Candlekeep Forum
Candlekeep Forum
Home | Profile | Register | Active Topics | Active Polls | Members | Private Messages | Search | FAQ
Username:
Password:
Save Password
Forgot your Password?

 All Forums
 Realmslore
 Sages of Realmslore
 Alustriel had a daughter with another female?
 New Topic  New Poll New Poll
 Reply to Topic
 Printer Friendly
Author Previous Topic Topic Next Topic  

zezia
Acolyte

Canada
2 Posts

Posted - 14 Oct 2017 :  19:31:14  Show Profile  Send zezia an AOL message Send zezia a Private Message  Reply with Quote  Delete Topic
In the Cult of the Dragon book it states Alustriel possibly had a daughter with a Witch of Rashemen:

"The Sorority of the Silver Fire was founded in the Year of
Bright Nights (985 DR) by the half-elven incantatrix Fetitia
Ledora, said to be the daughter of Alustriel Silverhand, and
Yhelfanna the Masked, a Rashemaar witch of the Hathran."

Is this even possible even for a Chosen?

Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire

USA
14387 Posts

Posted - 14 Oct 2017 :  20:12:20  Show Profile Send Markustay a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Never assume a Chosen's gender... which is malleable.

"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone

Go to Top of Page

sleyvas
Great Reader

USA
6094 Posts

Posted - 14 Oct 2017 :  20:34:15  Show Profile Send sleyvas a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by zezia

In the Cult of the Dragon book it states Alustriel possibly had a daughter with a Witch of Rashemen:

"The Sorority of the Silver Fire was founded in the Year of
Bright Nights (985 DR) by the half-elven incantatrix Fetitia
Ledora, said to be the daughter of Alustriel Silverhand, and
Yhelfanna the Masked, a Rashemaar witch of the Hathran."

Is this even possible even for a Chosen?



Interesting find.

It doesn't say that Alustriel was the man, nor does it say Yhelfana isn't a hermaphrodite (which in and of itself would open up some interesting questions). Plus, noone has ever said that polymorph magic makes one sterile with certainty. That being said, it very well could also be something like Cassana and Alias.

Alavairthae, may your skill prevail

Phillip aka Sleyvas
Go to Top of Page

Starshade
Learned Scribe

Norway
147 Posts

Posted - 14 Oct 2017 :  21:57:38  Show Profile Send Starshade a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I assume someone made an mistake, and thought Alustriel was a guy?
Go to Top of Page

sleyvas
Great Reader

USA
6094 Posts

Posted - 15 Oct 2017 :  00:40:34  Show Profile Send sleyvas a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Starshade

I assume someone made an mistake, and thought Alustriel was a guy?



Absolutely not. This was done on purpose for exactly this reason.

Alavairthae, may your skill prevail

Phillip aka Sleyvas
Go to Top of Page

BadCatMan
Learned Scribe

Australia
281 Posts

Posted - 15 Oct 2017 :  01:52:03  Show Profile Send BadCatMan a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Uh. Look at the commas and look at full passage:
"The Sorority of the Silver Fire was founded in the Year of Bright Nights (985 DR) by the half-elven incantatrix Fetitia Ledora, said to be the daughter of Alustriel Silverhand, and Yhelfanna the Masked, a Rashemaar witch of the Hathran. In the decade prior to their first meeting, the two incantatrixes independently confronted the enduring legacy of Sammaster's madness in the form of powerful dracoliches which sought to ravage their homelands: Everlund and Rashemen, respectively. Both women felt compelled to track down the source of this blasphemous contamination of the Weave, a trek which led them to Sembia and the secret temples of the Keepers of the Secret Hoard."

It's pretty clear that the Sorority was founded by Fetitia Ledora and Yhelfanna the Masked together.

The statement "said to be the daughter of Alustriel Silverhand" is just a parenthetical statement enclosed by commas. Read it instead as "the half-elven incantatrix Fetitia Ledora (said to be the daughter of Alustriel Silverhand) and Yhelfanna the Masked, a Rashemaar witch of the Hathran."

BadCatMan, B.Sc. (Hons), M.Sc.
Scientific technical editor
Head DM of the Realms of Adventure play-by-post community
Administrator of the Forgotten Realms Wiki and Candlekeep Wiki
Go to Top of Page

Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire

USA
14387 Posts

Posted - 15 Oct 2017 :  03:10:50  Show Profile Send Markustay a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Well gee, you're no fun at all.

And my internet search of 'lesbian witches' had turned up such wonderful research material, too.

"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone


Edited by - Markustay on 15 Oct 2017 03:11:02
Go to Top of Page

BadCatMan
Learned Scribe

Australia
281 Posts

Posted - 15 Oct 2017 :  03:38:51  Show Profile Send BadCatMan a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I hold out more hope for the Ladies of Elversult.

BadCatMan, B.Sc. (Hons), M.Sc.
Scientific technical editor
Head DM of the Realms of Adventure play-by-post community
Administrator of the Forgotten Realms Wiki and Candlekeep Wiki
Go to Top of Page

George Krashos
Master of Realmslore

Australia
4920 Posts

Posted - 15 Oct 2017 :  03:43:31  Show Profile Send George Krashos a Private Message  Reply with Quote
BadCatMan is right. Always important to check those commas. As I recall the info on the Sorority was first featured in Eric Boyd's incantatrix 2E article in Polyhedron.

-- George Krashos

"Because only we, contrary to the barbarians, never count the enemy in battle." -- Aeschylus
Go to Top of Page

BadCatMan
Learned Scribe

Australia
281 Posts

Posted - 15 Oct 2017 :  04:01:51  Show Profile Send BadCatMan a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Yeah, not checking the punctuation is what brought us the Cult of the Dragon in the first place.

BadCatMan, B.Sc. (Hons), M.Sc.
Scientific technical editor
Head DM of the Realms of Adventure play-by-post community
Administrator of the Forgotten Realms Wiki and Candlekeep Wiki
Go to Top of Page

Ayrik
Great Reader

Canada
6428 Posts

Posted - 15 Oct 2017 :  08:35:38  Show Profile Send Ayrik a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Seems pretty straightforward. Alustriel and an elven male had a daughter.

My only comment is that if any gender-changing magic was involved then it would need sufficient duration to last throughout the conception, the "mother's" pregnancy, and perhaps a while longer (6-12 months) to nurse the infant.
I've seen much speculation about elven gestation period, ranging from the same as humans (~40 weeks) to as high as 18-24 months (or more), although 10-10 months seems to be the most widely accepted figure. And this daughter would be half-elven, and the "mother's" human or elven biology could assert precedence before birth. I can't recall any specific mention of elven pregnancy in D&D or Realms canon.

But wouldn't Realmslore have made better note of Alustriel having a child?

[/Ayrik]

Edited by - Ayrik on 15 Oct 2017 08:43:49
Go to Top of Page

sleyvas
Great Reader

USA
6094 Posts

Posted - 15 Oct 2017 :  14:25:01  Show Profile Send sleyvas a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by BadCatMan

Uh. Look at the commas and look at full passage:
"The Sorority of the Silver Fire was founded in the Year of Bright Nights (985 DR) by the half-elven incantatrix Fetitia Ledora, said to be the daughter of Alustriel Silverhand, and Yhelfanna the Masked, a Rashemaar witch of the Hathran. In the decade prior to their first meeting, the two incantatrixes independently confronted the enduring legacy of Sammaster's madness in the form of powerful dracoliches which sought to ravage their homelands: Everlund and Rashemen, respectively. Both women felt compelled to track down the source of this blasphemous contamination of the Weave, a trek which led them to Sembia and the secret temples of the Keepers of the Secret Hoard."

It's pretty clear that the Sorority was founded by Fetitia Ledora and Yhelfanna the Masked together.

The statement "said to be the daughter of Alustriel Silverhand" is just a parenthetical statement enclosed by commas. Read it instead as "the half-elven incantatrix Fetitia Ledora (said to be the daughter of Alustriel Silverhand) and Yhelfanna the Masked, a Rashemaar witch of the Hathran."



Awww, that's not as fun.

Alavairthae, may your skill prevail

Phillip aka Sleyvas
Go to Top of Page

zezia
Acolyte

Canada
2 Posts

Posted - 15 Oct 2017 :  15:24:56  Show Profile  Send zezia an AOL message Send zezia a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Your right BadCatMan thx for pointing that out :D
Go to Top of Page

TBeholder
Master of Realmslore

1489 Posts

Posted - 15 Oct 2017 :  16:46:02  Show Profile Send TBeholder a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by zezia

In the Cult of the Dragon book it states Alustriel possibly had a daughter with a Witch of Rashemen:
[...]
Is this even possible even for a Chosen?

Why not?
Mystra not only turned Elminster to Elmara, but later gave him a no-somatic-components spell to repeat the trick ("El in Myth Drannor").
Without extra requirements, it's no more complex than a fireball - Zagig's Gender Shift is a 3rd level spell.
Of course, to make a little half-elf, one of them would have to turn into an elf. Which is presumably much harder to do "completely", but higher-level polymorphs allow to transform oneself even into a dragon or fiend, so turning into an elf certainly should be possible.

There's just no obvious reason why she would actually do so. And if she did, could at least take a pseudonym.
quote:
Originally posted by BadCatMan

Uh. Look at the commas and look at full passage:

quote:
Originally posted by BadCatMan

Yeah, not checking the punctuation is what brought us the Cult of the Dragon in the first place.

(after looking at an article on the names used as verbs) "Sammastered" it?

People never wonder How the world goes round -Helloween
And even I make no pretense Of having more than common sense -R.W.Wood
It's not good, Eric. It's a gazebo. -Ed Whitchurch
Go to Top of Page
  Previous Topic Topic Next Topic  
 New Topic  New Poll New Poll
 Reply to Topic
 Printer Friendly
Jump To:
Candlekeep Forum © 1999-2017 Candlekeep.com Go To Top Of Page
Snitz Forums 2000