| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| Ranin |
Posted - 22 Feb 2007 : 16:55:32
Ok I have a basic question. I know elven folk have no body or facial hair like humans do. But what what about half-elves? Am I correct in my assumption that half-elves may have a range of body and facial hair amounts,depending how much elven or human blood they have in them? What are everyone's thoughts? |
| 30 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| Jorkens |
Posted - 16 May 2008 : 10:50:29
quote:
Originally posted by Kajehase
quote:
Originally posted by Faraer
Other kinds of people 'have accents', 'all look the same', 'smell funny', 'hate freedom', and on and on.
Especially the ones from Trøndelag (no idea if the place has an English name).
Are we talking about facial hair or dialect (which you must agree is easier understood than certain areas of Dalarne?
Ah, the days of the moustachioed drow. If you get hold of the Complete book of Elves from 2ed. Rainin, you will find every drow male looking like they jumped out of the 70's. |
| Kajehase |
Posted - 11 May 2008 : 12:58:18
quote:
Originally posted by Faraer
Other kinds of people 'have accents', 'all look the same', 'smell funny', 'hate freedom', and on and on.
Especially the ones from Trøndelag (no idea if the place has an English name). |
| Rinonalyrna Fathomlin |
Posted - 09 May 2008 : 22:46:33
quote:
Originally posted by Erik Scott de Bie
I even mentioned her toilet, and while it's only a passing comment about the need to relieve herself . . . I'll just add that it wasn't rose water.
I remember that scene--I liked it. |
| Erik Scott de Bie |
Posted - 09 May 2008 : 18:08:30
quote:
Originally posted by Rinonalyrna Fathomlin
In the novel Depths of Madness, the protagonist is a elven female, and yet the author doesn't flinch about the fact that she doesn't get much of an opportunity to bath and groom herself, and thus becomes quite dirty and smelly.
I even mentioned her toilet, and while it's only a passing comment about the need to relieve herself . . . I'll just add that it wasn't rose water.
Though I did stop short of describing her . . . grooming. 
(Not for want of imagination, but rather because there was never a particularly relevant opportunity.)
Cheers |
| Faraer |
Posted - 05 May 2008 : 02:07:33
Other kinds of people 'have accents', 'all look the same', 'smell funny', 'hate freedom', and on and on. |
| Rinonalyrna Fathomlin |
Posted - 05 May 2008 : 01:17:57
quote:
Originally posted by monknwildcat
For some reason, perhaps it was reading El in Myth Drannor, I'd understood that humans stank and had more hair than elves. Was that simply cultural sentiment?
I think it's safe to say that an elf speaking of humans is likely to be quite a biased account.
Humans generally are considered to be more hirsute creatures than elves. As for them "stinking" though? Well, I'd bet if an elf didn't bath often (ie. they lived under a bridge, as I mentioned before), they'd probably stink, too.
In the novel Depths of Madness, the protagonist is a elven female, and yet the author doesn't flinch about the fact that she doesn't get much of an opportunity to bath and groom herself, and thus becomes quite dirty and smelly. |
| monknwildcat |
Posted - 04 May 2008 : 01:03:11
re: elven holy symbols and nether art
I can just see the less-sophisticated elf-lad drunk on elven spirits and starlight attempting social interaction at Myth Drannor's temple district's summer solstice: "May I see your holy symbol, milady?" *hic* "Ooo, you follow the Winged Mother!"
For some reason, perhaps it was reading El in Myth Drannor, I'd understood that humans stank and had more hair than elves. Was that simply cultural sentiment? But, like KEJr mentioned, it could just be from reading Tanis in Dragonlance.
And, Rino, you bring up a good point about eyebrows and hair. I chalked that up as further homage to an almost medieval Japanese portayal of elven culture, what with their sexual openness, fastidiousness, cultural superiority over the more Euro humans, extensive sword-art, isolationism, and willingness to believe an ounce of non-elven blood made you a not-person.
Aravine, I understand what I think you were trying to say. Many gaming groups are more comfortable with the violence than with sexuality in RPGs.
Ergdusch, if your half-elf hails from Aglarond, you could switch it up by having one of those ancient gods subsumed within the Seldarine and Sharess be his patron (as an aspect of the appropriate deity). It's amusing that they were apparently human deities before the green elves worshipped them. Might be appropriate for local half-elves.... |
| Ergdusch |
Posted - 30 Apr 2008 : 07:08:27
quote:
Originally posted by Dalor Darden
quote:
Originally posted by Kuje
If it was my game, I'd run it like Rino mentions for divine casters and in fact that is how I run my games if you are a divine caster.
A deity chooses the divine caster by supplying that person with spells and if you insult/anger/deny/etc that deity then you lose the divine abilities until the deity is content with your actions to resupply said divine powers.
The only alteration to my "way" is that most often a mortal prays fervently to their chosen god (should I use the word Chosen...or will all my postings be hunted down and slain by WotC? ) and then, if the god is happy with the supplicant, they become a priest. There are obviously those that a god DOES watch though, and they are special cases.
Thant's what I ment!
I thank you all for your input. |
| Dalor Darden |
Posted - 30 Apr 2008 : 04:11:29
quote:
Originally posted by Kuje
If it was my game, I'd run it like Rino mentions for divine casters and in fact that is how I run my games if you are a divine caster.
A deity chooses the divine caster by supplying that person with spells and if you insult/anger/deny/etc that deity then you lose the divine abilities until the deity is content with your actions to resupply said divine powers.
The only alteration to my "way" is that most often a mortal prays fervently to their chosen god (should I use the word Chosen...or will all my postings be hunted down and slain by WotC? ) and then, if the god is happy with the supplicant, they become a priest. There are obviously those that a god DOES watch though, and they are special cases. |
| Kuje |
Posted - 30 Apr 2008 : 01:19:23
If it was my game, I'd run it like Rino mentions for divine casters and in fact that is how I run my games if you are a divine caster.
A deity chooses the divine caster by supplying that person with spells and if you insult/anger/deny/etc that deity then you lose the divine abilities until the deity is content with your actions to resupply said divine powers. |
| Rinonalyrna Fathomlin |
Posted - 30 Apr 2008 : 01:12:13
Well, it's your game, so ultimately you can use whatever concept you like best.
However, I still think the idea of a god being the one to call a person into service has grounding in the FR setting. That's my take on it, and the concept I would use. |
| Ergdusch |
Posted - 29 Apr 2008 : 16:20:09
quote:
Originally posted by Rinonalyrna Fathomlin
quote:
Originally posted by Ergdusch
To answer your question, Rino - the character (a PC of mine - see above) wants to become a cleric but not until later in the game. Now, I was wondering about how defined his knowledge of a god would have to be in order for the worshiping PC to actually be granted spells.
Here's my take--anyone can be a priest as long as a god calls them to be. I don't think a person needs to have any "defined knowledge" of said deity in the least.
It's not a matter of what the PC knows, it's a matter of what the god wants.
Well I was thinking along the same lines at first. Then I came to realized that a god might not neccisarily be aware of such an individual. To my understanding, a god does not watch any single individual on Toril. And withouth the person never voicing the gods name, he (the god) would have no real means of knowing about his devotion unless it would be his 'portfolio' or the likes.
After all - I doubt that all clerics are chosen for great destinies. Somrie might actually become clecs out of their own motives and are granted spells by the gods for their utter adamant devotion in the faith, IMO.
Or, for that matter more than one god could 'claim' the person for different purposes. While I know that a person might worship and also be a cleric of more than one god, the entire concept of not really knowing abouth the gods and still worshipping them triggered my interest enough to post the querry here. |
| Rinonalyrna Fathomlin |
Posted - 29 Apr 2008 : 15:44:00
quote:
Originally posted by Ergdusch
To answer your question, Rino - the character (a PC of mine - see above) wants to become a cleric but not until later in the game. Now, I was wondering about how defined his knowledge of a god would have to be in order for the worshiping PC to actually be granted spells.
Here's my take--anyone can be a priest as long as a god calls them to be. I don't think a person needs to have any "defined knowledge" of said deity in the least.
It's not a matter of what the PC knows, it's a matter of what the god wants. |
| Rinonalyrna Fathomlin |
Posted - 29 Apr 2008 : 15:40:59
quote:
Originally posted by The Sage
How can you really assume that will be the case, though? Perhaps your hypothetical character will be something like Torm, and during his sexual dalliances, eventually becomes aware of such specific female elven genital grooming.
Anyway, I would think a lot of people would care about the grooming of their potential partner (even "down there"). After all, what if your prospect looked like they lived under a bridge or something? *laughs* |
| Ergdusch |
Posted - 29 Apr 2008 : 08:09:49
Interesting what a discussion on hair can develope! 
Anyways, thanks for your thoughts on the half-elf priest matter, you guys. I will ponder on this a little while.
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
*snip*
I'd go with the prayer book idea, myself. This would not only give the character more of a connection to Corellon (the deity picked him and led him to the faith, after all!), but it gives the DM more opportunities -- maybe a special quest from Corellon before the character becomes a full-on priest, or maybe he has to win the approval of the clergy when he does find an established temple...
I very much like the 'book'-idea of yours Wolly. By the way, another matter I forgot to mention, the Half-elf character is actaully an PC while I am the DM! So - yes this would give ME great opportunities!
quote:
Originally posted by Rinonalyrna Fathomlin
Ergdusch, this character of yours. Does he want to be a priest? That's not too clear from your post.
To answer your question, Rino - the character (a PC of mine - see above) wants to become a cleric but not until later in the game. Now, I was wondering about how defined his knowledge of a god would have to be in order for the worshiping PC to actually be granted spells.
quote:
Originally posted by Ladejarl
Don't forget Mileikki, or Khalreshaar as she is called among the Elves. There is this story of her being the daughter of Hanali and Silvanus. A half-eleven godess.
I thought of Mielikki but she was just to 'forest-focused' IMO and too little elfish for this purpose.
Again fellow sribes, my thanks so far. |
| The Sage |
Posted - 29 Apr 2008 : 01:26:37
quote:
Originally posted by Aravine
okay, I don't know about you, but if I met a "nekkid elfchic" in-game, the last thing i would be thinking about is how she...grooms herself. and I'd say an encounter such as that would be memorable irregardless of if that detail was included.
How can you really assume that will be the case, though? Perhaps your hypothetical character will be something like Torm, and during his sexual dalliances, eventually becomes aware of such specific female elven genital grooming.
As I said above, it really does depend on just what you want to do with a particular scene or piece of an adventure that would offer the opportunity for such campaign detail.
|
| The Sage |
Posted - 29 Apr 2008 : 01:19:37
quote:
Originally posted by Aravine
quote:
Originally posted by The Sage
Yes, though sometimes a part of the campaign will warrant such a level of detail. For example, Aravine, if you actually read the entry in Ed's replies that Kuje initially referred to, you'll note that there is actually a reason for why Ed felt the need to add that little tidbit.
I actually did read that exscript from Ed. However, I still think It is a little too much detail. Verne also had a reason, although he wasn't creating a world, so that's not the best example.
I'm not sure how you can consider it too much detail. Ed's often said that his players were and are superb actors/roleplayers, and demand a world that felt real to them. This particular detail would only add to that campaign depth, as I noted earlier.
Overall, I think the level of campaign detailing, depends somewhat on both the type of people you're campaigning with, and the DM's attitude and involvement toward campaign design. In Ed's, and my own case, we prefer deeply immersive campaign worlds that include detailed aspects for just about every single piece of an adventure that the PCs will experience. We want to know that when the PCs wish to explore just how far the world around them extends -- there will always been something there for them to find, regardless of how far the detailed aspect has to go. We want them to know that there's always something new they can discover, deep inside the worlds we create. |
| Ladejarl |
Posted - 28 Apr 2008 : 21:40:04
quote:
Originally posted by Ergdusch
Another half-elven question, this time concerning his clerical path:
Would Corellon Larethian answer prayers from a half-elven Cleric?
Would there be another elven god more suited for the worship of a half-elf? Sehanine Moonbow comes to my mind...
Don't forget Mileikki, or Khalreshaar as she is called among the Elves. There is this story of her being the daughter of Hanali and Silvanus. A half-eleven godess. |
| Wooly Rupert |
Posted - 28 Apr 2008 : 20:16:06
quote:
Originally posted by Aravine
okay, I don't know about you, but if I met a "nekkid elfchic" in-game, the last thing i would be thinking about is how she...grooms herself. and I'd say an encounter such as that would be memorable irregardless of if that detail was included.
Ah, but the scenario happened to someone that had encountered more than one nekkid elfchic. Apart from the psychological factor of seeing such a thing, the interesting grooming would make its bearer (barer? ) stand out more than a nekkid elfchic without such an intriguing feature.
But wow, have we gone off-topic! 
|
| Aravine |
Posted - 28 Apr 2008 : 18:14:45
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
quote:
Originally posted by Aravine
quote:
Originally posted by The Sage
Yes, though sometimes a part of the campaign will warrant such a level of detail. For example, Aravine, if you actually read the entry in Ed's replies that Kuje initially referred to, you'll note that there is actually a reason for why Ed felt the need to add that little tidbit.
I actually did read that exscript from Ed. However, I still think It is a little too much detail. Verne also had a reason, although he wasn't creating a world, so that's not the best example.
If it comes up in the game -- as happened here -- then how is it too much detail? Keep in mind that it's often a tiny bit of detail that turns something forgettable into something memorable. While a nekkid elfchic is something most of us don't encounter in-game, if we did encounter one, a minor detail like how her pubes are groomed would make the encounter stand out much more readily than if that detail was not given.
okay, I don't know about you, but if I met a "nekkid elfchic" in-game, the last thing i would be thinking about is how she...grooms herself. and I'd say an encounter such as that would be memorable irregardless of if that detail was included. |
| Rinonalyrna Fathomlin |
Posted - 28 Apr 2008 : 18:11:36
Ergdusch, this character of yours. Does he want to be a priest? That's not too clear from your post. I was going to say, anyone can worship any deity they want to. If they want to be a cleric, that's when they have to worry about whether or not the deity in question would grant them spells.
If your character wants to worship the elven gods, and he's dedicated enough, I don't see why he couldn't be a priest (he can be a cleric of one elven deity he identifies with most, and still venerate the others). |
| Wooly Rupert |
Posted - 28 Apr 2008 : 18:10:32
quote:
Originally posted by Aravine
quote:
Originally posted by The Sage
Yes, though sometimes a part of the campaign will warrant such a level of detail. For example, Aravine, if you actually read the entry in Ed's replies that Kuje initially referred to, you'll note that there is actually a reason for why Ed felt the need to add that little tidbit.
I actually did read that exscript from Ed. However, I still think It is a little too much detail. Verne also had a reason, although he wasn't creating a world, so that's not the best example.
If it comes up in the game -- as happened here -- then how is it too much detail? Keep in mind that it's often a tiny bit of detail that turns something forgettable into something memorable. While a nekkid elfchic is something most of us don't encounter in-game, if we did encounter one, a minor detail like how her pubes are groomed would make the encounter stand out much more readily than if that detail was not given.
Besides, it's not unreasonable to assume that in a fantasy world, something like that would happen. Grooming hair (no matter where it is) is something that happens quite readily in the real world, for a lot of different reasons, so it is quite logical to assume it would happen in a fantasy world. |
| Aravine |
Posted - 28 Apr 2008 : 17:52:14
quote:
Originally posted by The Sage
Yes, though sometimes a part of the campaign will warrant such a level of detail. For example, Aravine, if you actually read the entry in Ed's replies that Kuje initially referred to, you'll note that there is actually a reason for why Ed felt the need to add that little tidbit.
I actually did read that exscript from Ed. However, I still think It is a little too much detail. Verne also had a reason, although he wasn't creating a world, so that's not the best example. |
| The Sage |
Posted - 28 Apr 2008 : 17:38:23
Yes, though sometimes a part of the campaign will warrant such a level of detail. For example, Aravine, if you actually read the entry in Ed's replies that Kuje initially referred to, you'll note that there is actually a reason for why Ed felt the need to add that little tidbit. It adds campaign depth, as well as another facet to a particular PC.
From Ed, back in Dec. '04:-
"As it happens, all of the Knights can attest that Merith Strongbow has both (scant, but dark in hue and definitely present) facial and body hair (though unlike human males, he doesn’t get facial stubble if he doesn’t shave every morning, and in fact never needs to shave) and Torm of the Knights can tell you that certain elf ladies of his acquaintance definitely have genital hair abundant enough to be trimmed into shapes. A subject I’d probably better say nothing more about. :}"
|
| Aravine |
Posted - 28 Apr 2008 : 17:33:05
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
quote:
Originally posted by Aravine
quote:
Originally posted by Kuje
Really.
Ed even mentioned elven females that shaved thier.... into shapes. :)
You know, It is at this point I think that certain people have maybe given a little too much thought to...the mythology that is D&D, FR specifically
It's simply being thorough. I wish I could think up that much detail while creating a new world!
Thorough is one thing, I have no problem with Thorough. Thorough is good. but there is a fine line between Thorough and unnecessary. For example, Tolkien was thourogh. No problem with that. then there is 20,000 Leagues. Verne used so much detail, so thourogh, what with the scientific name of every animal they encountered, that it became unnecessary. the thnig is, unless I'm just one who runs a immature campaign, that is something that is really not something that is imparitive to know. |
| Wooly Rupert |
Posted - 28 Apr 2008 : 17:22:21
quote:
Originally posted by Aravine
quote:
Originally posted by Kuje
Really.
Ed even mentioned elven females that shaved thier.... into shapes. :)
You know, It is at this point I think that certain people have maybe given a little too much thought to...the mythology that is D&D, FR specifically
It's simply being thorough. I wish I could think up that much detail while creating a new world! |
| Wooly Rupert |
Posted - 28 Apr 2008 : 17:20:32
quote:
Originally posted by Ergdusch
Thanks for your answers so far. However, I should have elaborated on the character a little more:
I was thinking of a half-elf character who grew up in an exclusive human environment. He would not have much knowledge of elven religion or elven lore and might not even know of Corellon Larethian or any other elven God for that matter. Therefore, in his attempt to embrace his elfen roots he would venerate not a god in general but more his elven nature or the 'aspect of all that is elvish' in general.
Again, with this in mind: would Corellon be the most proper god to answer his prayers as he is the leader of the elven panthoen?
Or, as the worship of this particular half-elf cannot be narrowed down to particualr parts - the 'aspect' he embraces being more like a distand 'dream' to him, a mysterium he has no real knowledge of - Sehanine Moonbow might be the better choice to grant him spells.
Sehanine herself is spiritual and ephemeral, evades any attempt to define her. Similarly the worship of the half-elf lacks any borders for definition.
Thoughts?
Considering that deities are real, I don't see why anyone would simply worship a concept such as elfishness.
The way I would handle it... If the character does feel a strong draw towards things elvish, I'd either have Corellon send him little signs (see his manifestations in Demihuman Deities) that would lead the character into a position where he can actually find out about Corellon, or have Corellon send an existing cleric into the character's area.
With the first method, you could do something like have little signs that lead the character into finding an old shrine, a book about the Seldarine, or even a prayer book dedicated to Corellon. You could even be a bit more overt, and have the signs lead the character to a temple or cleric of Corellon.
The other method would be to have an NPC cleric meet the character, who then learns about Corellon. The character could become a student of the NPC cleric, or could be inspired enough by the cleric to find his own way to the faith (into being a priest, in other words).
I'd go with the prayer book idea, myself. This would not only give the character more of a connection to Corellon (the deity picked him and led him to the faith, after all!), but it gives the DM more opportunities -- maybe a special quest from Corellon before the character becomes a full-on priest, or maybe he has to win the approval of the clergy when he does find an established temple... |
| Aravine |
Posted - 28 Apr 2008 : 16:50:22
quote:
Originally posted by Kuje
Really.
Ed even mentioned elven females that shaved thier.... into shapes. :)
You know, It is at this point I think that certain people have maybe given a little too much thought to...the mythology that is D&D, FR specifically |
| Ergdusch |
Posted - 28 Apr 2008 : 16:41:07
Thanks for your answers so far. However, I should have elaborated on the character a little more:
I was thinking of a half-elf character who grew up in an exclusive human environment. He would not have much knowledge of elven religion or elven lore and might not even know of Corellon Larethian or any other elven God for that matter. Therefore, in his attempt to embrace his elfen roots he would venerate not a god in general but more his elven nature or the 'aspect of all that is elvish' in general.
Again, with this in mind: would Corellon be the most proper god to answer his prayers as he is the leader of the elven panthoen?
Or, as the worship of this particular half-elf cannot be narrowed down to particualr parts - the 'aspect' he embraces being more like a distand 'dream' to him, a mysterium he has no real knowledge of - Sehanine Moonbow might be the better choice to grant him spells.
Sehanine herself is spiritual and ephemeral, evades any attempt to define her. Similarly the worship of the half-elf lacks any borders for definition.
Thoughts? |
| Rinonalyrna Fathomlin |
Posted - 28 Apr 2008 : 14:38:56
quote:
Originally posted by Ergdusch
Would Corellon Larethian answer prayers from a half-elven Cleric?
Don't see why he wouldn't.
quote:
Would there be another elven god more suited for the worship of a half-elf? Sehanine Moonbow comes to my mind...
How about Hanali, goddess of love and therefore one particular goddess to thank for bringing an elf and a human together. |
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