Candlekeep Forum
Candlekeep Forum
Home | Profile | Register | Active Topics | Active Polls | Members | Private Messages | Search | FAQ
Username:
Password:
Save Password
Forgot your Password?

 All Forums
 Realmslore
 Sages of Realmslore
 Pyramids under Ascore
 New Topic  New Poll New Poll
 Reply to Topic
 Printer Friendly
Previous Page | Next Page
Author Previous Topic Topic Next Topic
Page: of 8

George Krashos
Master of Realmslore

Australia
4788 Posts

Posted - 19 Jul 2009 :  09:06:09  Show Profile Send George Krashos a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Oh, it certainly exists - I keep most everything - but it's pointless for it to ever see the light of day.

-- George Krashos

"Because only we, contrary to the barbarians, never count the enemy in battle." -- Aeschylus
Go to Top of Page

Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire

USA
13441 Posts

Posted - 19 Jul 2009 :  21:17:15  Show Profile Send Markustay a Private Message  Reply with Quote
NOTHING 'FR' is EVER pointless.

Shame on you, Krash...

Even if it never becomes canon, it still gives us all something to mull over (and discuss). Then again, perhaps it wasn't all that great to begin with...

Are those four-sided pyramids, BTW? Just wondering... I was doing something in my own setting, using them as magical accumulators (which is supposedly along the lines of what they were for in RW).

"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone


Edited by - Markustay on 19 Jul 2009 21:18:23
Go to Top of Page

Jakk
Great Reader

Canada
2165 Posts

Posted - 20 Jul 2009 :  03:25:04  Show Profile Send Jakk a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Five-sided (pentagonal), IIRC... yep, check the OP... and red, as we should all know by now...

Edit: So *why* is it pointless for the lore to see the light of day, exactly? Just because the Smellplague has overrun the Realms, doesn't mean that everybody's holding their noses and diving in. I have a completely separate alternate unplagued timeline that I am fully committed to, and I would love to have more lore to contribute to it... particularly lore from masters such as yourself, Krash. I mean, as you know from this scroll, I have my own theory, but now that you've said that my theory has nothing to do with what was almost canon, you've made it necessary (if possible) to share what might have been, imho... assuming that the NDA no longer applies thanks to the LEoF cut and the timeline advance.

Edit 2: And, as Markustay says, it gives us something to ponder and debate, which is what Candlekeep is for, is it not?

Playing in the Realms since the Old Grey Box (1987)... and *still* having fun with material published before 2008, despite the NDA'd lore.

If it's comparable in power with non-magical abilities, it's not magic.

Edited by - Jakk on 20 Jul 2009 03:38:25
Go to Top of Page

Nightseer
Seeker

45 Posts

Posted - 20 Jul 2009 :  07:08:05  Show Profile Send Nightseer a Private Message  Reply with Quote
3 little ity bity letters.....NDA.

Shar!
Go to Top of Page

Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire

USA
13441 Posts

Posted - 20 Jul 2009 :  15:08:56  Show Profile Send Markustay a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Jakk

Five-sided (pentagonal), IIRC... yep, check the OP... and red, as we should all know by now...
Interesting.

If the Netherease used the concept of five elements (like Eastern philosiphy), rather then the standard four, that would work.

I was going with 'five sided' for my Egypt-like region in my homebrew, just to be different. I suppose every idea HAS already been thought of before <sigh>.

"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone


Edited by - Markustay on 20 Jul 2009 15:09:34
Go to Top of Page

Ashe Ravenheart
Great Reader

USA
3071 Posts

Posted - 20 Jul 2009 :  15:21:06  Show Profile Send Ashe Ravenheart a Private Message  Reply with Quote
*put my mathematics degree to use*

The difficulty in a five-sided polygon is in figuring out how to create it with a compass (the one that draws circles, not the one that points north). It's one of those mathematical conundrums that, although you can create almost any of the basic degrees using a compass, the 72 degree needed to create a five-sided polygon is impossible* to do with a compass.

So, the question then becomes how difficult is it to express architecturally in the plans to build one? A four-sided pyramid, therefore, becomes MUCH more easier to design and build since 90 degrees is easy to create.

Of course, all this gets tossed out the window once you start using magic and it's "reality-is-just-a-guidline" rules-breaking.





*impossible, of course is defined as 'hasn't been done yet', of course.

I actually DO know everything. I just have a very poor index of my knowledge.

Ashe's Character Sheet

Alphabetized Index of Realms NPCs
Go to Top of Page

Jakk
Great Reader

Canada
2165 Posts

Posted - 24 Jul 2009 :  02:34:17  Show Profile Send Jakk a Private Message  Reply with Quote
*bump*
quote:
Originally posted by George Krashos

Oh, it certainly exists - I keep most everything - but it's pointless for it to ever see the light of day.

-- George Krashos




quote:
Originally posted by Markustay

NOTHING 'FR' is EVER pointless.

Shame on you, Krash...

Even if it never becomes canon, it still gives us all something to mull over (and discuss).

<snip>



Agreed, Mark... just because Toril is round, doesn't mean it's pointless. The Earth, on the other hand...

So, Krash... this (admittedly non-canon) lore is pointless why? NDA hoops too numerous to jump through? It's always worth it for Realmslore, even of the non-canonical sort. Really.

Playing in the Realms since the Old Grey Box (1987)... and *still* having fun with material published before 2008, despite the NDA'd lore.

If it's comparable in power with non-magical abilities, it's not magic.
Go to Top of Page

Arivia
Great Reader

Canada
2872 Posts

Posted - 24 Jul 2009 :  02:40:15  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I'd imagine likely because that draft of the Old North was written over and that explanation would be jarring with or conflict against the final product.
Go to Top of Page

Jakk
Great Reader

Canada
2165 Posts

Posted - 24 Jul 2009 :  03:52:05  Show Profile Send Jakk a Private Message  Reply with Quote
So? We should be used to jarring and conflicting explanations in the Brave New Realms (TM) by now... what's one more?

Playing in the Realms since the Old Grey Box (1987)... and *still* having fun with material published before 2008, despite the NDA'd lore.

If it's comparable in power with non-magical abilities, it's not magic.
Go to Top of Page

Arivia
Great Reader

Canada
2872 Posts

Posted - 24 Jul 2009 :  04:46:26  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Cute.

While good things come out of omissions and contradictions, there's no need to introduce more.
Go to Top of Page

Ashe Ravenheart
Great Reader

USA
3071 Posts

Posted - 24 Jul 2009 :  13:54:08  Show Profile Send Ashe Ravenheart a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Arivia

Cute.

While good things come out of omissions and contradictions, there's no need to introduce more.



Tell that to the editors of DC and Marvel...

I actually DO know everything. I just have a very poor index of my knowledge.

Ashe's Character Sheet

Alphabetized Index of Realms NPCs
Go to Top of Page

Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire

USA
13441 Posts

Posted - 24 Jul 2009 :  14:32:40  Show Profile Send Markustay a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Yeah... and see how well they're doing <smirk>.

They probably make more money now off of franchising their IP then they do off the comics...

Which sounds a lot like FR these days... we've been told for quite some time that the novels make more then the game. Its probably the only reason why there was a 4e FR (because if Eberron novels sold nearly as well, THAT setting would have been thier flagship).

"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone

Go to Top of Page

Jakk
Great Reader

Canada
2165 Posts

Posted - 25 Jul 2009 :  00:34:10  Show Profile Send Jakk a Private Message  Reply with Quote
So... why did they bother with a 4E game setting at all, instead of making the Spellplague a novels-only thing? Oh... right... that would have made *everyone* happy... erm... no. The grognards like myself, Ashe, and Markustay would still be outraged, only this time over two things: the Spellplague *and* the complete lack of gaming materials. Mind you, that's not so different from the present situation, is it?

Anyway, to return this scroll to topic... does anyone have any other theories about these pyramids?

Playing in the Realms since the Old Grey Box (1987)... and *still* having fun with material published before 2008, despite the NDA'd lore.

If it's comparable in power with non-magical abilities, it's not magic.

Edited by - Jakk on 25 Jul 2009 00:36:41
Go to Top of Page

George Krashos
Master of Realmslore

Australia
4788 Posts

Posted - 25 Jul 2009 :  04:48:56  Show Profile Send George Krashos a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Because I was trusted with a copy in the product's development phase and don't consider it appropriate to release it into the public domain. Also, it's nice to speculate - I've been criticised (indirectly) many times by fans of message boards for filling in too many blanks.

-- George Krashos

"Because only we, contrary to the barbarians, never count the enemy in battle." -- Aeschylus
Go to Top of Page

The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Moderator

Australia
31688 Posts

Posted - 25 Jul 2009 :  04:59:11  Show Profile  Send The Sage an AOL message  Click to see The Sage's MSN Messenger address  Send The Sage a Yahoo! Message Send The Sage a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Eh, the loss is theirs.

Your ability to weave together archaic pieces of Realmslore and reveal what would otherwise be forgotten is something I've always considered to be one of your main strengths when it comes to writing Realms, Krash.

It's one element that I've felt has been sorely missed from the 4e Realms.

Candlekeep Forums Moderator

Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com
-- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct

Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)

"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood

Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage

Edited by - The Sage on 25 Jul 2009 05:01:28
Go to Top of Page

Jakk
Great Reader

Canada
2165 Posts

Posted - 25 Jul 2009 :  06:16:08  Show Profile Send Jakk a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I agree with both of you, Krash and Sage... and to that end... Krash, what's your personal theory regarding these pyramids?

Edit: I mean, you did say it's nice to speculate... so how's about some speculation? I've done mine on this matter for the moment, but I have a couple of other ideas percolating.

Playing in the Realms since the Old Grey Box (1987)... and *still* having fun with material published before 2008, despite the NDA'd lore.

If it's comparable in power with non-magical abilities, it's not magic.

Edited by - Jakk on 25 Jul 2009 06:34:40
Go to Top of Page

Jakk
Great Reader

Canada
2165 Posts

Posted - 25 Jul 2009 :  06:40:53  Show Profile Send Jakk a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by The Sage


It's one element that I've felt has been sorely missed from the 4e Realms.




Which element is that, Sage? Background? Characters? Cohesiveness? Or should I go on? The only parts of the 4E Realms that have any of these are Laerakond (no surprise there), Waterdeep, and Cormyr. I'll refrain from commenting on the rest of the Brave New Realms (TM).

Playing in the Realms since the Old Grey Box (1987)... and *still* having fun with material published before 2008, despite the NDA'd lore.

If it's comparable in power with non-magical abilities, it's not magic.

Edited by - Jakk on 25 Jul 2009 06:41:57
Go to Top of Page

Arivia
Great Reader

Canada
2872 Posts

Posted - 25 Jul 2009 :  06:58:17  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Hey, pointless bashing of the 4e Realms doesn't add anything to the discussion. Keep it out of here, thanks.
Go to Top of Page

The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Moderator

Australia
31688 Posts

Posted - 25 Jul 2009 :  07:16:10  Show Profile  Send The Sage an AOL message  Click to see The Sage's MSN Messenger address  Send The Sage a Yahoo! Message Send The Sage a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Indeed. And to re-inforce Arivia's point, I'll elaborate on my thoughts from above:-
quote:
Originally posted by Jakk

quote:
Originally posted by The Sage


It's one element that I've felt has been sorely missed from the 4e Realms.
Which element is that, Sage? Background? Characters? Cohesiveness? Or should I go on? The only parts of the 4E Realms that have any of these are Laerakond (no surprise there), Waterdeep, and Cormyr. I'll refrain from commenting on the rest of the Brave New Realms (TM).
I meant only with respect to elements that would usually demonstrate Krash's skill of weaving together forgotten or long-ignored pieces of Realmslore for the sake of explaining something that would otherwise be left as unresolved. It's his presence that I've come to miss in the new Realms.

Candlekeep Forums Moderator

Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com
-- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct

Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)

"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood

Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage

Edited by - The Sage on 25 Jul 2009 07:19:24
Go to Top of Page

Brimstone
Great Reader

USA
2887 Posts

Posted - 25 Jul 2009 :  07:21:07  Show Profile Send Brimstone a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by George Krashos

Because I was trusted with a copy in the product's development phase and don't consider it appropriate to release it into the public domain. Also, it's nice to speculate - I've been criticised (indirectly) many times by fans of message boards for filling in too many blanks.

-- George Krashos



I can respect that. I guess you have what's called integrity.

"These things also I have observed: that knowledge of our world is
to be nurtured like a precious flower, for it is the most precious
thing we have. Wherefore guard the word written and heed
words unwritten and set them down ere they fade . . . Learn
then, well, the arts of reading, writing, and listening true, and they
will lead you to the greatest art of all: understanding."
Alaundo of Candlekeep

Edited by - Brimstone on 25 Jul 2009 22:19:19
Go to Top of Page

Jakk
Great Reader

Canada
2165 Posts

Posted - 25 Jul 2009 :  17:54:03  Show Profile Send Jakk a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by The Sage

Indeed. And to re-inforce Arivia's point, I'll elaborate on my thoughts from above:-
<snip>I meant only with respect to elements that would usually demonstrate Krash's skill of weaving together forgotten or long-ignored pieces of Realmslore for the sake of explaining something that would otherwise be left as unresolved. It's his presence that I've come to miss in the new Realms.


Agreed... but, with the absence of lore from the new Realms, Krash's skills have gone sadly un(der)appreciated by those in power.

I also meant what I said about returning this scroll to topic; does anyone have any theories of their own? The Shadevari theory was neat, but not really cohesive; as already mentioned, why would they be under Netheril, and we already know that the Shadevari were imprisoned within the Key of Shadows. In addition, we have Krash's assurance that the pyramids have nothing to do with Azuth or the Shadevari.

Two other theories just came to mind, one just as far-fetched as the Shadevari hypothesis, but I'll mention it anyway:
1. The thirteen skulls of Skullport; doesn't really fly (not nearly as well as the skulls themselves, anyway), simply because we know that the pseudomythal of Skullport acts as their collective phylactery, so the pyramids are both far too remote and ultimately redundant... but then, redundancy is good, esp. for unlife-support...
2. the Princes of Shade/Thultanthar: there are thirteen Princes of Shade, and thirteen pyramids; the pyramids are in the right neighbourhood of Faerun for association with the Shades; and they look sinister enough to be Shadework. Any thoughts on this idea? Krash?


Playing in the Realms since the Old Grey Box (1987)... and *still* having fun with material published before 2008, despite the NDA'd lore.

If it's comparable in power with non-magical abilities, it's not magic.
Go to Top of Page

The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Moderator

Australia
31688 Posts

Posted - 26 Jul 2009 :  01:57:42  Show Profile  Send The Sage an AOL message  Click to see The Sage's MSN Messenger address  Send The Sage a Yahoo! Message Send The Sage a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Jakk

Agreed... but, with the absence of lore from the new Realms...
I can't agree with that. Not completely.

While there is certainly lesser amounts of Realmslore being crafted for the 4e Realms, I can't agree that there is an "absence of lore" as such. And embracing such a mindset, I think, actually detracts from the efforts of master 4e Realmslore crafters like Brian James and Bruce Cordell, who are weaving together some pretty impressive background articles for use in the somewhat more limiting framework of the 4e Realms.

Candlekeep Forums Moderator

Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com
-- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct

Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)

"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood

Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage
Go to Top of Page

Brimstone
Great Reader

USA
2887 Posts

Posted - 26 Jul 2009 :  11:30:06  Show Profile Send Brimstone a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Thats was cute a year ago. Now its just old. So what WotC 'ruined' the Realms. Give WotC time and they will 'ruin' Eberron/Dark Sun/Dragonlance/Ravenloft/Greyhawk. It is inevitable. Heck give Paizo enough time and Golarion will get ruined also. Its the nature of RPGS. Rant is now over sorry if I offend anyone.

On Topic: In what books can I find more info about this topic?

"These things also I have observed: that knowledge of our world is
to be nurtured like a precious flower, for it is the most precious
thing we have. Wherefore guard the word written and heed
words unwritten and set them down ere they fade . . . Learn
then, well, the arts of reading, writing, and listening true, and they
will lead you to the greatest art of all: understanding."
Alaundo of Candlekeep
Go to Top of Page

Jakk
Great Reader

Canada
2165 Posts

Posted - 26 Jul 2009 :  15:09:44  Show Profile Send Jakk a Private Message  Reply with Quote
The only published information that I recall off the top of my head is a single paragraph in FR5, The Savage Frontier by Paul Jaquays (long out of print; PDF used to be available online from Paizo, but Wizbro pulled PDF resale rights, probably because they didn't want products from earlier editions competing with 4E... for obvious reasons, IMHO...). If anyone else recalls any other published sources, please refresh my memory; thanks.

Edit: Re: Rant: No offense taken here, Brimstone. However, I would dispute your contention that Golarion will eventually suffer a similar fate to the Realms; that may happen, but only if a bean-counting conglomerate like Wizbro gets their hands on it.

Playing in the Realms since the Old Grey Box (1987)... and *still* having fun with material published before 2008, despite the NDA'd lore.

If it's comparable in power with non-magical abilities, it's not magic.

Edited by - Jakk on 26 Jul 2009 15:13:40
Go to Top of Page

Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
Moderator

USA
29893 Posts

Posted - 26 Jul 2009 :  15:22:18  Show Profile Send Wooly Rupert a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Jakk

The only published information that I recall off the top of my head is a single paragraph in FR5, The Savage Frontier by Paul Jaquays (long out of print; PDF used to be available online from Paizo, but Wizbro pulled PDF resale rights, probably because they didn't want products from earlier editions competing with 4E... for obvious reasons, IMHO...). If anyone else recalls any other published sources, please refresh my memory; thanks.


Actually, FR5 The Savage Frontier is still available as a freebie from the Wizards downloads page.

Candlekeep Forums Moderator

Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com
-- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct

Editor and scribe for The Candlekeep Compendium

I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen!

Edited by - Wooly Rupert on 26 Jul 2009 15:23:15
Go to Top of Page
Page: of 8 Previous Topic Topic Next Topic  
Previous Page | Next Page
 New Topic  New Poll New Poll
 Reply to Topic
 Printer Friendly
Jump To:
Candlekeep Forum © 1999-2017 Candlekeep.com Go To Top Of Page
Snitz Forums 2000