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 Throw out ideas -WHAT were the neighbors on Abeir
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Zeromaru X
Master of Realmslore

Colombia
1061 Posts

Posted - 02 Jan 2018 :  20:06:56  Show Profile Send Zeromaru X a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Abeir its a magic world. The stuff is that is a Weave-less world, so magic there is hard to use following the rules of the Realms. When I pestered him about this, Ed answered that there is a magical force in that world (is not a Weave, but a Torilian spellcaster will call it that), however such force is not connected to Mystra, so its not a Weave. Mystra can feel this "magical force" however, even if she cannot control it (there is a video in youtube with that answer... I'm going to look it).

So, magic is there. A "magical force", just like the Weave (I call it raw magic, as that is a canon term) but that doesn't work like the Weave. So, the problem with magic in Abeir is accessing magic, not the lack of it. So, a Torilian wizard cannot use magic there not because she lost her magic, but because she lost access to her magical energy source (Mystra Weave do not draw energy from Abeir's "magical energy"). But a guy like Elminster, that knows how to use magic in Oerth (another Weave-less), I guess that will have no problems using magic in Abeir. Hence, why I do not have a good opinion on the Weave, as it seems to be a way for the goddesses of magic to control mortals in a way a god shouldn't.

Erin M. Evans said that only creatures with the inborn ability to use magic can use magic freely in Abeir (a sorcerer, a dragon, an elemental). There is also "ban" of sorts that negates magic that comes from the Outer Planes (as that is the realm of gods). The Abyss seems to be the only exception (as in 4e, the Abyss was part of the elemental realms/inner planes). So warlocks using pact magic from devils are screwed. But those who use magic from demons, archfey, Cthulhu, are not.

Divine magic its out of the question, as gods are "banned" from Abeir. Though, I guess a god can grant divine spells to an Abeiran if that god cares about that world. Few gods would care for Abeir, though, as they really fear this world.

Primal magic (druidic magic) and psionics works normal in Abeir, as per some article in dragon mag and the Psionic Power sourcebook. The problems seems to be only arcane and divine.

People who is not a sorcerer or a dragon can access magic using magic items. Magic items from a Abeir seem to be quite powerful, as Graz'zt gladly exchanged a whole army of demons for a few Abeiran magic items Gilgeam had accumulated while on Abeir (this is part of the plot in "The Devil You Know" novel, in fact).

My personal theory about this, is that innate spellcasters and magic items access directly to the raw magic, instead of using the normal "access point" (the Weave). Magic items survived the Spellplague almost unscathed, so...

TL;DR — magic exists on Abeir, and is as common there as is in Toril. What do not exists is Weave. So, Torilian casters—forced and accustomed to use magic through the Weave—cannot use magic there, unless they have another source to use it (a magic item, for instance).

Long ago, in the distant past, they fell into decay. The philosopher’s path... The river of glory... Even the saints resting in the darkness rise up without response and block the way...

Edited by - Zeromaru X on 02 Jan 2018 20:15:47
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Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire

USA
15675 Posts

Posted - 02 Jan 2018 :  20:14:14  Show Profile Send Markustay a Private Message  Reply with Quote
So its got 'the Lurue', but not Mystra. Gotcha.

Lurue is like DOS, and Mystra/The Weave (they are really one and the same) is like Windows. There are plenty of other GUI's one can put over DOS, and make it more powerful (or, at least seem that way), but we know 'Windows' (The Weave) best, so its become 'the default' (except in the Old Empires, where they were using MAC OS... damn hipsters).

Poor Maztica... they're still plodding along on an Amiga.

EDIT:
Actually, that was an imperfect analogy - RAW Magic is more like Assembler - programming in Binary. DOS is more like Mystryl; the beginnings of a GUI, but very basic (an unfortunately, problem-ridden... as we saw by what Karsus did).

EDIT2:
And typing that just now made me think of Shar/The Shadoweave as a virus, rather than a competing GUI. I guess that makes The Chosen 'anti-virus' programs.

"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone


Edited by - Markustay on 02 Jan 2018 20:18:43
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Zeromaru X
Master of Realmslore

Colombia
1061 Posts

Posted - 02 Jan 2018 :  20:31:10  Show Profile Send Zeromaru X a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Yeah, you abbreviated it quite good, lol. Not much familiar with Lurue. Its she the unicorn goddess of the Moonshaes? I'm going to search for info about her (but she cannot be a "celestial" if you can act on Abeir).

Long ago, in the distant past, they fell into decay. The philosopher’s path... The river of glory... Even the saints resting in the darkness rise up without response and block the way...
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Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire

USA
15675 Posts

Posted - 02 Jan 2018 :  22:40:11  Show Profile Send Markustay a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Ed describes Mystra as 'the goddess of the Weave' (and Mystra IS The weave), whereas Lurue is pure (Raw) magic - she is the boundless essence of magic and infinite probability.

If you think of Mystra as arithmatic, than Lurue are the numbers. She's MUCH MORE than just a Moonshae goddess (although unifying her with the unicorn archtype from that sub-setting works, if we think of Chauntea as an aspect of the Earthmother - than 'magic incarnate' is a part of the natural order).

Although I think the Earthmother (what I call 'The Gaea') is one of those next-level beings above estelar and primordials - what I call a 'Supernal'. Thus, Chauntea is just one minor aspect of that, as would be other aspects of nature like Lurue (magic/life). The 'children' of the Earthmother in the Moonshaes are 'reflections' of these other aspects serving Chauntea locally, thus her unicorn (Kamerynn) is not precisely the same as Lurue (Kamerynn may even be looked at as a divine 'nephew' of Lurue in this context).

"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone

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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
Moderator

USA
31149 Posts

Posted - 02 Jan 2018 :  22:51:11  Show Profile Send Wooly Rupert a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Lurue was originally Ed's goddess of magic, before the Realms was published.

She's also known as Silverymoon -- and is the patron goddess of the city that's named for her.

In the published Realms, she covers unicorns and intelligent animals, and is known for being kindly and whimsical.

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sleyvas
Great Reader

USA
7063 Posts

Posted - 07 Jan 2018 :  23:30:04  Show Profile Send sleyvas a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Just to throw it in the thread.... after doing some research on different dragons from 3.5, I feel like Fog, Mountain, Shadow, and Forest Giants could all fit Abeir to one degree or another as the "giant" races of said world in addition to eldritch giants. There is also the canon by novel "stone giants" that are kind of like big stone people. I like the idea of death giants too, but their origin story doesn't quite fit.

Oh, and on Kamerynn.... I would not tie her to Lurue... I'd make her a form of avatar of the earthmother. After all Lurue isn't the only unicorn related goddess, as we definitely have Mielikki as well.

Alavairthae, may your skill prevail

Phillip aka Sleyvas
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sleyvas
Great Reader

USA
7063 Posts

Posted - 10 Jan 2018 :  04:02:26  Show Profile Send sleyvas a Private Message  Reply with Quote
So, in another thread I was discussing the idea of a "troll" like people, but not D&D troll... more like what I'm seeing on the trollhunter TV show, Warcraft, etc.. I was thinking like the Asgardian trolls a bit from the Marvel comics. These would be trolls that turn to stone in full daylight, and I found the rules for Fensir from earlier editions of the game. However, I don't want to use the "fensir" per se, so I guess we could create a new race from scratch... but matching up to some of what we see from all these mythical sources. I'd like them to have regeneration, but not like that of D&D trolls, and maybe it only works while in low-light.

So, I'm picturing a portion of Abeir, probably to the north of Shyr. Let's call it the "Night Realm" and there is no steelsky above it. In fact, the sky above it it constantly full of deep emerald green, dark purple, and black clouds... periodically punctuated by black lightning and deep thunder. The land beneath this sky is filled with small and giant mushrooms, violet fungi, bromeliads, ferns, climbing vines, and things resembly chicory. This chicory is used to brew a coffee like drink using its roots by the natives. The natives can eat many plants which would be poisonous to other races, and their consumption of these oddly colored flora has resulted in them having unusual skin and hair colors (ebony, purples, blues, violet, pink, yellow, red, etc...). In it live these troll beings whose skins grow steadily more and more stone-like as they age. Also, their bodies naturally produce small crystals, horns/antlers, tusks, claws, etc... These nightlands should be riddled also with links to the underdark, and maybe these trolls use the underdark to traverse to the lighted realms and trade at night (or some trolls raid at night). One of the main imports may be wood, as the plants that grow in he Night Realm are not particularly sturday. The Night Realm should also have a LOT of mountains throughout the land, and these mountains are similarly filled with caves.

Then I'm picturing Eltab showing up, possibly forming a harem of "Abeiran Troll" females. He has some Mur-Zhagul (demon troll) children who serve as his lieutenants. He perhaps uses some ritual to turn some "Abeiran Trolls" into the equivalent of "blooded ones" in concept, wherein they are changed as children and grow up more powerful, but also more pliable and angry. Maybe some of these Abeiran trolls flee their ancestral home because of Eltab's growing strength, and when he learns that there are red wizards to the south of him... he decides to become a thorn in their side. Some of these Abeiran trolls flee to these red wizard territories (thinking Laothkund would make a good retreat while in Abeir.... and unlike on Toril its a mountain enclosed city with a lake and a nearby small forest comprised of a portion of the Yuirwood that comes with it. These Abeiran trolls take up residence in the forest.

Below are just some pictures to give an idea of what they place should look like.

fungi & mushrooms
https://files.shroomery.org/files/12-008/976416922-2487886849_22709d5f79_z.jpg
https://i.pinimg.com/736x/e1/03/47/e10347c2842cc080d15b59b83866e475--violet-purple.jpg
http://www.abc.net.au/radionational/image/7316598-3x2-700x467.jpg

picture of bromeliads
http://www.flowerspictures.org/image/flowers/bromeliads/bromeliad_17.jpg

pictures of forced chicory
http://dgmgrowers.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2015/04/chicory-forcing.jpg
https://res.cloudinary.com/growinginteractive/image/upload/q_80/v1445548546/growblog/chicory-2x.jpg
http://wrir4.ucdavis.edu/Photos/Projects/Endive/images/Exposed%20Chicory%20Roots%20Forcing%20Room.jpg

picture of African violet
https://www.almanac.com/sites/default/files/image_nodes/african-violet-houseplant.jpg



Alavairthae, may your skill prevail

Phillip aka Sleyvas
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sleyvas
Great Reader

USA
7063 Posts

Posted - 11 Jan 2018 :  14:15:47  Show Profile Send sleyvas a Private Message  Reply with Quote
It also just occurred to me that it might be a useful thing to have the ruined city of Medinat Muskawoon & the Skysea in the Raurin desert transfer to Abeir (would anyone really notice), and have a portion of fertile land come over from Abeir like a small island in the middle of the Raurin. We could then have that Efreeti get freed and Martek not be available to stop him. That city also has temples of Ra, Horus, and Osiris, which can play into things, and the temple of Ra has "eyes of Hathor". There's also temples of Balder (Norse god), Dunatis (Celtic, god of mountains and peaks), Tyche, Untamo (Finnish, god of sleep and dreams), Prometheus (a titan punished by the gods for giving fire to humans).

Prometheus and the Efreeti both having some ties to fire could have some possibilities. Dunatis actually being a primordial (I know next to nothing about him though). The ties of Untamo to dreams and dream magic being prominent in Abeir also plays into things.

Anyway, not sure what exactly to do with it, but figured it could be interesting to use.

Alavairthae, may your skill prevail

Phillip aka Sleyvas
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