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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Moderator

Australia
31690 Posts

Posted - 23 Mar 2006 :  14:27:21  Show Profile  Send The Sage an AOL message  Click to see The Sage's MSN Messenger address  Send The Sage a Yahoo! Message Send The Sage a Private Message
Another from me, for Ed...

Ed, you've talked a little about the duties of the courtesan and courtier in terms of function in royal courts and places of power and how they relate to visiting foreign dignitaries and the like. But I'm actually more curious about actual royalty visiting other realms... to keep this specific, how would a visit to the Forest Kingdom by a foreign royal ruler from another realm be handled inside Cormyr itself? Obviously, there are traditions to satisfy and the usual security measures and political wranglings to get out of the way first... but what happens during an actual visit? I'm looking for more lore than the few snippets that have been hinted at in both novels and sourcebooks in the past.

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"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood

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Jamallo Kreen
Master of Realmslore

USA
1537 Posts

Posted - 23 Mar 2006 :  22:53:43  Show Profile  Visit Jamallo Kreen's Homepage Send Jamallo Kreen a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by The Hooded One

Hi, all. Ed herewith replies to Jamallo Kreen’s question: “Unfortunately I do not have the 2nd edition "Anauroch" handy, but I have a question regarding the Bedine glossary. One word is listed as meaning "tell."
(snip)



Mercy buckets.

I have a question regarding the Herald class in PoF: what are their class skills?

I also have a question regarding Lady Saheral of Spellgard (to which Kuje or someone may already know the answer): in what product is her obsession with, and defense of, Elminster (referenced in LEoF) detailed?

Assistance, please!


I have a mouth, but I am in a library and must not scream.


Feed the poor and stroke your ego, too: http://www.freerice.com/index.php.

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George Krashos
Master of Realmslore

Australia
4906 Posts

Posted - 23 Mar 2006 :  23:13:02  Show Profile Send George Krashos a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by Jamallo Kreen
I have a question regarding the Herald class in PoF: what are their class skills?



I would say that they are the same as the Loremaster PrC.

quote:

I also have a question regarding Lady Saheral of Spellgard (to which Kuje or someone may already know the answer): in what product is her obsession with, and defense of, Elminster (referenced in LEoF) detailed?



Ed's novel "Shadows of Doom" from the 'Shadow of the Avatar' trilogy.

-- George Krashos

"Because only we, contrary to the barbarians, never count the enemy in battle." -- Aeschylus
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The Hooded One
Lady Herald of Realmslore

5043 Posts

Posted - 24 Mar 2006 :  01:10:46  Show Profile  Visit The Hooded One's Homepage Send The Hooded One a Private Message
Hi, all! My turn, this time, to answer this, from George Krashos to me: “. . . a question to THO popped into my head the other day when reading about Torm's activities in Waterdeep. It seems like some of the KoMD engage in solo adventures. If so, how did Ed handle such situations as DM and how did you know what was going on as players? Did you learn about Torm's adventures "in character", from him presumably, or did you learn of them OOC and just separate game and outside-game stories from what your character "knows"? Oh, and one last question: Did the KoMD ever fight or face off against any dragons (the events in the novel "Spellfire" obviously not included)? Thanks THO, to quote my younger cousin: "You rock!"”

I rock? Good to know!
The question is, of course: how well do I roll? [rimshot, hi-hat, insert groans here]
Ahem. Solo adventures are handled thus: players write Ed little notes about their intentions (regarding, say, investments or training or specific spell studies). Ed either writes another note in reply, or judges this merits roleplaying, one-on-one. If said roleplaying is small in scope (that is, easily completed in half an hour or so) it’s often taken care of by the player “coming early” to a Realmsplay session, to get it out of the way before the rest of us roll in.
Although we’re close friends (and in some cases lovers, partners, or siblings), and free to discuss anything we want with each other, over the years we’ve kept pretty well to discussing things in character, in-game - - though if anything really juicy or hilarious happened, we’ve often asked Ed’s permission to tell everyone, usually during our chips and green tea (or at the cottage, beer) break. We can all, I think (John Hunter is notably “noble” in this regard, when playing Florin), firmly separate what we know and our characters know, and always have done.
And yes, we’ve faced down or fought almost a dozen dragons (in one case, whilst on dragonback, and in another, with some of us having the magically-bestowed temporary ability to take on dragonshape ourselves). No, PLEASE don’t ask me all the gory details. And believe me, some of them were gory (for the dragons, not so much).
love,
THO
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Jamallo Kreen
Master of Realmslore

USA
1537 Posts

Posted - 24 Mar 2006 :  21:58:21  Show Profile  Visit Jamallo Kreen's Homepage Send Jamallo Kreen a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by The Hooded One


(snip)

the Ivy Mansion music - - the work of Harghondrahn Harpell - - is a cross between Antonin Dvorák and Albert Ketèlby (please forgive my inability to convey accents properly in this crude e-mail program, hence a “plain” r in Dvorák), with a dash of Ottorino Respighi. (See why I said this was hard?)

(snip)


The Harpells are Bohemians!!!!! Why am I not surprised?



I have a mouth, but I am in a library and must not scream.


Feed the poor and stroke your ego, too: http://www.freerice.com/index.php.

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Jamallo Kreen
Master of Realmslore

USA
1537 Posts

Posted - 24 Mar 2006 :  22:54:28  Show Profile  Visit Jamallo Kreen's Homepage Send Jamallo Kreen a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by George Krashos


I would say that they are the same as the Loremaster PrC.

quote:


Ed's novel "Shadows of Doom" from the 'Shadow of the Avatar' trilogy.

-- George Krashos






Thank you, George. I think I just purchased that in a book lot.


I have a mouth, but I am in a library and must not scream.


Feed the poor and stroke your ego, too: http://www.freerice.com/index.php.

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The Hooded One
Lady Herald of Realmslore

5043 Posts

Posted - 25 Mar 2006 :  01:27:24  Show Profile  Visit The Hooded One's Homepage Send The Hooded One a Private Message
Hi, scribes. This time, Ed replies to khorne’s question: “What is the tightest spot Torm has ever been in? He seems to have a talent for nearly getting himself killed.”
Ed speaks:


Oooh, that’s a toughie; there have been SO many tight spots, including four times in which Torm would definitely have died if he hadn’t had potions and/or healing spells pumped into him right away, and countless times where his survival depending on saving throw and/or damage rolls, AND being one of a group of capable fighting adventurers, rather than alone.
Possibly the very tightest was the time Torm got two awesomely beautiful sisters drunk at a revel so he could bed both of them at once. It worked, but their very sober (and VERY unamused) husbands burst in on him at a moment of blissfully groaning climax, with swords in their hands and every intention of using them.
Torm normally kept daggers within reach whilst lovemaking, but on this particular occasion he’d been ‘carried away’ just that little bit too far, and found himself naked, encumbered by two nude and terrified women, and unable to get to his clothes, footwear, weapons, or much of anything else - - while being cornered in a high turret bedchamber, in the midst of days’ rides-worth of rugged terrain ruled by said angry males. He “wore” one of the women just long enough to avoid being sliced open on his way to the window, and did a high dive through it (without opening it first) into the moat some sixty feet below.
Instead of trying to flee (and inevitably going down under the jaws of hunting dogs led by mounted men with lances and crossbows), Torm dressed as a maid he’d seduced earlier, and took over the task that maid hated: the annual forking out of the cesspool. He toiled messily for three days while she hid in her rooms and enjoyed a long-overdue rest, and then made his escape in an outgoing wagon of uncured hides bound for a tannery (still inside the ruled lands), switching wagons (as they bounced past each other) onto a load of turnips (heading out of the ruled lands). He was wearing only a ragged old maid’s shift with an uncured hide over it as a covering and night-blanket, and escaped detection, decamping onto the roof a wayside inn some days later to steal food and drink and a series of horsepond baths while he awaited some wagons he thought he could ride undetected on top of. When they came (a convoy of fast-goods coster wagons), he rode them to the nearest market town, where he stole clothes, food, quite a lot of coin, and a good horse, to get safely home again by another route. Typical Torm. [Here’s just one typical Torm moment: the Knights are staying at an inn in a wayside village wherein the inn doubles as the local restaurant; when the locals come in for their evening meal, one of them recognizes Torm and storms over to him, snarling, “You! You’re the one as stole my daughter’s maidenhood!” and Torm looks up, wearing a concerned look, and asks, “You want it back?”]



So saith Ed. I can attest that what Ed’s told you here is MILD Torm behaviour. The character makes ME look demure.
Er, if you can believe that.
love to all (and often),
THO

Edited by - The Hooded One on 25 Mar 2006 01:27:59
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Kajehase
Great Reader

Sweden
2104 Posts

Posted - 25 Mar 2006 :  06:16:51  Show Profile Send Kajehase a Private Message
Part 9 of Oroon Rising is now up.

There is a rumour going around that I have found god. I think is unlikely because I have enough difficulty finding my keys, and there is empirical evidence that they exist.
Terry Pratchett
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scererar
Master of Realmslore

USA
1615 Posts

Posted - 25 Mar 2006 :  06:24:54  Show Profile Send scererar a Private Message
I would not be surprised by any other behavior such as this by Torm. He is my all time favorite realms character, and I hope to see more. This latest tidbit is just wonderful, keep it coming Ed

"Yap,yap, little dog!" - Riven - page 326 Shadowbred, by Paul Kemp

_________________________

I don't know half of you half as well as I should like; and I like less than half of you half as well as you deserve.
- J. R. R. Tolkien
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Moderator

Australia
31690 Posts

Posted - 25 Mar 2006 :  08:42:44  Show Profile  Send The Sage an AOL message  Click to see The Sage's MSN Messenger address  Send The Sage a Yahoo! Message Send The Sage a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by Kajehase

Part 9 of Oroon Rising is now up.

Actually, that chapter is a little behind. The "Inside Wizards" section offers the latest parts of Ed's tale... which Wooly linked to earlier this month -- Chap. 11:- http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=insidewizards/dnd/article14

If you look through the RELATED ARTICLES section at the bottom of the page, you'll notice that Chap. 9 was posted back in February... but is now only being included on WotC D&D site proper.

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"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood

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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
Moderator

USA
30283 Posts

Posted - 25 Mar 2006 :  08:55:53  Show Profile Send Wooly Rupert a Private Message
Yeah, as Sage pointed out (invalidating my original post! ), they're now up to part 11. They've been rearranging some of the Legendology stuff, and now new stuff appears on what was the main Legendology page (it's now "Inside Wizards") quite some time before it makes the Legendology archive.

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I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen!

Edited by - Wooly Rupert on 25 Mar 2006 08:59:51
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scererar
Master of Realmslore

USA
1615 Posts

Posted - 25 Mar 2006 :  09:15:29  Show Profile Send scererar a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert

Yeah, as Sage pointed out (invalidating my original post! ), they're now up to part 11. They've been rearranging some of the Legendology stuff, and now new stuff appears on what was the main Legendology page (it's now "Inside Wizards") quite some time before it makes the Legendology archive.



Hey now, let's not so readily dismiss my friend Torm He works far too hard on getting into the situations he finds himself, to be thrown to the wayside by some "other" article

"Yap,yap, little dog!" - Riven - page 326 Shadowbred, by Paul Kemp

_________________________

I don't know half of you half as well as I should like; and I like less than half of you half as well as you deserve.
- J. R. R. Tolkien
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
Moderator

USA
30283 Posts

Posted - 25 Mar 2006 :  17:46:04  Show Profile Send Wooly Rupert a Private Message
I've another question for Ed, one that will hopefully prove to be quick and easy...

In the real world, there are various names used to refer to the average common person. The ones I hear most often are "average Joe" or "John Q. Public". There is also the practice of calling persons with an unknown or concealed name "John Doe".

Is there a Realms equivalent to any of these names?

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At your Behest
Seeker

Germany
46 Posts

Posted - 25 Mar 2006 :  18:00:36  Show Profile  Visit At your Behest's Homepage Send At your Behest a Private Message
Howdy!

I do not know whether this is of help for that particular hamster but I remember a scene from Elminster: Making of a Mage (It's been a while that I read this book...) where city guards ask a newly arriving elminster for his name. Elminster answers that he is called "Wanlorn" whereupon the guards say that every traveler calls himself that way.
So that would be at least the wandering John Doe I guess.

Cheers!

Beware the beast man, for he is the Devil's pawn.

Alone among God's primates, he kills for sport or lust or greed. Yeah, he will murder his brother to possess his brother's land.
Let him not breed in great numbers, for he will make a desert of his home and yours. Shun him, for he is the harbinger of death.
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Neriandal Freit
Senior Scribe

USA
396 Posts

Posted - 25 Mar 2006 :  23:59:36  Show Profile  Visit Neriandal Freit's Homepage  Click to see Neriandal Freit's MSN Messenger address Send Neriandal Freit a Private Message
two more posts Wooly and THO might be all over you ;)

"Eating people is wrong...unless it's on the first date." - Ed Greenwood, GenCon Indy 2006
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The Hooded One
Lady Herald of Realmslore

5043 Posts

Posted - 26 Mar 2006 :  00:59:38  Show Profile  Visit The Hooded One's Homepage Send The Hooded One a Private Message
Hello again, fellow scribes of the Realms!
Why, Neriandal Freit, how right you are. 6969yessss!
Wooly, your "John Doe" question has several replies. By coincidence, one of Ed's soon-upcoming replies will answer it (regionally).
To Purple Dragon Knight, The Sage, Kajehase, and everyone else who has posted thanks and expressed enjoyment for POWER OF FAERUN and the (serialized) Border Kingdoms web enhancement, Ed tenders his thanks and hopes you go on enjoying it for years. Both of them have been large parts of why he’s been so busy these last few months, but he warns that he’s still just as busy (read: you all have loads more FR goodies in your future).
Now, in the spirit of answering all Realmslore requests in the fullness of time, we go back to May of last year, and several Cormyr-related posts by Zandilar, which I’ve compiled hereafter:

What I'm trying to say is that the perception of the clawing, biting, hair pulling cat fight is an illusion perpertrated by daytime soap operas, and when pushed we women are more than capable of defending ourselves. The only times I've been involved in fights with girls, they've always used their fists. I have always been perplexed by the perception that women are so "whimpy" that they only scratch and bite and pull hair in a fight.
You also seem to imply here that Alusair is truely an exception. That women are raised to be weak and fragile and know that their place is in the home having children. Cry otherwise if you like, but I'm on to Cormyr! As much as I love the country, it's a patriarchal nation! Where are the women warriors? Where are the noble females who fight for King and Country? Alusair can't be the only noble female of her age that is a warrior, surely?
quote [Ed G’s words]: “Tanalasta, when both she and Alusair were young, was a perfect example of the scratch and bite school, and Alusair knows full well that most females she’d dare show this side of herself to have been raised to do little else.”
It's a matter of how you are raised and how you are trained, each to differing degress depending on who the person is. Tanalasta, in Death of the Dragon, had a couple of really strong fight scenes if I recall correctly - and I don't think she scratched and bit and hair pulled in them.
[Ed G’s words]: “The attitude towards Alusair (the wanton slut) as opposed to Azoun IV (our rampant king, chuckle chuckle wink wink) is indeed holding the royal house to a different standard to the ‘decadent’ nobles (“wallowing in it, and each other” is a common Cormyrean saying, regarding the raffish behaviour, or at least reputation, of the nobility in general), but it’s not a negative attitude towards bastards (children born out of wedlock), or even towards females (Alusair can rut all she wants before becoming Regent and after Azoun V is on the throne, or if he dies and she becomes Queen, after she marries and produces ‘an heir and a spare’). The “good folk of Cormyr” (i.e. general public opinion) just doesn’t think a female who sleeps around is the right sort of person to be a good Regent.”
I am not sure where this double standard might come from, because you've basically eliminated all the reasons why that might be. They don't have a problem with "bastards" (which is the major issue with a female who sleeps with lots of men - but it's not as if Alusair has even proven herself fertile... I am sure the general populace has been asking questions about her seeming lack of fertility by now - after all, no form of contraception is 100%... though this is the Realms we're talking about, so it might be foolproof), and they don't have a problem with Alusair because she's female, and finally they don't have a problem with a male in the same position being randy. So why else might this be? I'm scratching my head here, because try as I might I cannot see a good reason (aside from the two already eliminated)... Ah well, time to think about it a bit - maybe I'll think of something on my own that is just not obvious to me at the moment.
But this reminds me of something else. In all my recent readings of Cormyr, I found and re-read the Dragon Annual magazine article "After the Dragon"... In it, it basically says that Azoun at two points in his life vowed not to philander... I must admit that this took me by surprise, because it was not my impression that he "toned down" his wanderings in the least. The first time was after his marriage to Filfaeril in 1329 DR, and then again when he came to the throne in 1336 DR. So maybe the common people do have problems with a randy male in a position of authority...
[Ed G’s words]: “Of course, her blades and the Purple Dragons she’s fought alongside judge her very differently, and already have as much or more personal loyalty towards her than they ever had towards her father. In my opinion, if Alusair produced two healthy children, in ‘untainted’ married circumstances, I think her strong sexual appetites would be accepted even if she then remained unmarried. However, we’ll have to see.”
I must admit that this paragraph is confusing. Are you saying she marries, has children, then the children's father dies or she divorces him and then she remains unmarried? Or are you saying she has children out of wedlock people are not likely as much as blink about it?
Though I also find this very interesting in light of what you say a bit later about the fertility or lack of polymorph and similar spells. You mention that basically only divine magic has the power to make such a change a fertile one. Are you implying here that it takes a less divinely guided hand to meddle and make someone infertile? So a wizard or a sorcerer with the ability to alter their form could do so in such a way as to render themselves infertile?
The Hooded One said these words by Garen Thal were correct: “Speaking of Alusair, all of this is why there is so much pressure on her to be married. Azoun is still young, and there is no telling what kind of man he will grow up to be. Alusair is approaching the end of child-bearing years, and it is vital that she be able to produce a member of the royal house before that occurs. Azoun needs at least one royal cousin (in the mode of Bhereu and Thomdor), as an aide, advisor, means of grounding himself, and as a backup heir.”
Not only is she approaching the end of her childbearing years, but she's also barren (so it's not like she has child bearing years in her anyway!). So I don't see how her getting married might make a difference to that, unless getting married is the condition which triggers the removal of Vangerdahast's "magically enforced barrenness"... And wouldn't that be a surprise for Alusair? Though it has been implied that she somehow suspects something (I think it was in a recent Ed via THO post to this forum, but danged if I can find it!)... But still, I can't see she would be too pleased.

So saith Zandilar. Ed now makes reply:



Yes, she’s not too pleased, but it’s been “the way things are” since she’s been old enough to be told about (ages four through six, as the explanation was gently expanded and deepened; all folk in the Realms know the ‘mechanics’ of sex a lot better and earlier than we real-world moderns, and the Obarskyr princesses were raised from knowing what words meant onwards with continual “this is what it means to be a princess of the Dragon Throne” lectures), but think of it this way: if Alusair WANTS to “have fun,” sexually, she needn’t fear unwanted pregnancy, and so can trust in Vangey’s magic - - until now, of course, when his ‘retirement’ leaves her wondering if he’s undone any enchantments, or if they’ve failed or started to fade. I believe Vangey (or Laspeera, or Caladnei) would have to magically ‘do something specific’ to end the spell, which will survive Vangerdahast’s death - - but yes, I believe his intention was to remove it on her wedding night, and I believe enough hints have been handed her over the years that she ‘knows’ that.
Such magical meddling, by the way, is why the general populace aren’t speculating as to Alusair’s fertility; they generally assume that the royal family, like most of the nobles, hire spellcasters to make sure they have children just when they want to (because, as [usually] hard-working but coin-poor commoners, that’s what THEY’D do: have childbirth when they’re financially ready for it).

[[And before divers scribes start energetically posting “but that’s contraception! Or abortion!” objections, let me answer firmly: NO. To ‘go there’ is to completely misunderstand the Realms, and blindly apply real-world mores. Use of such magics is part of what many churches in Faerûn do as a matter of course, and debates about life are avoided because lay worshippers are NEVER told if the spells are making wombs barren, blocking access to the wombs, or permitting conception but putting development into “stasis;” it’s all considered “the will of the gods,” and the priests you pay to cast the spells are “putting in a good word with the god on your behalf” regarding either having a child right now, or delaying having a child, NOT deciding things (the deity does that).]]

As for the hair-pulling, clawing, and biting: it’s wrong to think of Cormyr as patriarchal because that’s the general perception of how women fight, because it isn’t, and it isn’t. :}
The “clawing biting scratching thing” is the country-wide perception of how NOBLE WOMEN fight, raised to spit and slap faces and deliver barbed insults and pull hair, scratch, and bite when they either lose their tempers or are being beaten or raped. It is NOT how most of Cormyr sees common-born women as behaving. Alusair is unusual because she’s noble and female and still wants to “ride to war with the boys” (in other words, behave in an “unladylike” manner).
You questioned the meaning of these words of mine: “Of course, her blades and the Purple Dragons she’s fought alongside judge her very differently, and already have as much or more personal loyalty towards her than they ever had towards her father. In my opinion, if Alusair produced two healthy children, in ‘untainted’ married circumstances, I think her strong sexual appetites would be accepted even if she then remained unmarried. However, we’ll have to see.”
Yep, confusing. I certainly could have said it better. I did mean the hypothetical case of Alusair marrying, having children, and then outliving the father and deciding not to remarry (ever). Children out of wedlock aren’t as much a social stigma as they ever were in our real world, but they are a serious problem to the succession, and would be seen as “regrettable” lapses in judgement on the part of either Obarskyr princess, and therefore colour public attitude towards said princess (in Cormyr).
Yes, I did say that only divine magic has the power to make a change in shape result in a “new” body or form that is reliably fertile. Most shapechanging magics are cast by individuals who haven’t “lived” in the form they’re taking before, and so only have a vague idea of the creature’s innards and workings. They often end up changing shape to a form that turns out to be infertile, without even knowing it. If skillful enough, a wizard or a sorcerer with the ability to alter their form could certainly do so in such a way as to deliberately render themselves infertile. However, if they lack the necessary knowledge (gained through dissection, mind-melding with beasts, or shapechanging and living among beasts, or casting the right “peek and probe” spells and using them properly) to do so, shapechanges are always going to be “possibly fertile but then again, possibly not.”



So saith Ed. Who can peek and probe me ANYtime. Er, ahem.
love to all,
THO
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Moderator

Australia
31690 Posts

Posted - 26 Mar 2006 :  14:55:21  Show Profile  Send The Sage an AOL message  Click to see The Sage's MSN Messenger address  Send The Sage a Yahoo! Message Send The Sage a Private Message
Another for Ed, this time from a poster at WotC who sent me a PM request regarding translation of FR novels into another language -

quote:
Hello Old Sage,

Thanks for the reply.

I believe you know how to reach Ed Greenwood, so I just need a little bit of infortation as follow

1 - I have a company in Brazil, and we are interested to translate to portuguese the novels from Ed, and in the future from others like Troy, Elaine and Salvatore.

2 - We have a good team ready to start the translations and publish the books, and we just have to know what is needed. I believe that Ed will be happy to know that someone is requesting to translate his books to portuguese.

I will appreciate if you forward this message to Ed because we are very interested to start this kind of business in Brazil.

My best regards,

Marcelo
I'm not entirely sure how much info you can share Ed... I've already provided the poster with relevant WotC contact details and other particulars concerning translation projects like this. If you can add anything further though... I'll send it with the details I've already put together.

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Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
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-- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct

Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)

"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood

Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage
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The Hooded One
Lady Herald of Realmslore

5043 Posts

Posted - 27 Mar 2006 :  02:24:57  Show Profile  Visit The Hooded One's Homepage Send The Hooded One a Private Message
Hi again, all!
Kajehase recently posted: “Incidentally, two new words in Chondathan to invent if you'd like: Border, and Kingdom(s).”
Ed makes reply:



In Chondathan, border or boundary is “auba” (fences or barriers have their own words), and kingdoms are “oerlar” [singular: “oerl”]. Lands, by the way, are “luth” [singular and plural are both the same]. However, to utter “auba oerlar” would be to say “kingdoms along a border” and would lead most hearers to think you meant either the string of lands along the edge of the northern ice or a large desert (depending on where you were, when you were speaking), or that you meant the lands where Faerûn ends, and other places start (“Karatur whence the caravans come” or the unknown-to-most southern lands). If you wanted to refer to THE Border Kingdoms, you’d say “Daerlardul Taertaer”
from “daysur” (folly or foolishness or a doomed striving, process or construction) plus “oerlar” plus “dul” (of the, or belong to, or pertaining to) plus “taertaer” (beasts or persons who are crazed, mad, or berserk)
In other words, you’re saying: “Folly-realms of the Madmen.”
As good a place to hail from as any, I suppose. :}



So saith Ed. Who’s hard at work on ANOTHER surprise for you all, in time to come.
love to all,
THO
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George Krashos
Master of Realmslore

Australia
4906 Posts

Posted - 27 Mar 2006 :  02:58:02  Show Profile Send George Krashos a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by The Hooded One

In other words, you’re saying: “Folly-realms of the Madmen.”
As good a place to hail from as any, I suppose. :}



Hmm, sounds like a good description for where most of the more 'intense' FR fans would hail from, yours truly included.

-- George Krashos

"Because only we, contrary to the barbarians, never count the enemy in battle." -- Aeschylus
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Zandilar
Learned Scribe

Australia
313 Posts

Posted - 27 Mar 2006 :  03:00:53  Show Profile  Visit Zandilar's Homepage Send Zandilar a Private Message
Heya,

Ooh this came as a complete surprise... A happy one, of course!

quote:

So saith Zandilar. Ed now makes reply:

Yes, she’s not too pleased, but it’s been “the way things are” since she’s been old enough to be told about (ages four through six, as the explanation was gently expanded and deepened; all folk in the Realms know the ‘mechanics’ of sex a lot better and earlier than we real-world moderns, and the Obarskyr princesses were raised from knowing what words meant onwards with continual “this is what it means to be a princess of the Dragon Throne” lectures), but think of it this way: if Alusair WANTS to “have fun,” sexually, she needn’t fear unwanted pregnancy, and so can trust in Vangey’s magic - - until now, of course, when his ‘retirement’ leaves her wondering if he’s undone any enchantments, or if they’ve failed or started to fade. I believe Vangey (or Laspeera, or Caladnei) would have to magically ‘do something specific’ to end the spell, which will survive Vangerdahast’s death - - but yes, I believe his intention was to remove it on her wedding night, and I believe enough hints have been handed her over the years that she ‘knows’ that.


Ah, that makes things much clearer. So basically Alusair knows nearly everything, and has probably guessed at the rest. *nods* Why, then, hasn't she asked any questions to ascertain whether or not the spell(s) has faded/failed/been removed? That would seem logical, especially if she's not yet ready to stop being promiscuous (and I don't mean anything negative with that word).

quote:

Such magical meddling, by the way, is why the general populace aren’t speculating as to Alusair’s fertility; they generally assume that the royal family, like most of the nobles, hire spellcasters to make sure they have children just when they want to (because, as [usually] hard-working but coin-poor commoners, that’s what THEY’D do: have childbirth when they’re financially ready for it).



Ah more clarity! Lovely stuff clarity!

quote:

[[And before divers scribes start energetically posting “but that’s contraception! Or abortion!” objections, let me answer firmly: NO. To ‘go there’ is to completely misunderstand the Realms, and blindly apply real-world mores. Use of such magics is part of what many churches in Faerûn do as a matter of course, and debates about life are avoided because lay worshippers are NEVER told if the spells are making wombs barren, blocking access to the wombs, or permitting conception but putting development into “stasis;” it’s all considered “the will of the gods,” and the priests you pay to cast the spells are “putting in a good word with the god on your behalf” regarding either having a child right now, or delaying having a child, NOT deciding things (the deity does that).]]



Oh! Two thumbs up to that. That's pretty much how I'd thought of things, but then again I'm not against contraception or abortion. Other people do seem to have a much harder time distinguishing between Real World (tm) social mores, and Realms social mores - so it's an imporant piece of information for people to digest.

quote:

As for the hair-pulling, clawing, and biting: it’s wrong to think of Cormyr as patriarchal because that’s the general perception of how women fight, because it isn’t, and it isn’t. :}


There are lots of reasons why I think Cormyr is a patriarchy... Mostly to do with it being a patrilineally emphasised primogeniture (hence why Alusair having a bastard child is less acceptable than Azoun, since you KNOW the mother, but not the father - and KNOWING the father seem MORE important than KNOWING the mother!). Inheritance definitely favours males in Cormyr. That's why I see Cormyr, particularly the nobility, as patriarchal.

quote:

The “clawing biting scratching thing” is the country-wide perception of how NOBLE WOMEN fight, raised to spit and slap faces and deliver barbed insults and pull hair, scratch, and bite when they either lose their tempers or are being beaten or raped. It is NOT how most of Cormyr sees common-born women as behaving. Alusair is unusual because she’s noble and female and still wants to “ride to war with the boys” (in other words, behave in an “unladylike” manner).


If I were a noble father (and I'd have to change gender for that!), I would want my daughter to know how to defend herself properly... And clawing and biting when being beaten or raped just doesn't cut it for me. If someone is threatening my daughter that much, I'd want her to be in a position to eliminate that threat (ie: to disable their attacker, at the least able to severely injure, if not kill them). So maybe I'm just a little more aggressive than most women, because I feel that women should be in a position to defend themselves properly. (Can you tell I'm a feminist yet? *laughs*)

But it seems that not all noble fathers think that way in Cormyr. A shame, really. Just re-emphasises the patriarchal nature of the nobility of Cormyr. Noble boys can learn to fight, noble girls never (well, hardly ever!), it's not ladylike!

quote:

Yep, confusing. I certainly could have said it better. I did mean the hypothetical case of Alusair marrying, having children, and then outliving the father and deciding not to remarry (ever). Children out of wedlock aren’t as much a social stigma as they ever were in our real world, but they are a serious problem to the succession, and would be seen as “regrettable” lapses in judgement on the part of either Obarskyr princess, and therefore colour public attitude towards said princess (in Cormyr).


Quick question to start with: Is there divorce in Cormyr? Or are two people, especially nobles, who find themselves not in love anymore (or in the case of an arranged marriage - in a situation untenable to both) expected to stay together once married? I was under the impression that marriage was variable from "one night only" to "one year and a day" to "as long as love lasts" to "while this vase remains whole" to "forever".

And to respond to the quote: Yes, they are a serious problem to succession, if it mattered who the father was (which is only the case when the male is the sole determining factor of the royal bloodline, which it's not in Cormyr - otherwise the first female Orbarskyran ruler of Cormyr would have been the last Orbarskyran ruler of Cormyr, since the throne would have shifted to her husband's line! This, of course, is an exception to the male favoring inheritance rules of Cormyr's nobility). In the case of Alusair, it would be blindingly obvious that the child was hers (and she'd be the one carrying/passing on the line in this case), simply because the physiological changes a female body undergoes throughout the process of pregnancy are hard to hide! (It could be done magically, but why?) Simply put, the child would obviously be an Orbarskyr.

Likewise, it's easy to accuse a male of being a child's father... But there's no proof. A blue eyed male who was about the right age could be presented as a Son of Azoun IV, without it actually being true. That is the why bastards present a threat, because there will always be pretenders to the throne... Except, of course, that this is a magical world, and there are magical ways to prove or disprove the parentage. So pretenders would be less common (though probably more common than the circumstances would make us think, since there's also countermagic and the like).

If it *really* mattered who the father was, why wasn't Azoun IV's eldest male bastard even in the running against Azoun V? Or why wasn't Alusair the more legitimate heir?

To expand on that: Tanalasta's marriage to Rowan was only witnessed by Chauntea herself - what proof is there to everyone else that the child is not a bastard? Certainly the Chaunteans would say he was legitimate (since their divinations could prove it for themselves), but some nobles would point to the Chaunteans "political aspirations" (imagined or supposed from Tanalasta's public (but refused) gift of Chauntean priests to her father) and say that they had an agenda (maybe to make Chauntea the state religion) in saying that Azoun V was a legitimate son. Also, surely people who hated (or even just mildly disliked) the Cormaerils would have protested Tanalasta's son becoming the next king! And oooh I can only imagine the backlash/outcry if Rowan was ever revealed as a Ghazneth! An elder bastard son might be the perfect thing to hold up as an alternative (except, of course, people would laugh because Azoun IV had so many of them!)... And surely some would have (or are still) pressed (pressing) Alusair herself as an alternative to the "bastard son of a Cormaeril"?

I suppose some of these things are "behind the scenes" things... Things that have been happening off the page, so to speak. I suppose not all gamers are as interested in the intricate intrigues that surely plague the Throne of the Purple Dragon. To me, what's in print seems to be "Oh, Tanalasta had a son, he's the heir, and that's that!"

quote:

Yes, I did say that only divine magic has the power to make a change in shape result in a “new” body or form that is reliably fertile. Most shapechanging magics are cast by individuals who haven’t “lived” in the form they’re taking before, and so only have a vague idea of the creature’s innards and workings. They often end up changing shape to a form that turns out to be infertile, without even knowing it. If skillful enough, a wizard or a sorcerer with the ability to alter their form could certainly do so in such a way as to deliberately render themselves infertile. However, if they lack the necessary knowledge (gained through dissection, mind-melding with beasts, or shapechanging and living among beasts, or casting the right “peek and probe” spells and using them properly) to do so, shapechanges are always going to be “possibly fertile but then again, possibly not.”



Oh now, that would make a lovely plot twist... Definitely playing dice with the gods kind of fare!

Zandilar
~amor vincit omnia~
~audaces fortuna iuvat~

As the spell ends, you look up into the sky to see the sun blazing overhead like noon in a desert. Then something else in the sky catches your attention. Turning your gaze, you see a tawny furred kitten bounding across the sky towards the new sun. Her eyes glint a mischevious green as she pounces on it as if it were nothing but a colossal ball of golden yarn. With quick strokes of her paws, it is batted across the sky, back and forth. Then with a wink the kitten and the sun disappear, leaving the citizens of Elversult gazing up with amazed expressions that quickly turn into chortles and mirth.

The Sunlord left Elversult the same day in humilitation, and was never heard from again.
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Kajehase
Great Reader

Sweden
2104 Posts

Posted - 27 Mar 2006 :  07:14:58  Show Profile Send Kajehase a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by The Hooded One

Hi again, all!
Kajehase recently posted: “Incidentally, two new words in Chondathan to invent if you'd like: Border, and Kingdom(s).”
Ed makes reply:
...
So saith Ed. Who’s hard at work on ANOTHER surprise for you all, in time to come.
love to all,
THO



Lots of thanks to both Ed and Our Lady of the Hood for the quick reply. And some words I hadn't even asked for (well not explicitly at least). You spoil us Ed

There is a rumour going around that I have found god. I think is unlikely because I have enough difficulty finding my keys, and there is empirical evidence that they exist.
Terry Pratchett
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Asgetrion
Master of Realmslore

Finland
1564 Posts

Posted - 27 Mar 2006 :  10:36:41  Show Profile  Visit Asgetrion's Homepage Send Asgetrion a Private Message
Well met again, Milady and Ed!

Could Ed provide us with the elven words for 'realm'/'kingdom', 'falcon', and 'city'/'citystate' (one without a mythal). I know '-ar/-aar' means a great realm, but is '-reier' (as in Shantel Othreier) also another word for a realm/kingdom?

p.s. Would it be possible for Ed to write "additional" (as in "more words that have not yet been published in any sourcebook" :) elven and dwarven vocabularies for the WoTC 'Realmslore'-column? I mean, when the Bearded Master only (if ever, considering all his projects ;) had the time to do it.

p.p.s. I absolutely love the Power of Faerun and the Border Kingdoms =) I think we may be up for some of the juiciest Realmslore ever published, and I am yearning to know even more about the 'Folly-realms of the Madmen' ;D

"What am I doing today? Ask me tomorrow - I can be sure of giving you the right answer then."
-- Askarran of Selgaunt, Master Sage, speaking to a curious merchant, Year of the Helm
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Kuje
Great Reader

USA
7915 Posts

Posted - 27 Mar 2006 :  18:31:33  Show Profile  Send Kuje an AOL message  Click to see Kuje's MSN Messenger address  Send Kuje a Yahoo! Message Send Kuje a Private Message
Hiya Ed,

You know, I wonder how many questions I've asked that haven't been answered yet? Anyhow, here's another.

I was pondering the Unseen as I'm coding the cleric file for Alaundo and I'm wondering this: Does Selune know that Acolyte Respen Moongleam is "dead" and that his form has been taken over by a doppleganger? Why does she continue to grant spells to him then, if she does know. It seems a bit odd to me that she'd grant spells to a doppleganger that killed her worshipper and taken his form and life.

For some of us, books are as important as almost anything else on earth. What a miracle it is that out of these small, flat, rigid squares of paper unfolds world after world, worlds that sing to you, comfort and quiet and excite you... Books are full of the things that you don't get in real life - wonderful, lyrical language, for instance, right off the bat. - Anne Lamott, Bird by Bird

My Goodreads page: http://www.goodreads.com/kuje

Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium
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Elfinblade
Senior Scribe

Norway
377 Posts

Posted - 27 Mar 2006 :  18:42:32  Show Profile Send Elfinblade a Private Message
Greetings to thee Ed and THO.

I am in dire need of some linguistic and some gastronomical lore.

I dont know whether you know these particular words from before, or if you would be so kind as to "invent" them for me now. I am looking for some translations from English to Tethyrian(?).

1: Shimmering black lights. (i realize single word translations may differ from entire sentences, but here it is the sentence i need translated)

2: Spiral (like in a spiral of stairs)

3: Murky Depths (Same as #1)

And now for some food/drink lore if you have time for it :P

In Tethyr, do you have any local dinner meals? I am looking in particular at specific meals from the northern reaches of Tethyr, near the coast.
Same goes with beverages. Not necessarily spirits or ale (although tis welcome if you would give a few ale specialities) but maybe if they drink milk? from goats, or cows perhaps? What about fruit juices? This is a land rather far south in Faerûn, i would guess they had certain juices and such. Wine from grapes perhaps?

Anyhow, thanks for the effort you put into answering us lorefreaks who believe lore is one of the aspects of role-playing in the realms that is the most important. It is really appreciated :)

-Stig-

Edited by - Elfinblade on 27 Mar 2006 18:48:51
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
Moderator

USA
30283 Posts

Posted - 27 Mar 2006 :  19:11:27  Show Profile Send Wooly Rupert a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by Kuje

Hiya Ed,

You know, I wonder how many questions I've asked that haven't been answered yet? Anyhow, here's another.

I was pondering the Unseen as I'm coding the cleric file for Alaundo and I'm wondering this: Does Selune know that Acolyte Respen Moongleam is "dead" and that his form has been taken over by a doppleganger? Why does she continue to grant spells to him then, if she does know. It seems a bit odd to me that she'd grant spells to a doppleganger that killed her worshipper and taken his form and life.



I thought that when a greater doppleganger killed someone like a cleric or paladin, they lost all divinely-granted abilities and the ability to cast spells above second level... I'm away from my sources, but I'm thinking that's the case.

As for the spells thing... I'm noticing that that rule has an odd parallel in the Spelljammer universe. In Spelljammer, any cleric could regain 1st and 2nd level spells, regardless of where he was. If he wanted higher-level spells, either the deity had to be local (worshipped in the sphere), have an agreement with the local deity to cover each other's clerics, or the cleric would have to cast a certain spell to "call home" so his deity could answer his prayers.

So what I'm thinking is that the granting of 1st and 2nd level spells is an unconscious thing that the deity doesn't have to think of or pay attention to -- it happens by default. Anything above that, or any other abilities, and the deity has to pay attention, which would enable them to notice what's happened to their follower.

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