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 Harpers' Hall in Waterdeep
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Celephais
Acolyte

USA
5 Posts

Posted - 15 Oct 2018 :  20:43:08  Show Profile Send Celephais a Private Message  Reply with Quote  Delete Topic
I know there is one, at least according to the Realms wiki, but I downloaded the excellent .pdf map of Waterdeep from this site and can't seem to find it. I know it's a niggling detail but I have a hard time writing past it. So, where in Waterdeep is (or was) the Harpers' Hall?

Death's so quick but it can last so long.

Zeromaru X
Master of Realmslore

Colombia
1114 Posts

Posted - 15 Oct 2018 :  22:46:44  Show Profile Send Zeromaru X a Private Message  Reply with Quote
The Harper Hall is located in the second floor of an inn and tavern named The Beholder's Lament, located in the Trade Ward of Waterdeep. You can get more info about this place in the "Harpers of Waterdeep" article (in Dragon 430). The article is for the current year (so 1486 DR onwards), but as Waterdeep didn't changed that much in 100 years, you should only change the NPCs and the place will be useful for a pre-Spellplague campaign.

Long ago, in the distant past, they fell into decay. The philosopher’s path... The river of glory... Even the saints resting in the darkness rise up without response and block the way...
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Fineva
Seeker

Canada
68 Posts

Posted - 15 Oct 2018 :  23:16:35  Show Profile Send Fineva a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Same NPCs in charge as in Tiamat time, a noble house also has a great Harper, not to mention Mirt is as well.

I"
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
Moderator

USA
31591 Posts

Posted - 16 Oct 2018 :  04:16:03  Show Profile Send Wooly Rupert a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Ye gods... I'd not read that before. The whole "there used to be more Harpers but now there aren't because reasons" does not sit well with me, and it reinforces my determination to never allow the Spellplague to sully my personal Realms.

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Zeromaru X
Master of Realmslore

Colombia
1114 Posts

Posted - 16 Oct 2018 :  22:22:03  Show Profile Send Zeromaru X a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Fineva

Same NPCs in charge as in Tiamat time, a noble house also has a great Harper, not to mention Mirt is as well.




Well, it doesn't surprise me. That supplement was to supplement the Sundering novels (especifically, the Adversary, that's the one that uses the Harpers of Waterdeep), so is from the time period when they started to pretend that a 100 years leap from one edition to another was if as nothing had happened.

Long ago, in the distant past, they fell into decay. The philosopher’s path... The river of glory... Even the saints resting in the darkness rise up without response and block the way...

Edited by - Zeromaru X on 16 Oct 2018 22:22:35
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Celephais
Acolyte

USA
5 Posts

Posted - 17 Oct 2018 :  00:41:52  Show Profile Send Celephais a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Thanks for the info, guys.

Death's so quick but it can last so long.
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Balmar Foghaven
Learned Scribe

Canada
97 Posts

Posted - 17 Oct 2018 :  17:31:52  Show Profile Send Balmar Foghaven a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I find it a shame that Tam Zawad is never referenced in any of the official adventures; he was quite the character. I suppose WotC would require express permission from Erin Evans to include her brain-child in any of their licensed products.

"Despair not, for in the end all things shall work out for the best - in at least one timeline."
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
Moderator

USA
31591 Posts

Posted - 17 Oct 2018 :  18:45:52  Show Profile Send Wooly Rupert a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Balmar Foghaven

I suppose WotC would require express permission from Erin Evans to include her brain-child in any of their licensed products.



Nope. Work for hire -- he's their character.

There has been, in general, a hand's-off approach with regards to authors using each other's characters, but any character in a WotC novel is owned by WotC and they can do with the characters whatever they want. Check out the story of the Shores of Dusk novel, sometime.

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Zeromaru X
Master of Realmslore

Colombia
1114 Posts

Posted - 17 Oct 2018 :  19:29:13  Show Profile Send Zeromaru X a Private Message  Reply with Quote
In fact, there is a NPC in Dragon Heist that is from Erin novels (and is mentioned in this harper article, as well): the guy who lives in the head on one of the Walking Statues, Thort. So, pretty much, they haven't used Zawad for some other reason.

Long ago, in the distant past, they fell into decay. The philosopher’s path... The river of glory... Even the saints resting in the darkness rise up without response and block the way...
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
Moderator

USA
31591 Posts

Posted - 17 Oct 2018 :  20:58:36  Show Profile Send Wooly Rupert a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Zeromaru X

In fact, there is a NPC in Dragon Heist that is from Erin novels (and is mentioned in this harper article, as well): the guy who lives in the head on one of the Walking Statues, Thort. So, pretty much, they haven't used Zawad for some other reason.



They likely just overlooked him. It's not like they worry too much about maintaining continuity.

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Cards77
Senior Scribe

USA
605 Posts

Posted - 18 Oct 2018 :  16:02:09  Show Profile Send Cards77 a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert

quote:
Originally posted by Balmar Foghaven

I suppose WotC would require express permission from Erin Evans to include her brain-child in any of their licensed products.



Nope. Work for hire -- he's their character.

There has been, in general, a hand's-off approach with regards to authors using each other's characters, but any character in a WotC novel is owned by WotC and they can do with the characters whatever they want. Check out the story of the Shores of Dusk novel, sometime.


Very interesting read thank you. I hadn't even known about that.

Did that novel ever get leaked or see the light of day in any form?

It's sad to think that someone's hard work like that can never be appreciated and must remain locked away for such trivial reasons.

Writers are definitely a different breed.
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Seravin
Senior Scribe

Canada
856 Posts

Posted - 18 Oct 2018 :  22:43:32  Show Profile Send Seravin a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Speaking of Harpers in Waterdeep, it always puzzled me in Elfshadow why Arilyn made a bee line for Waterdeep when searching out Harper assassin and didn't mention or think of going to Berdusk, where there is a Harper stronghold and is as close to Evereska as Waterdeep. The decision to go to Waterdeep seemed completely random given there wasn't much of a Harper base there that ever got much press or attention (before this post I wouldn't have said there is a Harper stronghold there as it never features in any novels). Meh.
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
Moderator

USA
31591 Posts

Posted - 19 Oct 2018 :  02:33:49  Show Profile Send Wooly Rupert a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Cards77

quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert

quote:
Originally posted by Balmar Foghaven

I suppose WotC would require express permission from Erin Evans to include her brain-child in any of their licensed products.



Nope. Work for hire -- he's their character.

There has been, in general, a hand's-off approach with regards to authors using each other's characters, but any character in a WotC novel is owned by WotC and they can do with the characters whatever they want. Check out the story of the Shores of Dusk novel, sometime.


Very interesting read thank you. I hadn't even known about that.

Did that novel ever get leaked or see the light of day in any form?

It's sad to think that someone's hard work like that can never be appreciated and must remain locked away for such trivial reasons.

Writers are definitely a different breed.



So far as I know, it has never seen the light of day.

Candlekeep Forums Moderator

Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com
-- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct

Editor and scribe for The Candlekeep Compendium

I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen!
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
Moderator

USA
31591 Posts

Posted - 19 Oct 2018 :  02:35:27  Show Profile Send Wooly Rupert a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Seravin

Speaking of Harpers in Waterdeep, it always puzzled me in Elfshadow why Arilyn made a bee line for Waterdeep when searching out Harper assassin and didn't mention or think of going to Berdusk, where there is a Harper stronghold and is as close to Evereska as Waterdeep. The decision to go to Waterdeep seemed completely random given there wasn't much of a Harper base there that ever got much press or attention (before this post I wouldn't have said there is a Harper stronghold there as it never features in any novels). Meh.



I'd say it was because she had more allies there, and better access to resources. Plus, if you're looking to lose yourself in a crowd, a very large city is a good place to find said crowd.

Candlekeep Forums Moderator

Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
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-- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct

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I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen!
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