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 Plz someone stops Salvatore :-)
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Gary Dallison
Great Reader

United Kingdom
6350 Posts

Posted - 28 Jan 2015 :  14:30:29  Show Profile Send Gary Dallison a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I agree with Matt's disagreement with the notion.

I find many of the novels to be counterproductive when it comes to running or even playing in a roleplaying game. While they may help detail the world (the quality of the detail varies with the author) they also use up all the plot hooks and kill off many of the interesting characters.

I never use them but for some the canon nature of the world is important and when an interesting storyline has been detailed and ended in a way with which you do not agree that frustrates the whole point of a roleplaying game - to take part in/tell a story.

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TBeholder
Great Reader

2378 Posts

Posted - 28 Jan 2015 :  14:39:53  Show Profile Send TBeholder a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by TaeghenAmalith

I've read many Salvatore novels despite the very low quality of them in terms of artistic writing and I've never found it as a great problem because I think Salvatore itself is perfectly conscious of the aim of the novels and he approach his work with onesty.

But there'is something I believe is wrong even if you are producing "pulp fiction". This wrong thing is slovenliness.

How many seconds are necessary in this world of social networking to find an italian mothertongue guy and ask him: "Hi my friend, can you tell me how it sounds this name for my new character in your language?"

Italian?
I'm reasonably sure English is his primary language. Yet he got Matron Mother Malice and worse. What did you expect?

Aside of names, there was "me big dumb fightar" dialect early and crystal killer yo-yo later...
That's how it was from the very first books. And that's what was annoying about him from the very first books: that never was complete Tweenlight fit only to ignore or to poke appendages at and laugh. Salvatore got talent, and writes cool stuff... occasionally. A gem here and dust speck there. And then he encases it in mountain ranges worth of shameless hack.
Should've kept writing about dwarves, maybe?

People never wonder How the world goes round -Helloween
And even I make no pretense Of having more than common sense -R.W.Wood
It's not good, Eric. It's a gazebo. -Ed Whitchurch
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TaeghenAmalith
Acolyte

Italy
28 Posts

Posted - 28 Jan 2015 :  18:46:12  Show Profile Send TaeghenAmalith a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Matt James

I apologize, my reply was swift. I meant to disagree with the notion that the books are written to only support adventures and the games.



Maybe "only" is too strong.
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Entromancer
Senior Scribe

USA
388 Posts

Posted - 28 Jan 2015 :  19:55:09  Show Profile Send Entromancer a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Anyone here read Bob's Demon Wars saga? He's got a thing for quirky names. Simple as that.

"...the will is everything. The will to act."--Ra's Al Ghul

"Suffering builds character."--Talia Al Ghul
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Cards77
Senior Scribe

USA
745 Posts

Posted - 29 Jan 2015 :  01:09:21  Show Profile Send Cards77 a Private Message  Reply with Quote
He's said before in interviews that he just puts down whatever pops into his head. I have a VERY limited appetite for SOME quirkiness as I feel it adds some humor, and even can add some lore.

Not every name has to be BADASS sounding. I mean Pikel..I couldn't really imagine him named anything else. Corio Muffinhead, McKnuckles......those are great dwarf names, just of a different flavor. I did not know there was a dwarf clan of bakers and cooks!

Seriously though, most of them are downright rediculous. The only thing worse is trying to listen to Felicia Day read one of his books on Audio.......uggg I was looking for an icepick so i could rupture my eardrums.
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Jeremy Grenemyer
Great Reader

USA
2717 Posts

Posted - 29 Jan 2015 :  02:48:58  Show Profile Send Jeremy Grenemyer a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I always read Pikel like pike, not pickle.

Look for me and my content at EN World (user name: sanishiver).
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Diffan
Great Reader

USA
4425 Posts

Posted - 29 Jan 2015 :  04:52:36  Show Profile Send Diffan a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Entromancer

Anyone here read Bob's Demon Wars saga? He's got a thing for quirky names. Simple as that.



I think I read the first couple of books, and yes it's not a unique thing for just the Realms. Same with the Spearwielder's Trilogy.
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Corwyn the Errant
Acolyte

USA
16 Posts

Posted - 29 Jan 2015 :  13:08:01  Show Profile  Visit Corwyn the Errant's Homepage Send Corwyn the Errant a Private Message  Reply with Quote
The ones that make me wince are Dagnabit {I picture Yosemite Sam every time I read that} and Bouldershoulder {brings to mind old 2nd grade jokes about "over the shoulder boulder-holders", but that might just be me :}...} Some of the names Salvatore uses...reading one of his works and running across one of them is like hitting a speed bump, breaks the flow of the narrative for me. But as the original poster said, we're not talking about high literature here; a little silliness is forgivable.
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Arcanus
Senior Scribe

485 Posts

Posted - 29 Jan 2015 :  13:25:53  Show Profile  Visit Arcanus's Homepage Send Arcanus a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Jeremy Grenemyer

I always read Pikel like pike, not pickle.



The spelling was Bobs way of getting one over on his editor. I watched an interview with him where he explained that he was still irked over being told not to use Dagnabbit (future books saw the use of Dagna instead).

Pikel should be pronounced 'Pickel'
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Cards77
Senior Scribe

USA
745 Posts

Posted - 29 Jan 2015 :  19:19:31  Show Profile Send Cards77 a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Jeremy Grenemyer

I always read Pikel like pike, not pickle.

Same here.
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lordsknight185
Seeker

USA
99 Posts

Posted - 30 Jan 2015 :  06:12:24  Show Profile Send lordsknight185 a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Pikels the drummer doodly doodly doo

(Im sorry!...not really)

seriously though, been reading bob for years and years and while I understood it was meant to be a joke on pickel, I did not realise it was meant to be pronounced that way.
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Arcanus
Senior Scribe

485 Posts

Posted - 30 Jan 2015 :  15:25:51  Show Profile  Visit Arcanus's Homepage Send Arcanus a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Yep, to quote him-

"Of course it's pickel, his beard is dyed green forgods sake! I couldn't make it anymore obvious!"

Or words to that effect lol. (That comes from a panel that someone on here gave a link to. The Tome Show I think it was).

Edited by - Arcanus on 30 Jan 2015 15:26:44
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
Moderator

USA
36779 Posts

Posted - 30 Jan 2015 :  18:12:14  Show Profile Send Wooly Rupert a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Something I don't like with character names is repeating syllables -- I hated the names Mari Almaren and Caledon Caldorian, for example. The first names are fine, and the surnames are fine, but together, they bugged the crap out of me.

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Tanthalas
Senior Scribe

Portugal
508 Posts

Posted - 30 Jan 2015 :  21:19:55  Show Profile Send Tanthalas a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Farrel
8) The Circus of Dr Trundles - No, just no! Does anywhere in the Forgotten Realms even have a medical school to gain the required qualifications?


Technically, the Dr title comes from having a PhD, not a medical licence.

But around here people use it for anyone that has any kind of college decree.

Sir Markham pointed out, drinking another brandy. "A chap who can point at you and say 'die' has the distinct advantage".
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BEAST
Master of Realmslore

USA
1714 Posts

Posted - 31 Jan 2015 :  01:42:47  Show Profile  Visit BEAST's Homepage Send BEAST a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Cards77

quote:
Originally posted by Jeremy Grenemyer

I always read Pikel like pike, not pickle.

Same here.

Yeah, after reading Tolkien's elaborate language pronunciation guides in the Appendices to "TLOTR", I've been spoiled by the idea of consistency in pronunciations.

If "Ivan" is pronounced with a hard "i" (/EYE-vuhn/), then my conditioned inclination is to think that "Pikel" should be pronounced with one too (/PIKE-uhl/).

But nooooooooo!

So if the green-bearded one is a /PIH-kuhl/, then is the yellow-beared one an /IH-vuhn/?

What if, for consistency's sake, it were /PEE-kuhl/ and /EE-vahn/?

I guess we could Russki it up and make it /ee-VAHN/.

/PEE-kul/ and /ee-VAHN/? Tee-hee-hee, as Pikel might say.

"'You don't know my history,' he said dryly."
--Drizzt Do'Urden (The Pirate King, Part 1: Chapter 2)

<"Comprehensive Chronology of R.A. Salvatore Forgotten Realms Works">
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lordsknight185
Seeker

USA
99 Posts

Posted - 31 Jan 2015 :  07:06:52  Show Profile Send lordsknight185 a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert

Something I don't like with character names is repeating syllables -- I hated the names Mari Almaren and Caledon Caldorian, for example. The first names are fine, and the surnames are fine, but together, they bugged the crap out of me.



While I personally understand how annoying it can be, it happens even in the real world. Something like a "Jonathan Johnson" would be buggy too.
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Portuguese D. Ace
Seeker

Italy
82 Posts

Posted - 31 Jan 2015 :  08:20:26  Show Profile Send Portuguese D. Ace a Private Message  Reply with Quote
TaeghenAmalith, we have a problem in common.
we are both italian.

thats it.

maybe to the average reader Pericolo/donnola topolino may sound exotic.

we cant perceive that exotic feeling simply because, as you said, it sounds to us as a danger roadsign pointing out HOW DANGEROUS mickey mouse is.

but just try to see it as Dangerous Little Mouse. thats it. it has its "hidden" meaning.


if you adapt to it you will see what an awesome character it is.



Please, bring back the Realms. I'm really fed up with the Sword Coast.


===== Since English is not my first language, I pre-emptively apologize for any (grammar) mistake that has been made in my post. In order to help me improve my English, please, point out those mistakes (If you could do it politely, it would be even better!). Thanks! =====
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
Moderator

USA
36779 Posts

Posted - 31 Jan 2015 :  14:59:58  Show Profile Send Wooly Rupert a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by lordsknight185

quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert

Something I don't like with character names is repeating syllables -- I hated the names Mari Almaren and Caledon Caldorian, for example. The first names are fine, and the surnames are fine, but together, they bugged the crap out of me.



While I personally understand how annoying it can be, it happens even in the real world. Something like a "Jonathan Johnson" would be buggy too.



Oh, I understand that... There was a CPA in this area, for a while, whose name was Joseph J Joseph, Jr. The Junior part, by itself, is in my opinion, quite bad -- I seriously dislike that suffix (apologies to any who bear it; it's just a personal thing, and no offense is intended).

But it showed in this case that two generations of parents thought that Joseph Joseph was a great name, and that one of them had already gone thru life with that name and still thought it was a good idea to inflict it on someone else.

But as bad as that is, in the real world, there could be some compelling reason to do that. Family tradition, perhaps, or honoring a fallen parent, or something like that. My son is named for his grandfather, as a way of honoring him. My dad, too, was named after his grandfather (to whom he is virtually identical). So my son is at least the third to bear the name, but my dad didn't have a number trailing his name, so neither does my son. If I have another son, we'll have to come up with something different -- I'm not fond of my own first name, and I dislike my grandfather's first name, so both of those are out.

In a fantasy world, though, when you're literally making up the names as you go, there isn't that much reason to do that. And that particular author did it not once, but twice in the same book -- Caledon Caldorian and Mari Almaren are companions. So when I read something like that, it's the same as seeing characters named Rob Roberson and Mark Marx, except there is no valid reasoning other than whim for it. That makes it worse.

Candlekeep Forums Moderator

Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com
-- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct

I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen!
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