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sleyvas
Skilled Spell Strategist
USA
11691 Posts |
 Posted - 01 Oct 2007 : 01:27:39
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Ok, I'm still working my way through it, but I wanted to see what some have seen so far and compare notes. Some of this may have been released in previous products, and if so maybe noting that will help us all lead somewhere. As always, the name of the game is speculation.
Firstly, I liked George's article on the fall of Narfell/Raumathar. From it, we learn a few things and have some definitions to correlate to future things.
First, in -160 DR a "hortha" of Kostchtchie was summoned to the realms. From this, I gather that a "hortha" is something less than an avatar... because in -150 DR an "urhortha" or avatar of Kossuth was summoned.
Other definitions
Sarnar - year (plural years is Sarn)
Drith - summoned extraplanars (presumably demons)
Drithdarkar - presumably Narfellian conjurers of some sort (demonbinders most likely)
Dun-Orthass - another name for the citadel of conjurers
From other areas, we discover that the demonic magic of the Nars was from Narathmault, which was formerly a holding of the Ilythiir (see -1015 dr, -9750 DR, -10000 DR and -10400 DR). It was Clan Sethomiir who traversed there, guided by the balor Wendonai. Narathmault is an underground fortress "Dark Pit" and its at the site of Dun-Tharos (which is where the nentyarch built his capital and forged the crown of Narfell). Note, that even before the dark elves arrived there, they recognized the area as an "area of great evil". Therefore, theoretically, something happened to the area before the Narfellians came along (and therefore, THEY didn't necessarily create the demoncysts).
Another thing I find of interest, Larloch's enclave, Jiksidur, crashed in northern Narfell when Karsus cast his avatar spell. However, his warlock's crypt is actually his enemy's enclave of Orbedal. Therefore, before Narfell fell, there was a crashed netherese enclave within their domain (granted, this was in the last 190 years of their empire, but....). Also, conceivably, Larloch had some involvement with Narfell, otherwise his enclave wouldn't have been there?
Next, do we have a date for the death of Borem of the Boiling Mud yet? If not, we know that Kisonraathiisar's death was in -349 and he was the Topaz dragon ruling westgate. In the year of Boiling Moats (which was?) we have what would seem to be Kisonraathiisar speaking of the arrival of the mortal forms of Bane, Bhaal, and Myrkul to kill Borem.
Note that the entry for the topaz dragon's death also gives us a different premise for the existence of the Hills of the Seven Lost Gods (ultimately providing us the reason that Selune has its tears). However, this entry also has what would seem a paradox, because it says that the dragon's used this trying to blast the stars (presumably the King-Killer's star). It also says that it caused "an inland sea to mark their failure". Now, there could be several things here. First, the dragon may have been wrong. Secondly, if true, this inland sea could not be the sea of fallen stars because it was formed before the dracorage mythal was created. I know there were some other instances mentioned of comets falling that I noted, but I haven't looked at yet.... did anyone note any lakes or seas being caused by such?
Mod edit: Decided to move this scroll to the RPG products section, since I looked for it there and couldn't find it. The Grand History is, after all, a Realms product, so... 
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Alavairthae, may your skill prevail
Phillip aka Sleyvas |
Edited by - Wooly Rupert on 02 Oct 2007 00:34:34
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31701 Posts |
Posted - 01 Oct 2007 : 01:36:35
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quote:
Originally posted by sleyvas
Next, do we have a date for the death of Borem of the Boiling Mud yet? If not, we know that Kisonraathiisar's death was in -349 and he was the Topaz dragon ruling westgate. In the year of Boiling Moats (which was?) we have what would seem to be Kisonraathiisar speaking of the arrival of the mortal forms of Bane, Bhaal, and Myrkul to kill Borem.
We know that Bane, Bhaal, and Myrkul slew Borem -- one of the Seven Lost Gods -- each seizing a portion of Borem's divine essence for themselves. This was, perhaps, shortly before they entered the Castle of Bone and confronted Jergal.
F&P places the Lake of Boiling Mud's, which may have been the "avatar" of Borem, possible location on Mezeketh Isle -- two miles SW of Saerloon's harbor. It's also said that the Lake may have existed, during pre-Dale Reckoning, somewhere in Jhaamdath -- possibly in the vicinity of what would become Sembia. No specific dates are offered.
Jhaamdath "falls" in -255 DR. And Chondathan, which will eventually become Saerloon, was "properly" established between the 360's and 380's DR. 'Tis likely founded some time before that... given that Chondathan migrations across the Inner Sea to the lands of what will become Sembia, occur around the -200s DR.
Given the -339 DR starting point, and the details about the Lake possibly being located in pre-Dale Reckoning Jhaamdath, that could possibly narrow the period of Bane's ascension and the death of Borem to between Netheril's Fall in -339 DR and the Fall of Jhaamdath in -255 DR.
Additionally, Eric offers this little tidbit...
"Implicit in your assumption is that the Lake of Burning Blood is a "real lake". I'd suggest that maybe it's a moveable lake (in other words, the lake is the "avatar" of Borem). Alternatively, it could be the lake is created by opening a blood-spewing portal. When the portal closes/moves, the lake drains away.
--Eric"
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Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
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Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)
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Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage |
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sleyvas
Skilled Spell Strategist
USA
11691 Posts |
Posted - 01 Oct 2007 : 02:02:27
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Oh, another thing coming to my notice is it seems the the serpent gods and the shadow gods are coming to heads of sorts. Of course, this is slowly over time, but it does fit that Set is now Sseth... and isn't Set over black magic and darkness? This I haven't researched as much, so would appreciate some help
In 10 DR we have Emperor Sseth of the Serpentes Empire disappearing in the peaks of flame. I know at some point the god Merrshaulk was replaced by the god Sseth. Sseth is now in slumber due to Set's working with the Sarrukh Pil'it'ith (and I forget what the ultimate end was in the snake novels... I think it was just that the followers now know that Sseth and Set are separate?)
In 34 DR, We have the the Shadowking (Verraketh Talember) discovering the shadowstar and forming the empire of Ebenfar.
In 89 DR, Terpenzi, the naga king of Najara foresees his death at the hands of the shadowking
Finally, on page 60 we have Shar's Chosen (?) Vanrak Moonstar, who I know is from Waterdeep and I believe a death knight in Undermountain having turned to Shar because Selune wouldn't let him forget the nightmares he recieved by visiting the peaks of flame (where Dendar was entrapped and where Emperor Sseth disappeared).
Haven't put it all together yet, but there's something here.... and my initial thoughts are that there will be something coming to a head between Set and Shar. |
Alavairthae, may your skill prevail
Phillip aka Sleyvas |
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Purple Dragon Knight
Master of Realmslore
Canada
1796 Posts |
Posted - 01 Oct 2007 : 04:20:17
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| Sleyvas... well done! whether canon or not, some of this may make some incursions in my campaign. I currently run my players through the Age of Worms using Eric's notes: a post Age of Worm epic campaign involving such "epic leads", with Shar, Dendar and serpent gods, could be interesting... please keep us informed of any other speculations you have on this. |
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Brian R. James
Forgotten Realms Game Designer
USA
1098 Posts |
Posted - 01 Oct 2007 : 04:35:36
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It's nice to see someone going through the timeline proper and not focus on the last few pages.  |
Brian R. James - Freelance Game Designer
Follow me on Twitter @brianrjames |
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Aewrik
Seeker
80 Posts |
Posted - 01 Oct 2007 : 05:09:47
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I want my copy, now 
I have to go to the bookstore tomorrow and see if they just haven't forgotten to call me... |
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maransreth
Learned Scribe
Australia
157 Posts |
Posted - 01 Oct 2007 : 08:13:38
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| Same here. Its now been how many weeks since it was released, and it looks like no-one outside of the States (unless they ordered from an US online store) has received copies as of yet. |
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Zanan
Senior Scribe
Germany
942 Posts |
Posted - 01 Oct 2007 : 09:16:00
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I got mine on publishing date via amazon (-> Germany).
The "funny" thing about the last two pages is that much of it has not yet even occured, but people theorize about it as if it happened in the past. |
Cave quid dicis, quando et cui!
Gæð a wyrd swa hio scel!
In memory of Alura Durshavin.
Visit my "Homepage" to find A Guide to the Drow NPCs of Faerûn, Drow and non-Drow PrC and much more. |
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Chosen of Moradin
Master of Realmslore
Brazil
1120 Posts |
Posted - 01 Oct 2007 : 14:01:31
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quote:
Originally posted by sleyvas
...Another thing I find of interest, Larloch's enclave, Jiksidur, crashed in northern Narfell when Karsus cast his avatar spell. However, his warlock's crypt is actually his enemy's enclave of Orbedal. Therefore, before Narfell fell, there was a crashed netherese enclave within their domain (granted, this was in the last 190 years of their empire, but....). Also, conceivably, Larloch had some involvement with Narfell, otherwise his enclave wouldn't have been there?
Now, the funny thing about this: back in july my players was exploring an ancient ruin in Narfell. It was to be only a simple "explore the dungeon" adventure, and in the end, they fight a kind of mummy, and the rogue of the group recover the mummy´s scepter, and stay with it now. Some days later, I was re-reading Ed´s answers about living nethereses, and the fact that some netherese still live, in sentient items. 
With this in mind, I re-hash the concept of the ruin, and established it as an old netherese enclave, that hit Narfell´s ground in Karsu´s folly. Right now, the "scepter" have givem some good advice to the rogue (that don´t know yet who was talking in her mind ).
And now... I have realmslore suporting my idea? That´s funny! And better yet, Larloch enclave? 
Ho ho ho. |
Dwarf, DM, husband, and proud of this! :P
twitter: @yuripeixoto
Facebook: yuri.peixoto |
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sleyvas
Skilled Spell Strategist
USA
11691 Posts |
Posted - 01 Oct 2007 : 17:04:04
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quote:
Originally posted by Chosen of Moradin
quote:
Originally posted by sleyvas
...Another thing I find of interest, Larloch's enclave, Jiksidur, crashed in northern Narfell when Karsus cast his avatar spell. However, his warlock's crypt is actually his enemy's enclave of Orbedal. Therefore, before Narfell fell, there was a crashed netherese enclave within their domain (granted, this was in the last 190 years of their empire, but....). Also, conceivably, Larloch had some involvement with Narfell, otherwise his enclave wouldn't have been there?
Now, the funny thing about this: back in july my players was exploring an ancient ruin in Narfell. It was to be only a simple "explore the dungeon" adventure, and in the end, they fight a kind of mummy, and the rogue of the group recover the mummy´s scepter, and stay with it now. Some days later, I was re-reading Ed´s answers about living nethereses, and the fact that some netherese still live, in sentient items.
With this in mind, I re-hash the concept of the ruin, and established it as an old netherese enclave, that hit Narfell´s ground in Karsu´s folly. Right now, the "scepter" have givem some good advice to the rogue (that don´t know yet who was talking in her mind ).
And now... I have realmslore suporting my idea? That´s funny! And better yet, Larloch enclave?
Ho ho ho.
Yeah, I had always wondered how much these two cultures would have interacted. After all, they were relatively close to one another. I wonder what kind of information may have been getting shared? For instance, the Narfellians were masters of "binding" beings due to their studies of Narathmault (Dun-Tharos) and possibly old Illithyri Clan Seltormir works. Could this binding magic have been modified in order to bind undead like liches? Could this have been why Larloch was in the area?
Could Zhengyi's purpose for capturing Vaasa have involved finding and studying Larloch's enclave? |
Alavairthae, may your skill prevail
Phillip aka Sleyvas |
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khorne
Master of Realmslore
Finland
1073 Posts |
Posted - 01 Oct 2007 : 17:09:09
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quote:
Originally posted by Brian R. James
It's nice to see someone going through the timeline proper and not focus on the last few pages.
Maybe it's so hard to ignore the last pages because the information written there hits you in the face like Tempus's fist.
(rest of the book was fantastic, though) |
If I were a ranger, I would pick NDA for my favorite enemy |
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sleyvas
Skilled Spell Strategist
USA
11691 Posts |
Posted - 01 Oct 2007 : 19:22:53
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quote:
Originally posted by The Sage
quote:
Originally posted by sleyvas
Next, do we have a date for the death of Borem of the Boiling Mud yet? If not, we know that Kisonraathiisar's death was in -349 and he was the Topaz dragon ruling westgate. In the year of Boiling Moats (which was?) we have what would seem to be Kisonraathiisar speaking of the arrival of the mortal forms of Bane, Bhaal, and Myrkul to kill Borem.
We know that Bane, Bhaal, and Myrkul slew Borem -- one of the Seven Lost Gods -- each seizing a portion of Borem's divine essence for themselves. This was, perhaps, shortly before they entered the Castle of Bone and confronted Jergal.
F&P places the Lake of Boiling Mud's, which may have been the "avatar" of Borem, possible location on Mezeketh Isle -- two miles SW of Saerloon's harbor. It's also said that the Lake may have existed, during pre-Dale Reckoning, somewhere in Jhaamdath -- possibly in the vicinity of what would become Sembia. No specific dates are offered.
Jhaamdath "falls" in -255 DR. And Chondathan, which will eventually become Saerloon, was "properly" established between the 360's and 380's DR. 'Tis likely founded some time before that... given that Chondathan migrations across the Inner Sea to the lands of what will become Sembia, occur around the -200s DR.
Given the -339 DR starting point, and the details about the Lake possibly being located in pre-Dale Reckoning Jhaamdath, that could possibly narrow the period of Bane's ascension and the death of Borem to between Netheril's Fall in -339 DR and the Fall of Jhaamdath in -255 DR.
Additionally, Eric offers this little tidbit...
"Implicit in your assumption is that the Lake of Burning Blood is a "real lake". I'd suggest that maybe it's a moveable lake (in other words, the lake is the "avatar" of Borem). Alternatively, it could be the lake is created by opening a blood-spewing portal. When the portal closes/moves, the lake drains away.
--Eric"
Hmmm, if I'm correct in that the person "speaking" about the Borem entry in GHoTR is actually Kisonrathiisar... then actually, this date would be pre -349 DR, and thereby pre-Karsus. However, I need more info for confirmation of the speaker's identity. I'm gonna try cloak and dagger, hopefully it has some info on westgate. Of course, even if it was pre-Karsus, it doesn't mean they ascended pre-Karsus, just that they killed Borem pre-Karsus (and became immortal, as they "took a step away from mortality" according to F&P).
The entry does strongly indicate that the 3 came, killed Borem, and took off with his heart and the Jathiman dagger. So, the isle where the dagger is found is not where the battle took place. Wish I had my GHotR right now. I'd like to reread that section. |
Alavairthae, may your skill prevail
Phillip aka Sleyvas |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36779 Posts |
Posted - 02 Oct 2007 : 00:32:37
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| I like the sidebar on page 60. It gives a nice insight into why Vanrak Moonstar became such a git, and the fact that his journal is no longer in his hands implies (to me, at least) that he is no longer around. |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
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sleyvas
Skilled Spell Strategist
USA
11691 Posts |
Posted - 02 Oct 2007 : 01:39:28
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quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
I like the sidebar on page 60. It gives a nice insight into why Vanrak Moonstar became such a git, and the fact that his journal is no longer in his hands implies (to me, at least) that he is no longer around.
Was never hated or loved him, but I wonder if he didn't have something to do with Halaster's failure. The twisted rune was involved, but they tend to work through undead. Shar has some ties to Halaster's problems. Vanrak is a death knight. Its all circumstantial, but it could play out. |
Alavairthae, may your skill prevail
Phillip aka Sleyvas |
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Gray Richardson
Master of Realmslore
USA
1291 Posts |
Posted - 02 Oct 2007 : 03:25:26
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FYI the year of Boiling Moats is in -359 DR. About 20 years before Netheril fell. I find it interesting, because it means that Bane, Bhaal & Myrkul may have ascended earlier than we had thought. Although, we don't know that they actually ascended immediately after killing Borem.
However, I had always assumed they had started out on a series of trials, part of an "ascension quest", that culminated in killing Borem, with their ascension ceremony happening soon after. While I suppose it is possible that the quest could have continued for some years after the slaying of Borem, I would think it likely they ascended in -359 DR or close to it.
Which is weird, because I had always thought Jergal had passed along his portfolios out of some great ennui, precipitated by the fall of Netheril--and the death of a large part of his worshiper base. But if Jergal instead abdicated 20 years before the Fall, that strikes me as more of a Machiavellian scheme, like he wanted to unload his portfolios in a hurry, at a discount to the first interested marks. |
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KnightErrantJR
Great Reader
USA
5402 Posts |
Posted - 02 Oct 2007 : 04:08:30
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quote:
Originally posted by Gray Richardson
But if Jergal instead abdicated 20 years before the Fall, that strikes me as more of a Machiavellian scheme, like he wanted to unload his portfolios in a hurry, at a discount to the first interested marks.
Which is why I dearly love Eric Boyd's conversion notes for the Age of Worms Adventure Path, and wish that some aspect of them could creep into Realmslore proper, though it would likely have to be a bit modified. |
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Daviot
Senior Scribe
USA
372 Posts |
Posted - 02 Oct 2007 : 04:12:11
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On some of my favorite nuggets:
-I didn't realized that Velsharoon ascended so recently. I thought he'd been deific longer than he'd been. I suppose he'd just been very lichlike for many centuries prior.
-Loved the Raumathar/Narfell tidbits. I took to liking those Lost Empires when I first heard about them, and it's interesting how two migratory horse-riding peoples took to magic in totally different ways and became the local superpowers for several hundred years. Mutually assured destruction's never been so much fun/heroic!
-It was nice to see the Spelljamming tidbits, and a surprisingly huge amount of Shou references for a book focused on the otherside of the supercontinent in question. |
One usually has far more to fear from the soft-spoken wizard with a blade and well-worn boots than from the boisterous one in the ivory tower.
My Tabletop Writing CV. |
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warlockco
Master of Realmslore
USA
1695 Posts |
Posted - 02 Oct 2007 : 04:55:23
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quote:
Originally posted by khorne
quote:
Originally posted by Brian R. James
It's nice to see someone going through the timeline proper and not focus on the last few pages.
Maybe it's so hard to ignore the last pages because the information written there hits you in the face like Tempus's fist.
(rest of the book was fantastic, though)
Have to agree. |
News of the Weird
D20 System Reference Document
D20 Modern System Reference Document
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scererar
Master of Realmslore
USA
1618 Posts |
Posted - 02 Oct 2007 : 05:06:32
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quote:
Originally posted by Brian R. James
It's nice to see someone going through the timeline proper and not focus on the last few pages.
here here  yes, the OTHER 158 pages of lore |
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sleyvas
Skilled Spell Strategist
USA
11691 Posts |
Posted - 02 Oct 2007 : 15:09:31
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quote:
Originally posted by Gray Richardson
FYI the year of Boiling Moats is in -359 DR. About 20 years before Netheril fell. I find it interesting, because it means that Bane, Bhaal & Myrkul may have ascended earlier than we had thought. Although, we don't know that they actually ascended immediately after killing Borem.
However, I had always assumed they had started out on a series of trials, part of an "ascension quest", that culminated in killing Borem, with their ascension ceremony happening soon after. While I suppose it is possible that the quest could have continued for some years after the slaying of Borem, I would think it likely they ascended in -359 DR or close to it.
Which is weird, because I had always thought Jergal had passed along his portfolios out of some great ennui, precipitated by the fall of Netheril--and the death of a large part of his worshiper base. But if Jergal instead abdicated 20 years before the Fall, that strikes me as more of a Machiavellian scheme, like he wanted to unload his portfolios in a hurry, at a discount to the first interested marks.
Gods bless you! Where did you find reference for the year name? I've been scouring through some things, but hadn't found it yet. I like this idea that Jergal had some plan in mind.
It also opens up some ideas to me that Mellifleur's ascension occurred pre-Karsus as well. Especially if Mellifleur's ascension happened at the same time that Jergal was giving over his power to Bane, Bhaal, and Myrkul. Do we know when Karsus actually began his study into his Karsus' Avatar spell? Could he have been inspired by the actions of these 4 individuals? As always speculation is the name of the game. |
Alavairthae, may your skill prevail
Phillip aka Sleyvas |
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Chosen of Moradin
Master of Realmslore
Brazil
1120 Posts |
Posted - 02 Oct 2007 : 18:37:16
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This is what Netheril - Empire of Magic says:
"He finished a spell that he’d been working on for years and then cast it upon himself."
I check Lost Empires of Faerûn, and it don´t give any date, too. |
Dwarf, DM, husband, and proud of this! :P
twitter: @yuripeixoto
Facebook: yuri.peixoto |
Edited by - Chosen of Moradin on 02 Oct 2007 18:45:56 |
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Asgetrion
Master of Realmslore
Finland
1564 Posts |
Posted - 02 Oct 2007 : 23:09:35
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| *SIGH*, I'm still waiting for my copy -- the guy at my FLGS told me that GHotR will arrive in a week and a half if I'm lucky (and the damned polar bears don't eat the shipment ;) |
"What am I doing today? Ask me tomorrow - I can be sure of giving you the right answer then."
-- Askarran of Selgaunt, Master Sage, speaking to a curious merchant, Year of the Helm |
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Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire
USA
15724 Posts |
Posted - 03 Oct 2007 : 00:47:31
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The Term 'Hortha' appears to indicate an outsider - probably a unique one, ie, an Archfiend. The prefix 'Ur' is from German -
ur-, Ur- prefix
"original, primitive, ancient" [< German ur- "the original condition or first representative of a thing" < Middle & Old High German ur- "out (of)"].
Ergo, even though it is borrowed from RW language, we can assume that Kossuth is considered an "Archfiend most High" by the Raumathari. Given the new connections between demons and elementals in 4e, it would make tons of sense in the new lore that Kossuth was considered an Elemental Ancient.
quote:
Originally posted by sleyvas
Another thing I find of interest, Larloch's enclave, Jiksidur, crashed in northern Narfell when Karsus cast his avatar spell. However, his warlock's crypt is actually his enemy's enclave of Orbedal. Therefore, before Narfell fell, there was a crashed netherese enclave within their domain (granted, this was in the last 190 years of their empire, but....). Also, conceivably, Larloch had some involvement with Narfell, otherwise his enclave wouldn't have been there?
Look under the Jiksidur entry in LEoF - it's in the 'Fallen Netheril' - Shattered Cities section. First the Nentyarch of Narfell 'raided' the place, and later Larloch managed to recover many of the stolen artifacts from Demonbinder tombs.
quote:
Originally posted by sleyvas
Gods bless you! Where did you find reference for the year name? I've been scouring through some things, but hadn't found it yet. I like this idea that Jergal had some plan in mind.
Its the very first sentence in the Battle of Boiling Mud sidebar on page 46. |
"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone
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Edited by - Markustay on 03 Oct 2007 04:19:29 |
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sleyvas
Skilled Spell Strategist
USA
11691 Posts |
Posted - 04 Oct 2007 : 19:20:51
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quote:
Originally posted by Markustay
The Term 'Hortha' appears to indicate an outsider - probably a unique one, ie, an Archfiend. The prefix 'Ur' is from German -
ur-, Ur- prefix
"original, primitive, ancient" [< German ur- "the original condition or first representative of a thing" < Middle & Old High German ur- "out (of)"].
Ergo, even though it is borrowed from RW language, we can assume that Kossuth is considered an "Archfiend most High" by the Raumathari. Given the new connections between demons and elementals in 4e, it would make tons of sense in the new lore that Kossuth was considered an Elemental Ancient.
quote:
Originally posted by sleyvas
Another thing I find of interest, Larloch's enclave, Jiksidur, crashed in northern Narfell when Karsus cast his avatar spell. However, his warlock's crypt is actually his enemy's enclave of Orbedal. Therefore, before Narfell fell, there was a crashed netherese enclave within their domain (granted, this was in the last 190 years of their empire, but....). Also, conceivably, Larloch had some involvement with Narfell, otherwise his enclave wouldn't have been there?
Look under the Jiksidur entry in LEoF - it's in the 'Fallen Netheril' - Shattered Cities section. First the Nentyarch of Narfell 'raided' the place, and later Larloch managed to recover many of the stolen artifacts from Demonbinder tombs.
quote:
Originally posted by sleyvas
Gods bless you! Where did you find reference for the year name? I've been scouring through some things, but hadn't found it yet. I like this idea that Jergal had some plan in mind.
Its the very first sentence in the Battle of Boiling Mud sidebar on page 46.
No, I'm sorry, should have made myself clearer. Where did you find the reference of -359 being the year of boiling moats? The GHotR doesn't have any reference for -359 DR and I didn't easily spot it anywhere else.
Thanks for the input on Jiksidur. I wonder what kind of spying Larloch was doing that would require him to bring his whole enclave within proximity of the country. It would sound more like he was doing "political intrigue" type spying where he and his enclave were interacting with Narfell in some form.... rather than the kind of spying where he was trying to hide.
As to the Hortha/urhortha thing... my belief would be that a hortha would be their term for an "aspect" and an urhortha would be an "avatar". I believe this because they don't ever reference Eltab as an urhortha. Especially given that I think they actually made a miniature that was an aspect of Kostchtchie (sp?), and it would be a good way to subtly promote both that product and the idea of aspects. I think drith would be more of a term for outsider (or maybe its more specific to demon). I guess we'll need more examples to be able to nail it down more (and something makes me think some of this was posted elsewhere... maybe the article on Impiltur?). |
Alavairthae, may your skill prevail
Phillip aka Sleyvas |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36779 Posts |
Posted - 04 Oct 2007 : 20:51:22
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quote:
Originally posted by sleyvas
No, I'm sorry, should have made myself clearer. Where did you find the reference of -359 being the year of boiling moats? The GHotR doesn't have any reference for -359 DR and I didn't easily spot it anywhere else.
If it's just the year name you're unsure about, it's on the Roll of Years. And that can be found in a couple of different places -- it's part of the Forgotten Realms Calendar Tool, and on this site we have a zip file containing various formats for the Roll of Years. It's also still on the WotC site in the original RTF format (I believe that file is also part of the zip file I linked to), but you'll never find it without knowing the URL -- it's not linked to anywhere that I know of.
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Foxhelm
Senior Scribe
Canada
592 Posts |
Posted - 04 Oct 2007 : 21:52:15
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An interesting thought is the Roll of Years along with the Black Roll of years.
The Black Chronology is an alternative roll of years inspired by vision from Shar. So could it be possible there are other rolls of years inspired by the visions of other gods as well? The roll of Shadows from Mask or the Roll of Radiance by Lathander.
The roll of years have been inspired by many prophecies like those from the elves. Is there an active group which collects the prophecies of the different races, civil and savage, and collect them to be reviewed?
Who would they be and why would they exist? Do they collect the visions of the future and study them for better idea for the years to come? Looking for common images between the races for a more likely future.
Might make an interesting aspect for an campaign or adventure. |
Ed Greenwood! The Solution... and Cause of all the Realms Problems! |
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Gray Richardson
Master of Realmslore
USA
1291 Posts |
Posted - 05 Oct 2007 : 02:29:16
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Speaking of gems of lore, the page about Kurtulmak and the urds sparkles particularly brilliantly for me. I have been thinking a lot about it and the implications.
I could go on to list more gems, but I think I might find in short order I would have listed the entire contents of the book. Tis indeed a treasurehouse of lore. |
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sleyvas
Skilled Spell Strategist
USA
11691 Posts |
Posted - 05 Oct 2007 : 03:39:16
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quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
quote:
Originally posted by sleyvas
No, I'm sorry, should have made myself clearer. Where did you find the reference of -359 being the year of boiling moats? The GHotR doesn't have any reference for -359 DR and I didn't easily spot it anywhere else.
If it's just the year name you're unsure about, it's on the Roll of Years. And that can be found in a couple of different places -- it's part of the Forgotten Realms Calendar Tool, and on this site we have a zip file containing various formats for the Roll of Years. It's also still on the WotC site in the original RTF format (I believe that file is also part of the zip file I linked to), but you'll never find it without knowing the URL -- it's not linked to anywhere that I know of.
Thanks Wooly!!! Now this is a useful research tool |
Alavairthae, may your skill prevail
Phillip aka Sleyvas |
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sleyvas
Skilled Spell Strategist
USA
11691 Posts |
Posted - 05 Oct 2007 : 03:43:15
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quote:
Originally posted by Gray Richardson
Speaking of gems of lore, the page about Kurtulmak and the urds sparkles particularly brilliantly for me. I have been thinking a lot about it and the implications.
I could go on to list more gems, but I think I might find in short order I would have listed the entire contents of the book. Tis indeed a treasurehouse of lore.
Yeah, I did find this pretty good myself. Very interesting, especially since I believe there was an old dungeon mag module involving urds that was where this indicated urds had gone.
I'm not a big Shou fan, but I did find these entries about Giants in Grey and the impossible silver dome that come and go interesting. Not sure what they pertain to though. For some reason, it brings to mind spelljammer, but I don't know why. |
Alavairthae, may your skill prevail
Phillip aka Sleyvas |
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Gray Richardson
Master of Realmslore
USA
1291 Posts |
Posted - 05 Oct 2007 : 07:21:21
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I read about the Giants in Grey too and was also very intrigued, but not sure if I caught all their entries. I want to know more of them.
I personally like the Shou. There was a particular emperor of theirs that seemed very cool. |
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Rinonalyrna Fathomlin
Great Reader
USA
7106 Posts |
Posted - 06 Oct 2007 : 05:25:14
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This is indeed a fun book to read. It functions more as a starting point for learning about most subjects (that is, it's not the source to go to for depth), but that's the nature of a timeline. This in the kind of book I like to flip through just to find whatever I find.
I have to admit, I do have some nitpicks with the book, but overall it's a fine work, and I'm glad to have it. |
"Instead of asking why we sleep, it might make sense to ask why we wake. Perchance we live to dream. From that perspective, the sea of troubles we navigate in the workaday world might be the price we pay for admission to another night in the world of dreams."
--Richard Greene (letter to Time) |
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Gems of Lore in GHotR
