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TheIriaeban
Senior Scribe

USA
904 Posts

Posted - 30 Mar 2021 :  17:53:54  Show Profile Send TheIriaeban a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Another "behind the scenes" question if you don't mind:

When y'all were writing the supplements, adventures, etc., did you have access to something like an index of all of the Ed's unpublished Realms materials or did you have to dig through thousands of pages to try and locate all the information Ed or previous writers had already created for a specific area, organization, item, or person?

"Iriaebor is a fine city. So what if you can have violence between merchant groups break out at any moment. Not every city can offer dinner AND a show."

My FR writeups - http://www.mediafire.com/folder/um3liz6tqsf5n/Documents
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George Krashos
Master of Realmslore

Australia
6296 Posts

Posted - 31 Mar 2021 :  13:32:19  Show Profile Send George Krashos a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by TheIriaeban

Another "behind the scenes" question if you don't mind:

When y'all were writing the supplements, adventures, etc., did you have access to something like an index of all of the Ed's unpublished Realms materials or did you have to dig through thousands of pages to try and locate all the information Ed or previous writers had already created for a specific area, organization, item, or person?



I've long had a chuckle at the idea that some fans hold that TSR/WotC always had some Realms "bible" for designers to consult. There were style guides and general guidelines about FR "dos and don'ts" but nothing like that has ever existed - and still doesn't despite some implied statements to the contrary.

So it always came down to this: who is writing the product? FR products have seen many hits and misses over the years. Some works by X were heavily over-written by Y, especially in 2E and the swinging gulf in quality typified by 1E was an example of just how green most FR authors were in terms of understanding the setting and their ability to create out of whole cloth in a way that seemed "Realmsian". Some few writers were prepared to ask for help and grateful when it was given, a lot were not. Personally, I think you can pick the former from the latter in terms of quality.

So, to your question - and noting that I can only speak from my personal experience. I worked on two types of FR products: the ones by Steven Schend where he actively canvassed the fan base for information/lore/references to include in his work - which produced the gorgeous LOI and EotSS boxed sets, and to a lesser extent SoFS. The other type were the works of Eric Boyd where he and I worked pretty closely to gather the information. I'm a compulsive Realms List maker and lore collector so when, for example, Eric started work on Dragons of Faerūn he asked me for all the dragon lore I could find. My list of dragons - suitably enhanced - formed the backbone of the web enhancement. I did the same thing for DDGttU, CoS:W, SK, POF, et. al. and we did a bunch of work behind the scenes for LEoF and RoF. 3E was where I made my biggest contribution to the published Realms.

So basically, I would trawl through the products and provide a bunch of references for Eric to add to the stuff he already had or was looking to incorporate and then I'd field the incessant questions that still pop up daily from him: I need a wizard active in the North in the 600s DR; are there any artifacts/powerful magic relating to the Tashalar?; what lore do we have on standing militaries in the Realms?, etc. etc.

So we are clear, I was the research guy with the occasional good idea - Eric was the genius writing guy, weaving it all together. Ed always did his own thing and being the creator of the whole shebang never needed to ask us mere mortals for assistance. As it should be.

So yes, I had to dig through thousands of pages. Still do. Daily. It's fun.

-- George Krashos

"Because only we, contrary to the barbarians, never count the enemy in battle." -- Aeschylus
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TheIriaeban
Senior Scribe

USA
904 Posts

Posted - 31 Mar 2021 :  14:32:09  Show Profile Send TheIriaeban a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by George Krashos

quote:
Originally posted by TheIriaeban

Another "behind the scenes" question if you don't mind:

When y'all were writing the supplements, adventures, etc., did you have access to something like an index of all of the Ed's unpublished Realms materials or did you have to dig through thousands of pages to try and locate all the information Ed or previous writers had already created for a specific area, organization, item, or person?



I've long had a chuckle at the idea that some fans hold that TSR/WotC always had some Realms "bible" for designers to consult. There were style guides and general guidelines about FR "dos and don'ts" but nothing like that has ever existed - and still doesn't despite some implied statements to the contrary.

So it always came down to this: who is writing the product? FR products have seen many hits and misses over the years. Some works by X were heavily over-written by Y, especially in 2E and the swinging gulf in quality typified by 1E was an example of just how green most FR authors were in terms of understanding the setting and their ability to create out of whole cloth in a way that seemed "Realmsian". Some few writers were prepared to ask for help and grateful when it was given, a lot were not. Personally, I think you can pick the former from the latter in terms of quality.

So, to your question - and noting that I can only speak from my personal experience. I worked on two types of FR products: the ones by Steven Schend where he actively canvassed the fan base for information/lore/references to include in his work - which produced the gorgeous LOI and EotSS boxed sets, and to a lesser extent SoFS. The other type were the works of Eric Boyd where he and I worked pretty closely to gather the information. I'm a compulsive Realms List maker and lore collector so when, for example, Eric started work on Dragons of Faerūn he asked me for all the dragon lore I could find. My list of dragons - suitably enhanced - formed the backbone of the web enhancement. I did the same thing for DDGttU, CoS:W, SK, POF, et. al. and we did a bunch of work behind the scenes for LEoF and RoF. 3E was where I made my biggest contribution to the published Realms.

So basically, I would trawl through the products and provide a bunch of references for Eric to add to the stuff he already had or was looking to incorporate and then I'd field the incessant questions that still pop up daily from him: I need a wizard active in the North in the 600s DR; are there any artifacts/powerful magic relating to the Tashalar?; what lore do we have on standing militaries in the Realms?, etc. etc.

So we are clear, I was the research guy with the occasional good idea - Eric was the genius writing guy, weaving it all together. Ed always did his own thing and being the creator of the whole shebang never needed to ask us mere mortals for assistance. As it should be.

So yes, I had to dig through thousands of pages. Still do. Daily. It's fun.

-- George Krashos



Thank you. That has certainly given me a better perspective on how the Realms has grown into something loved by so many people. And, I completely understand about the digging. I find it fun, too.

"Iriaebor is a fine city. So what if you can have violence between merchant groups break out at any moment. Not every city can offer dinner AND a show."

My FR writeups - http://www.mediafire.com/folder/um3liz6tqsf5n/Documents
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Gary Dallison
Great Reader

United Kingdom
5798 Posts

Posted - 31 Mar 2021 :  17:02:22  Show Profile Send Gary Dallison a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I think your greatest contributions are now in unpublished works.

Races of Faerun is one of my favourites. Which bits were yours (I'm guessing migration patterns)

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George Krashos
Master of Realmslore

Australia
6296 Posts

Posted - 01 Apr 2021 :  02:05:40  Show Profile Send George Krashos a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Eric and I re-did most of the human chapters - the racial histories of the Damarans and Illuskans stem from my historical work over the years.

-- George Krashos

"Because only we, contrary to the barbarians, never count the enemy in battle." -- Aeschylus
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ericlboyd
Forgotten Realms Designer

USA
1902 Posts

Posted - 05 Apr 2021 :  16:04:40  Show Profile  Visit ericlboyd's Homepage Send ericlboyd a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by George Krashos

Eric and I re-did most of the human chapters - the racial histories of the Damarans and Illuskans stem from my historical work over the years.

-- George Krashos



I do regret the use of the word "Damaran." "Impilturan" would have been more accurate, although perhaps there could have been a good word for the region that didn't focus on a particular kingdom.

--
http://www.ericlboyd.com/dnd/
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Grievous
Acolyte

4 Posts

Posted - 06 Apr 2021 :  17:00:47  Show Profile Send Grievous a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by George Krashos


I've come up with both a line of monarchs for Damara and a story for the origin of the name. Ed liked it. It also explains that godawful "FR" instead of "DR" dating system in FR9 Bloodstone Lands.

-- George Krashos



Hey George and all,

Just doing some research into Damara for a rejiggered old school Bloodstone campaign and was wondering if this list of monarchs for the kingdom ever managed to surface in some manner or is still locked up in a chest somewhere?
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TomCosta
Forgotten Realms Designer

USA
787 Posts

Posted - 06 Apr 2021 :  22:03:03  Show Profile Send TomCosta a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Several of George's lists made it into Grand History of the Realms, including that for Impiltur, but not Damara.
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George Krashos
Master of Realmslore

Australia
6296 Posts

Posted - 07 Apr 2021 :  10:11:35  Show Profile Send George Krashos a Private Message  Reply with Quote
There is no official lineage of Damara. I have one, but most of it is ... ahem ... made up.

-- George Krashos

"Because only we, contrary to the barbarians, never count the enemy in battle." -- Aeschylus
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ericlboyd
Forgotten Realms Designer

USA
1902 Posts

Posted - 07 Apr 2021 :  12:31:16  Show Profile  Visit ericlboyd's Homepage Send ericlboyd a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by George Krashos

There is no official lineage of Damara. I have one, but most of it is ... ahem ... made up.

-- George Krashos



We know George. The rest of us do the hard work of traveling to the Realms and interviewing surly Realmsians, but you just make it all up. ;-)

--
http://www.ericlboyd.com/dnd/
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
Moderator

USA
35541 Posts

Posted - 07 Apr 2021 :  16:41:48  Show Profile Send Wooly Rupert a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by ericlboyd

quote:
Originally posted by George Krashos

There is no official lineage of Damara. I have one, but most of it is ... ahem ... made up.

-- George Krashos



We know George. The rest of us do the hard work of traveling to the Realms and interviewing surly Realmsians, but you just make it all up. ;-)




And suddenly I find myself wondering... Which has more dangerous natural inhabitants, the Realms -- or Australia? Both have very large spiders, one has dragons, the other has drop bears...


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Gary Dallison
Great Reader

United Kingdom
5798 Posts

Posted - 07 Apr 2021 :  17:41:00  Show Profile Send Gary Dallison a Private Message  Reply with Quote
For a second there I had the horrifying thought that wotc had done an anchorome style adventure book and introduced drop bears as the latest kewl idea.


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Kyrene
Senior Scribe

South Africa
688 Posts

Posted - 02 Aug 2021 :  14:29:41  Show Profile  Visit Kyrene's Homepage Send Kyrene a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by George Krashos

Saisha Level 20 Poison

Made from ever-rarer Tashlutan herbs, this flavourless, reddish liquid is known as “Hammerlock” for the rigid immobility it causes. It is commonly used by slavers to subdue their prey.

Poison: 38,250 gp
Attack: +23 vs. Fortitude; paralyzed (save ends) [see sidebar].
Aftereffect: immobilised (save ends).
Special: If this poison is delivered by way of food or drink it makes its first attack 1d4 rounds after its victim consumes it. All saving throws against this poison are made with a -3 penalty.

quote:
Originally posted by George Krashos

was left crippled and blind by a malady that defied all attempts to heal it whether by magic or through more mundane medical efforts. Uldrith committed suicide some months afterward, unable to cope with the constant pain that wracked his body, and Wendren was anointed as heir of the Balindre family. Of course none know that Uldrith's malady was as a result of a rare poison, known as "minth" and hailing from the Tashalar which Wendren had a pleasure lass ply on a drunken Uldrith, thereby assuring his succession to the rulership of Telflamm.

Hi George,

Any idea on the 5E stats for "saisha" and (or indeed any for) "minth"?

Edit: Nevermind "saisha," I'll get that from DMsGuild and support you at the same time. Still interested in "minth" though...

Edit: Actually, Talona's Touch (purchased and downloaded thanks) says "Made from plants including maidbane, monk’s pepper and laburnam" instead of the above description. Am I to assume that those plants grow in Tashluta (or the Tashalar since Tashlutan could be the older use of Tashalan as seen in Serpent Kingdoms), and if so perhaps more exclusively by the priests of Talona in the House of Night's Embrace (therefore explaining "ever-rarer")? Personally, I prefer that but can probably live with finding the "ever-rarer" plants in secluded (and hard to get to) pockets of the Tashalar or even the Black or Mhair Jungles.

Lost for words? Find them in the Glossary of Phrases, Sayings & Words of the Realms

Edited by - Kyrene on 03 Aug 2021 12:37:00
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George Krashos
Master of Realmslore

Australia
6296 Posts

Posted - 06 Aug 2021 :  14:42:46  Show Profile Send George Krashos a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Hi Kyrene. I can't confess to any consistency, so my DMs Guild effort differs from what was posted here. I have no problem with the plants in question being more commonly found in the Tashalar or any of the ideas you have. The description is intended to provide campaign immersion and flexibility at the same time. Enjoy.

-- George Krashos

"Because only we, contrary to the barbarians, never count the enemy in battle." -- Aeschylus
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Kyrene
Senior Scribe

South Africa
688 Posts

Posted - 06 Aug 2021 :  17:25:55  Show Profile  Visit Kyrene's Homepage Send Kyrene a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by George Krashos

The description is intended to provide campaign immersion and flexibility at the same time. Enjoy.



Thanks for the reply!

In that case, for my upcoming Tashalan campaign, I'm going to interpret Tashlutan as Tashalan, with those three plants formerly having been more abundant in the Tashalar and Jungles, and now rarely found in the wild, but definitely cultivated by the priests of Talona.

Any ideas on the "minth" part of the question? More the lore, since I can take a stab at the stats now that I own your "DMs Guild effort"s as follows:
Minth (Ingested). George's awesome lore here.
A creature subjected to this poison must succeed on a DC 17 Constitution saving throw or take 7 (2d6) poison damage and become poisoned. The poisoned creature is blinded and must repeat the saving throw every 24 hours. Until this poison ends, the damage the poison deals can’t be healed by any means. Any creature that attempts to end an effect on the creature must succeed on a DC 17 spellcasting ability check or fail. After three successful saving throws, the effects end and the creature can heal normally.

I think that would satisfy "was left crippled and blind by a malady that defied all attempts to heal" while being low enough in damage to not outright kill a commoner NPC. I'd probably price it in line with Bakhalam (another long-duration DC 17 ingested poison).

Lost for words? Find them in the Glossary of Phrases, Sayings & Words of the Realms
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George Krashos
Master of Realmslore

Australia
6296 Posts

Posted - 07 Aug 2021 :  06:23:55  Show Profile Send George Krashos a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Kyrene

quote:
Originally posted by George Krashos

The description is intended to provide campaign immersion and flexibility at the same time. Enjoy.



Thanks for the reply!

In that case, for my upcoming Tashalan campaign, I'm going to interpret Tashlutan as Tashalan, with those three plants formerly having been more abundant in the Tashalar and Jungles, and now rarely found in the wild, but definitely cultivated by the priests of Talona.

Any ideas on the "minth" part of the question? More the lore, since I can take a stab at the stats now that I own your "DMs Guild effort"s as follows:
Minth (Ingested). George's awesome lore here.
A creature subjected to this poison must succeed on a DC 17 Constitution saving throw or take 7 (2d6) poison damage and become poisoned. The poisoned creature is blinded and must repeat the saving throw every 24 hours. Until this poison ends, the damage the poison deals can’t be healed by any means. Any creature that attempts to end an effect on the creature must succeed on a DC 17 spellcasting ability check or fail. After three successful saving throws, the effects end and the creature can heal normally.

I think that would satisfy "was left crippled and blind by a malady that defied all attempts to heal" while being low enough in damage to not outright kill a commoner NPC. I'd probably price it in line with Bakhalam (another long-duration DC 17 ingested poison).



That all sounds good to me. Didn't realise people paid so much attention to my off the cuff postings. I'll have to be more careful going forward!

-- George Krashos

"Because only we, contrary to the barbarians, never count the enemy in battle." -- Aeschylus
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Kyrene
Senior Scribe

South Africa
688 Posts

Posted - 07 Aug 2021 :  09:52:38  Show Profile  Visit Kyrene's Homepage Send Kyrene a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Or give it proper treatment, along with 19 other unknown poisons, in a third Talona's offering on DMs Guild? You can even use my poor attempt wholesale, and I'll pay you for the privilege. I can twist your arm harder if you want...

At the very least can't I entice you to add a few "off the cuff" sentences of lore for that wicked poison?

Lost for words? Find them in the Glossary of Phrases, Sayings & Words of the Realms
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Lukas Kain
Seeker

USA
60 Posts

Posted - 19 Aug 2021 :  06:21:35  Show Profile Send Lukas Kain a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:


That all sounds good to me. Didn't realise people paid so much attention to my off the cuff postings. I'll have to be more careful going forward!

-- George Krashos



George, I type up and cross-reference your musings and print them into a binder for a greater sense of cohesion and seeming-omniscience for my players in my Impiltur campaign. There are more than a few of us that pay great attention to your postings.
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ericlboyd
Forgotten Realms Designer

USA
1902 Posts

Posted - 19 Aug 2021 :  19:13:50  Show Profile  Visit ericlboyd's Homepage Send ericlboyd a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I, for one, find his complete omission of Realmslore about the demon-worshiping gnomes of Impiltur very frustrating.

--Eric

quote:
Originally posted by Lukas Kain

quote:


That all sounds good to me. Didn't realise people paid so much attention to my off the cuff postings. I'll have to be more careful going forward!

-- George Krashos



George, I type up and cross-reference your musings and print them into a binder for a greater sense of cohesion and seeming-omniscience for my players in my Impiltur campaign. There are more than a few of us that pay great attention to your postings.


--
http://www.ericlboyd.com/dnd/
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TheIriaeban
Senior Scribe

USA
904 Posts

Posted - 19 Aug 2021 :  19:35:15  Show Profile Send TheIriaeban a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by ericlboyd

I, for one, find his complete omission of Realmslore about the demon-worshiping gnomes of Impiltur very frustrating.

--Eric

quote:
Originally posted by Lukas Kain

quote:


That all sounds good to me. Didn't realise people paid so much attention to my off the cuff postings. I'll have to be more careful going forward!

-- George Krashos



George, I type up and cross-reference your musings and print them into a binder for a greater sense of cohesion and seeming-omniscience for my players in my Impiltur campaign. There are more than a few of us that pay great attention to your postings.





Hah! I had heard about them and wondered who came up with them. That is really devious, George. Having them steal only left shoes so it forces people to walk in circles. To be able to get anywhere they have to hop. I can understand how that would lead to so much murderous rage. Truly, a land of chaos.

"Iriaebor is a fine city. So what if you can have violence between merchant groups break out at any moment. Not every city can offer dinner AND a show."

My FR writeups - http://www.mediafire.com/folder/um3liz6tqsf5n/Documents
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
Moderator

USA
35541 Posts

Posted - 27 Oct 2021 :  05:11:03  Show Profile Send Wooly Rupert a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Krash, I seem to recall that a promise was made that we'd see more of the Covenant in the future... Not going to ask about that, though.

I'm tinkering with the idea of an NPC that sympathizes with the goals of the Covenant. He's long-lived enough that he may have been around when the Covenant leaders left the Realms, though I don't think he'll have been a member or even knew of the group at that time. (And he might not be that old; this is still very much in the spitballing phase).

In the mid-1370s timeframe, if a determined person already knew of the Covenant's existence, how much more would that person be able to learn? Where and in what form would such information be found?

I'm assuming most of the information available would be from after the group's demise, journals and memoirs by former members who survived the fighting at the end. Obviously, though, I'd love to hear your take on it.

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Edited by - Wooly Rupert on 27 Oct 2021 05:12:38
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George Krashos
Master of Realmslore

Australia
6296 Posts

Posted - 28 Oct 2021 :  00:49:59  Show Profile Send George Krashos a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Hi Wooly

There would be plenty of sages information about the group in terms of their clashes with the Red Wizards several centuries ago. The actual Tome of the Covenant is extant and as per City of Splendors: Waterdeep, the wizard Savengriff is looking to recreate the group. In terms of what form the information would take, I think it would either be something like an actual tome on the history of the Covenant (likely to be found in a major library in the North or Candlekeep), or alternatively something a bit less expansive such as a diary. Of course the coolest and most dangerous way to get the info might be conversing with the wizard trapped in the crystal ball to be found in the Stag-Horned Flagon in Amphail who may know something or not ...

-- George Krashos

"Because only we, contrary to the barbarians, never count the enemy in battle." -- Aeschylus

Edited by - George Krashos on 28 Oct 2021 01:40:09
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
Moderator

USA
35541 Posts

Posted - 28 Oct 2021 :  02:05:01  Show Profile Send Wooly Rupert a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by George Krashos

Hi Wooly

There would be plenty of sages information about the group in terms of their clashes with the Red Wizards several centuries ago. The actual Tome of the Covenant is extant and as per City of Splendors: Waterdeep, the wizard Savengriff is looking to recreate the group. In terms of what form the information would take, I think it would either be something like an actual tome on the history of the Covenant (likely to be found in a major library in the North or Candlekeep), or alternatively something a bit less expansive such as a diary. Of course the coolest and most dangerous way to get the info might be conversing with the wizard trapped in the crystal ball to be found in the Stag-Horned Flagon in Amphail who may know something or not ...

-- George Krashos



Thankee for the info, friend Krash. I knew they were a secretive group, but also figured that word would have eventually spread.

But about that wizard... Were you referring to the one imprisoned by the Weeping Witch, at the Stone Stallion?

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Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
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I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen!

Edited by - Wooly Rupert on 28 Oct 2021 12:15:32
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George Krashos
Master of Realmslore

Australia
6296 Posts

Posted - 28 Oct 2021 :  13:15:23  Show Profile Send George Krashos a Private Message  Reply with Quote
That's the one.

-- George Krashos

"Because only we, contrary to the barbarians, never count the enemy in battle." -- Aeschylus
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
Moderator

USA
35541 Posts

Posted - 28 Oct 2021 :  13:36:18  Show Profile Send Wooly Rupert a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by George Krashos

That's the one.

-- George Krashos



It's an interesting idea. Given the info in the entry, I think I might have my guy aware of this imprisoned wizard, and trying to figure out how to safely deal with him. This would also involve the Weeping Witch.

At the least, it gives my NPC (who I intend to use more as a sponsor of quests) something else to send people to the area to look into.

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Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
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