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TomCosta
Forgotten Realms Designer
USA
645 Posts |
 Posted - 21 Sep 2019 : 01:43:07
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| Apparently. He joined Zariel's invasion of Hell among her army from Elturel. Things didn't quite work out for him (or anyone from Elturel). Players have a chance to help save him. |
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Gary Dallison
Great Reader
United Kingdom
4765 Posts |
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Renin
Learned Scribe
193 Posts |
Posted - 13 Oct 2019 : 15:03:22
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https://www.dndbeyond.com/posts/496-live-from-the-descent-who-is-zariel
From this article on DND beyond, they look at her history, but this line rankled; "
While information from sourcebooks of earlier editions of D&D aren't non-canon per se, books from the current edition (like Mordenkainen's Tome of Foes) should be considered authoritative."
And
"Zariel had a few brief mentions throughout the life of 3rd edition D&D in the Manual of the Planes (2001) and Fiendish Codex II: Tyrants of the Nine Hells (2006), but even in these books, Zariel remained Bel's prisoner, and the beleaguered pit fiend remained master of Avernus. Now in fifth edition D&D, Zariel is back. It's unclear how exactly she was freed from Bel's clutches and regained her control over Avernus—or if this element of her story is still canon at all! It's possible that Zariel's imprisonment has been retconned out of existence, and now Bel's relationship to Zariel is merely one of a deposed archdevil allowed to remain her lieutenant."
So, she's whatever they want her to be. |
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Zeromaru X
Master of Realmslore
Colombia
1384 Posts |
Posted - 14 Oct 2019 : 00:06:37
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| Well, back in 2017 they also said that all the novels are non-canon as well, unless they say otherwise. I guess, this means they have retconet all the storyline of D&D so far with a new one that they use for 5e (I suspected this when they retconed the story of the Raven Queen). |
Long ago, in the distant past, they fell into decay. The philosopher’s path... The river of glory... Even the saints resting in the darkness rise up without response and block the way... |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
32457 Posts |
Posted - 14 Oct 2019 : 00:23:43
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quote:
Originally posted by Zeromaru X
Well, back in 2017 they also said that all the novels are non-canon as well, unless they say otherwise.
I do not recall them saying this, in regards to the Realms. |
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I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen!  |
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Zeromaru X
Master of Realmslore
Colombia
1384 Posts |
Posted - 14 Oct 2019 : 00:42:18
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They were asked about Ravenloft, about some inconsistency between old novels and Curse of Strahd, but the answer was a general "Novels are of nebulous canonocity - not canon until we directly state as such" (Mike Mearls) or "I've been involved with D&D long enough to realize that what is "canonical" and what isn't changes on a whim and, ultimately, harms nothing" and "When it comes to D&D lore, we embrace things we like and discard things we don't. I can't unwrite something, but I can ignore it" (Chris Perkins).
Here are the sources:
https://www.sageadvice.eu/2018/02/07/are-the-ravenloft-novels-considered-canon/
https://www.sageadvice.eu/2017/01/06/how-much-of-the-old-dd-ravenloft-novels-are-actually-considered-canon/
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Long ago, in the distant past, they fell into decay. The philosopher’s path... The river of glory... Even the saints resting in the darkness rise up without response and block the way... |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
32457 Posts |
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Zeromaru X
Master of Realmslore
Colombia
1384 Posts |
Posted - 15 Oct 2019 : 17:09:21
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| So, if I'm reading this correctly, are Bane, Bhaal and Myrkul just demigods post-Second Sundering? |
Long ago, in the distant past, they fell into decay. The philosopher’s path... The river of glory... Even the saints resting in the darkness rise up without response and block the way... |
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George Krashos
Master of Realmslore
Australia
5615 Posts |
Posted - 16 Oct 2019 : 01:14:29
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quote:
Originally posted by Zeromaru X
They were asked about Ravenloft, about some inconsistency between old novels and Curse of Strahd, but the answer was a general "Novels are of nebulous canonocity - not canon until we directly state as such" (Mike Mearls) or "I've been involved with D&D long enough to realize that what is "canonical" and what isn't changes on a whim and, ultimately, harms nothing" and "When it comes to D&D lore, we embrace things we like and discard things we don't. I can't unwrite something, but I can ignore it" (Chris Perkins).
Here are the sources:
https://www.sageadvice.eu/2018/02/07/are-the-ravenloft-novels-considered-canon/
https://www.sageadvice.eu/2017/01/06/how-much-of-the-old-dd-ravenloft-novels-are-actually-considered-canon/
I was three-quarters of the way through posting on this and even creating a new topic in the General forum and then took a breath.
-- George Krashos |
"Because only we, contrary to the barbarians, never count the enemy in battle." -- Aeschylus |
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Renin
Learned Scribe
193 Posts |
Posted - 16 Oct 2019 : 19:56:17
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| You're a better man than I, George. That's why Hasbro simply doesn't get my money for DND anymore. |
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Gary Dallison
Great Reader
United Kingdom
4765 Posts |
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Seravin
Senior Scribe
Canada
972 Posts |
Posted - 16 Oct 2019 : 21:16:38
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| I know it's a bit off topic, but a consistent and cohesive lore in the shared world is what attracts me to the Realms and would keep me interested in future products. Throwing out past works and being wildly and willfully disrespectful of the established canon would cause me to totally disengage, and I'm sure many others. Star Wars got a huge backlash from The Last Jedi with its "kill the past" message and destruction of the old characters to usher in the new. I don't understand this "strategy" from marketing and content creators who inherit an established IP. |
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Baldur's Gate: Descent to Avernus spoilers
