| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| jordanz |
Posted - 06 Aug 2011 : 04:10:51
Vuron, Grazzt's right hand man intrigues me. He is a very non Demon acting Demon. He is almost like a Demonized "Spock". Wouldn't mind seeing him pop up in a novel. He's was cool in those Gord books from way back.
What about you guys? |
| 30 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| althen artren |
Posted - 01 Sep 2011 : 23:10:37
My favored archfiend is the dead one sticking out
on the business end of my sword. |
| Shemmy |
Posted - 01 Sep 2011 : 09:59:33
quote:
Originally posted by The Sage
quote:
Originally posted by Ayrik
Which books are the best sources for lore about Daru Ib Shamiq and baernaloth?
I'm going from memory, but I recall the Hellbound: The Blood War boxed set has scattered sections/info on the baernaloth.
I don't think Daru is mentioned outside of the Hellbound box set, though his kindred are mentioned elsehwere (2e Faces of Evil: The Fiends, 3.x Fiendish Codex I, a few times in Dragon/Dungeon magazine in 3.x).
The only other named baernaloth was Harishek Ap Thulkesh (named in passing in Dragon in a listing of demiplanes and their descriptions; no room to expand on him there, but I've done a lot of non-canon stuff online with him). |
| The Sage |
Posted - 01 Sep 2011 : 08:39:56
quote:
Originally posted by Ayrik
Which books are the best sources for lore about Daru Ib Shamiq and baernaloth?
I'm going from memory, but I recall the Hellbound: The Blood War boxed set has scattered sections/info on the baernaloth. |
| Ayrik |
Posted - 01 Sep 2011 : 07:17:26
Which books are the best sources for lore about Daru Ib Shamiq and baernaloth? |
| Dennis |
Posted - 11 Aug 2011 : 16:24:56
quote:
Originally posted by Synthalus
my vote would be for Mephistopheles. He is so sinister and cunning. A true example of the way lawful evil should be.
And he's the most ambitious. Which I think all archdevils should be. |
| Synthalus |
Posted - 11 Aug 2011 : 11:43:42
my vote would be for Mephistopheles. He is so sinister and cunning. A true example of the way lawful evil should be. Gargauth is a close second though. i have always loved gargauth. |
| Chosen of Asmodeus |
Posted - 11 Aug 2011 : 09:07:59
quote:
Originally posted by Dennis
How exactly does Levistus maintain dominance over his realm? Can't another archdevil just smash his "cage" and crush him with it?
Magical/psionic communication with his minions, and an avatar ruling proxi for him.
As for the cage; Asmodeus made it. As such it's enchantments are likely beyond the skill of any other archdevil to undo. Asmodeus wants Levistus alive, suffering in his prison. |
| jordanz |
Posted - 11 Aug 2011 : 05:31:53
Ok you know my favorite, time for some honorable mentions.
King of Ghouls - Iknow little about this guy but since ghouls are my favorite type of undead you cant go wrong here.
Orcus - he's like the obvious choice, he's the prototype for what most people picture as a Demon Lord
Kostchtchie- I always considered this dude to be the ultimate test for an epic level fighter. He's a brute who I'd love to see depicted in a novel. |
| Dennis |
Posted - 10 Aug 2011 : 14:06:56
How exactly does Levistus maintain dominance over his realm? Can't another archdevil just smash his "cage" and crush him with it? |
| Chosen of Asmodeus |
Posted - 10 Aug 2011 : 10:37:58
quote:
Originally posted by Fellfire
I, myself, plan to free poor Levistus, the greatest swordsman in the multiverse. His wrath will be boundless. Let all Hell tremble.
Was planning on freeing him myself. Kind of hard to put his head on a pike when he's so deep in the ice, after all.
All part of an over-arching storyline I'm running involving the second Reckonning, bringing death to the disloyal in a consolodation of power for the master of Nessus. |
| Kno |
Posted - 10 Aug 2011 : 09:20:06
Gargauth: he is power corrupts. No one said Lolth |
| Fellfire |
Posted - 10 Aug 2011 : 03:32:12
I, myself, plan to free poor Levistus, the greatest swordsman in the multiverse. His wrath will be boundless. Let all Hell tremble. |
| Chosen of Asmodeus |
Posted - 09 Aug 2011 : 11:55:00
Well, Levistus is. But he's immune to pretty much everything, what with being trapped in an iceberg. Kind of a mixed blessing, that. |
| Dennis |
Posted - 09 Aug 2011 : 11:39:08
I thought Levistus is immune to the effects of his realm... But even if he's not, his mind/essence as an archdevil must have been hardwired to accept the effects as comforts rather than suffering. |
| Chosen of Asmodeus |
Posted - 09 Aug 2011 : 11:34:27
Look, I'm not saying there isn't a sinister beauty in watching someone freeze to death; their flesh turning blue and then black as the water in their cells crystalizes, destroying the tissue, rotting their bodies even as they draw breath...where was I going with this...oh yes. But then there's the wind. The deafening, howling wind that drives you to madness even as it soaks you in the dagger-like sprays of water from the River Styx, robbing you of your memories, your very sense of self. Yes, it's a wonderful place to send your enemies, and ruling it by proxy would be a sweet gig, but actually living there? No thank you, sir. No thank you. |
| Dennis |
Posted - 09 Aug 2011 : 11:28:24
Yes, I pretty much like the intense, bone-chilling cold. I like ice as much as fire. |
| Chosen of Asmodeus |
Posted - 09 Aug 2011 : 11:21:32
The smartest one of them is Dagon. If intelligence and beauty are in direct corralation here, that is a sad statement.
And Levistus is mostly luck; Belial was pretty sure he could take him before he got distracted with the whole, Glaysa issue. Not to mention; would you want to rule Stygia? |
| Dennis |
Posted - 09 Aug 2011 : 11:10:31
Not all of them. Depending on which angle you're looking at.
Anyway, I haven't seen any vote for Levistus. I think the imprisonment is a major turn-off. But then again, he's able to command armies, silently rules his own layer in Hell, and keeps his rivals at bay. |
| Chosen of Asmodeus |
Posted - 09 Aug 2011 : 10:47:08
That would explain why they're all ugly as sin. |
| Dennis |
Posted - 09 Aug 2011 : 10:24:48
quote:
Originally posted by jordanz
quote:
Originally posted by Dennis
I might vote for Graz'zt for being the only handsome (by demon standards, of course) and most fashionable archdevil.
Yes and to have someone as calculating and logical as Vuron as your advisor is downright GANGSTA!
I read somewhere (I can't recall exactly, but it's either in one of the Warhammer novels, or the Riftwar Cycle) that among demons, "good looks" and brains usually go together. |
| jordanz |
Posted - 09 Aug 2011 : 06:00:55
quote:
Originally posted by Dennis
I might vote for Graz'zt for being the only handsome (by demon standards, of course) and most fashionable archdevil.
Yes and to have someone as calculating and logical as Vuron as your advisor is downright GANGSTA! |
| Dennis |
Posted - 08 Aug 2011 : 09:16:12
I might vote for Graz'zt for being the only handsome (by demon standards, of course) and most fashionable archdevil. |
| Chosen of Asmodeus |
Posted - 08 Aug 2011 : 04:37:11
Yea, I doubted it was. Saw it brought up on tvtropes and looked into it; like I said, can't find anything on him except that and a couple other fan pages.
Personally I'm rather fond of the fan theory floating around that Graz'zt is Asmodeus' son. 4e changed him to an archdevil who invaded the Abyss on Asmodeus' orders and went native. A lot of people cried foul that it controdicted the lore about Graz'zt being the child of Pale Night and an unknown father until someone noticed that there was another piece of lore saying that Asmodeus had once mated with Pale Night, which can be used to tie the two stories together. Under this light I rather like the implications of Graz'zt as the rebellious prince. |
| Dennis |
Posted - 08 Aug 2011 : 03:52:39
quote:
Originally posted by Chosen of Asmodeus
I'm a big fan of Glasya, as well. One of my major disappointments with 4e is that the Belial/Fiernia/Glasya plot didn't advance at all, or that they didn't further Glasya's plots for vengeance against Levistus. Oh well, homebrew.
I am hoping James P. Davis would make a sequel to The Shield of Weeping Ghosts and delve more into the plots of Levistus.
quote:
Originally posted by Chosen of Asmodeus
Speaking of, I was recently informed about a character named Lixerhttp://worldsofimagination.com/monster%20devil%20Lixer%20Prince%20of%20Hell.htm , Asmodeus' son and co-heir with Glasya. An interesting character, though I can't say I like him much(little too hyper-competent for my tastes), but I can't seem to find anything resembling "offical" for him.
I don't think that's canon. |
| Chosen of Asmodeus |
Posted - 08 Aug 2011 : 03:27:04
4e story paints the obyriths as coming from another universe that they had managed to destroy. They punched a whole into another universe, forcing a shard of pure evil through. They waited for someone to find it as their universe died around them, until the shard was discovered by Tharizdun, who used it to pull them through. After a prolonged battle, Tharizdun fled into the elemental chaos, planting the shard of evil at the bottom, where the abyss formed around it. The obyriths took residence there, and primordials were drawn in, where they became the first demons(Demogorgon, Orcus, and Baphomet among them).
Yugoloths, and baernaloths among them are listed as demons in 4e; no specific origin has been given to them but there's the suggestion/implication that there's something different about them than the others. |
| Fellfire |
Posted - 08 Aug 2011 : 03:18:42
Daru Ib Shamiq, The Lie Weaver. I want to know more. I found some good information at Planewalker (thank you Shemeska!) is there more? I'm in the dark regarding Baernaloth. Help out a curious clueless Prime. |
| Shemmy |
Posted - 08 Aug 2011 : 02:46:39
quote:
Originally posted by Bladewind
My vote goes to Gargauth for an archdevil and Baphomet for an archdemon. Gargauth's activities on Toril are just so scary and unpredicable. Baphomet is an uncontrollable force of bestial nature with a demonic cunning.
I am quite unfamiliar with all the bearnoloth lore but sure like their premise. Can't make a proper choice amongst them though.
What exists was mostly released during 2e Planescape, though they were later referenced in the 3.5 Fiendish Codex I, and in several of the late 3.5 Demonomicon articles. Basically they created yugoloths, demodands/gehreleths, obyriths, and the ancient baatorians (who were largely supplanted when Asmodeus and the future baatezu fell from true law to LE), and while most of them have since vanished from the known multiverse, abandoning it and their creations alike, the ones who still exist manipulate the other fiends like a giant game of chess with billion year long turns. Or they're utterly insane and wholly absorbed by the very spiritual wasting they represent, and long ago abandoned any meaningful role. Nobody knows. But they're possibly the oldest extant creatures in the planes.
Only two of them have ever been overtly named: Daru Ib Shamiq who was apparently responsible for granting the younger fiendish races their teleportation abilities, and Harishek Ap Thulkesh 'The Blind Clockmaker' (about whom little was said because I didn't have enough space in the article to do more than mention him, heh). |
| Bladewind |
Posted - 08 Aug 2011 : 01:05:36
My vote goes to Gargauth for an archdevil and Baphomet for an archdemon. Gargauth's activities on Toril are just so scary and unpredicable. Baphomet is an uncontrollable force of bestial nature with a demonic cunning.
I am quite unfamiliar with all the bearnoloth lore but sure like their premise. Can't make a proper choice amongst them though. |
| Chosen of Asmodeus |
Posted - 08 Aug 2011 : 00:35:50
quote:
Originally posted by Dennis
I would also vote for Glasya. Given time, she would most likely inherit Asmodeus's throne. Besides, rarely do we see an evil female who holds such power and status.
I'm a big fan of Glasya, as well. One of my major disappointments with 4e is that the Belial/Fiernia/Glasya plot didn't advance at all, or that they didn't further Glasya's plots for vengeance against Levistus. Oh well, homebrew.
Speaking of, I was recently informed about a character named Lixerhttp://worldsofimagination.com/monster%20devil%20Lixer%20Prince%20of%20Hell.htm , Asmodeus' son and co-heir with Glasya. An interesting character, though I can't say I like him much(little too hyper-competent for my tastes), but I can't seem to find anything resembling "offical" for him. |
| The Sage |
Posted - 07 Aug 2011 : 15:52:36
quote:
Originally posted by Shemmy
Daru Ib Shamiq for many reasons. Plus he's older by eons than any other creature thus far named on the thread.
Any of the baernaloth, really. Partly due to your own detailing, of course. But, also, because I've long been a particular fan of the baern and my own theories about connecting them to the Dark Powers of "Ravenloft."
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