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Gyor
Master of Realmslore
1621 Posts |
 Posted - 01 Dec 2016 : 09:17:10
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The first real 5e fluff for Maztica is in the Volo's Guide to Monsters.
Its not much, but Volo's Guide to Monsters have very little realms content despite its title.
So it confirms that Maztica is back, which SCAG only hinted at.
So also says that weird stuff has been happening their lately, and that the Tabaxi's culture has radically changed, causing them to go from an isolationist culture to really curisous culture, so a whole bunch of them are visiting Faerun now. It also says the Catlord is the God of the Tabaxi.
The culture of the Tabaxi has been compared to Kender and Aztec by the devs, so think Kender Aztec Bipedal Cats.
This whole thing really begs for more details form WotC.
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sleyvas
Skilled Spell Strategist
USA
11695 Posts |
Posted - 01 Dec 2016 : 19:43:48
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| I wish I had time to focus on the stuff I've been writing up for the "United Tharchs of Toril".... it very much fits the idea of these cat folk making it over to Faerun. It should also be noted that the book also has Tlincalli (scorpion folk), which are also traditionally from Maztica (granted though, a tribe of them were brought to Amn and escaped into the underdark, then later came to the surface). It also doesn't mention any of their linkage to the obyrith demon Obox-ob. |
Alavairthae, may your skill prevail
Phillip aka Sleyvas |
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Gyor
Master of Realmslore
1621 Posts |
Posted - 01 Dec 2016 : 19:57:49
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| Yeah the Tlincalli is cool. |
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Gyor
Master of Realmslore
1621 Posts |
Posted - 02 Dec 2016 : 01:20:06
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| It also doesn't mention the Tlincalli's nine Gods or that they used to be native to Calimshan, but went extinct (novel Star of Cruah, may have mispelled that). |
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sleyvas
Skilled Spell Strategist
USA
11695 Posts |
Posted - 02 Dec 2016 : 01:48:38
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quote:
Originally posted by Gyor
It also doesn't mention the Tlincalli's nine Gods or that they used to be native to Calimshan, but went extinct (novel Star of Cruah, may have mispelled that).
Wow, I really need to reread that novel. I think I read it when I was half asleep 20 years ago. Honestly, I can't even remember the plot, just that it was some back and forth between time scenes in the book. So far, its mentioned at least 2 things I'm very interested in that have come up this month. |
Alavairthae, may your skill prevail
Phillip aka Sleyvas |
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Arivia
Great Reader
Canada
2965 Posts |
Posted - 02 Dec 2016 : 02:04:29
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| What's the connection between the tlincalli and Obox-ob? |
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sleyvas
Skilled Spell Strategist
USA
11695 Posts |
Posted - 02 Dec 2016 : 15:04:09
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From GHotR
The Swordbelt Alliance sacks the subterranean city of Oaxatupa, scattering
the tlincallis like a giant stepping on an anthill. In the years that follow, the
stingers boil up to attack targets throughout Amn and Murannheim without
warning, forcing the two neighbors to maintain their uneasy truce. Although
the Armory of Nedeheim is never recovered, adventurers return from ruined
Oaxatupa with reports of a portal to the Abyss from which demonic servitors
of Obox-Ob continue to pour forth in support of the tlincallis. The Council of
Six institutes a heavy war tax on Amn in preparation for years of warfare. |
Alavairthae, may your skill prevail
Phillip aka Sleyvas |
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Gyor
Master of Realmslore
1621 Posts |
Posted - 02 Dec 2016 : 17:12:23
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quote:
Originally posted by sleyvas
From GHotR
The Swordbelt Alliance sacks the subterranean city of Oaxatupa, scattering
the tlincallis like a giant stepping on an anthill. In the years that follow, the
stingers boil up to attack targets throughout Amn and Murannheim without
warning, forcing the two neighbors to maintain their uneasy truce. Although
the Armory of Nedeheim is never recovered, adventurers return from ruined
Oaxatupa with reports of a portal to the Abyss from which demonic servitors
of Obox-Ob continue to pour forth in support of the tlincallis. The Council of
Six institutes a heavy war tax on Amn in preparation for years of warfare.
And then 4e happened and that plotline was abaddoned to never to mentioned again. |
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sleyvas
Skilled Spell Strategist
USA
11695 Posts |
Posted - 02 Dec 2016 : 19:34:31
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quote:
Originally posted by Gyor
quote:
Originally posted by sleyvas
From GHotR
The Swordbelt Alliance sacks the subterranean city of Oaxatupa, scattering
the tlincallis like a giant stepping on an anthill. In the years that follow, the
stingers boil up to attack targets throughout Amn and Murannheim without
warning, forcing the two neighbors to maintain their uneasy truce. Although
the Armory of Nedeheim is never recovered, adventurers return from ruined
Oaxatupa with reports of a portal to the Abyss from which demonic servitors
of Obox-Ob continue to pour forth in support of the tlincallis. The Council of
Six institutes a heavy war tax on Amn in preparation for years of warfare.
And then 4e happened and that plotline was abaddoned to never to mentioned again.
lol, true |
Alavairthae, may your skill prevail
Phillip aka Sleyvas |
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Gyor
Master of Realmslore
1621 Posts |
Posted - 13 Dec 2016 : 16:38:44
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| If weird things are going on in Maztica, I could see it pushing various local Maztican races like the Tabaxi and Scopianmen to Faerun as refugees. |
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Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire
USA
15724 Posts |
Posted - 13 Dec 2016 : 16:40:47
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IF I were to use 'catfolk' in one of my games, I would have to give them a queen named 'Pu**y Galore' (after the James Bond character).
And as an aside to this thread's main topic, I am starting to like merging Returned Abeir with Maztica less and less. Not that it can't be done - that's the easy part. I just don't know if I actually like it, or I'm forcing t to fit. On the map I am fiddling with now, there doesn't seem to be any place I can plunk Laerakond down easily.
There is a PERFECT spot (geographically) for it in the Segara Sea, between KT and Zakhara, but that area is actually pretty detailed, in Ronin Challenge, and the idea is to NOT lose anything. Those obnoxious, near-to-jungles, mountains become part of the Yehimals, which is IDEAL. We have so any 'empty regions' I'd love to stick it, but the fit isn't right. It could easily fit in the southern sea, but then I'd have to flip it upside down.
Or if I (or 5e) really wanted to 'go nuts', it would probably fit nicely where Halruua was... but people want Halruua back. It would make the most sense THERE, in terms of putting it someplace usable, without squashing anything else (since Halruaa already got nuked).
Maybe give it a few 'secret enclaves' hidden in the jungles? 'Deep Halruua'... LOL |
"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone
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Edited by - Markustay on 13 Dec 2016 17:17:08 |
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sleyvas
Skilled Spell Strategist
USA
11695 Posts |
Posted - 14 Dec 2016 : 16:04:28
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quote:
Originally posted by Markustay
IF I were to use 'catfolk' in one of my games, I would have to give them a queen named 'Pu**y Galore' (after the James Bond character).
And as an aside to this thread's main topic, I am starting to like merging Returned Abeir with Maztica less and less. Not that it can't be done - that's the easy part. I just don't know if I actually like it, or I'm forcing t to fit. On the map I am fiddling with now, there doesn't seem to be any place I can plunk Laerakond down easily.
There is a PERFECT spot (geographically) for it in the Segara Sea, between KT and Zakhara, but that area is actually pretty detailed, in Ronin Challenge, and the idea is to NOT lose anything. Those obnoxious, near-to-jungles, mountains become part of the Yehimals, which is IDEAL. We have so any 'empty regions' I'd love to stick it, but the fit isn't right. It could easily fit in the southern sea, but then I'd have to flip it upside down.
Or if I (or 5e) really wanted to 'go nuts', it would probably fit nicely where Halruua was... but people want Halruua back. It would make the most sense THERE, in terms of putting it someplace usable, without squashing anything else (since Halruaa already got nuked).
Maybe give it a few 'secret enclaves' hidden in the jungles? 'Deep Halruua'... LOL
Her realmsian name is Puescy Gaalor |
Alavairthae, may your skill prevail
Phillip aka Sleyvas |
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Brian R. James
Forgotten Realms Game Designer
USA
1098 Posts |
Posted - 17 Dec 2016 : 16:19:32
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| Not sure if fans ever picked up on this before, but I added two small Maztican settlements to the Moonshae isles. They are Tetauctaa and Hyoclaatl, located in southwest Gwynneth near the ruins of Wyngate. You can find the settlements on the map included in the Sarifal article in Dragon #376. Notice also their proximity to the Glade of the Cat Lord in Llyrath Forest. |
Brian R. James - Freelance Game Designer
Follow me on Twitter @brianrjames |
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Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire
USA
15724 Posts |
Posted - 17 Dec 2016 : 17:12:53
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Poor Moonshaeans (Moonies? Shaers?), someone is always showing up and taking their land.
On the other hand, a semi-drained Moonwell would make for an excellent Cenote.  |
"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone
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EltonRobb
Seeker
USA
66 Posts |
Posted - 18 Dec 2016 : 04:36:30
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| Well for my FR game, I basically allow any race. As long as the players use some common sense. |
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moonbeast
Senior Scribe
USA
522 Posts |
Posted - 18 Dec 2016 : 06:17:04
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quote:
Originally posted by Gyor
The first real 5e fluff for Maztica is in the Volo's Guide to Monsters.
Its not much, but Volo's Guide to Monsters have very little realms content despite its title.
So it confirms that Maztica is back, which SCAG only hinted at.
So also says that weird stuff has been happening their lately, and that the Tabaxi's culture has radically changed, causing them to go from an isolationist culture to really curisous culture, so a whole bunch of them are visiting Faerun now.
Do the Tabaxiites know that curiosity killed the cat? |
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Gyor
Master of Realmslore
1621 Posts |
Posted - 20 Dec 2016 : 23:02:01
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| The Tabaxi and their FR history are explored in the latest issue of Dragon+ in an article called Lore You Should Know by Matt Sarnet, some really interesting Intel, such as the fact that they originate in both Maztica and Katshaka, that in the wider Cosmos, Tabaxi are linked to Bast, but not so much in FR. Some other interesting stuff is that Tabaxi in FR actually go back as far as a mention in 1e. |
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sleyvas
Skilled Spell Strategist
USA
11695 Posts |
Posted - 21 Dec 2016 : 02:32:30
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quote:
Originally posted by Gyor
The Tabaxi and their FR history are explored in the latest issue of Dragon+ in an article called Lore You Should Know by Matt Sarnet, some really interesting Intel, such as the fact that they originate in both Maztica and Katshaka, that in the wider Cosmos, Tabaxi are linked to Bast, but not so much in FR. Some other interesting stuff is that Tabaxi in FR actually go back as far as a mention in 1e.
Hmmm, I guess I really need to start reading Dragon+ |
Alavairthae, may your skill prevail
Phillip aka Sleyvas |
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Gyor
Master of Realmslore
1621 Posts |
Posted - 21 Dec 2016 : 17:07:51
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| Yep |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36779 Posts |
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Gyor
Master of Realmslore
1621 Posts |
Posted - 21 Dec 2016 : 17:43:17
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quote:
Originally posted by Brian R. James
Not sure if fans ever picked up on this before, but I added two small Maztican settlements to the Moonshae isles. They are Tetauctaa and Hyoclaatl, located in southwest Gwynneth near the ruins of Wyngate. You can find the settlements on the map included in the Sarifal article in Dragon #376. Notice also their proximity to the Glade of the Cat Lord in Llyrath Forest.
Interesting. |
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sleyvas
Skilled Spell Strategist
USA
11695 Posts |
Posted - 21 Dec 2016 : 20:09:57
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quote:
Originally posted by sleyvas
quote:
Originally posted by Gyor
The Tabaxi and their FR history are explored in the latest issue of Dragon+ in an article called Lore You Should Know by Matt Sarnet, some really interesting Intel, such as the fact that they originate in both Maztica and Katshaka, that in the wider Cosmos, Tabaxi are linked to Bast, but not so much in FR. Some other interesting stuff is that Tabaxi in FR actually go back as far as a mention in 1e.
Hmmm, I guess I really need to start reading Dragon+
Thank you for that reference. I didn't see much that I didn't already know until I got to the part where it was talking about the cat lord and it said there was an unusual reference to him in the ravenloft appendix III entry for a shapechanging cat folk known as the "Paka". While they aren't extremely unusual, they look to be fairly easy to adapt. The main thing seems to be that they can see through the eyes/hear through the ears of any cat within 50 feet, can telepathically command said animals, and can take on human form. They also excel at jumping/acrobatics. Makes me wonder if the Cat Lord isn't an ascended Paka (not a deal breaker if he's not). |
Alavairthae, may your skill prevail
Phillip aka Sleyvas |
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Gyor
Master of Realmslore
1621 Posts |
Posted - 22 Dec 2016 : 16:47:44
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| I don't know. |
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Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire
USA
15724 Posts |
Posted - 22 Dec 2016 : 18:29:29
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Personally, I'd spin The Cat Lord as the Black Panther from the K-T setting. Maybe even have him as an exarch of Nobanion, or some-such. I like to connect things - there is a TON of 'cat lore' in the K-T material; hence my saying that Petan is actually a secret 'Catfolk' nation... where they keep humans as 'pets' (Petan is on the K-T maps, and is geographically detailed in the Ronin Challenge AP {and 2e update} maps, but was never actually mentioned in ANY product). Tons of stuff about 'cat people' and people turning into cats, and vice-versa, all over the place, but it seems to be concentrated in the south and west of K-T.
As for the 'Paka', in 5e I would turn them into a Paragon Class, if 5e has PrCs or their equivalent (I haven't gotten far enough in a 5e game to know anything about its version of 'multiclassing'). If not a PrC, than just call it a 'racial class' (because thats what a Paragon Class is - a race-specific PrC that can be taken to become more about that race). They appeared in 3e's Unearthed Arcana, and I wrote a couple up for the Elves of Faerūn Netbook. Basically, if you were to take the 'Elf Paragon' class, you would become an elven archtype, and be more like the folklorish version of said race. It was a great way to give back some of the Drow abilities they lost between editions (using the 'Drow Paragon', of course).
Thus, you start out as a tabaxi, and then there would be a 3-level 'Paka' Paragon PrC/Class you could take to become the Paka variant.
Just as the drow of Greyhawk automatically get/take the Drow Paragon Path, the Ravenloft tabaxi would have the Paka one. It really is a great way to patch things between settings and/or rules editions.
And BTW, this is why I prefer rules systems wherein you level by race, like the demihumans did in OD&D - it makes more sense. 'Aliens' (non-humans) should have access to abilities humans don't at most levels. 'Class' is just a job-description, and shouldn't determine/adjust all your physical attributes and abilities. I suppose the best compromise would be a system where you can choose either path (as the 'Paragon PrC's did). Its also a great way to give monsters lots of flavor without all the bookeeping of 3e - you would know precisely what a level 5 drow could do because that would BE their class, as well as race. Only 'specials' would need extra treatment and write-up (like a drow priestess or mage... although those could be branch-paths off the main racial one as well).
Have an encounter with some hobgoblins? You'll know precisely what each can do by their level. No need for 'class' if they don't live in/near human society and take human-like occupations. |
"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone
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Edited by - Markustay on 22 Dec 2016 18:33:10 |
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sleyvas
Skilled Spell Strategist
USA
11695 Posts |
Posted - 22 Dec 2016 : 23:37:04
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I'm kind of looking at it as different racial offshoots that maybe if we research farther back may have some commonality. So, what I'm looking at specifically for Katashaka is a land that has little human involvement before the last century (most of those coming from Maztica). There are however a lot of "beast folk"... possibly animals that took on humanoid form due to spirit involvement. So, to compare Faerun, it has a lot of "humanlike" folk in the form of humans, genasi, tieflings, spiritfolk, half-orcs, half-elves, halflings, etc.... or human/beast crosses like centaurs with a human torso. This area of the world would have a variety of cat/canine/rodent races (so leopard people, lion people, panther people, tiger people, lynx people, fox people, various dog people, wolf people, jackal people, rat people, mouse people, rabbit people, weasel people, meerkat people, etc... of both humanoid and tauric forms) and a spattering of "African"/"South American" races (which may also be either humanoid or tauric). What this means is that like a half-elf and a human may have different racial abilities, so may two different cat folk which both happen to look kind of pantherish. There may also be entirely different races (such as Rakasta, Sphinxes, griffins, etc...) with cat like features. They may have seen some humans, in the forms of Mazticans, but usually those races stayed to the more northerly continent.
Then, in the midst of all this, I'm having a culture shock of Mulan humans leading a mix of Maztican / Anchorome humans (Azuposi, Metahel, Nahopaca, Natican, Kolan, Maztican) and Faerunian humans (Tethyrian, Tashalan, and Chondathan stock) which made inroads into their world over the past century.
Deeper in the jungles on the Midwestern coast, I'm also having there be a native human population which has kept to the jungles and which MAY have ties to the "Tabaxi" humans that went to Chult as opposed to the "tabaxi" cat folk that are nearby (which may both have a common origin... maybe the "tabaxi" came from the "Tabaxi".... but you don't have to define that right away... hell it could even be that "Tabaxi" was the name of a country/kingdom/empire long ago which held both). The native humans of this area have been the prey of a large clan of hags who have taken to ruling them. Into this area did fall some Shou and Wa countrymen during the spellplague, and they began slowly "civilizing" the region, much to the chagrin of the hags (and their newfound Oni allies). So, here are two human cultures growing in the region.... and all of a sudden maybe 80 years after the spellplague and their transfer to Abeir... these two human cultures finally find out about one another. |
Alavairthae, may your skill prevail
Phillip aka Sleyvas |
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5e Maztica and the Tabaxi
