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Fendrikor
Learned Scribe
Australia
189 Posts |
 Posted - 19 Sep 2016 : 06:33:57
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Hey all,
I am currently running Red Hand of Doom, converted and set in the Sunset Vale 1490.
Hills Edge is about to get attacked by a horde of Hobgoblins, Ogres, Giants and Dragons - then the horde is going to steam roll through everything else on its way towards Iriaebor.
Not much is written on the state of things in Iriaebor in 1490, except that it is influenced by and possibly under Elturgardts Shield as an independant city state.
From what i have read, Iriaebor is protected by an army of 8000 (2000 trained soldiers, 6000 mercinaries) which form the Shield. My question is, what is the shield for?
Who are the 6000 mercinaries? the only group i can find is the Black Talons which number 120. What is the likelyhood that any of them would be Zhents?
If war came to Iriabor, how likely would it be that Elturel would be able to ride to its assistance?
Additionally has anyone here converted any of the Spawn of Tiamat over to 5e? I would love to use them if i could!
PS on a political note...
Elturel may have the motive of bringing Iriaebor under its protection in the same way it has done to Berdusk should the war go badly, but i dont think it would manufacture that scenario by choice.
The Darkhold probably wants the vale to fall, so that it can come in at the last moment and assert ownership and influence along the entire uldoon trail.
Cormyr is probably indifferent to events happening beyond the Tunlands.
Apparently Waterdeep has a stake in the Sunset vale somehow??
Shared thoughts and considerations appreciated :)
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'Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons, for you are crunchy and taste good with ketchup' |
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moonbeast
Senior Scribe
USA
522 Posts |
Posted - 19 Sep 2016 : 18:29:19
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If Iraebor was threatened by hostile forces, I'd think that the Palatinate of Elturgard (it's falsely referred to as a kingdom in SCAG and other 5E sources, but it's not ruled by a king, rather ruled by a paladin/clerical theocracy) will likely send some assistance in the form of re-inforcements. Probably not the entire Elturgard army, but a large enough force to assist an ally.
Why would Elturgard help? Uhh…. because Iriaebor is a large neigboring city (pop > 20,000) and allowing such a large significant city to fall into the hands of hostile forces would end up threatening all of Elturgard. Iriaebor is not a small insignificant town. It's a very urban, built up city with numerous high towers and spires. If that city fell to a wicked force….. Elturgard knows it's in deep trouble.
So the answer is yes, Elturgard would definitely assist. Iriaebor is a city which generally tilts toward "good" alignment, its leadership tilts towards Torm worship, one of the "Good Warrior Deities" also revered in Elturel.
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Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire
USA
15724 Posts |
Posted - 20 Sep 2016 : 22:56:35
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Zhents as mercenaries works for me.
I did a map awhile back placing Elsir Vale in the Channath Vale (where it belongs), but the lore, and final portion of all those adventures, did not fit well there (the Overlook stuff).
Sunset Vale is good, since its post-Spellplague.
In my own 'Misbegotten Realms' I placed that region (Elsir Vale) up around Mirabar, and it was a great fit. |
"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone
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Edited by - Markustay on 20 Sep 2016 22:58:35 |
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Fendrikor
Learned Scribe
Australia
189 Posts |
Posted - 21 Sep 2016 : 18:37:23
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I did feel the sunset vale was an ironically good spot to place the elsir vale for a number of reason.
1 - Proximity to the well of dragons and the Sunset mountains (which are full of monster hordes)
2 - The hill of lost souls and the north dark woods are excellent locations which mirror both Cinder hill and the Witchwood in location AND skull gorge runs next to them both.
3 - There are hills west of the Northdark woods AND the Witchwood... the Trielta hills.
4 - The Hammerfist Dwarf holds can easily be replaced in purpose by the Darkhold.
5 - The Tiri Kitor can easily be replaced by the wild elf colonies living in the reaching woods.
6 - The Ghostlord can easily be made instead to be the Shadowking of Talis.
7 - Iraebor is well placed to be Brindol and Berdusk is well placed to be that.. other.. town whos name i forget.
8 - The kingdom of Rhestilor could easily have been some ancient human kingdom that sank into the marshes of Tun.
Well its enough reasons but you get the picture..
The Paladinate of Elturgardt will send soldiers to Iraebor if given sufficient evidence about a threat to the vale. They might even be convinced to send immediate aid to Hills Edge if it can be done quickly enough (but it wont be enough to stop the horde).
The Darkhold is happy to sit on its laurels, dealing primarily with threats in the far hills until they are paid to intervene in the sunset war, namely in bolstering iraebors defences.
Gonna be epic, but many of the creatures in the module dont exist yet in 5e (spawn of tiamat and Abishai devils) so i need to do some conversion work. |
'Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons, for you are crunchy and taste good with ketchup' |
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Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire
USA
15724 Posts |
Posted - 22 Sep 2016 : 19:36:46
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So its all conversion?
When I shoe-horn stuff in, I usually just modify the maps so I can use the material as-is, but thats because maps are easier for me to make changes to.
And if you are looking for any more conversions, the Nentir Vale fits near-perfectly just south of the High Forest. FR is HUGE. |
"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone
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Fendrikor
Learned Scribe
Australia
189 Posts |
Posted - 25 Sep 2016 : 09:17:27
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Ofcourse, but i want to keep as true to the Sunset Vale and the politics of the surrounding countries and cities as i can to the invasion of a huge hoard of hobgoblins.
What program do you use to modify the maps with? Just photoshop?
I did some research into the towns in the vale, and found out about a race of ancient humans called 'the Horsepeople' who came down from the north and built the city that would eventually become Asbravn. There were ancient dwarves, and ancient humans in the Reaching woods.. i get the feeling this section of the realms would have been a facinating place in ancient times especially with the Giants ruling in the mountains from the Darkhold.
Still, if there is anything to consider locally id like to hear about it while i piece it all together.
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'Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons, for you are crunchy and taste good with ketchup' |
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Gary Dallison
Great Reader
United Kingdom
6351 Posts |
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Fendrikor
Learned Scribe
Australia
189 Posts |
Posted - 25 Sep 2016 : 10:30:59
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If your curious, ive drawn my notes from this web page dazzlerdal.
http://www.nj-pbem.com/data/Places/Asbravn.htm
Do you know anything about any ancient major happenings in the Tunlands? |
'Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons, for you are crunchy and taste good with ketchup' |
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Gary Dallison
Great Reader
United Kingdom
6351 Posts |
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Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire
USA
15724 Posts |
Posted - 25 Sep 2016 : 19:38:15
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The Tunlanders (Mir? There was a name for this group) are related to the Netherese, who are also related to the horse warriors of The Ride (The Eraka) - probably all parts of the proto-group that I suspect came from the eastern Realms (The Taan/Wastes region). Its been awhile since I read through all this material, but I suspect the Tunlanders are a 'throw back' relative of the Netherese - survivors, mostly, who have 'gone savage' again. Whereas the Riders are probably a group closely related to the founders of Seventon, who never joined their cousins in 'civilization', preferring to retain their traditional (somewhat 'Cossack') culture.
There is also evidence of citystates in the Tunlands (at least two for sure), that had different 'civic deities'. I suspect these were the surviving remnants of Thaeravel that were folded-into the Netherese empire. After the fall of Netheril, when there were just the 'survivor states', these cities became independent again, but only for a short time before they, themselves, succumbed to internal squabbles and the encroaching desert. The remains of the two 'known' citystates are under the two marshes there.
I had intended to do a 'regional sourcebook' for that area - I even created a map for it way back when. I did a lot of research, but like so many other projects I got involved in, I got sidetracked (A squirrel!) and never finished. 
quote:
Originally posted by Fendrikor
Ofcourse, but i want to keep as true to the Sunset Vale and the politics of the surrounding countries and cities as i can to the invasion of a huge hoard of hobgoblins.
What program do you use to modify the maps with? Just photoshop?
I used to use Photoshop, but I lost my copy in a house fire. I now use GIMP (even though I recently re-bought Creative Suite, I haven't started using it again - I've just gotten more used to GIMP at this point). Also, my current mapping looks NOTHING like the 3e FR style. (Did I just say 'current mapping? Why YES... yes I did!)  |
"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone
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Edited by - Markustay on 25 Sep 2016 19:38:56 |
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Gary Dallison
Great Reader
United Kingdom
6351 Posts |
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Fendrikor
Learned Scribe
Australia
189 Posts |
Posted - 26 Sep 2016 : 04:55:57
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Hrmm at this rate i might make the Kingdom of Rhestilor in the Red hand of Doom (the fallen kingdom of Rhestilor) into Elah Nydra's seven throned kingdom. Given post spell plague the Farsea Marsh lierally butts up against the Marsh of Tun and both are now directly behind the Sunset mountains, ill use the lost city of Farsea instead of Rhest.
Edit: I just did some research on Elah Nydra - and both Elah and 'Bright Nydra' are other names for Selune. Is this intentional? because then the queen of the Seven throne kingdom would then be simply 'moon moon'. |
'Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons, for you are crunchy and taste good with ketchup' |
Edited by - Fendrikor on 26 Sep 2016 06:06:05 |
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Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire
USA
15724 Posts |
Posted - 26 Sep 2016 : 06:12:05
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Sounds good. The marshes in that area work well as substitutes for The Blackfens.
Have you figured out how you are going to spin "The Ghostlord"?
quote:
Originally posted by dazzlerdal
Well Volos Guide to the sword coast only says that they migrated to the tunlands or the savage north it doesn't say from where.
Of course with a name like Urdath I couldn't help but link it to the Dath of Jhaamdath. Plus there are sources that placed nomadic peoples in the northern reaches of Jhaamdath (basically the Dragon Coast) and then it makes sense for them to be forced out of their homes as people move into the area.
But that's just why I picked them as from Jhaamdath
I don't know they are from Netheril - I thought I had read that somewhere (that both 'horse barbarian' groups around Anauroch were both connected to the Netherese through blood). I think it may have been Ed himself with the 'Riders' (Eraka), but the Tunlander stuff I have some dim recollection of it being in a canon source (or a source I would consider canon, such as Krash's History of the North). I could be completely wrong, though - its been so long since I dug through all that stuff.
I do like your line of reasoning, and both could be true, since the Tunlanders could be a group of Netherese survivors who 'went savage' and joined other barbarians in the area (those Dathites you mentioned). There are at least a dozen cases of Netherese joining other groups after the fall (like the Uthgardt/Rengardt, and those folks who settled up in Hartsvale, etc).
Off-Topic:
I recently learned that there is another RPG that had a group called 'The Netherese' from 1985 (its getting a remake, and I did a map). No connection to FR's Netherese, of course - that was their term for their 'half-orc' race (actually half-goblin, but their orcs are goblins). The rules set is called The Arcanum, and its pretty nifty. An OD&D clone with some very 'ahead of its time' concepts (including a couple that wound up in 3e). It will have a Kickstarter soon for the '30th anniversary edition', and I'll post that in the appropriate section when it starts (I also designed the 'cover sigil'  ). |
"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone
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Edited by - Markustay on 26 Sep 2016 08:58:09 |
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Gary Dallison
Great Reader
United Kingdom
6351 Posts |
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Fendrikor
Learned Scribe
Australia
189 Posts |
Posted - 27 Sep 2016 : 15:34:49
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My spin on the Ghostlord is going to be a kinda hybrid of the 'Shadow King' of Iriabor and the 'Shadow magic' employed by the Talfir who used to live in the reaching wood in Talis.
What im going to rule is the Zhentarim were briefly in power in Iriaebor before the Rise of Bron (His line has continued to rule since) - What they searched for beneath Iriaebor during this time was the Phylactary of a powerful Lich called 'The Shadow King' who they hoped to awaken in the ruins of Talis. They succeded in doing so, triggering the events that transformed High Rider Delt of Elturgardt into a Vampire (after he lead an order of the gauntlet expedition into Talis to stop the awakening of the Shadowking). He failed and as his pawn nearly destroyed Elturel. In response the gods intervened and created the companion banishing the Shadowkings minions back to the Reaching woods. Ever since it has been 'off limits' because Elturgardt does not wish to supply fuel for the Shadowkings undead armies. The Gnolls of Reaching woods were his first targets, they were driven from their territories into everyone elses systematically wiping out every other thing in the woods from the Centaurs to the Goblins. In a last ditch attempt to flee the Shadowking they tried to cross the River Reaching into wood elf territory but thanks to my players last campaign, they were thwarted by a combined force of wood elves and the mercinary company 'Silent Rain'. Since then the wood has been quiet... nothing stirs on the southern side of the river. Anyone who enters the woods is never seen again. The Shadow king is massing an army in the woodlands of Shadow infused bone drinkers, Shadow wolves, Shadow deamons and greater shadows.
The Hobgoblins already made an overture to the darkhold months ago, Ulawai Stormcaller visited upon it and attempted to broker an alliance between the Darkhold and the Well of Dragons. During her time there as their guest she stole information form Manxam's lair that the Phylactary had been hidden away in the Ruins of Rhestilor, which now sits beneath the Farsea Marsh north of the Marsh of Tun. She made good her escape, but the Pereghost disagreed with the well of dragons terms saying it would be contrary to the New Zhentarims interests as a Sterling mercinary force. He sat on the information, massing an army of Tunlanders in the Marsh to bolster the Darkholds numbers. The Harpers caught wind that the Zhentarim were massing an army in the Tunlands but had no idea about the Army from the Well of Dragons massing in the north.
So basically my idea is - Ulawai found the Phylactary with Saarvith then travelled into the Woodlands to negotiate with the Shadowking for his involvment in the War - she is very brave. The Phylactary meanwhile is still in Rhestilor with Saarvith, who cannot dispatch it out to Azzar Kul because the Zhentarim's army in Tunland has blockaded Yellow snake pass. The Zhentarim are fighting a secret war already with the Hobgoblins for posession of the Swamps in the Tunlands (replacing the elf factions flying owls with the trained Wyverns from the Darkhold).
to be honest i havent read the ghostlord section too deeply so i might be wrong about the Phylactarys placement. Regardless, this is how im going to tie all the local shadow themes together.
Again any tips of tweaks are welcome! |
'Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons, for you are crunchy and taste good with ketchup' |
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Matrix Sorcica
Seeker
Denmark
89 Posts |
Posted - 05 Oct 2016 : 21:59:09
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quote:
Originally posted by Markustay
Also, my current mapping looks NOTHING like the 3e FR style. (Did I just say 'current mapping? Why YES... yes I did!)
Rejoicing!
Will you return to your Misbegotten Realms? |
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Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire
USA
15724 Posts |
Posted - 10 Oct 2016 : 19:14:51
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I've been thinking about it, but only because I put a LOT of work went into all the maps I had done, and it seems like such a waste if no-one ever got to use them.
There is (at least) one map I plan to definitely release, but I am waiting for the 'go ahead' from the man who did all the lore work involved with it (I consider it HIS). He's mega-busy with RW stuff right now, so I won't 'nudge' him again.. for a couple of weeks, yet.
And if I DO return to the Misbegotten Realms (I am sorely tempted), I plan to increase the size of (MR) Varisia back to its Golarion original - it always bothered me that if someone wanted to run any of their related AP's (about half the published adventures Paizo have, last time I checked), they'd have to convert all the distances... which I absolutely HATE. The fit won't be nearly as good, and I'll have to nudge my MR 'Old Empires' a bit further south, but thats okay. No-one uses the 'bottom half' of the map anyway. 
On-Topic:
I was finally able to locate my files on what I did with the RHoD (and the Scales of War AP). I wanted to post the map here, for posterity, but then realized that some it is parts of the 'big move' I had done to my Misbegotten Realms, which could cause a lot of confusion (to anyone now familiar with what I did to my Realms).
Thus, I am thinking about doing a backwards-conversion, taking out the stuff that shouldn't be in the canon North-Western Realms, other than the stuff that pertains to these two AP's. I am not sure sure how hard that would be; although I have maps of just about everywhere (FR), they are all different scales (DPI/PPI). My lack of organization bites me in the arse once again. I had a canon Nevewinter map I was working on (using the same backwards-engineering technique) that I could use for that, but its going to be rough to find. I've switched to a new computer and had no intention of ever working on maps again, so the files are NT handy... by a long shot. |
"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone
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Edited by - Markustay on 10 Oct 2016 19:38:49 |
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Matrix Sorcica
Seeker
Denmark
89 Posts |
Posted - 11 Oct 2016 : 16:17:40
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| Fingers crossed. As I've said, your Misbegotten Realms map (the part you made a snapshot of - Varisia, the North etc.) is absolutely perfect for my own campaign world. Also very curious to see how you fit Elsir Vale around Mirabar, and of course how you made the lore all fit! |
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Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire
USA
15724 Posts |
Posted - 11 Oct 2016 : 21:59:01
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looking at it right now.
I am starting to remember why I walked away from all this (or, at least, one of the reasons).
I stopped with all my original maps because the continent changed drastically in both 3e and 4e. I was never sure which edition I should be depicting, so I usually settled for 'amalgam' versions.
Now in 5e they've gone back to the original (1e/2e) layout... so i should have just stuck with that all along.
None of the maps I was working on when I quit (making 'canon' FR maps) match any of the official layouts - they are amalgams. The originals are all long gone (house fire), not that I would have used those anyway - I've progressed too far from then.
I am still trying to post my version of Red Hand of Doom just for posterity (and is why I am having this conversation HERE, in THIS thread). I will just have to fudge-in the 1e/2e layout on my MR map and see how that goes. Was looking for a 'quick fix'. {sigh} |
"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone
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Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire
USA
15724 Posts |
Posted - 11 Oct 2016 : 22:56:42
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Gave up trying to paste it into something else, so just ignore the non-canon weirdness (although, since this IS a conversion, the whole thing is completely non-canon anyway).
Elsir Vale in The North
You could see how I nudged the mountains more north and made the 'Frozenfar' bigger, to accommodate everything. Mirabar takes the place of Overton in this conversion (and all the little thorps around that dwarf city can now be placed around this one). You could even just say 'Overton' is the local, human name for Mirabar, if you want (its not all that important). |
"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone
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Matrix Sorcica
Seeker
Denmark
89 Posts |
Posted - 12 Oct 2016 : 13:03:05
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| Looks great! I'm really not too concerned about canon. Really hoping we get to see the larger area (that I mentioned above), even if it's just WIP. |
Edited by - Matrix Sorcica on 12 Oct 2016 15:21:17 |
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Fendrikor
Learned Scribe
Australia
189 Posts |
Posted - 12 Oct 2016 : 13:15:03
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I love it :)
For the record - the campaign is going well so far.
The party evacuted hills edge (drellins ferry) but some die hard rednecks stayed to defend their homes. They were thoroughly overwhelmed at the brief - battle of blackwater (out in the northdark woods). 70 dug in militia with some elusive dryads in support, pits and snares were overwhelmed by a force of manticores being ridden by hobgoblin elite infantry to a man. The two players present at the battle managed to escape into the feywild thanks to the dryads.
Next the redhand hit Hills Edge, where 100 Zhentilar heavy infantry with a few ballistae and a contingent of archers had been tricked into making a stand (in part thanks to one Zhent players incompetance and bad information). They retreated when they realised they had no match for the Red hands airforce, the dragon Abrithax chased them off suffice to say the Zhentarim were not pleased at the humilating defeat. They had come expecting 150 militia in support, and mostly just for political reasons.
The party meanwhile fended off an Chimera which attacked the refugees on their way to corm orp, then convinced Corm orp to evacuate aswell. A group of around 80 or so halflings wanted to stay though, calling themselves the Sheeland Patriots, intent on waging a guerilla war from the hills but the party managed to convince them to pull back. They were rallied around a charismatic band of halfling adventurers called the Grinning ponies (i know next to nothing about the grinning ponies from the books, so i reinvented them for my own realms). They managed to convince them and Lord Hultel and his riders to make a stand at Hluthvar against the red hand.
On the way to Hluthvar they came under attack by about 40 worg riders, Lord Hultels riders, the grinning ponies and the adventurers rode out to meet them in battle on the plains (Think the Warg rider battle in the Two towers). At the halfway point of the fight, as the bodies began to pile up a Kulkor adept riding a Hieracosphinx swooped in to attack (he hasted his hieracosphinx, 360 feet per round!) they won the day and slew the Adept, but the sphinx and a 3rd of the worg riders managed to retreat.
They came upon a small hamlet called Lake Placid with a shrine to Eldath and a large road house inn where they met Miha Serani who seemlessly worked her way into the party. One big thing i have changed is that Delora, the stable owner from the module, is a 'not so retired' harper. To make things interesting the one remaining Zhentarim affiliated player is a rogue, and a spy himself. NOW with Miha in the mix there is a veritable shadow war being waged within the party. Delora and the Zhent are onto eachother, but no one yet suspects miha.
In addition, an attempt was made on the lives of the party and the nobility of Corm Orp / Hills Edge who were staying at the road house when a dark wizard broke in via the second story, dumped a cloud kill spell and misty stepped away. It would have been ignited by any source of naked flame - blowing up the Road house - but thankfully the cleric was... erm... still awake at midnight.. with... erm.. Miha... who was picking her brain for information after an interesting night together. This alowed her to get into the hall and cast dispel magic (After first being surprised, then acting second to the wizard and taking 10d8 poison damage at level 6... it was very lucky she survived to have her turn!). Ironically, Miha's choice of partner for the night had saved everyones lives.
Next session looks to be interesting as they will meet High Ward Murandyr and get an idea of if Hluthvar can hold out against the red hand. They will likely attempt to rally support in Asbravn, or maybe even head over to the Tunlands to investigate what Wyrmlord Saarvith is doing at the ruins of Rhest. Whatever the case, a climactic fight is set to happen at Hluthvar. I will re-run the information used for the Massacre at Drellins ferry, except instead of War barges the hobgoblins will use giant pushed Siege towers (After stopping for a few days to construct them).
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'Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons, for you are crunchy and taste good with ketchup' |
Edited by - Fendrikor on 12 Oct 2016 13:15:29 |
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Iriaebor and the Red Hand of Doom
