And the OGB starts things off saying the year 1357 is just ending.
Looking through my notes, some of the "present day" plagues would be the Iriaebor plague in 1367 (it was nipped in the bud with only 20 people dying), Neverwinter in 1372, Border Kingdoms in 1374, a draconic plague in 1409, and Luskan in 1480. |
| Wooly Rupert |
Posted - 28 Aug 2022 : 04:28:14
quote:
Originally posted by Azar
Are those occurrences primarily historical footnotes or have any of them ever taken center stage in an adventure/module/supplement? If they were mostly tidbits providing fuel for the imagination and not focal topics, then that would explain why I didn't recall even one such event.
With very few exceptions, the fiction has always been present day (at the time of publication) for the Realms. And the OGB starts things off saying the year 1357 is just ending. |
| Azar |
Posted - 28 Aug 2022 : 03:29:50
quote:
Originally posted by George Krashos
quote:
Originally posted by Azar
quote:
Originally posted by TheIriaeban
Epidemics
Earth: You already know.
Toril: Tend to be localized and priests from multiple temples will try to stop it using relatively low-level and common magic. Bonus: you have someone to blame: Talona
I'm putting my ignorance on display here, but...
What significant widespread sicknesses/plagues have befell the Realms? The only event that comes to mind involved The Wailing Death (ref. Neverwinter Nights).
Plague in the Inner Sea in 1253 DR. Mention of plague in Waterdeep in 1150 DR. Great Plague of the Inner Sea noted as still around in 1317 DR. A bajillion plagues are noted in the timeline of the Calimport accessory. There is plague in Baldur's Gate in 1350 DR. I have plague in Impiltur in the years just after 1 DR and 880s DR. There are lots of plagues noted in the sources.
-- George Krashos
Thank you.
Are those occurrences primarily historical footnotes or have any of them ever taken center stage in an adventure/module/supplement? If they were mostly tidbits providing fuel for the imagination and not focal topics, then that would explain why I didn't recall even one such event. |
| George Krashos |
Posted - 28 Aug 2022 : 02:48:53
quote:
Originally posted by Azar
quote:
Originally posted by TheIriaeban
Epidemics
Earth: You already know.
Toril: Tend to be localized and priests from multiple temples will try to stop it using relatively low-level and common magic. Bonus: you have someone to blame: Talona
I'm putting my ignorance on display here, but...
What significant widespread sicknesses/plagues have befell the Realms? The only event that comes to mind involved The Wailing Death (ref. Neverwinter Nights).
Plague in the Inner Sea in 1253 DR. Mention of plague in Waterdeep in 1150 DR. Great Plague of the Inner Sea noted as still around in 1317 DR. A bajillion plagues are noted in the timeline of the Calimport accessory. There is plague in Baldur's Gate in 1350 DR. I have plague in Impiltur in the years just after 1 DR and 880s DR. There are lots of plagues noted in the sources.
-- George Krashos |
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