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 Avariel history and other esoteric things...
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Arravis
Learned Scribe

USA
93 Posts

Posted - 15 Apr 2004 :  21:54:40  Show Profile  Visit Arravis's Homepage  Send Arravis an AOL message  Send Arravis an ICQ Message  Click to see Arravis's MSN Messenger address Send Arravis a Private Message  Reply with Quote  Delete Topic
Question from a new poster here :)

I'm hoping the Forgotten Realms gurus here might be able to lend me a hand. I've posted this in the Wizards site as well, but I suspect to get an answer I'll need to post it far and wide, anyway...

I've been researching avariel history (which I plan to post once I'm done :)), and in doing so it's created more questions then it's answered. It seems that avariels were last "seen" in the beginning of the First Flowering (probably circa -23,000 DR). From there they next appeared at the Aerie of the Snow Eagles near Sossal.

The Aerie of the Snow Eagles is built atop the ruins of a dwarfhold on Mount Sundabar. The dwarven keep was built by dwarves from the collapsed Ice Kingdom of Dareth (circa 1,000 DR, due to constant white dragon attacks), in the Mountains of Dareth (Peaks of Cold Death), and some of their Delzounian allies. There they built their citadel and waged war against the dragons. Their last stand was at the Mount Sundabar dwarfhold, which is likely the actual cause of ther sheered peak.

Anyway... I'm trying to figure out what happened to the Avariels for 24,000 years. The very earliest they could take over Mount Sundabar was probably 1,100 DR, that's just a huge gap in the timeline. The only mention of any of this time is the line from Races of Faerun:
"They took to the skies only when they had to, hiding on the ground like vermin and living terrible, dirty lives as nomads and scavengers."

From what I can tell, they didn't actually grow in numbers or find a place to prosper until the Aerie of the Snow Eagles. Additionally, it would seem logical that they moved as a single group, not scattered groups of divergant avariels that suddenly found each other to come together at the Aerie. If they were together as one group and didn't prosper it would mean that they were stuck in pretty horrible place for a VERY long time or were wandering the lands from temporary home to temporary home. If they were stuck somewhere rather nasty, why didn't they simply move? If they were wandering, why aren't there more mention of them as they travel from place to place meeting many different people?

Anyway... anyone know of even a hint of a "canon" or "official" answer to this anywhere? It might simply be one of the many realms mysteries there has never been an answer to. Well, suggestions and ideas would be welcome. Thanks guys!

-Arravis

P.S.: Anyone know of any sources for information on Sossal?

Edited by - Arravis on 15 Apr 2004 22:00:35

Sarta
Senior Scribe

USA
505 Posts

Posted - 16 Apr 2004 :  02:46:40  Show Profile Send Sarta a Private Message  Reply with Quote
George Krashos posted something about the Avariel history in this thread: http://www.candlekeep.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=2146

George is the expert with regard to timelines, especially given his mythic notes.

I'm sure his timeline of the north will be a huge help with your project.

Sarta

Edited by - Sarta on 16 Apr 2004 04:27:54
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George Krashos
Master of Realmslore

Australia
5853 Posts

Posted - 16 Apr 2004 :  06:00:16  Show Profile Send George Krashos a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I'm blushing.

Avariel have never had a major presence in the Realms. They really only became a member of the FR races after FOR5 Elves of Evermeet, Elaine used them in her novel Evermeet and Eric (for the sake of completeness) gave them some time in Demihuman Deities. Details are very thin on the ground. So basically ... ahem ... make it up! It's how all good realmslore started in the first place. Just make sure you look at all the angles and possibilities and fill in the gaps so surrounding realmslore is enhanced, not contradicted or ignored. Remember, nothing in the Realms happens in a vacuum.

-- George Krashos

"Because only we, contrary to the barbarians, never count the enemy in battle." -- Aeschylus
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SiriusBlack
Great Reader

USA
5517 Posts

Posted - 16 Apr 2004 :  06:21:38  Show Profile  Visit SiriusBlack's Homepage Send SiriusBlack a Private Message  Reply with Quote
One of the avariel is featured in Lisa Smedman's Sembia novel, Heirs of Prophecy. Although, nothing is revealed as avariel history. Additionally, Richard Lee Byers newest novel feature an avariel character as well.
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cpthero2
Master of Realmslore

USA
1189 Posts

Posted - 29 Sep 2018 :  00:08:17  Show Profile  Visit cpthero2's Homepage Send cpthero2 a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Senior Scribe Sarta,

That link you referenced is no longer functioning. Do you have any other references?

Best regards,




quote:
Originally posted by Sarta

George Krashos posted something about the Avariel history in this thread: http://www.candlekeep.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=2146

George is the expert with regard to timelines, especially given his mythic notes.

I'm sure his timeline of the north will be a huge help with your project.

Sarta


Robert McDonell
Higher Atlar
Spirit Soaring
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cpthero2
Master of Realmslore

USA
1189 Posts

Posted - 29 Sep 2018 :  00:22:02  Show Profile  Visit cpthero2's Homepage Send cpthero2 a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Learned Scribe Arravis,

I first wanted to start by thanking you for such an excellent question: I really had to go digging for this.

Master Krashos is definitely correct here: there is very little information on the Avariel, and what you can find at:

http://forgottenrealms.wikia.com/wiki/Avariel

...is about as good as it is going to get as of now (28 Sep 18).

Best regards,




quote:
Originally posted by Arravis

Question from a new poster here :)

I'm hoping the Forgotten Realms gurus here might be able to lend me a hand. I've posted this in the Wizards site as well, but I suspect to get an answer I'll need to post it far and wide, anyway...

I've been researching avariel history (which I plan to post once I'm done :)), and in doing so it's created more questions then it's answered. It seems that avariels were last "seen" in the beginning of the First Flowering (probably circa -23,000 DR). From there they next appeared at the Aerie of the Snow Eagles near Sossal.

The Aerie of the Snow Eagles is built atop the ruins of a dwarfhold on Mount Sundabar. The dwarven keep was built by dwarves from the collapsed Ice Kingdom of Dareth (circa 1,000 DR, due to constant white dragon attacks), in the Mountains of Dareth (Peaks of Cold Death), and some of their Delzounian allies. There they built their citadel and waged war against the dragons. Their last stand was at the Mount Sundabar dwarfhold, which is likely the actual cause of ther sheered peak.

Anyway... I'm trying to figure out what happened to the Avariels for 24,000 years. The very earliest they could take over Mount Sundabar was probably 1,100 DR, that's just a huge gap in the timeline. The only mention of any of this time is the line from Races of Faerun:
"They took to the skies only when they had to, hiding on the ground like vermin and living terrible, dirty lives as nomads and scavengers."

From what I can tell, they didn't actually grow in numbers or find a place to prosper until the Aerie of the Snow Eagles. Additionally, it would seem logical that they moved as a single group, not scattered groups of divergant avariels that suddenly found each other to come together at the Aerie. If they were together as one group and didn't prosper it would mean that they were stuck in pretty horrible place for a VERY long time or were wandering the lands from temporary home to temporary home. If they were stuck somewhere rather nasty, why didn't they simply move? If they were wandering, why aren't there more mention of them as they travel from place to place meeting many different people?

Anyway... anyone know of even a hint of a "canon" or "official" answer to this anywhere? It might simply be one of the many realms mysteries there has never been an answer to. Well, suggestions and ideas would be welcome. Thanks guys!

-Arravis

P.S.: Anyone know of any sources for information on Sossal?


Robert McDonell
Higher Atlar
Spirit Soaring
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cpthero2
Master of Realmslore

USA
1189 Posts

Posted - 12 Feb 2020 :  07:17:13  Show Profile  Visit cpthero2's Homepage Send cpthero2 a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Hello all,

I am guessing with Senior Scribe Sarta not being active on the site anymore (not 100%, just guessing), that the Senior Scribe may not reply.

Does anyone else know of a new link to that URL provided above?

Best regards,




quote:
Originally posted by cpthero2

Senior Scribe Sarta,

That link you referenced is no longer functioning. Do you have any other references?

Best regards,




quote:
Originally posted by Sarta

George Krashos posted something about the Avariel history in this thread: http://www.candlekeep.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=2146

George is the expert with regard to timelines, especially given his mythic notes.

I'm sure his timeline of the north will be a huge help with your project.

Sarta




Robert McDonell
Higher Atlar
Spirit Soaring
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George Krashos
Master of Realmslore

Australia
5853 Posts

Posted - 12 Feb 2020 :  07:31:14  Show Profile Send George Krashos a Private Message  Reply with Quote
It's an FR Wiki reference, which would still exist. Whether it has been expanded on in the interim ... who knows.

-- George Krashos

"Because only we, contrary to the barbarians, never count the enemy in battle." -- Aeschylus
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sleyvas
Great Reader

USA
8994 Posts

Posted - 13 Feb 2020 :  00:49:02  Show Profile Send sleyvas a Private Message  Reply with Quote
One thing I've always wondered about was the Aearee and the Ee'aarr of Mystara and the Avariels of Toril. I suspect there's some links between Mystara and Toril (and there may even be some links between Mystara and Mystra).

https://dungeonsdragons.fandom.com/wiki/Ee%27aar

Alavairthae, may your skill prevail

Phillip aka Sleyvas
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TBeholder
Great Reader

2025 Posts

Posted - 13 Feb 2020 :  02:49:41  Show Profile Send TBeholder a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Arravis

Additionally, it would seem logical that they moved as a single group, not scattered groups of divergant avariels that suddenly found each other to come together at the Aerie.

Or, one group discovered and told those they knew.
Or, divine revelation to the priests.

quote:
If they were stuck somewhere rather nasty, why didn't they simply move? If they were wandering, why aren't there more mention of them as they travel from place to place meeting many different people?

The main problem of the Avariel in Realms is how to avoid becoming light snacks for dragons.
Thus they are mostly hiding.

quote:
Originally posted by sleyvas

One thing I've always wondered about was the Aearee and the Ee'aarr of Mystara and the Avariels of Toril.

The Ee'aar seem to be just the Avariel who get more flying exercises.
Also, there were Al karak elam, but Planescae canon is that they are simply different tribes, who venerate Remnis and live on Beastlands. And even have the same two-caste society.
Rather than venerate Aerdrie Faenya (on Ysgard).
They are spread very thin, but all over the Multiverse. There's an Avariel town even on the plane of Earth of all places (in a huge Air pocket, of course).

People never wonder How the world goes round -Helloween
And even I make no pretense Of having more than common sense -R.W.Wood
It's not good, Eric. It's a gazebo. -Ed Whitchurch
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cpthero2
Master of Realmslore

USA
1189 Posts

Posted - 14 Feb 2020 :  21:31:28  Show Profile  Visit cpthero2's Homepage Send cpthero2 a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Great Reader sleyvas,

I like your outlook on this. Interesting find!

Best regards,




quote:
Originally posted by sleyvas

One thing I've always wondered about was the Aearee and the Ee'aarr of Mystara and the Avariels of Toril. I suspect there's some links between Mystara and Toril (and there may even be some links between Mystara and Mystra).

https://dungeonsdragons.fandom.com/wiki/Ee%27aar


Robert McDonell
Higher Atlar
Spirit Soaring
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