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 Elminster and Psionics
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Kuje
Great Reader

USA
7898 Posts

Posted - 24 Apr 2006 :  23:21:52  Show Profile  Send Kuje an AOL message  Click to see Kuje's MSN Messenger address  Send Kuje a Yahoo! Message Send Kuje a Private Message  Reply with Quote  Delete Topic
I'm moving these replies from Ed's scroll since it turned into a discussion over there.

On April 24th rweston posted: Wooly,
The article in question (Elminster 1st ed stats) was in Dragon #110.
The one with the cover image lovely glade with a unicrn nibbling grass next to a long dead adventurer's skeleton.
Man I love that cover.

Anyway...
Elminster had psionic stas in that article - though I've suspected for a long time that the psionic powers Ed attibuted to Elminster in that article were of the "none of this is a lie, but not all may proove to be true" lore.
My guess is psionic stats were a "cover" for Elminsters powers as a "Chosen". Something to keep everyone in the dark until the decision to reveal chosem / silver fire / spellfire etc.
That's just a guess though.
:)
Rory"

On April 24th Kaladorm posted: "I'm pretty sure it's not a cover, Elminster does indeed have psionic powers. Can't remember what it was but somewhere I read a (canon) description which briefly explained the character of El, and as well as mentioning his skills as a rogue and his abilities to dance it mentioned his psionic powers."

On April 24th rweston posted: "The article in question (#110) was the first full on stat block of Elminster I remember seeing, and as far as I can recall it was penned by Ed (I don't have the article in front of me - but I'm 99.999% sure it was Ed).

So, as far as I know, for 1st edition, Elminster's psionic powers were what you'd call "Canon".

I am suggesting that seeing as the article came out before the whole Chosen power suite/silver fire lore was revealed, I thought it possible that Ed might have been having some fun with it.

Elminster was listed as having an "Energy Control" power (I'm not sure that was the exact name) which lets you absorb magical energy attacks, transforming the energy into harmless light.

That would look pretty similar to a spellfire wielder or a silver fire wielder absorbing an incoming spell attack, wouldn't it?

I like psionics, Elminsters is listed as having psionics at the very least in his 1st edition write up, I'm just suggesting that it may have been a bit of misdirection, or a bit of both (El has psionics, but some of his chosen powers could have been described as psionic powers early on).
:)
Rory Weston"

Now, pray continue the debate in this scroll, not Ed's. :)

For some of us, books are as important as almost anything else on earth. What a miracle it is that out of these small, flat, rigid squares of paper unfolds world after world, worlds that sing to you, comfort and quiet and excite you... Books are full of the things that you don't get in real life - wonderful, lyrical language, for instance, right off the bat. - Anne Lamott, Bird by Bird

My Goodreads page: http://www.goodreads.com/kuje

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rweston
Acolyte

Canada
13 Posts

Posted - 25 Apr 2006 :  00:25:11  Show Profile  Visit rweston's Homepage Send rweston a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Hello Kuje,

I didn't mean to spark a debate, I just want to point to the original article for those interested & bring up my suspicions about the lore & see if Ed or THO would comment.

I was actually agreeing with Kaladorm regarding Canon, I was just pointing out that Ed's fond of misdirection & subtle hints & wondering if that was the case here.
Sorry if it came across as a debate.
:)
Rory Weston
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Kuje
Great Reader

USA
7898 Posts

Posted - 25 Apr 2006 :  00:32:30  Show Profile  Send Kuje an AOL message  Click to see Kuje's MSN Messenger address  Send Kuje a Yahoo! Message Send Kuje a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by rweston

Hello Kuje,

I didn't mean to spark a debate, I just want to point to the original article for those interested & bring up my suspicions about the lore & see if Ed or THO would comment.

I was actually agreeing with Kaladorm regarding Canon, I was just pointing out that Ed's fond of misdirection & subtle hints & wondering if that was the case here.
Sorry if it came across as a debate.
:)
Rory Weston




Aye,

I know you didn't but it was heading into a large discussion in Ed's scroll and the point of his scroll is for him to answer posts from questions people have asked. Having these debates in his scroll tends to distract from that and it makes finding his replies harder to find. :) So, I moved the replies to this scroll.

For some of us, books are as important as almost anything else on earth. What a miracle it is that out of these small, flat, rigid squares of paper unfolds world after world, worlds that sing to you, comfort and quiet and excite you... Books are full of the things that you don't get in real life - wonderful, lyrical language, for instance, right off the bat. - Anne Lamott, Bird by Bird

My Goodreads page: http://www.goodreads.com/kuje

Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium
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George Krashos
Master of Realmslore

Australia
3729 Posts

Posted - 25 Apr 2006 :  02:36:13  Show Profile Send George Krashos a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Ed also showcases Elminster's psionic powers in the novel "Elminster: Making of a Mage".

-- George Krashos

"Because only we, contrary to the barbarians, never count the enemy in battle." -- Aeschylus

Edited by - George Krashos on 25 Apr 2006 02:36:51
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Hoondatha
Great Reader

USA
2219 Posts

Posted - 25 Apr 2006 :  03:26:03  Show Profile  Visit Hoondatha's Homepage Send Hoondatha a Private Message  Reply with Quote
He does? Where? Sigh. It's touch being without all of my books.

Doggedly converting 3e back to what D&D should be...
Sigh... And now 4e as well.
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George Krashos
Master of Realmslore

Australia
3729 Posts

Posted - 25 Apr 2006 :  06:54:56  Show Profile Send George Krashos a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Right at the beginning, as a young child. The magelord charms him and orders him to run off a cliff. he heals himself using psionics as he lies, badly wounded in a ravine.

-- George Krashos

"Because only we, contrary to the barbarians, never count the enemy in battle." -- Aeschylus
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Faraer
Great Reader

3235 Posts

Posted - 25 Apr 2006 :  14:02:18  Show Profile  Visit Faraer's Homepage Send Faraer a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Elminster's psionics are a salutary example of the kind of minor, little-known abilities that are typical of Realms characters but not handled by overprecise 3E stat blocks.
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
Moderator

USA
26994 Posts

Posted - 25 Apr 2006 :  17:26:53  Show Profile Send Wooly Rupert a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Faraer

Elminster's psionics are a salutary example of the kind of minor, little-known abilities that are typical of Realms characters but not handled by overprecise 3E stat blocks.



Kinda like the innate talents mentioned on pages 82-3 of Volo's Guide to All Things Magical (formerly a suppressed work, now freely available from the Wizards downloads page)... 'Twas just nifty little magical abilities average people might or might not possess...

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KnightErrantJR
Great Reader

USA
5382 Posts

Posted - 25 Apr 2006 :  17:30:48  Show Profile  Visit KnightErrantJR's Homepage Send KnightErrantJR a Private Message  Reply with Quote
They also mention things like this in the DMG II, traits that various NPCs might have that, while they have rules attatched to them, aren't something you can just take a feat to gain, or pick up from having a given class.

"Because philosophy arises from awe, a philosopher is bound in his way to be a lover of myths and poetic fables. Poets and philosophers are alike in being big with wonder."--Saint Thomas Aquinas

http://knighterrantjr.blogspot.com/

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Faraer
Great Reader

3235 Posts

Posted - 25 Apr 2006 :  17:37:46  Show Profile  Visit Faraer's Homepage Send Faraer a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Right. But they are something that a DM might give a PC -- and therefore not an example of the 'favoured treament for certain NPCs' that's occasionally supposed.
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khorne
Master of Realmslore

Finland
1069 Posts

Posted - 25 Apr 2006 :  18:35:23  Show Profile  Visit khorne's Homepage  Click to see khorne's MSN Messenger address Send khorne a Private Message  Reply with Quote
If Elminster has psionic powers, why has he not developed his potential more? I mean, it would give him an edge, being able to use both arcane and psionic magic.

If I were a ranger, I would pick NDA for my favorite enemy
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Moderator

Australia
31435 Posts

Posted - 25 Apr 2006 :  18:45:20  Show Profile  Send The Sage an AOL message  Click to see The Sage's MSN Messenger address  Send The Sage a Yahoo! Message Send The Sage a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Because it's likely they've just fallen into dis-use... much like his skills picked up from the times when he was a fighter, a thief, and a priestess, before becoming a mage. Yes, he likely utilises a minor psionic ability here and there (sometimes drawing on more significant powers of the mind when the need arises), but they're largely neglected abilities now... or he's simply chosen not to develop them further.

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Edited by - The Sage on 25 Apr 2006 18:46:30
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