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 Suriving Netherial Empire Magick and other things
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LWhitehead1
Seeker

38 Posts

Posted - 07 Jul 2017 :  06:03:24  Show Profile Send LWhitehead1 a Private Message  Reply with Quote  Delete Topic
Hi I wasing wondering in FR 5th verison what of the Netheril Empire has survived in 5th FR currently?,

Such as Magic objects, spells, and nations.


LW

sfdragon
Master of Realmslore

1978 Posts

Posted - 07 Jul 2017 :  06:52:20  Show Profile Send sfdragon a Private Message  Reply with Quote

netheril is gone. scattered to the 4 winds. all that is left is people who left it all to get away from Old Man Lord Shadow both before and after the city of shade's final fall from glory.

past this, notta know. ask ED down in his scroll...


why is being a wizard like being a drow? both are likely to find a dagger in the back from a rival or one looking to further his own goals, fame and power


My FR fan fiction
Magister's GAmbit
http://steelfiredragon.deviantart.com/gallery/33539234
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Starshade
Learned Scribe

Norway
101 Posts

Posted - 07 Jul 2017 :  08:50:35  Show Profile Send Starshade a Private Message  Reply with Quote
What do you need, to be specific? A list of items and spells who survives from netheril? And nations who still exist from that time, non-netherilian?
The second edition, AD&D Empire of Magic might be of use, if you want to make lists of your own:
http://www.drivethrurpg.com/product/17546/Netheril-Empire-of-Magic-2e?it=1 This got second edition rules for playing IN Netheril, and could be used as a guide for what items and spells are "netherilian", if you need that
Some or many items and spells would simply not exist, others just altered to fit the magic in existence after netheril fell. Also, lots of spells were made after netheril fell.
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Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire

USA
13606 Posts

Posted - 07 Jul 2017 :  15:51:39  Show Profile Send Markustay a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Just as an aside, I wouldn't mind there being a 'New Shade' (call it something else, though) within the Shadowfell - perhaps a 'floating fortress' that they kept some of their folks in, that survived the 2nd fall of their empire. I never liked the whole storyline with them - I found them terribly redundant with Ed's Malaugrym (which were MUCH better), but there's no reason why a small group of them can't still be around 'off stage'.

Maybe a few settlements on the ground, on the outskirts of Anauroch. Nothing major, and nothing 'overly magical' - just some low-key survivors trying to get by. I was hoping they'd make that giant patch of nothing (that kinda useless desert) into something interesting in 5e (which, in hindsight, is what I suppose they were trying to do in 3e), but it appears their trepidation of causing another 4e backlash won't allow them to deviate much from the 1e/2e realms geopolitically.

Personally, the 'desert' (or some other form of 'No-mans Land') would work better to the SW of Cormyr, not above it like Ed had it. The desert, where it is, is almost totally useless - it doesn't really block people from going back and forth, it's just a nuisance, really. It should have become smaller, and perhaps not extend all the way north anymore (have a land of 'steppes' along the top). If anything, I would make the Stonelands and Goblin marches go further north now, like it was at the time the battle of Bones happened. If you are going to 'turn back the clock' terrain-wise, at least make some improvements.

"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone


Edited by - Markustay on 10 Jul 2017 18:03:55
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LWhitehead1
Seeker

38 Posts

Posted - 07 Jul 2017 :  19:05:32  Show Profile Send LWhitehead1 a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I mean like the Nation of Halarvaa are they still around in 5th FR?, they were founded by Mage fleeing the First Fall.

LW
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Starshade
Learned Scribe

Norway
101 Posts

Posted - 10 Jul 2017 :  16:18:38  Show Profile Send Starshade a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Halruaa? in 4th edition, it exploded, then returned unharmed in 5th edition.
Also: The hosttower of the Arcane in Luskan was buildt by Netherese, but destroyed in 4th edition, I think it is repaired again in 5th edition.
there was 3 cities who managed to land, and survived: Anauria, Asram and Hlondath, all now ruined.
the moon goddess took a city to another dimention, and Shar, her counterpart, saved the city of Thultanthar.
The earthbound areas never fell down, of course. The Mines of Dekanter is one example.
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Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire

USA
13606 Posts

Posted - 10 Jul 2017 :  18:19:45  Show Profile Send Markustay a Private Message  Reply with Quote
The Spellplague was like the universe's biggest game of 'hide-and-seek', and Abeir seems to have been the best hiding spot.

Just rereading (and editing) what I wrote above, and a thought occurred to me - when weather is magically changed (on a dramatic and somewhat permanent basis) it affects everything else ("for every action, there is a reaction"). This is explained well in the non-FR Belgariad series of books; 'Mighty Wizards' don't go around making grand, sweeping changes - even though they can - because they have no way of knowing what else such 'big things' will change. With magic, smaller, more precise usage is best, so as to cause the least amount of damage (the difference between a surgeon, and a butcher). A place like the Endless Wastes shouldn't be as dry and arid as it is - could perchance Thay's meddling with its own weather have caused some of that?

And the thing that made me think along these lines was my statement above: What if the region that no-one seems to ever want (for some bizarre reason) - that vast area to the south and east of Cormyr - is like that because 'in times past' it was more arid and less livable? What if the same goes for The North? Maybe when the Phaerimm started their 'Life Draining' BS in Anauroch, some of that 'better weather' got pushed out, and to the sides of it? The area of the Greenfields and surrounding territory may have been like America's 'Dustbowl' at one point, and been undesirable until fairly recently (water doesn't just 'disappear', it had to have been shifted elsewhere).

You see, I have to think about these things, because I make maps, and part of that is knowing Realms history, and the why of the geography. Some of it (quite a bit of it, actually) makes little sense. And since my current mapping project (there are several 'current', but I mean the one I have been actively working on the past few days) is designed to do historic maps... ACCURATE historic maps (and I am going to have to call on some 'big guns' to help me with all of that), now is the time for me to think about history, and the maps, and the 'why' behind everything thats happened (because wars are ALWAYS fought over land - don't fool yourself into thinking they're not). Like, ya know... why Thay keeps hammering away at Aglarond - to NO avail - and yet, there are several large, 'empty' regions all around them, ready to be conquered. There has to be something juicy in Aglarond that's driving them nuts (and not just the Simbul's magnificent booty).

"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone


Edited by - Markustay on 10 Jul 2017 18:22:27
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LWhitehead1
Seeker

38 Posts

Posted - 10 Jul 2017 :  20:09:16  Show Profile Send LWhitehead1 a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Well Spellplaque was like you said a game of Hide-and-seek, due to the fact the Goddess of Magic nearly died again, Simbal went Mad due to this Magic problem.


So my main question is currently what Nerthil Magic spells, and objects survived?.

LW
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Gyor
Master of Realmslore

1087 Posts

Posted - 10 Jul 2017 :  22:47:14  Show Profile Send Gyor a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Halruua is a Netherese survivor state, Sembia was a subject of Shade until rescently so likely alot of Netherese and Netherese magic, there are some survivor cities in Faerun, but where I don't know.

And the Netherese city of Gloomwrought in the Shadowfell would have survived.

Selunarra, Netherese city of Aasimar in the Plane of The Gates of the Moon would be uneffected by most things going on in the Material plane.

There is a city of Shadar Kai in the underdark/Shadowdark that would likely practice Netherese magic.
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LWhitehead1
Seeker

38 Posts

Posted - 11 Jul 2017 :  02:22:09  Show Profile Send LWhitehead1 a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I can undersatnd why current people of FR aren't to comforable with Mages and Magic around them given what the Nerthil Empire did.


LW
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
Moderator

USA
30019 Posts

Posted - 11 Jul 2017 :  04:42:03  Show Profile Send Wooly Rupert a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by LWhitehead1

I can undersatnd why current people of FR aren't to comforable with Mages and Magic around them given what the Nerthil Empire did.


LW



Again, where is this coming from? Most people don't know what Netheril did, and there is no evidence that the common person in the Realms has a problem with magic.

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Starshade
Learned Scribe

Norway
101 Posts

Posted - 14 Jul 2017 :  11:43:55  Show Profile Send Starshade a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by LWhitehead1

I can undersatnd why current people of FR aren't to comforable with Mages and Magic around them given what the Nerthil Empire did.


LW


"Did"? For a Mage, Netheril was like our Atlantis. Unlike the Tower of Bable, or flight of Icarus, there is no religious condemnation made universally in Forgotten Realms.

The empire of Shade is a post-Netheril devlopment. Netheril Mythallars made it possible to imbue small items With Power, and give the commoners small "spells" fueled by the mythallars, not the weave. Imagine a Kingdom where a Baker or a Smith can cast Magic, that's Netheril. Why condemn it as bad?
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Ayrik
Great Reader

Canada
6221 Posts

Posted - 14 Jul 2017 :  18:02:32  Show Profile Send Ayrik a Private Message  Reply with Quote
The "common" people of Halruaa could cast cantras as well. Small magics which would help bake the bread or sweep the chimney or whatnot. Without any Netherese mythallars. So these cantras would presumably be fueled by the power of the Weave or - at least implicitly - by the power of a deity (like Mystra or Azuth).

Shade definitely had a mythallar, required to keep Tultanthar aloft if nothing else. Not to mention the second mythallar of ancient Sakkors. But Realmslore strangely never mentioned any Shadovar cantras or Shadovar quasimagics - strange since I imagine the Shadovar should have all the magical and quasimagical conveniences of ancient Netheril.

Eat lots of garlic - it keeps the elves and vampires away.
Don't stick your sword into dragons, you just don't know where they've been.
Avoid stepping on halflings. They stick to your boots, will smell awful, and are impossible to scrape off.
Ah, of course. Never play leapfrog with a unicorn.
[/Ayrik]
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TBeholder
Master of Realmslore

1411 Posts

Posted - 14 Jul 2017 :  20:16:53  Show Profile Send TBeholder a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by LWhitehead1

Hi I wasing wondering in FR 5th verison what of the Netheril Empire has survived in 5th FR currently?,

Such as Magic objects, spells, and nations.

They left a lot of things. Lore, via lots of running refugees. Ruins, obviously. Magic items - via ruins and refugees, but also in lots and lots of caches, some buried until the shades found them, others found and either re-hidden, used, or even reverse-engineered (the ones near Sshamath).

quote:
Originally posted by Gyor

And the Netherese city of Gloomwrought in the Shadowfell would have survived.

Was it pulled into Darkbad?

People never wonder How the world goes round -Helloween
And even I make no pretense Of having more than common sense -R.W.Wood
It's not good, Eric. It's a gazebo. -Ed Whitchurch
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LWhitehead1
Seeker

38 Posts

Posted - 15 Jul 2017 :  07:16:39  Show Profile Send LWhitehead1 a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Oh very funny,


LW
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