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 Wardmists and tracers
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ericlboyd
Forgotten Realms Designer

USA
1740 Posts

Posted - 07 Apr 2020 :  00:21:37  Show Profile  Visit ericlboyd's Homepage Send ericlboyd a Private Message  Reply with Quote  Delete Topic
Wardmists and various tracer spells play a ubiquitous role in Ed's depiction of the Realms.

Has anything close been published for 3.5e?

--Eric

--
http://www.ericlboyd.com/dnd/

Ayrik
Great Reader

Canada
7058 Posts

Posted - 07 Apr 2020 :  00:48:52  Show Profile Send Ayrik a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I'm only aware of 2E mentions. In the FRA and some early FR# products, I think. Or maybe The North boxset (from WotC downloads) or Savage Frontier?

There was a place - a castle or a fortress keep? - founded by a rsnger somewhere near Luskan and Mirabar, I think. "Xanthorn's Keep" maybe. Defended by wards, mists, wardmists, descriptions and mechanics were provided.

Sorry I can't be more specific. Probably 20 years since I read that stuff.

[/Ayrik]

Edited by - Ayrik on 07 Apr 2020 00:50:30
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George Krashos
Master of Realmslore

Australia
5828 Posts

Posted - 07 Apr 2020 :  16:48:17  Show Profile Send George Krashos a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Wardmist is problematic. The concept works fine. The practicalities, not so much. Is the "mist" present permanently? Even during the day? If not, is the mist only present when you enter the wardmist environs? Even in the middle of a bright, summer's day? If you have a ward token, does the mist exist for you? Do you travel through it unmolested or do you not encounter or see any mist?

-- George Krashos

"Because only we, contrary to the barbarians, never count the enemy in battle." -- Aeschylus
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
Moderator

USA
33475 Posts

Posted - 07 Apr 2020 :  18:37:53  Show Profile Send Wooly Rupert a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by George Krashos

Wardmist is problematic. The concept works fine. The practicalities, not so much. Is the "mist" present permanently? Even during the day? If not, is the mist only present when you enter the wardmist environs? Even in the middle of a bright, summer's day? If you have a ward token, does the mist exist for you? Do you travel through it unmolested or do you not encounter or see any mist?

-- George Krashos



I don't see anything in the description about day or night being a factor, and it does specify the mist is permanently present... Though it does say that if you have the token, the mist basically doesn't exist for you.

I'm looking at the description that starts on page 226 of Volo's Guide to the North. It's also on pages 9 and 10 of Volo's Guide to All Things Magical (formerly a suppressed work ).

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ericlboyd
Forgotten Realms Designer

USA
1740 Posts

Posted - 07 Apr 2020 :  19:49:53  Show Profile  Visit ericlboyd's Homepage Send ericlboyd a Private Message  Reply with Quote
For 3.5e wardmist, I'm thinking it's essentially a permanent variant of "guards in wards."

And yes, the key places it shows up are VGttN (which was then copied into The North boxed set).

For the "tracer" spell, I'm still at a lost to find a starting spell, other than "locate object"

--Eric

--
http://www.ericlboyd.com/dnd/
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
Moderator

USA
33475 Posts

Posted - 07 Apr 2020 :  22:09:11  Show Profile Send Wooly Rupert a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by ericlboyd

For the "tracer" spell, I'm still at a lost to find a starting spell, other than "locate object"

--Eric



There was the old Tulrun's Tracer, but I don't think it's been updated since 1E. It was in the OGB.

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TheIriaeban
Learned Scribe

USA
222 Posts

Posted - 07 Apr 2020 :  23:14:13  Show Profile Send TheIriaeban a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert

quote:
Originally posted by ericlboyd

For the "tracer" spell, I'm still at a lost to find a starting spell, other than "locate object"

--Eric



There was the old Tulrun's Tracer, but I don't think it's been updated since 1E. It was in the OGB.



Tulrun's Tracer is on page 958 of the Wizard's Spell Compendium Vol 4.

There is also Trembling Horn on 952 of the above book (it is used by the Watchful Wizard guys in Waterdeep), Psionic Tracer (page 718, WSC3), Shandaril's Tracer (page 805, WSC3), and Locate Creature/Object/Portal/Remains (pages 522-524, WSC2).

Edit: Almost forgot, Find Person/Treasure/Water (pages 355-357, WSC2).

"Iriaebor is a fine city. So what if you can have violence between merchant groups break out at any moment. Not every city can offer dinner AND a show."

My FR writeups - http://www.mediafire.com/folder/um3liz6tqsf5n/Documents

Edited by - TheIriaeban on 07 Apr 2020 23:19:07
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George Krashos
Master of Realmslore

Australia
5828 Posts

Posted - 08 Apr 2020 :  01:33:24  Show Profile Send George Krashos a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert

I don't see anything in the description about day or night being a factor, and it does specify the mist is permanently present... Though it does say that if you have the token, the mist basically doesn't exist for you.

I'm looking at the description that starts on page 226 of Volo's Guide to the North. It's also on pages 9 and 10 of Volo's Guide to All Things Magical (formerly a suppressed work ).



And the "permanently present" thing is the dumb part. Does that mean every settlement protected by a wardmist can't be observed from outside? One of the VGttN descriptions says that there is a gap in the wardmist to allow entry/exit - that would be immediately noticeable if the mist was always present and observable. Wouldn't the mist block sunlight? Can you fly over a wardmist? Just ... no, needs a revamp.

Personally, I think the mist only exists if you enter its environs without a proper token. In other words, it's a bit like putting on the One Ring in the LotR films - you enter illegally and you are suddenly plunged into this strange, mist shrouded environment. You can't see anything and monsters start popping in out of nowhere to try kill you. That makes way more sense than riding up over the hill rise and seeing a clump of mist in the hollow at the height of summer and saying, "Gee, Sholdo's Mill looks good today."

-- George Krashos

"Because only we, contrary to the barbarians, never count the enemy in battle." -- Aeschylus
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TheIriaeban
Learned Scribe

USA
222 Posts

Posted - 08 Apr 2020 :  04:38:18  Show Profile Send TheIriaeban a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I checked the Wizards Spell Compendium for the wardmist spell. Sometimes, it says something about it being modified from the original form to make better sense. This spell doesn't appear to be changed that much (if at all). This seems more for handling the cannon-fodder troops and not for any kind of serious assault.

"Iriaebor is a fine city. So what if you can have violence between merchant groups break out at any moment. Not every city can offer dinner AND a show."

My FR writeups - http://www.mediafire.com/folder/um3liz6tqsf5n/Documents
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TBeholder
Great Reader

2012 Posts

Posted - 08 Apr 2020 :  04:43:34  Show Profile Send TBeholder a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Plainly named "tracer"?
Chevic's Tracer - Wiz 4, Divination/Alteration, Field: Mentalism; from: How the Mighty are Fallen.
Tulrunís Tracer - Wiz 4; Divination/Alteration; from: Pages from the Mages (also PftM in Dragon #69) and FRCS.
Shandarilís Tracer - Wiz 5; Divination, from: The Magister, Pages from the Mages.
Psionic Tracer - Wiz 4; Divination, from: Wizardís Spell Compendium.
Tracer Pot: XP value 1,000, GP value 5,000, from: The North: The Wilderness.

quote:
Originally posted by TheIriaeban

There is also Trembling Horn on 952 of the above book (it is used by the Watchful Wizard guys in Waterdeep),
[...] and Locate Creature/Object/Portal/Remains (pages 522-524, WSC2).
Edit: Almost forgot, Find Person/Treasure/Water (pages 355-357, WSC2).

Locate/Find are not cast preemptively. So is Tulrunís Tracer, for that matter.

Trembling Horn may be related, but the effect is just a fancy visible spell cast on a creature - if it counts, so would curse of the grinning skull, faerie fire, light and whatnot.

People never wonder How the world goes round -Helloween
And even I make no pretense Of having more than common sense -R.W.Wood
It's not good, Eric. It's a gazebo. -Ed Whitchurch

Edited by - TBeholder on 08 Apr 2020 06:28:12
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TheIriaeban
Learned Scribe

USA
222 Posts

Posted - 08 Apr 2020 :  04:50:39  Show Profile Send TheIriaeban a Private Message  Reply with Quote
A good place to look for wards is VGtCormyr starting on page 231. It has sections about the various types of wards in Cormyr.

"Iriaebor is a fine city. So what if you can have violence between merchant groups break out at any moment. Not every city can offer dinner AND a show."

My FR writeups - http://www.mediafire.com/folder/um3liz6tqsf5n/Documents
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ericlboyd
Forgotten Realms Designer

USA
1740 Posts

Posted - 08 Apr 2020 :  06:38:53  Show Profile  Visit ericlboyd's Homepage Send ericlboyd a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert

There was the old Tulrun's Tracer, but I don't think it's been updated since 1E. It was in the OGB.



Found it in Pages from the Mages (2e).

Thanks,

--Eric

--
http://www.ericlboyd.com/dnd/
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