| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| Ghostfinger |
Posted - 28 Nov 2011 : 03:56:46
We've heard wizards at lvl 30 carved conquered kingdoms (Telamont Tanthul) or capable of spectacularly level whole armies (The Simbul).
Then what are their warrior-counterpart of equal level capable of doing ?
Does a lvl 20 ranger kill pesky dragons for practice ?
Does a lvl 30 fighter cleave buildings in half ?
Does a lvl 40 barbarian murder a marching army stupid enough to trespass his homeland ?
On other hand, is there any FR novel/comic which have a high level warrior (25+) as its main villain ? |
| 30 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| Diffan |
Posted - 02 Dec 2011 : 18:42:21
quote:
Originally posted by creyzi4zb12
I've always thought that wizards are supposed to loose in 1 on 1 fights in 4th edition. They're purpose was supposed to be crowd-control or environmental control instead of killing someone.
Sorcerers on the other hand just own in one on one.
Maybe I'm wrong tho'
While 1-on-1 battles rarely happen (or come up) due to monster's being written different mechanically, I think there is a good chance for either class in a sort of situation. Neither the Fighter or Wizard is designed to be a super damage machine, focusing more on their own separate roles in the party. That being said, I think it largely depends on who goes first. The Fighter closes the gap and uses a Daily power right off the bat as a good chance of downing the wizard in 1 strike. The wizard can easily counter with the Shield spell or some other defensive mechanism available at 1st level. The wizard then could cast any Blast spell they know (which doesn't provoke an Opportunity Attack) such as Color Spray (blast 5) or even Hypnotism to make the Fighter walk away or attack itself with it's own weapon. Those are but two options they have to use in their aresnal.
Even as both character progress, at 25th level the Fighter has access to a great many powers, which might allow him to drop the wizard with an 25th daily power or two. But this again falls to initiative rather than spells and character build. Roughly speaking, it depends on how you play the character, and not what its limited to as far as resources are concerned. |
| creyzi4zb12 |
Posted - 02 Dec 2011 : 18:24:11
I've always thought that wizards are supposed to loose in 1 on 1 fights in 4th edition. They're purpose was supposed to be crowd-control or environmental control instead of killing someone.
Sorcerers on the other hand just own in one on one.
Maybe I'm wrong tho' |
| Diffan |
Posted - 02 Dec 2011 : 15:13:12
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
Of course, that assumes that the wizard has all of those spells memorized that day, and that he hasn't already cast them...
Agreed, yet what I proposed the Wizard had available was directly taken from the PHB. Additionally, they're options I'm assuming every wizard should have prepared/known/on-hand to use. Quicken Spell isn't an "If" options but "When" during a wizard's career. Otto's Irrestible Dance and Spectral Hand are classic spells which should be in most wizard's prepared repitoire. But that's just two spells in conjunction with one another.
I'm not even mentioning Rune-Bombs (Explosive Runes x10 on one piece of paper and detonated) or the 0-level cantrip called Caltrops (Spell Compendium) in conjunction with the feat Cloudy Conjuration (Complete Mage) halts charging, immobilized enemies, and other nasty effects for a 0-level spell and a feat obtainable at 1st level. There are just so many variables that wizards are a venerable Tool-Box. Add in Scribe Scroll, a feat they gain for free, and they should have most of the spells I mentioned memorized, on a scroll, in a wand, or some other form (eternal wands, Summon Monster beads, staffs, rune-staffs, rods, yadda yadda).
Fighters just don't have the magical implements to compete with these aspects of spellcasting classes. What's worse, monster and villians are build using these rules, so it's perfectly acceptable for an Enemy spellcaster to have memorized half a dozen offensive spells, defensive spells, utility spells, with a number of others on-hand.
quote:
Originally posted by MrHedgehog
I agree with Wooly, i've never played at a level higher than like... 15 (and i've only played 4th edition a couple of times, ever) so I don't really know what happens at high levels regarding mechanics but there a lot of "what ifs" you could say. And even if there are loopholes to do super powerful things in theory the character classes are supposed to be equal power wise? Bard, cleric, rogue, fighter, druid, etc.
I was speaking from a v3.5 context about the disparity, and I'm currently running a high-level campaign (3 players, party level 1s 17th) and I can say without a doubt that my character (fighter/tempest 17th) is out-gunned by the Sorcerer and Cleric in the group. I get, at most, 6 attacks with Two-Weapon Fighting and I have Wounding weapons (which deal Con-based damage) and I'm lucky to get in one round before either the monster is turned to stone, glass, disintegrated, or banished. Sometimes it has SR, and only the Soreress has Spell Penetration, so her spells hit more often but if they don't have SR, well then it's always a short encounter.
Along the lines of balance also lies in what a class can accomplish and what it can't based on the mechanics of said class. A fighter can fight, pretty well most of the time, but at high levels his life is depending on magical items to be any sort of threat at all. Mages, OTOH, have spells and the like to get them over these hurdles to be proactive in an adventure.
quote:
Originally posted by MrHedgehog
If the wizard is prepared for a fight with a level 29 fighter, then the fighter should be able to come prepared to fight the powerful wizard too = P Shouldn't he potentially have possessions like Ryld Argith (from the war of the spider queen)'s dispelling sword? Potions? And decked out in a magical item for every possible thing he could wear? If you can say the wizard can neutralize the warrior with __________, then the warrior should be able to neutralize the wizard with something else just as easily.
Problem here is that most wizards have a general idea on how to deal with Fighters, from the charging warrior types to the versatile types, to the unique/exotic-weapon types. Fighter, by contrast, had better have the correct feats and magical items to take on wizards of high level. And a wizard can adapt/change/switch their tactics on a whim (due to spells) where as a Fighter's versatility is built into his build (feat wise).
Now this is not exactly the same case in 4E. Fighter's ability to lock down enemies (via "marking") and the ability to make an OA (opportuinity attack) against any marked creature that shifts (5-ft move), moves their speed, or makes an attack that doesn't include the fighter is automatically getting attacked with no questions asked. Moreover, Fighters get a bonus to OAs in the form of their Wisdom modifier.
From the wizards side of things, they still have loads of versatility but their spells aren't as absolute. A spell that dazes, stuns, or renders creatures helpless are POWERFUL and change battles but they're not a definite guarentee of success and if they do hit, it's duration is only a few rounds at the most. Wizards spells also don't deal TONS of damage in the area of +10d6 in damage (ok, one does) but have lots of controll effects such as forced movement, creatures attacking their own allies, being knocked prone, stunned, dazed, penalties to AC-attacks-damage, etc.. |
| Artemas Entreri |
Posted - 02 Dec 2011 : 14:21:27
quote:
Originally posted by creyzi4zb12
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
Of course, that assumes that the wizard has all of those spells memorized that day, and that he hasn't already cast them... 
I believe that this is what makes a wizard most dangerous..If they do this, they can even take out non-spellcasters that have a higher level than them.
I remember reading in the Drizzt novels when Artemis Entreri said something about wizards being almost impossible to stop if they are prepared for a certain job. I even remember Entreri loosing to a wizard who burned an entire warehouse to battle against his stealth (Jarlaxle to the rescue!!)
I believe that was in Servant of the Shard if memory serves |
| _Jarlaxle_ |
Posted - 02 Dec 2011 : 12:36:55
I think the problem in this discussion is that there is story telling mixed with game mechanics.
In a novel you can't go by pure game mechanics because this would make bad and boring stories. So there a monk can easily defeat dragons or a low level char kill a balor and so on.
But if you go by game mechanics this is a whole diffrent story and Diffan has the right of it as fighters suck in direct comparision to wizards. That doesn't mean playing a fighter sucks so, imho you can have a lot of fun with each class if you like it. |
| creyzi4zb12 |
Posted - 02 Dec 2011 : 11:49:16
quote:
Originally posted by Ghostfinger
I've just remembered something called "Ki" which enable warriors do things that is not normally probable.
How is "Ki" explained in FR ? Is it considered magic or entirely something else ?
Think warriors can exploit this "Ki" things to have an equal ground to spell-casters ?
Grandmaster Kane = Read the novel Road of the Patriarch...he's one of those imba monks out there...maybe a munchkin since he can take out two dragons barehanded. |
| Ghostfinger |
Posted - 02 Dec 2011 : 07:15:21
I've just remembered something called "Ki" which enable warriors do things that is not normally probable.
How is "Ki" explained in FR ? Is it considered magic or entirely something else ?
Think warriors can exploit this "Ki" things to have an equal ground to spell-casters ? |
| creyzi4zb12 |
Posted - 02 Dec 2011 : 00:32:01
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
Of course, that assumes that the wizard has all of those spells memorized that day, and that he hasn't already cast them...
I believe that this is what makes a wizard most dangerous..If they do this, they can even take out non-spellcasters that have a higher level than them.
I remember reading in the Drizzt novels when Artemis Entreri said something about wizards being almost impossible to stop if they are prepared for a certain job. I even remember Entreri loosing to a wizard who burned an entire warehouse to battle against his stealth (Jarlaxle to the rescue!!) |
| MrHedgehog |
Posted - 01 Dec 2011 : 20:37:37
I agree with Wooly, i've never played at a level higher than like... 15 (and i've only played 4th edition a couple of times, ever) so I don't really know what happens at high levels regarding mechanics but there a lot of "what ifs" you could say. And even if there are loopholes to do super powerful things in theory the character classes are supposed to be equal power wise? Bard, cleric, rogue, fighter, druid, etc.
If the wizard is prepared for a fight with a level 29 fighter, then the fighter should be able to come prepared to fight the powerful wizard too = P Shouldn't he potentially have possessions like Ryld Argith (from the war of the spider queen)'s dispelling sword? Potions? And decked out in a magical item for every possible thing he could wear? If you can say the wizard can neutralize the warrior with __________, then the warrior should be able to neutralize the wizard with something else just as easily. |
| Wooly Rupert |
Posted - 01 Dec 2011 : 19:20:50
Of course, that assumes that the wizard has all of those spells memorized that day, and that he hasn't already cast them... |
| Diffan |
Posted - 01 Dec 2011 : 16:10:40
quote:
Originally posted by MrHedgehog
A level 29 fighter should be just as powerful as a level 29 wizard. (Although I guess it depends on which edition you'd be looking at?)
Although i'm not aware of any warriors that high level (Unless Shurrupak counts?) being that powerful, in theory, they should be. A really high level warrior would have abilities that would mirror the power of an archmage, would they not? However a warrior becomes powerful enough to single defeat a dragon could be "magical" in some way even if its not directly controlling magic. Like how a monk can (in the D&D universe at least) punch through stone, or whatever, a warrior would learn to tap into similar physical feats.
A high level warrior would also presumably have powerful weapons (and artifacts?)
I agree with you about class balance, yet that's not really the case in editions prior to 4E. As Wooly stated, it largely depneds on circumstances, however those circumstances heavily favor the Wizard. The Wizard has various ways, through spells, to get the drop on the Fighter where the Fighter would need feats to compete. Take the wrong feats and he's done for.
What exactly is a Fighter supposed to do against a wizard who casts a Quickened spectral hand then Otto's Irrestable Dance? Lets say the Fighter gets to the wizard first, makes an incredible attack and drops the wizard 1/2 his total HP (requiring a DC 15 fort save or die). The Wizard's base Fort at this level is +6, which drops the precentage to almost half. Add in ability score modifiers, magical items, and Feats makes this rule practically null-and-void.
The wizard 5-ft steps backwards, casts the Quickend spectral hand then touches the fighter with irrestable dance and now the fighter is helpless for 1d4+1 rounds. So a minimum of 2 rounds the wizard can then use Time Stop to: buff himself up, cast summon spells, and terrain hindering spells. When the Time Stop ends, Summon monster attacks against the Fighter's AC (-4 penalty, -10 to Reflex saves, and provokes AoOs) while the wizard blasts him with Reflex-Save spells or whatever The spell has no saving throw yet is subject to Spell Resistance. Most Fighters don't have Spell Resistance Armor, and if it does, it's usually too low, which Wizards easily overcome.
It's these sorts of incidents (which can eaily be done by NPCs and monsters with class levels) that make the disparity between spellcasting and non-spellcasting classes so obvious
|
| Ayrik |
Posted - 01 Dec 2011 : 15:14:56
Another thing to consider ... not a lot of those squishy wizards can survive up to the epic levels without a big strong buddy to tank for them while they're growing up. |
| Bladewind |
Posted - 01 Dec 2011 : 14:54:02
A feat I see that most tales of epic warriors share is the sheer tenaciousness and toughness that epic warriors have. Some even gain a form of invincibility that can only be overcome with intimate knowledge of the warriors weakness and in certain specific instances.
In Celtic-Irish legends the warrior Cu Chulainn was able to fight battles while repeatedly being stabbed, rended apart and pummeled by the spears, swords and cudgels of the enemy. He could fight without tiring; he once defeated an army by challenging and slaying every single commander the foes could bear in a proces that took months. He sometimes fought in a berserker rage that transformed him into a hideous monster. Cu Chulainn eventually succumbed to three legendary cursed spears wielded by Lugaid mac Con Roi, after he was weakened because he broke his vows to never eat dogmeat (he was bound by laws of hospitality and tricked into eating dog by an old hag). Cu Chulainn tied himself up on a stone to die standing, and his corpse terrified his foes for a time untill Lugaid cut off his head. His hero soul-energy exploded from his neck, cutting off Lugaids arm.
A level 20 warrior should be able to have gear that allows them to one shot critical hit a foe of fearsome reputation. They can successfully command armies against great odds. After level 30 a warrior should be breaking the laws of nature, and start to show a measure of godhood. They can single-handedly slay armies and come back from wounds that would instantly slay lesser beings. So a level 40 warrior in the realms should be nigh unkillable, and the results of killing him should be devastating in some way; as they are practically gods in mortal form. |
| creyzi4zb12 |
Posted - 01 Dec 2011 : 11:37:25
Some IMBA non spellcasters in the Realms
- Kane that "Monk of the Flower monastery thingy" from Road of the Patriarch was said to beat two full grown dragons bare-handed. It was said that he was able to trick the two dragons into breathing fire towards each other.
- There was this one dude I keep hearing about (forgot his name), some kind of gladiator of Thay who beat a dracolich using a stick. I think he was mentioned a lot of times in some threads on my time at boards1.wizards
- Shurrupak (I don't know if he counts since he has wizard levels on him), was said to walk in front of an army as everybody shivers in fear and can't do anything about it.
- If you're thinking about Drizzt and Entreri sagas, one guy stands out above all of them. Bruenor Battlehammer, that guy wrestled a PitFiend all on his own.
- Obould Many Arrows (with his armor/the only badass whom Drizzt was never able to defeat in melee) could take down an army of demons. And he once threw Gerti Orelsdottr (i don't know if that's the correct spelling) with ease. Gerti is considered epic BTW
- The protagonist from Netheril Trilogy "Sunbright" was a barbarian from the Ravens Clan, he defeated a Netherese archwizard who came back from hell (This hell-netherese was able to defeat one of the great Netheri-Archwizards Polaris (who commanded her very own floating city) with ease)..survived an encounter with Lord Karsus himself and continued the Ravens Clan Bloodline, if that's not epic then I don't know what is.
- The Cat Lord = it's kind of weird how you point this guy out. He's a level 37 rogue, and he's able to travel several planes and loves cats. He was considered semi-divine (god of cats?)
|
| MrHedgehog |
Posted - 01 Dec 2011 : 08:23:56
A level 29 fighter should be just as powerful as a level 29 wizard. (Although I guess it depends on which edition you'd be looking at?)
Although i'm not aware of any warriors that high level (Unless Shurrupak counts?) being that powerful, in theory, they should be. A really high level warrior would have abilities that would mirror the power of an archmage, would they not? However a warrior becomes powerful enough to single defeat a dragon could be "magical" in some way even if its not directly controlling magic. Like how a monk can (in the D&D universe at least) punch through stone, or whatever, a warrior would learn to tap into similar physical feats.
A high level warrior would also presumably have powerful weapons (and artifacts?) |
| creyzi4zb12 |
Posted - 01 Dec 2011 : 06:57:03
quote:
Originally posted by entreri3478
Normal weapons won't harm most archmages. Why would a genius archmage not be ready for a warrior? Even if they were totally caught by surprise they would still have contingencies in order.
What? I didn't know this? Who made this rule up? Unless there's a buff out there (which would expire), wizards can be killed by normal weapons.
As far as I know, the only way to determine if a wizard is really immune to a fighter at equivalent high level is through PvP.
Go PvP in 3.5 or 4e rules...let's see what a level 15 wizard can do to a level 15 fighter with a fort/ref/will of 30 above |
| Wooly Rupert |
Posted - 30 Nov 2011 : 21:42:35
quote:
Originally posted by entreri3478
Normal weapons won't harm most archmages. Why would a genius archmage not be ready for a warrior? Even if they were totally caught by surprise they would still have contingencies in order.
And where is it written that normal weapons won't hurt an archmage?
You think that even a genius could prepare for every single possible contingency? Archmages are people, too. People can be surprised, and people make mistakes. |
| Artemas Entreri |
Posted - 30 Nov 2011 : 20:28:09
quote:
Originally posted by entreri3478
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
quote:
Originally posted by entreri3478
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
quote:
Originally posted by Kentinal
quote:
Originally posted by entreri3478
Who is better at counter-acting magical items? Wizards or warriors?
It still depends on equipment, Cloak of magic resistance, ring of spell turning. +5 Vorpal Sword, +20 vs. spell casters and so on. Boots of speed, there are so many items a wizard or a fighter can acquire that could effect which of the two could be best equipped to counter magic items.
Indeed. And while the wizard is busy counter-acting the magical sword, the fighter steps up and stabs him in the throat with a non-magical dagger. And so on.
It's all situational.
You think a warrior would be able to walk up to Szass Tam, Elminster, or Telamont and stab them in the throat with a dagger? Fascinating
If they weren't ready for him to do so, why not?
Normal weapons won't harm most archmages. Why would a genius archmage not be ready for a warrior? Even if they were totally caught by surprise they would still have contingencies in order.
Unless of course you are a moron like Aznar Thrul  |
| Artemas Entreri |
Posted - 30 Nov 2011 : 20:27:13
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
quote:
Originally posted by entreri3478
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
quote:
Originally posted by Kentinal
quote:
Originally posted by entreri3478
Who is better at counter-acting magical items? Wizards or warriors?
It still depends on equipment, Cloak of magic resistance, ring of spell turning. +5 Vorpal Sword, +20 vs. spell casters and so on. Boots of speed, there are so many items a wizard or a fighter can acquire that could effect which of the two could be best equipped to counter magic items.
Indeed. And while the wizard is busy counter-acting the magical sword, the fighter steps up and stabs him in the throat with a non-magical dagger. And so on.
It's all situational.
You think a warrior would be able to walk up to Szass Tam, Elminster, or Telamont and stab them in the throat with a dagger? Fascinating
If they weren't ready for him to do so, why not?
Normal weapons won't harm most archmages. Why would a genius archmage not be ready for a warrior? Even if they were totally caught by surprise they would still have contingencies in order. |
| Wooly Rupert |
Posted - 30 Nov 2011 : 19:45:57
quote:
Originally posted by entreri3478
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
quote:
Originally posted by Kentinal
quote:
Originally posted by entreri3478
Who is better at counter-acting magical items? Wizards or warriors?
It still depends on equipment, Cloak of magic resistance, ring of spell turning. +5 Vorpal Sword, +20 vs. spell casters and so on. Boots of speed, there are so many items a wizard or a fighter can acquire that could effect which of the two could be best equipped to counter magic items.
Indeed. And while the wizard is busy counter-acting the magical sword, the fighter steps up and stabs him in the throat with a non-magical dagger. And so on.
It's all situational.
You think a warrior would be able to walk up to Szass Tam, Elminster, or Telamont and stab them in the throat with a dagger? Fascinating
If they weren't ready for him to do so, why not? |
| Artemas Entreri |
Posted - 30 Nov 2011 : 19:29:39
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
quote:
Originally posted by Kentinal
quote:
Originally posted by entreri3478
Who is better at counter-acting magical items? Wizards or warriors?
It still depends on equipment, Cloak of magic resistance, ring of spell turning. +5 Vorpal Sword, +20 vs. spell casters and so on. Boots of speed, there are so many items a wizard or a fighter can acquire that could effect which of the two could be best equipped to counter magic items.
Indeed. And while the wizard is busy counter-acting the magical sword, the fighter steps up and stabs him in the throat with a non-magical dagger. And so on.
It's all situational.
You think a warrior would be able to walk up to Szass Tam, Elminster, or Telamont and stab them in the throat with a dagger? Fascinating |
| Wooly Rupert |
Posted - 30 Nov 2011 : 19:13:37
quote:
Originally posted by Kentinal
quote:
Originally posted by entreri3478
Who is better at counter-acting magical items? Wizards or warriors?
It still depends on equipment, Cloak of magic resistance, ring of spell turning. +5 Vorpal Sword, +20 vs. spell casters and so on. Boots of speed, there are so many items a wizard or a fighter can acquire that could effect which of the two could be best equipped to counter magic items.
Indeed. And while the wizard is busy counter-acting the magical sword, the fighter steps up and stabs him in the throat with a non-magical dagger. And so on.
It's all situational. |
| Kentinal |
Posted - 30 Nov 2011 : 18:18:39
quote:
Originally posted by entreri3478
Who is better at counter-acting magical items? Wizards or warriors?
It still depends on equipment, Cloak of magic resistance, ring of spell turning. +5 Vorpal Sword, +20 vs. spell casters and so on. Boots of speed, there are so many items a wizard or a fighter can acquire that could effect which of the two could be best equipped to counter magic items. |
| Artemas Entreri |
Posted - 30 Nov 2011 : 14:26:36
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
quote:
Originally posted by entreri3478
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
quote:
Originally posted by entreri3478
A 1 on 1 battle between a high level warrior and a high level wizard will result in the warrior being cooked well-done.
Not necessarily. As has been pointed out previously, with any X vs. Y debate, much depends on the circumstances. For example, if this fight starts with the wizard only 10 feet from the warrior, the wizard's going to be eating a magic sword as soon as he opens his mouth to cast a spell.
Easily avoided with any number of magical items
And there you go: it depends on the circumstances, which would include what equipment each one has.
Who is better at counter-acting magical items? Wizards or warriors? |
| Ghostfinger |
Posted - 30 Nov 2011 : 06:00:51
So it comes down who can get into their killing range first ?
A Monk with its high spell-resistance and moving speed maybe ? |
| Wooly Rupert |
Posted - 29 Nov 2011 : 21:54:53
quote:
Originally posted by entreri3478
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
quote:
Originally posted by entreri3478
A 1 on 1 battle between a high level warrior and a high level wizard will result in the warrior being cooked well-done.
Not necessarily. As has been pointed out previously, with any X vs. Y debate, much depends on the circumstances. For example, if this fight starts with the wizard only 10 feet from the warrior, the wizard's going to be eating a magic sword as soon as he opens his mouth to cast a spell.
Easily avoided with any number of magical items
And there you go: it depends on the circumstances, which would include what equipment each one has. |
| Artemas Entreri |
Posted - 29 Nov 2011 : 21:40:54
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
quote:
Originally posted by entreri3478
A 1 on 1 battle between a high level warrior and a high level wizard will result in the warrior being cooked well-done.
Not necessarily. As has been pointed out previously, with any X vs. Y debate, much depends on the circumstances. For example, if this fight starts with the wizard only 10 feet from the warrior, the wizard's going to be eating a magic sword as soon as he opens his mouth to cast a spell.
Easily avoided with any number of magical items |
| Ayrik |
Posted - 29 Nov 2011 : 18:05:32
Fighters aren't allowed to have pets and allies as well? We're talking about characters who are higher level than Elminster.
Again - if one class is stronger than another then it indicates bad game balance. A properly balanced game would make players hesitate indecisively about what to bring to battle. The fiction seems to prefer catering to the popular conception that wizards can lay waste to all obstacles. My preference would be more balance*. My gamers certainly favour warrior types over spellcasters.
* Well, actually I would prefer fewer gods, and consequently, fewer priests. |
| Wooly Rupert |
Posted - 29 Nov 2011 : 18:02:29
quote:
Originally posted by entreri3478
A 1 on 1 battle between a high level warrior and a high level wizard will result in the warrior being cooked well-done.
Not necessarily. As has been pointed out previously, with any X vs. Y debate, much depends on the circumstances. For example, if this fight starts with the wizard only 10 feet from the warrior, the wizard's going to be eating a magic sword as soon as he opens his mouth to cast a spell. |
| Artemas Entreri |
Posted - 29 Nov 2011 : 15:21:11
If you are saying the fighter gets to bring his army to the confrontation with the wizard then i suppose the wizard will bring his pet dragons, pit fiends, vampire generals, etc.
A 1 on 1 battle between a high level warrior and a high level wizard will result in the warrior being cooked well-done. |
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