| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| sleyvas |
Posted - 19 Nov 2021 : 21:53:16
I was a bit unimpressed by the new dragonborn in Fizban's Treasury of Dragons. I just felt like making a "new" kind of dragonborn with a unique'ish history. I'm basing these in western Anchorome, but they can theoretically appear anywhere with a slight story change. I would especially like to thank Seethyr's daughter, whom I've never met, for making him think about how pretty a turquoise dragon would be and ultimately writing up his DM's Guild offering of ANM6 The Turquoise Dragon.
Breath of Hli'Akwa, the Birth of the Turquoise Dragonborn
Do you want to play a DIFFERENT type of dragonborn? One that isn't just a breath weapon and resistance? The Turquoise dragonborn is a dragonborn with a breath of healing ability and who, like a dragon infusing his hoard with power, has a natural ability resembling an artificers to infuse a single non-magical item. In addition, turquoise dragonborn are a chosen type of dragonborn, not a born type, as each makes an active choice upon becoming an adult to embrace a new path.
https://www.dmsguild.com/product/377881/Breath-of-HliAkwa-the-Birth-of-the-Turquoise-Dragonborn?src=newest_community&filters=45469_0_0_0_0_0_0_0 |
| 12 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| sleyvas |
Posted - 21 Nov 2021 : 19:57:34
Oh, and a brief aside on the gem dragons
Sardior kept a court of five thanes, one for each of the various breeds of gem dragons. They were Aleithilithos (an amethyst dragon), Hrodel (a crystal dragon), Smargad (an emerald dragon), Charisma (a sapphire dragon), and Tithonnas (a topaz dragon). Sardior once had a sixth thane, Seradess, (an obsidian dragon), but he destroyed her and banished the obsidian dragons from his court. Even his own clergy didn't know the exact reason behind this decision.
But we also now have the moonstone dragons as well officially (from fizban's treasury of dragons), so "7 gem dragons, 2 of which might be perceived as related to the moon and darkness". Not sure that I'd want to make that connection, but... throwing it out. |
| Wooly Rupert |
Posted - 21 Nov 2021 : 18:32:07
I've never completed the idea, but my idea for dragonborn was that a Netherese enclave managed to land safely on one of Toril's undescribed continents, and the Netherese populace, now grounded, wound up integrating with a population of local dragons. Maybe it was a ritual that created the dragonborn; maybe when two half-dragons get together, a dragonborn is the result and then they bred true. Never did figure out the best option for that.
I was also thinking that maybe the integration happened because there was some dire threat that arose, and it was the new dragonborn who were best able to deal with it.
Again, this was all spitballing, and I've never come up with the ideal spin on it all.
...And I've long been enamored of the idea of a Netherese enclave, grounded by the Fall on a distant continent, but having it happen in such a way that a large portion of the populace survived.
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| sleyvas |
Posted - 21 Nov 2021 : 16:33:01
quote:
Originally posted by Zeromaru X
I didn't even knew there were turquoise dragons. This seems to be interesting.
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
Unless there's a similar backstory for dragonborn (I honestly don't know if there's a backstory for all dragonborn or not), then it makes sense to have them match all the draconic flavors.
Dragonborn aren't that sure of their origins. Their mythology is either Io created them, or Bahamut created them (at least, the metallic ones) or some crazy dragons from Abeir/Argonessen created them (in the specific case of the dragonborn of the Realms and Eberron, respectively).
In the most accepted myth, the one about Io creating them, Io used the same kind of spirits he used to create dragons, but in the case of the dragonborn those were lesser spirits instead of the greater ones that were used to create dragons. So, it makes sense that dragons and dragonborn share the same lineages/types, as their source is basically the same, and the only difference is the "rank" of the spirit used to create them.
If the story of Bahamut is true, then it means that the chromatic and gem dragonborn were created by Tiamat and Sardior, respectively. The Fizban's book implies this, with their "champion dragonborn" that embody the power of their "ancestors". And there are champions of Bahamut, Tiamat and Sardior.
If the story of them being created by dragons is true, then again it makes same that they share the same lineages of dragons, as their creation involved the use of dragon eggs (as said in the 5e PHB).
On the turquoise dragon, that's all Seethyr's daughter. To quote him
This small article sized supplement is the end result of an idea that came from the mind of an adorable six year old girl who said, "I think a dragon would be really beautiful if it was made out of turquoise." Never one to let a good idea go to waste (and taking advantage of a situation that will make my daughter smile), I thought the turquoise dragon would be a wonderful new dragon species to introduce to Anchôromé.
She told him that a turquoise gem dragon would be pretty. He was interested in turquoise because of Anchorome and the people of the Pasocada Basin (and also we were discussing what should be the nature of Hli'Akwa, who is the Great Spirit known as Turquoise Man and turquoise having a relationship to magic). So, he created a story involving the Great Spirit of Turquoise Man being attacked by the Ancient Ones mentioned in the City of Gold product by TSR. So, they are a fan created type of dragon tied to Anchorome, but I loved his story.
You can read more on his turquoise dragons FOR FREE in this DM's Guild product
https://www.dmsguild.com/product/321967/ANM6-The-Turquoise-Dragon
Jump forward 16 months, and after some discussions about dragonborn here, I decided to make these dragonborn something akin to the dragonborn of Unther/Chessenta prior to the spellplague.. as in beings who by choice become a type of dragonborn.. but coming from Dragonborn.
So, these "turquoise dragonborn" grow up as dragonborn of another ancestry, and as a transition to adulthood, they go through a ritual of using their breath on a piece of turquoise while intoning "Hli'Akwa"..... the name of Turquoise man.... and he changes their skin and nature. However, I throw in that they can awaken parts of their prior ancestry (for instance a dragonborn sorcerer might choose draconic bloodline and "awaken" his red/gold/blue or whatever bloodline).
https://www.dmsguild.com/product/377881/Breath-of-HliAkwa-the-Birth-of-the-Turquoise-Dragonborn
Finally, this raises a question.... IS the Great Spirit of Hli'Akwa, The Turquoise Man, really a man? Is he a primordial? Is he a new type of gem dragon? Is he both? Is he neither and rather some sort of primal spirit? What about the other "Mighty Spirits" of Anchorome, because several could be dragons? For instance Sho'tokunungwa is the neutral spirit of rain, lightning, and clouds, and is portrayed as a being with a single horn in his forehead.... could he be a blue dragon that isn't evil? Paiyetemu the Sun's Youth is portrayed as a trickster spirit with ties to butterfles.... could he be a powerful faerie dragon with shapechanging abilities? To be clear, I don't think these are the INTENDED things by the original authors, but it can easily be written this way.
On the part about where dragonborn themselves come from, my PERSONAL take is that the dragonborn of Toril/Abeir are an early offshoot of the ritual which was used on Krynn to make draconians. Takhisis then further corrupted this ritual on Krynn to make more powerful dragonborn. Bahamut also adapted this ritual later to allow other races to become dragonborn (like what happened in Unther/Chessenta prior to the spellplague). Then again, they could just as easily have originated on another world entirely (for instance, perhaps Coliar was inhabited by dragonborn, birdfolk, and lizard folk).
Finally, in "discovering" Anchorome and Maztica, we've discussed several types of dragons to be there, and some of these we've had "dragonborn" related to them appear. For instance, Plumed dragonborn/Feathered Dragonborn with a relationship to Mirage Dragons of the feywild while putting a mirage dragon in Anchorome's forests. Now I've taken Seethyr's idea of turquoise dragons and also added a turquoise dragonborn. We've also noted that Maztica is noted for "Hakuna" or dragonnes/liondrakes (and I think it might be interesting to explore other forms of cat dragons for the regions). There's also one very OLD type of dragon that's never seen much use that I would love to include in Anchorome and they are DIFFERENT which is why I like them.
http://adnd.geoshitties.installgentoo.com/mm/dragnamb.html
Amber Dragons are a very "fey" like dragon in that they live in forests, have "bark" like scales, and they drink the sap from trees. Their breath weapon is a quickly hardened glob of tree sap, which they get by stabbing trees with their horn (their teeth are too soft to bite with, but they have a powerful horn and claws). They have some control over magnetism. They can shape change. They can "blink". They can cast druid spells. They don't necessarily keep a hoard. As "Amber" is technically a kind of gem, they make a very unique form of "gem" dragon.... one very much tied to nature and less psionics. |
| Zeromaru X |
Posted - 21 Nov 2021 : 02:25:39
I didn't even knew there were turquoise dragons. This seems to be interesting.
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
Unless there's a similar backstory for dragonborn (I honestly don't know if there's a backstory for all dragonborn or not), then it makes sense to have them match all the draconic flavors.
Dragonborn aren't that sure of their origins. Their mythology is either Io created them, or Bahamut created them (at least, the metallic ones) or some crazy dragons from Abeir/Argonessen created them (in the specific case of the dragonborn of the Realms and Eberron, respectively).
In the most accepted myth, the one about Io creating them, Io used the same kind of spirits he used to create dragons, but in the case of the dragonborn those were lesser spirits instead of the greater ones that were used to create dragons. So, it makes sense that dragons and dragonborn share the same lineages/types, as their source is basically the same, and the only difference is the "rank" of the spirit used to create them.
If the story of Bahamut is true, then it means that the chromatic and gem dragonborn were created by Tiamat and Sardior, respectively. The Fizban's book implies this, with their "champion dragonborn" that embody the power of their "ancestors". And there are champions of Bahamut, Tiamat and Sardior.
If the story of them being created by dragons is true, then again it makes same that they share the same lineages of dragons, as their creation involved the use of dragon eggs (as said in the 5e PHB). |
| Wooly Rupert |
Posted - 20 Nov 2021 : 22:56:58
quote:
Originally posted by Ayrik
Even 1E Dragonlance only had four or five flavours of draconians. Basically a bunch of magical mongrel dragonborn types created from the eggs of evil dragons. Some of them released a spell effect on death, some could lick poison onto their blades, some were a bit tougher and hardier. But none of them had breath weapons or mighty draconic powers, lol, they were more like lizardmen than like dragons. Their lineage and colouration could influence their rank, status, and assignments in the Army Of Evil, but otherwise applied no real effect in or out of combat.
The draconians all matching one draconic category made sense: it was their backstory that they'd been created from the corrupted eggs of good dragons. (They later added ones made from the eggs of evil dragons, but because of Krynn's focus on balance, those wound up being good-aligned draconians)
Unless there's a similar backstory for dragonborn (I honestly don't know if there's a backstory for all dragonborn or not), then it makes sense to have them match all the draconic flavors. |
| Ayrik |
Posted - 20 Nov 2021 : 21:55:18
Even 1E Dragonlance only had four or five flavours of draconians. Basically a bunch of magical mongrel dragonborn types created from the eggs of evil dragons. Some of them released a spell effect on death, some could lick poison onto their blades, some were a bit tougher and hardier. But none of them had breath weapons or mighty draconic powers, lol, they were more like lizardmen than like dragons. Their lineage and colouration could influence their rank, status, and assignments in the Army Of Evil, but otherwise applied no real effect in or out of combat. |
| Wooly Rupert |
Posted - 20 Nov 2021 : 15:06:56
quote:
Originally posted by TBeholder
It looks like Dragonborn became the new Custom Elves for the scalies.
I dunno, in this case, I think it makes sense. If dragonborn matched one category of dragons, why not the others? This isn't going into weird one-off cases with pink or purple dragonborn or polka-dotted ones or anything goofy like this; it's saying we have three categories of dragons, so dragonborn should match.
It makes a hell of a lot more sense than the multiversal dragons concept and having at least one case of a dragon following the plot of a mediocre Jet Li movie. |
| TBeholder |
Posted - 20 Nov 2021 : 06:05:31
It looks like Dragonborn became the new Custom Elves for the scalies. |
| Lord Karsus |
Posted - 20 Nov 2021 : 05:14:31
-I tuned out when Dragonborn were introduced/given prominence.
-Since lineages matter and have an impact on the physiology, maybe a planar dragon from the Plane of Positive Energy? I couldn't find anything online from published books/magazines, but in theory they would exist since there's a dragon for pretty much everything else out there. |
| sleyvas |
Posted - 20 Nov 2021 : 02:06:26
quote:
Originally posted by Lord Karsus
-Do Dragonborn differ based on color?
For 5e, they recently redid dragonborn to give them at least a little more variety, but initially they got a breath weapon and resistance "based on their ancestry" (i.e. reds got a fire breath and fire resist, whites cold breath and resist, blues lightning breath and resist). To note though, their ancestry may not match their natural coloring (i.e. a dragonborn with red ancestry may have blue scales). The breath weapon they originally could only use once and then had to rest (but could do a short rest of an hour and get it back). They recently redid that so that they can use it a number of times a day equal to their proficiency bonus (so like 2 times a day to start in the new Fizban's book up to 6 times at around 17th level). the breath weapon becomes more damaging as well when you level. Also as part of the recent book, each "dragonborn family" got a few other abilities... so gem dragonborn got short range telepathy and at 5th lvl spectral wings for 1 minute, chromatics at 5th level can become immune instead of resistant to their energy type from their ancestry, and metallics at 5th level can make their breath weapon nondamaging but able to knock people over or incapacitate them.
This new dragonborn is special in that they were "another kind of dragonborn" and they perform a ritual to "become a turquoise dragonborn" that changes them (making their skin blue or green like turquoise, complete with striations, etc...). This take on a new "race" replaces their breath weapon with a breath that heals other beings (not themselves), and they can give up their own hit dice to heal others even in combat (note, hit dice, not hit points... so the stuff they'd use to heal themselves after a short rest they can convert into healing other people). They can also learn one type of infusion and infuse one nonmagical item with that infusion (so like enhance weapon to have a +1 weapon at 1st level or enhanced defence for +1 armor or shield at 1st lvl or enhance magical focus for a non-magical wand, etc.. that enhances spell attack). This plays on the idea that dragons infuse their surroundings with magic. Finally, at 5th level they can attune themselves to an extra magic item (so they can attune a whole 4 magic items instead of 3, which is a kind of unique thing to 5e unless you become an artificer). I was actually looking to hone this race a little bit towards becoming artificers, but I opted to go towards something more generic and adaptable to many roles. |
| Ayrik |
Posted - 19 Nov 2021 : 22:45:48
quote:
Originally posted by Lord Karsus
-Do Dragonborn differ based on color?
Dragons differ based on colour.
Dragonborn were treated differently in different rules editions. 3E and 3.5E (and d20 stuff galore) treated dragonborn lineages as extremely important stuff. 4E generally simplified the race, at least initially.
The question seems to be answered differently in different WotC publications over the years. Just like the question of "do dwarven females have beards?" |
| Lord Karsus |
Posted - 19 Nov 2021 : 22:22:55
-Do Dragonborn differ based on color? |
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