| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| dfemling |
Posted - 28 Aug 2008 : 19:05:56
Lords and ladies of the realms, i have loved the realms for 20 years now. I have played campaigns in 6 diffrent countries and have loved the rich and vibrant feel of the realms enjoyed the persional touch and care that i have seen alot of you fans/writers have put into the game.
I kept an open mind coming in to this major change, and now after reading through the campaign book i have found few positive and lots a negeative aspects in the new setting. I want to stay away from ranting and raving but i am so confused about these changes.
As a whole i find that D&D 4th edition feels like it's own system and nothing like D&D of past events. And now there are so many changes to the campaign, lost story lines that the Authors have set through out the expansions, and we the players have waited for word or product release to further these seeds into gaming oppurtunities.
Bottom line, the realms have lost it's magical feeling. I now see it as a product used to further a companies new product launch, not the loved and cherished creation that has been developed through the years.
I hope that i have not come of to bitter, and i just would like to see some fresh perspective to these new realms. I need help finding the magical feeling that should be the realms trademark!
Thank you for your time(and sorry for spelling errors, i am a soldier that has not the refined sense of spell check ) |
| 30 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| Rinonalyrna Fathomlin |
Posted - 06 Sep 2008 : 23:33:16
quote:
Originally posted by arry
I'm not going to give up the Realms. I'm giving up on WotC's Realms. 
That's how I look at it. |
| Ahwe Yahzhe |
Posted - 06 Sep 2008 : 21:45:59
quote:
Originally posted by Swordsage
In comparison, the FRCG repeats much 1E/2E/3E information in less detail and 'updates' it for the current year with broad brushstrokes. The new elements introduced have an embarrasing lack of detail (what currency is used in Tymanther? We get told what currency is used in Cormyr ... for the FOURTH time ...) and as the book stands now with only the haphazard dangling carrot of articles in the DDI, they require significant and likely "all too hard" work on the part of FR DMs to bring up to speed in relation to hosting a campaign. The question that confronts me is: if I'm going to do all this work, why not do a homebrew setting? If I want more detail, the Realms is not where it's at anymore. Golarion looks a better bet.
Coupled with what I consider is a large amount of 'whitespace'(just look at the space left at the end of Ed's Returned Abeir section - you can't tell me that Ed underwrote here ... he's never done that in his life!) and a larger font than was used in the core rulebooks as well as filler material like the Loudwater and Treasure Table sections (which were again done in a far superior fashion in the 4E core rulebooks), I get a sense of this product being something of a rush job and/or lacking in focus.
I have it. There are parts of it I like. Some parts I like a lot. But overall this is a disappointing endpoint for the Realms in terms of published products.
The Swordsage
Surprising how well this echoes all my impressions upon receiving my copy of the FRCG. The generic overviews, the large font and big chunks of white space on the pages, etc. Great production value, and some interesting ideas: dragonmarks/spellscars in FR instead of game-wrecking Spellfire, floating earthmotes, and lots of dead gods and blown-up realms (although the return of Nethril, Vilhon, and High Imaskar look like they could be fun.) But ultimately, it simply lacks sufficient content to make me care about these places. These are the things I posted on the "FRCG Satisfaction Poll" before that scroll was locked down.
I think people get it backwards- as a DM without a lot of time, I prefer a rich background and lots of detail that I can steal off the page and use for my campaign, not a nearly-blank slate. As another poster mentioned, if the new FR has this little detail in it, why not just create a home-brew world?
I am running a campaign that started with whatever 4e materials I could get my hands on: H1 with FR conversion(pretty good), H2 w/ FR conversion (OK), FRCG, the new Cormyr article with the better area map (except for the disappearance of the Thunder Peaks near the Tilver Gap, including the Bloodhorn.) But I still have to pull all of my interesting plot points and lore from earlier products: the Arcane Age: Cormanthyr (1e), Volo's Guide to Cormyr (1e), Cormyr (2e), and FRCS (3e). Which just reminds me that most of what is in the FRCG on Cormyr is an chopped-up few paragraphs of what was in the earlier books. And what expansion is offered in the 4e product is confusing: in the article, the king is Azoun VI, in the FRCG, it's what's-his-face with the evil cousin. Who's the king, anyway?
My point is that even in sticking to a well-known part of the Realms, and using a fair amount of new support articles, I still don't have any real sense of the kingdom or its history without referring to previous materials.
So how does that save me time in creating an interesting campaign? Should I be happy with the "stop the slavers in Saruun Khel" hook? Maybe the problem is I've used the stop-the-slavers plot too many times (A1-4, anyone?)
|
| arry |
Posted - 06 Sep 2008 : 17:35:28
I'm not going to give up the Realms. I'm giving up on WotC's Realms. |
| MerrikCale |
Posted - 06 Sep 2008 : 15:10:05
Hopefully, the new Realms is a financial disaster or so disliked and they retcon, but it doesn't appear that way. I guess its time to give up on the Realms |
| The Sage |
Posted - 06 Sep 2008 : 00:37:55
quote:
Originally posted by The Red Walker
Ah yes, I believe you shared thats in Erik's scroll, hence the confusion by me! (you won't even share it on your blog? I think would drive up your hits!)
Heh.
As it is, I'm not really all that interested in attracting large audiences to my blog. As I said in it's foundation post, it's mainly a place for me to ramble. If some of my online friends what to ramble along with me, that's fine.
As for sharing that particular tale on my blog, well... I know it'll likely result in the driving up of one form of hits. But it won't be of the virtual kind, if you follow my meaning.  |
| The Red Walker |
Posted - 05 Sep 2008 : 21:34:39
quote:
Originally posted by The Sage
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
quote:
Originally posted by The Red Walker
LOL, this from a scribe who once used his wife's eberron book as a doorstop?
I believe that was our many-faced Sage, who's about due for another avatar change.
Aye. 'Twas me. Needless to say, the Lady K was not happy! I won't say what she did later to gain a measure of revenge for herself. 
Ah yes, I believe you shared thats in Erik's scroll, hence the confusion by me! (you won't even share it on your blog? I think would drive up your hits!)
Apologies the the lanky writer of dark sexy Realms novels for accusations of book doorstoppering |
| sfdragon |
Posted - 04 Sep 2008 : 10:26:04
if you didnt like the book use it for TP.....
failing that take it to a bookstore that buys and sells used books.
like i wanted to do with my copy of the 4e frcs. |
| The Sage |
Posted - 04 Sep 2008 : 03:32:14
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
quote:
Originally posted by The Red Walker
LOL, this from a scribe who once used his wife's eberron book as a doorstop?
I believe that was our many-faced Sage, who's about due for another avatar change.
Aye. 'Twas me. Needless to say, the Lady K was not happy! I won't say what she did later to gain a measure of revenge for herself.
|
| Wooly Rupert |
Posted - 04 Sep 2008 : 03:18:06
quote:
Originally posted by The Red Walker
quote:
Originally posted by The Sage
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
I'm taking the FRCG and the Pathfinder book (assuming it arrives in time) on the honeymoon. When those are read (and after we're back from Ireland), it's back to reading the Ptolus book. Then I can get to Castlemourn.
Here's an idea... have your soon-to-be wife read you passages from the FRCG while you peruse your copy of Castlemourn.
If you have time while on honeymoon, let alone while in Ireland you must never sleep! That or you value the FR too much!
ed:sp
I honestly don't expect to get much reading done, other than en route to and from Ireland (we're leaving from Orlando). But I don't travel away from home without more than enough reading material.  |
| Wooly Rupert |
Posted - 04 Sep 2008 : 03:16:16
quote:
Originally posted by The Red Walker
LOL, this from a scribe who once used his wife's eberron book as a doorstop?
I believe that was our many-faced Sage, who's about due for another avatar change. |
| The Red Walker |
Posted - 04 Sep 2008 : 02:58:03
quote:
Originally posted by Erik Scott de Bie
Note that this post will add anything to the actual discussion at hand, but . . .
quote:
Originally posted by The Red Walker
I myself, if I dislike a book I have purchased, try to sell it on eBay or trade it in at a book handler so someone who does want it can get it on the cheap, but thats just me!
Not that it's on subject or anything, but I am personally extremely offended when someone writes that they spent a few minutes on a book, didn't like it, and threw it in the trash/fire/garbage disposal/dog . . .
. . .
. . . Mostly because I believe in recycling.
Also, in my state (Washington), it's actually illegal not to recycle.
Cheers
LOL, this from a scribe who once used his wife's eberron book as a doorstop? Now that's re-cycling at is finest!
P.S. point of clarity, I always finish a book once started no matter how tough the reading. ie, The Children of Hurin...I love JRR, but i had to set it aside and will pick it up again with a clear frame of mind!
I think the more I read this scroll, the more i realize people are going to find in something pretty much what they expect to.
If you don't like the recent changes, your probably not gonna like thr new FRCS. If you think its refreshing, you will find the FRCS to be new and fresh. |
| StarBog |
Posted - 04 Sep 2008 : 01:35:38
quote:
. . . Mostly because I believe in recycling.
Also, in my state (Washington), it's actually illegal not to recycle.
Cheers
To get back even more on topic, or perhaps even less on topic, is there recycling as a concept (or practice) in the Realms, or does the availability of the Planes effectively mean an unlimited source of materials?
(hmmmm...maybe this should go in the Ask... scrolls?) |
| Erik Scott de Bie |
Posted - 04 Sep 2008 : 00:37:46
Note that this post will add anything to the actual discussion at hand, but . . .
quote:
Originally posted by The Red Walker
I myself, if I dislike a book I have purchased, try to sell it on eBay or trade it in at a book handler so someone who does want it can get it on the cheap, but thats just me!
Not that it's on subject or anything, but I am personally extremely offended when someone writes that they spent a few minutes on a book, didn't like it, and threw it in the trash/fire/garbage disposal/dog . . .
. . .
. . . Mostly because I believe in recycling.
Also, in my state (Washington), it's actually illegal not to recycle.
Cheers |
| The Hooded One |
Posted - 03 Sep 2008 : 20:07:24
Now, now, it's supposed to be a honeymoon, not a Sexual Olympics! Romance, yes, but part of romance is . . . anticipation.
(She breathed, casually undoing some buttons and languidly shifting her long limbs oh-so-casually into another pose, before idly rising and drifting away . . . with just one long, dark-eyed look full of promise back over her shoulder . . .)
LOVE,
THO |
| The Red Walker |
Posted - 03 Sep 2008 : 19:02:15
quote:
Originally posted by The Sage
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
I'm taking the FRCG and the Pathfinder book (assuming it arrives in time) on the honeymoon. When those are read (and after we're back from Ireland), it's back to reading the Ptolus book. Then I can get to Castlemourn.
Here's an idea... have your soon-to-be wife read you passages from the FRCG while you peruse your copy of Castlemourn.
If you have time while on honeymoon, let alone while in Ireland you must never sleep! That or you value the FR too much!
ed:sp |
| Ashe Ravenheart |
Posted - 03 Sep 2008 : 17:47:28
quote:
Originally posted by The Sage
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
I'm taking the FRCG and the Pathfinder book (assuming it arrives in time) on the honeymoon. When those are read (and after we're back from Ireland), it's back to reading the Ptolus book. Then I can get to Castlemourn.
Here's an idea... have your soon-to-be wife read you passages from the FRCG while you peruse your copy of Castlemourn.
How romantic! I'm sure it'd be a great honeymoon... |
| The Sage |
Posted - 03 Sep 2008 : 17:26:14
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
I'm taking the FRCG and the Pathfinder book (assuming it arrives in time) on the honeymoon. When those are read (and after we're back from Ireland), it's back to reading the Ptolus book. Then I can get to Castlemourn.
Here's an idea... have your soon-to-be wife read you passages from the FRCG while you peruse your copy of Castlemourn. |
| Wooly Rupert |
Posted - 03 Sep 2008 : 17:01:54
quote:
Originally posted by Faraer
Take the plunge on Castlemourn, Wooly. Anyone pining for the pure discovery of the 1987 campaign set has it waiting for them in that book.
I shall. I just can't do it now. |
| Wooly Rupert |
Posted - 03 Sep 2008 : 16:58:11
quote:
Originally posted by The Red Walker
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
quote:
Originally posted by Faraer
quote:
Originally posted by The Sage
Well, there's always CASTLEMOURN.
I'd love to see a comparison between the Forgotten Realms Campaign Guide and the Castlemourn Campaign Setting by someone who has both.
I have both.
...But I've read neither. 
Well hurry up and get married, do the honey moon thing and get readin! Don't let us down furry one! It's your duty to read those forthwith!
I'm taking the FRCG and the Pathfinder book (assuming it arrives in time) on the honeymoon. When those are read (and after we're back from Ireland), it's back to reading the Ptolus book. Then I can get to Castlemourn. |
| Faraer |
Posted - 03 Sep 2008 : 16:50:13
Take the plunge on Castlemourn, Wooly. Anyone pining for the pure discovery of the 1987 campaign set has it waiting for them in that book. |
| The Red Walker |
Posted - 03 Sep 2008 : 14:57:57
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
quote:
Originally posted by Faraer
quote:
Originally posted by The Sage
Well, there's always CASTLEMOURN.
I'd love to see a comparison between the Forgotten Realms Campaign Guide and the Castlemourn Campaign Setting by someone who has both.
I have both.
...But I've read neither.
Well hurry up and get married, do the honey moon thing and get readin! Don't let us down furry one! It's your duty to read those forthwith! |
| The Sage |
Posted - 03 Sep 2008 : 06:00:14
I'd actually be curious to see something like that myself. |
| Wooly Rupert |
Posted - 03 Sep 2008 : 04:57:12
quote:
Originally posted by Faraer
quote:
Originally posted by The Sage
Well, there's always CASTLEMOURN.
I'd love to see a comparison between the Forgotten Realms Campaign Guide and the Castlemourn Campaign Setting by someone who has both.
I have both.
...But I've read neither. |
| Swordsage |
Posted - 02 Sep 2008 : 23:56:01
quote:
Originally posted by Christopher_Rowe
So, my experience of the setting and the rules set doesn't match up with yours, because I'm a "people who want to understand how things are related, how the things work and why something has happened as it is described in the timeline." I am! I am people!
And, as has been said by myself and others, I think the book I bought has as much on offer in those departments as the gray box that got me started in the Realms. YummyVee, as the kid say.
That's where my views on the FRCG and yours diverge, Mr Rowe, because clearly the new product contains nothing new or groundbreaking as was the case with the Grey Boxed Set.
The latter showcased for the first time such things as mages' sigils, examples of mercenary companies, a large number of city maps with locations (albeit not fleshed out), the idea of lore-focused items such as unique spellbooks (for those who hadn't spotted them in DRAGON magazine), currency (of all sorts), a Roll of Years (which still today remains the hands-down, most elegant and simple way to open vistas of adventuring ideas for DMs in the Realms - something that practically every FR novel author should doff their hat to Ed about) and references to wonderful things to come like elven High Magic and Chosen and a few other things.
In comparison, the FRCG repeats much 1E/2E/3E information in less detail and 'updates' it for the current year with broad brushstrokes. The new elements introduced have an embarrasing lack of detail (what currency is used in Tymanther? We get told what currency is used in Cormyr ... for the FOURTH time ...) and as the book stands now with only the haphazard dangling carrot of articles in the DDI, they require significant and likely "all too hard" work on the part of FR DMs to bring up to speed in relation to hosting a campaign. The question that confronts me is: if I'm going to do all this work, why not do a homebrew setting? If I want more detail, the Realms is not where it's at anymore. Golarion looks a better bet.
Coupled with what I consider is a large amount of 'whitespace'(just look at the space left at the end of Ed's Returned Abeir section - you can't tell me that Ed underwrote here ... he's never done that in his life!) and a larger font than was used in the core rulebooks as well as filler material like the Loudwater and Treasure Table sections (which were again done in a far superior fashion in the 4E core rulebooks), I get a sense of this product being something of a rush job and/or lacking in focus.
I have it. There are parts of it I like. Some parts I like a lot. But overall this is a disappointing endpoint for the Realms in terms of published products.
The Swordsage
|
| sfdragon |
Posted - 02 Sep 2008 : 22:07:39
the castlemourn setting isnt bad, they have glow in the dark elves....
its an ogl setting, and looks pretty good, it is a low magic setting... |
| Faraer |
Posted - 02 Sep 2008 : 20:28:29
quote:
Originally posted by The Sage
Well, there's always CASTLEMOURN.
I'd love to see a comparison between the Forgotten Realms Campaign Guide and the Castlemourn Campaign Setting by someone who has both. |
| Markustay |
Posted - 02 Sep 2008 : 20:16:36
Book stores take them back.
I don't know about online stores though; I don't ever buy from them.
But I don't see why anyone would want to return it - I can get tons of use out of it. Its also good to level a wobbly chair. |
| The Red Walker |
Posted - 02 Sep 2008 : 20:10:20
I would think that it would be expensive to heat with current prices of the 4e materials, but if you bought one and want to burn it, more power to you!
I myself, if I dislike a book I have purchased, try to sell it on eBay or trade it in at a book handler so someone who does want it can get it on the cheap, but thats just me! |
| Christopher_Rowe |
Posted - 02 Sep 2008 : 19:37:03
quote:
Originally posted by Uzzy
I find the new Realms product to be a fairly good heating product, so that's got some value at least.
Funny! Love that book burning humor! Here's a good one from noted wiseguy Ray Bradbury:
quote:
"Do you ever read any of the books you burn?"
He laughed. "That's against the law!"
"Oh. Of course."
--Fahrenheit 451
|
| Uzzy |
Posted - 02 Sep 2008 : 19:26:11
I find the new Realms product to be a fairly good heating product, so that's got some value at least. |
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