Candlekeep Forum
Candlekeep Forum
Home | Profile | Register | Active Topics | Active Polls | Members | Private Messages | Search | FAQ
Username:
Password:
Save Password
Forgot your Password?

 All Forums
 Forgotten Realms Products
 Forgotten Realms Novels
 The Greatest Villain Ever
 New Topic  New Poll New Poll
 Reply to Topic
 Printer Friendly
Previous Page | Next Page
Author Previous Topic Topic Next Topic
Page: of 11

Dennis
Great Reader

9933 Posts

Posted - 20 Jun 2010 :  05:28:42  Show Profile Send Dennis a Private Message  Reply with Quote

Baldur's Gate is one of the worst FR books I regretfully read. Not only because of the protagonist ( A mere fighter opposing those villains? What a lousy joke. I am partial to wizards, but even so...), but because of everything else. If there's anything good about it, I can really think of none, except the certainty of not having to read books 2 and 3.




Every beginning has an end.
Go to Top of Page

Sill Alias
Senior Scribe

Kazakhstan
588 Posts

Posted - 20 Jun 2010 :  15:57:41  Show Profile  Visit Sill Alias's Homepage Send Sill Alias a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Not just job. The guy should be interesting and exciting, otherwise he is no better than freaking emo-Drizzt or some stupid berserker who only slashes and does nothing at all. All those great quotes from games I liked were ignored that could give him life. And name was stupid. And what the hell is with this souleater thing? They could find some other manifestation of his power but not so boring!

You can hear many tales from many mouths. The most difficult is to know which of them are not lies. - Sill Alias

"May your harp be unstrung, your dreams die and all your songs be unsung." - curse of the harper, The Code of the Harpers 2 ed.
Go to Top of Page

Barastir
Master of Realmslore

Brazil
1394 Posts

Posted - 23 Jun 2010 :  14:00:22  Show Profile  Click to see Barastir's MSN Messenger address Send Barastir a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Cyric managed to be a mortal turned into a god... Roddy McGristle and Kymil Nimesin upsetted me with their cruel determination, Artemis Entreri - even if I don't like the name very much - and Jarlaxle were also very cunning and had a well developed personality...

But for me, the best of the best is Elaith Craulnober. Sometimes a "quessir", then a ruthless killer, and just after that a skilled and elegant warrior. Bound to the elven ways and also vengeful; cold and calculist, and a survivor. In my opinion, he's a complex, complete character, an almost real villain!

"Goodness is not a natural state, but must be
fought for to be attained and maintained.
Lead by example.
Let your deeds speak your intentions.
Goodness radiated from the heart."

The Paladin's Virtues, excerpt from the "Quentin's Monograph"
(by Ed Greenwood)

Edited by - Barastir on 23 Jun 2010 14:04:16
Go to Top of Page

Dennis
Great Reader

9933 Posts

Posted - 22 Apr 2011 :  12:14:16  Show Profile Send Dennis a Private Message  Reply with Quote

Wait, Karsus is a villain? Since when? He wanted to ascend to save his empire. He just didn't know what consequences it would bring. The intention/means justifies, in a way, the end.

Every beginning has an end.
Go to Top of Page

Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
Moderator

USA
29896 Posts

Posted - 22 Apr 2011 :  17:59:19  Show Profile Send Wooly Rupert a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Dennis


Wait, Karsus is a villain? Since when? He wanted to ascend to save his empire. He just didn't know what consequences it would bring. The intention/means justifies, in a way, the end.



So since his intention was to save the empire, this justifies him destroying it?

Candlekeep Forums Moderator

Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com
-- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct

Editor and scribe for The Candlekeep Compendium

I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen!
Go to Top of Page

Erik Scott de Bie
Forgotten Realms Author

USA
4586 Posts

Posted - 22 Apr 2011 :  18:08:31  Show Profile  Visit Erik Scott de Bie's Homepage  Send Erik Scott de Bie an AOL message Send Erik Scott de Bie a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Re the OP, I'm biased re: my own villains, so I'll toss out my favorite non-ESDB villain: Halaster.

Eh? Eh?

quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert

quote:
Originally posted by Dennis

Wait, Karsus is a villain? Since when? He wanted to ascend to save his empire. He just didn't know what consequences it would bring. The intention/means justifies, in a way, the end.
So since his intention was to save the empire, this justifies him destroying it?
The road to the Nine Hells needs paving stones, after all.

Karsus is what we call a "tragic villain"--someone brought down by hubris, like Oedipus or Agamemnon. Could he have avoided his awful fate? Sure, there were all sorts of points at which he could have left his path, but he was so convinced of his own power and destiny that he stuck to it.

Cheers

Erik Scott de Bie

'Tis easier to destroy than to create.

Signature of Shameless Self-Promotion +6: Order my sixth novel, Shadow of the Winter King (Amazon, e-signing, Dragonmoon Press)

Also check out my Realms work, most recently Shadowbane: Eye of Justice, out now on e-readers everywhere! (Kindle, Nook)
Go to Top of Page

Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
Moderator

USA
29896 Posts

Posted - 22 Apr 2011 :  18:56:04  Show Profile Send Wooly Rupert a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Erik Scott de Bie

Re the OP, I'm biased re: my own villains, so I'll toss out my favorite non-ESDB villain: Halaster.

Eh? Eh?

quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert

quote:
Originally posted by Dennis

Wait, Karsus is a villain? Since when? He wanted to ascend to save his empire. He just didn't know what consequences it would bring. The intention/means justifies, in a way, the end.
So since his intention was to save the empire, this justifies him destroying it?
The road to the Nine Hells needs paving stones, after all.

Karsus is what we call a "tragic villain"--someone brought down by hubris, like Oedipus or Agamemnon. Could he have avoided his awful fate? Sure, there were all sorts of points at which he could have left his path, but he was so convinced of his own power and destiny that he stuck to it.

Cheers



Oh, I agree with that. I'm just questioning how his destruction of the empire was justified.

Candlekeep Forums Moderator

Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com
-- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct

Editor and scribe for The Candlekeep Compendium

I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen!
Go to Top of Page

Erik Scott de Bie
Forgotten Realms Author

USA
4586 Posts

Posted - 22 Apr 2011 :  19:09:57  Show Profile  Visit Erik Scott de Bie's Homepage  Send Erik Scott de Bie an AOL message Send Erik Scott de Bie a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Dennis

The intention/means justifies, in a way, the end.
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert

So since his intention was to save the empire, this justifies him destroying it?
quote:
Originally posted by Erik Scott de Bie
The road to the Nine Hells needs paving stones, after all.
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert

Oh, I agree with that. I'm just questioning how his destruction of the empire was justified.
And I would agree with you that it wasn't. It was an unfortunate consequence of his own hubris. Hence, tragic villain.

Cheers

Erik Scott de Bie

'Tis easier to destroy than to create.

Signature of Shameless Self-Promotion +6: Order my sixth novel, Shadow of the Winter King (Amazon, e-signing, Dragonmoon Press)

Also check out my Realms work, most recently Shadowbane: Eye of Justice, out now on e-readers everywhere! (Kindle, Nook)
Go to Top of Page

The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Moderator

Australia
31688 Posts

Posted - 23 Apr 2011 :  00:59:31  Show Profile  Send The Sage an AOL message  Click to see The Sage's MSN Messenger address  Send The Sage a Yahoo! Message Send The Sage a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Erik Scott de Bie

Re the OP, I'm biased re: my own villains, so I'll toss out my favorite non-ESDB villain: Halaster.

Eh? Eh?

quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert

quote:
Originally posted by Dennis

Wait, Karsus is a villain? Since when? He wanted to ascend to save his empire. He just didn't know what consequences it would bring. The intention/means justifies, in a way, the end.
So since his intention was to save the empire, this justifies him destroying it?
The road to the Nine Hells needs paving stones, after all.

Karsus is what we call a "tragic villain"--someone brought down by hubris, like Oedipus or Agamemnon. Could he have avoided his awful fate? Sure, there were all sorts of points at which he could have left his path, but he was so convinced of his own power and destiny that he stuck to it.

Cheers

Erik has the right of it.

As I've said elsewhere, I think it's a complete disservice to the character of Karsus to merely label him as "mad" or "insane" and that his "Great Folly" was nothing more than a simple power-grab.

I do believe that whatever path Karsus truly found himself on, he actually believed that something positive would come about as a result, and not only for himself. His hubris likely also convinced him that all of Netheril would benefit from his rise as well, and, perhaps, to a even greater extent, all of Toril also.

Candlekeep Forums Moderator

Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com
-- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct

Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)

"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood

Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage
Go to Top of Page

Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
Moderator

USA
29896 Posts

Posted - 23 Apr 2011 :  04:21:37  Show Profile Send Wooly Rupert a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Dennis


Inaction would have been worse. Seeing his empire die every second and doing nothing about it. His means could not only be seen as a selfish power-grab, but also as a desperate attempt to save Netheril. Remember, he did not start to look for the star/heavy magic in the past until the phaerimm's magic drain proved to be beyond his might alone to counter. It was partly desperation that drove him to seek a source of magic enough to solve his empire's problem. Had he been powerful enough to dispel the magic drain and kill the phaerimm, he would most likely never resort to stripping Mystryl of her divinity. Why would he, if he's already a "god" (in his own right) in Toril. Unfortunately, he was not that puissant. Hence, the desperate means.



So he's justified in destroying Netheril, because it would have fallen anyway?

Candlekeep Forums Moderator

Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com
-- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct

Editor and scribe for The Candlekeep Compendium

I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen!
Go to Top of Page

Dennis
Great Reader

9933 Posts

Posted - 23 Apr 2011 :  05:00:50  Show Profile Send Dennis a Private Message  Reply with Quote

Inaction would have been worse. Seeing his empire die every second and doing nothing about it. His means could not only be seen as a selfish power-grab, but also as a desperate attempt to save Netheril. Remember, he did not start to look for the star/heavy magic in the past until the phaerimm's magic drain proved to be beyond his might alone to counter. It was partly desperation that drove him to seek a source of magic enough to solve his empire's problem. Had he been powerful enough to dispel the magic drain and kill the phaerimm, he would most likely never resort to stripping Mystryl of her divinity. Why would he, if he's already a "god" (in his own right) in Toril. Unfortunately, he was not that puissant. Hence, the desperate means.

Maybe, we're just predisposed to the idea that Karsus was irredeemably selfish, incapable of noble intentions. But isn't trying to save an empire (probably the most powerful and influential in the history of Toril) from utter entropy not noble? Had he possessed the foresight not even the goddess of magic herself did---that is, seeing the consequence of his action---he wouldn't have done it in the first place. He was mad, not stupid.

Now allow me provide an example that might prove relevant to this discussion. Imagine this situation: The Simbul had long ago "planted" mountain-shattering defensive spells around Aglarond, which she hid with her most potent cloaking spells; all of which only she herself could activate at the most dire of moments. Now Szass Tam finds out that the magic concentrated in Aglarond interferes with the energies emanating from the Dread Rings he has erected all around the Sword Coast, which in turn disables him to perform his demented ritual. He decides that the only way to neutralize the said magic is to annihilate Aglarond itself. With the help of Bane (or Larloch; you choose), he discovers the Witch-Queen's "death-traps." Tam marches his undead army in strategic locations and batters Aglarond ruthlessly and relentlessly. The Simbul, having felt exhaustion after battling the seemingly countless undead, and having seen her own army proves insufficient to defend her realm, finally activates her "planted" spells. She knows the blasts would most likely kill some of her followers as well. But she can sacrifice a few if it means the survival of the many. What she doesn't know is that Tam has corrupted those spells in such a way that when she utters the trigger phase, they fold on themselves, explode, and cause a massive earthquake, creating fissures wide and deep enough to swallow castles. Just like that, Aglarond is gone. Now, does trying to save her realm make her a horrible villain just because she ends up destroying it instead?

Every beginning has an end.
Go to Top of Page

Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
Moderator

USA
29896 Posts

Posted - 23 Apr 2011 :  05:21:31  Show Profile Send Wooly Rupert a Private Message  Reply with Quote
It's not the same thing. Karsus was trying to save his empire from a doom they were free to flee from at any time. They had flying cities -- nothing tied them to that one particular location.

Besides, Karsus's decision to supplant the goddess of magic was pure arrogance. He could have picked another deity... Or he could have figured out a better way to deal with the phaerimm magic. The phaerimm may be very powerful, but they're just mortal -- and thus an easier target than a deity.

Alternatively, he could have formed a coalition of Netherese mages, and lead them in forging a collective magic that would have stopped what the phaerimm were doing.

So Karsus had choices. But he also had arrogance, and that's what destroyed Netheril. His foolishness destroyed what he was trying to save. I don't see how that can possibly be justified, especially since there were other, more reasonable alternatives.

Candlekeep Forums Moderator

Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com
-- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct

Editor and scribe for The Candlekeep Compendium

I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen!
Go to Top of Page

ChieftainTwilight
Learned Scribe

171 Posts

Posted - 23 Apr 2011 :  10:59:56  Show Profile  Send ChieftainTwilight a Yahoo! Message Send ChieftainTwilight a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I realy only recognize about half of these, but I chose Elaith, because he reminds me of some of the villains in long-running series and comics that I love so much.

I briefly considered Szass Tam, Manshoom, and Fzoul. however, I feel that none of them are good enough to me.

Szass Tam is boring; just another generic lich-lord, I yawn when I think of him, and wouldn't do more than make him a side-dish antagonist.

Manshoon doesn't strike me as evil enough. he has ambition, and therefore potential, but realy he still comes second to Elaith in both regards. he's not a bad choice though.

Fzoul would make a fun and remarkable villain, and I hear that Lawful Evil tends to make the best villains, however I just don't feel it with him... I'd love to read it, and I'm sure he's got it down pat... but I dunno, Elaith just seems so much more fun to use. >w<

and a heart can only break so many times
and I've been to hell and back so many times
and I've seen folks walk away so many times
but just like anyone else I gotta stand up by myself
and a heart can only break so many times
a heart can only break so many times
Go to Top of Page

Dennis
Great Reader

9933 Posts

Posted - 23 Apr 2011 :  11:07:47  Show Profile Send Dennis a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert

Karsus had choices. But he also had arrogance, and that's what destroyed Netheril. His foolishness destroyed what he was trying to save. I don't see how that can possibly be justified, especially since there were other, more reasonable alternatives.



The Simbul has options, too. She could have sought help from all her allies- her fellow Chosen and some other mighty people- had she known her spells had been corrupted. Similarly, Karsus would have done other means - like the one you suggested (a coalition of Netherese archwizards) - had he known his Avatar spell would destroy Netheril. For both Alassra and Karsus, the choices they made were what they thought were the best at that moment in time. They might have incredible skill at divination, but it wasn't powerful enough to divine the results of their decisions.

Every beginning has an end.
Go to Top of Page

Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
Moderator

USA
29896 Posts

Posted - 23 Apr 2011 :  14:58:46  Show Profile Send Wooly Rupert a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Dennis

quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert

Karsus had choices. But he also had arrogance, and that's what destroyed Netheril. His foolishness destroyed what he was trying to save. I don't see how that can possibly be justified, especially since there were other, more reasonable alternatives.



The Simbul has options, too. She could have sought help from all her allies- her fellow Chosen and some other mighty people- had she known her spells had been corrupted. Similarly, Karsus would have done other means - like the one you suggested (a coalition of Netherese archwizards) - had he known his Avatar spell would destroy Netheril. For both Alassra and Karsus, the choices they made were what they thought were the best at that moment in time. They might have incredible skill at divination, but it wasn't powerful enough to divine the results of their decisions.



You're discussing a hypothetical situation that's not the same as what happened. In your scenario, the Simbul took what just about anyone would consider a reasonable precaution to try to save her nation -- not a overt action, a defensive move. And in that scenario, the Simbul does not have the option of taking Aglarond elsewhere.

The Netherese did have that option. And Karsus had options other than seeking godhood. The fact that he didn't consider those options, and that he didn't look at the possible ramifications of his one choice, is where he failed.

I'm not saying Karsus is evil... But it is undeniable that it was his poor decision that destroyed his nation.

My original point was questioning how it was justified that in trying to save Netheril, Karsus destroyed it. Saying it was justified is saying that because he meant well, it's okay that tens of thousands of people, their civilization, and a goddess died. That's the part I don't get.

Candlekeep Forums Moderator

Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com
-- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct

Editor and scribe for The Candlekeep Compendium

I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen!
Go to Top of Page

ChieftainTwilight
Learned Scribe

171 Posts

Posted - 23 Apr 2011 :  22:11:22  Show Profile  Send ChieftainTwilight a Yahoo! Message Send ChieftainTwilight a Private Message  Reply with Quote
wait, THAT'S ho Karsus is!? :D OH! ok! XD

and a heart can only break so many times
and I've been to hell and back so many times
and I've seen folks walk away so many times
but just like anyone else I gotta stand up by myself
and a heart can only break so many times
a heart can only break so many times
Go to Top of Page

Dennis
Great Reader

9933 Posts

Posted - 24 Apr 2011 :  00:50:29  Show Profile Send Dennis a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert

In your scenario, the Simbul took what just about anyone would consider a reasonable precaution to try to save her nation -- not a overt action, a defensive move. And in that scenario, the Simbul does not have the option of taking Aglarond elsewhere.



I disagree. She is the Simbul and a Chosen. Saying the names of her fellow Chosen would have made them appear before her and help her. And who knows how many allies she's made during her centuries of existence?! So, she has options. She simply thinks what she chooses is the best one because she's blind to Tam's tampering of her spells.

quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert

The fact that he didn't consider those options, and that he didn't look at the possible ramifications of his one choice, is where he failed.

I'm not saying Karsus is evil... But it is undeniable that it was his poor decision that destroyed his nation.

My original point was questioning how it was justified that in trying to save Netheril, Karsus destroyed it.



What do you think is the reason he hired Candlemas? He did so partly because he wanted to be advised, given options he might have failed to see. Just because he did not do Candlemas's suggestions and what he himself thought were his other, less desperate measures, doesn't mean he did not consider them.

Every beginning has an end.
Go to Top of Page

Joran Nobleheart
Senior Scribe

USA
489 Posts

Posted - 24 Apr 2011 :  01:04:09  Show Profile  Visit Joran Nobleheart's Homepage Send Joran Nobleheart a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I voted for Sarya. Or rather, the Sarya from Hellgate Keep. The version of her in The Last Mythal series wasn't even close to how she is in the module, and didn't reflect her intelligence in the slightest. Actually, none of the fey'ri were carried off all that well in that series in my opinion. But, whatever. Sarya's still my favorite, and when I use her, it's in the style of Hellgate Keep.

Paladinic Ethos
Saint Joran Nobleheart
Go to Top of Page

Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
Moderator

USA
29896 Posts

Posted - 24 Apr 2011 :  01:24:35  Show Profile Send Wooly Rupert a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Dennis

quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert

In your scenario, the Simbul took what just about anyone would consider a reasonable precaution to try to save her nation -- not a overt action, a defensive move. And in that scenario, the Simbul does not have the option of taking Aglarond elsewhere.



I disagree. She is the Simbul and a Chosen. Saying the names of her fellow Chosen would have made them appear before her and help her. And who knows how many allies she's made during her centuries of existence?! So, she has options. She simply thinks what she chooses is the best one because she's blind to Tam's tampering of her spells.

quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert

The fact that he didn't consider those options, and that he didn't look at the possible ramifications of his one choice, is where he failed.

I'm not saying Karsus is evil... But it is undeniable that it was his poor decision that destroyed his nation.

My original point was questioning how it was justified that in trying to save Netheril, Karsus destroyed it.



What do you think is the reason he hired Candlemas? He did so partly because he wanted to be advised, given options he might have failed to see. Just because he did not do Candlemas's suggestions and what he himself thought were his other, less desperate measures, doesn't mean he did not consider them.



Okay, you're missing two of my points: a hypothetical situation involving a reasonable precaution and what really happened, involving a move inspired purely by arrogance, are not the same thing. The other point is that what I was questioning wasn't whether or not Karsus was right, I was questioning the statement that his destruction of Netheril was justified by his intent of saving it. I'm really not wanting to debate what he did; I just want to know how it was justified.

Candlekeep Forums Moderator

Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com
-- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct

Editor and scribe for The Candlekeep Compendium

I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen!

Edited by - Wooly Rupert on 24 Apr 2011 01:25:45
Go to Top of Page

Dennis
Great Reader

9933 Posts

Posted - 24 Apr 2011 :  01:50:14  Show Profile Send Dennis a Private Message  Reply with Quote

I use that Simbul-Aglarond example because there's no one in the Realms who's made a mistake as big as Karsus's. And they are the same in the way that their "good" intentions (and lack of foresight) justify the consequences of their actions. If you can't accept that, that's a choice you're free to make. We might as well agree to disagree on this matter.

Every beginning has an end.
Go to Top of Page

Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
Moderator

USA
29896 Posts

Posted - 24 Apr 2011 :  02:51:36  Show Profile Send Wooly Rupert a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Dennis


I use that Simbul-Aglarond example because there's no one in the Realms who's made a mistake as big as Karsus's. And they are the same in the way that their "good" intentions (and lack of foresight) justify the consequences of their actions. If you can't accept that, that's a choice you're free to make. We might as well agree to disagree on this matter.



So again, you feel that Karsus was justified in destroying Netheril, because he meant well? That's all I'm trying to understand, here.

Candlekeep Forums Moderator

Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com
-- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct

Editor and scribe for The Candlekeep Compendium

I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen!
Go to Top of Page

Dennis
Great Reader

9933 Posts

Posted - 24 Apr 2011 :  03:51:26  Show Profile Send Dennis a Private Message  Reply with Quote

I hate repeating myself, so I leave it at that.

Every beginning has an end.
Go to Top of Page

Dennis
Great Reader

9933 Posts

Posted - 24 Apr 2011 :  03:56:02  Show Profile Send Dennis a Private Message  Reply with Quote

The poll says, "Not necessarily your favorite villain, but the greatest one you can think of."

What exactly did Elaith do that makes him one of the choices in this poll? No sarcasm intended. It's an honest curiosity. I hardly know him. I only remember him from Ed and Elaine's City of Splendors; and though there are hints as to his accomplishments here and there, they are not explained, let alone revealed in the book.

Every beginning has an end.
Go to Top of Page

Lord Karsus
Great Reader

USA
2881 Posts

Posted - 24 Apr 2011 :  04:18:40  Show Profile  Send Lord Karsus an AOL message Send Lord Karsus a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Dennis


The poll says, "Not necessarily your favorite villain, but the greatest one you can think of."

What exactly did Elaith do that makes him one of the choices in this poll? No sarcasm intended. It's an honest curiosity. I hardly know him. I only remember him from Ed and Elaine's City of Splendors; and though there are hints as to his accomplishments here and there, they are not explained, let alone revealed in the book.



-Well, to be metagame for a second, his alignment in the FRCS was Neutral Evil. That aside, he began his path to ruin when engaging in Elven tomb robbing, as described in Evermeet: Island of the Elves. Not evil, per se, but...After he left Evermeet and came to Watderdeep, all angry and hopeless because of what happened there, and with Princess Amnestria, he became a mercenary for hire who had no problem doing the "dirty" things that some mercenaries do, like senseless killing, assassination, and that kind of stuff. He slowly built up his reputation, and became something of a local underworld mafioso, specifically known for his ruthlessness and brutality. He utilizes Necromancy, not an evil thing per se, but a highly prohibited Elven taboo. In Dream Spheres he had no problem using the black kiira, a twisted and evil artifact.

-If you haven't read them, the Songs and Swords series is a must read, not just for information about Elaith, but just because they're among the cream of the crop of Forgotten Realms novels, period.

(A Tri-Partite Arcanist Who Has Forgotten More Than Most Will Ever Know)

Elves of Faerūn
Vol I- The Elves of Faerūn
Vol. III- Spells of the Elves
Vol. VI- Mechanical Compendium

Edited by - Lord Karsus on 24 Apr 2011 04:19:44
Go to Top of Page

Dennis
Great Reader

9933 Posts

Posted - 24 Apr 2011 :  04:26:14  Show Profile Send Dennis a Private Message  Reply with Quote

Doesn't sound that great to me. But thanks, anyway. Perhaps I should read those books. But the big problem is that there is a strong elven presence in those novels. So I have to pass. One day, if ever that day comes, when I get over my love for elves, I might read the said books.

Every beginning has an end.
Go to Top of Page
Page: of 11 Previous Topic Topic Next Topic  
Previous Page | Next Page
 New Topic  New Poll New Poll
 Reply to Topic
 Printer Friendly
Jump To:
Candlekeep Forum © 1999-2017 Candlekeep.com Go To Top Of Page
Snitz Forums 2000