Author |
Topic |
Madpig
Learned Scribe
Finland
148 Posts |
Posted - 05 Sep 2016 : 06:50:10
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There has been lot ups and downs with Drizzt during the years. Crystal Shard was AWESOME, as many know. Hunters Blades trilogy was bad, as was lot of transitions. BUT, Gauntlygrym (Spelling) was AWESOME again. Neverwinter Saga was rather boring aside of it. Companions was again great, but other books in companions codex was rather repetative again. About the same has Hunters Blades trilogy 100 years after. And now, after rather good Archmage we get this Maestro, that was quite terrible in my mind. It did couple of things that I hate with passion: first and foremost it did paint Jarlaxle as incompetent first time ever. And he has been my favorite guy for ages. Second, everyone co-operated so unbelievable way. Third: character interactions were something from Twilight-series. Fourth: Maestro was worst case in ignorance of settings established lore in general from RAS's part. So all in all, I dont shed too much tears if Drizzt is going to end.
But I do shed some tears of cancelled books from other authors, especially Kemp. |
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Gyor
Master of Realmslore
1621 Posts |
Posted - 05 Sep 2016 : 12:46:42
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There have been 33 novels, 1 anthology, several appearences in video games, a bunch of comic books, art work, ect... for Drizzt, who changed what it meant to be Drow, who shaped the politics of the North and Sword Coast all the way down to Calimport, who caught the attention of countless fans, sparking an interest in the Realms, and helping to keep the Realms alive in some dark times.
Drizzt is almost a setting in his own right, 34 total books, that's more books alone then most D&D settings get period.
And its all about to end in October. Its a dark Omen for the Realms and I don't like it one bit.
I hope Drizzt has a happy ending, after everything, he deserves it. |
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Lilianviaten
Senior Scribe
489 Posts |
Posted - 05 Sep 2016 : 20:11:25
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quote: Originally posted by Gyor
There have been 33 novels, 1 anthology, several appearences in video games, a bunch of comic books, art work, ect... for Drizzt, who changed what it meant to be Drow, who shaped the politics of the North and Sword Coast all the way down to Calimport, who caught the attention of countless fans, sparking an interest in the Realms, and helping to keep the Realms alive in some dark times.
Drizzt is almost a setting in his own right, 34 total books, that's more books alone then most D&D settings get period.
And its all about to end in October. Its a dark Omen for the Realms and I don't like it one bit.
I hope Drizzt has a happy ending, after everything, he deserves it.
A lot of the anti-Drizzt crowd don't seem to understand or appreciate how many doors he opened. A lot of the other novels, adventures, sourcebooks, etc. that we've enjoyed in recent years would not have existed if Drizzt was selling so well. But of course, there are some contrarian types who don't like when their hobbies become too popular and accessible to the masses. |
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Irennan
Great Reader
Italy
3802 Posts |
Posted - 05 Sep 2016 : 20:19:45
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quote: Originally posted by Lilianviaten
A lot of the anti-Drizzt crowd don't seem to understand or appreciate how many doors he opened. A lot of the other novels, adventures, sourcebooks, etc. that we've enjoyed in recent years would not have existed if Drizzt was selling so well. But of course, there are some contrarian types who don't like when their hobbies become too popular and accessible to the masses.
The anti-Drizzt crowd is surely outnumbered by those who like Drizzt, tho, otherwise WotC wouldn't have invested in him.
I very much appreciate that he opened the possibility to a deeper exploration and expansion of the drow. For example, if it wasn't for him, Idk if my favourite deities, Eilistraee and Vhaeraun, would have made the jump from Ed's Realms to the published setting, and I would have never cared for the dark elves as a result. However it also sucks when WotC takes decisions affecting the whole drow with that single character in mind. |
Mathematics is the art of giving the same name to different things. |
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Gyor
Master of Realmslore
1621 Posts |
Posted - 05 Sep 2016 : 20:33:55
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I'll point put that if it wasn't for Drizzt Drow wouldn't be in the PHB and he clearly inspired both the Hunter and Beastmaster Ranger subclasses too. He's even qouted in the PHB.
So it feel weird that in October Drizzt is meeting his end, whatever that means (death or retirement?). |
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Irennan
Great Reader
Italy
3802 Posts |
Posted - 05 Sep 2016 : 20:38:49
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quote: Originally posted by Gyor
I'll point put that if it wasn't for Drizzt Drow wouldn't be in the PHB and he clearly inspired both the Hunter and Beastmaster Ranger subclasses too. He's even qouted in the PHB.
Not arguing that, but when they decide to remove the entire drow pantheon and all that they entail, because otherwise Drizzt isn't enough of a special snowflake in WotC's eyes? That greatly diminishes the setting, deletes an entire huge side of a race, just to make a character supposedly feel more special (and that's even only their assumption, as I've never/very rarely seen Drizzt readers complain about the drow gods and their followers). C'mon.
quote:
So it feel weird that in October Drizzt is meeting his end, whatever that means (death or retirement?).
It seems retirement. The synopsis of Hero talks about finding peace, family, etc... |
Mathematics is the art of giving the same name to different things. |
Edited by - Irennan on 05 Sep 2016 20:42:33 |
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Gyor
Master of Realmslore
1621 Posts |
Posted - 05 Sep 2016 : 20:56:55
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I don't blame Drizzt for that, I blame some one at WotC for that bad idea. At least they're back. |
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CorellonsDevout
Great Reader
USA
2708 Posts |
Posted - 05 Sep 2016 : 21:00:44
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I would prefer Drizzt's 'retirement' to his death heh. |
Sweet water and light laughter |
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Irennan
Great Reader
Italy
3802 Posts |
Posted - 05 Sep 2016 : 21:03:07
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quote: Originally posted by Gyor
I don't blame Drizzt for that, I blame some one at WotC for that bad idea. At least they're back.
Sure. That's why I said that "it sucks when WotC take decisions about the whole drow with that single character in mind." |
Mathematics is the art of giving the same name to different things. |
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Irennan
Great Reader
Italy
3802 Posts |
Posted - 05 Sep 2016 : 21:09:55
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quote: Originally posted by CorellonsDevout
I would prefer Drizzt's 'retirement' to his death heh.
I honestly doubt that WotC would make a choice that would prevent any further Drizzt stories from being written. He has already been "resurrected" once, doing that again would be immensely lame, so I'd say that--were they to kill him--resurrection wouldn't be an option for having new stories about him. This means that they either just retire him, or they cut all possibilities for further Drizzt tales. |
Mathematics is the art of giving the same name to different things. |
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Tasker Daze
Seeker
84 Posts |
Posted - 05 Sep 2016 : 22:19:10
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quote: Originally posted by Lilianviaten
quote: Originally posted by Gyor
There have been 33 novels, 1 anthology, several appearences in video games, a bunch of comic books, art work, ect... for Drizzt, who changed what it meant to be Drow, who shaped the politics of the North and Sword Coast all the way down to Calimport, who caught the attention of countless fans, sparking an interest in the Realms, and helping to keep the Realms alive in some dark times.
Drizzt is almost a setting in his own right, 34 total books, that's more books alone then most D&D settings get period.
And its all about to end in October. Its a dark Omen for the Realms and I don't like it one bit.
I hope Drizzt has a happy ending, after everything, he deserves it.
A lot of the anti-Drizzt crowd don't seem to understand or appreciate how many doors he opened. A lot of the other novels, adventures, sourcebooks, etc. that we've enjoyed in recent years would not have existed if Drizzt was selling so well. But of course, there are some contrarian types who don't like when their hobbies become too popular and accessible to the masses.
no its because we're tired of drizzit. their are other characters. |
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Drizztsmanchild
Learned Scribe
USA
228 Posts |
Posted - 06 Sep 2016 : 09:39:46
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You know if the novel line is truly coming to an end...they should have one more grand adventure involving everyone's characters against a world ending menace.Spanning a 10 book timeframe. |
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BrianDavion
Seeker
71 Posts |
Posted - 06 Sep 2016 : 10:22:37
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quote: Originally posted by Tasker Daze
quote: Originally posted by Lilianviaten
quote: Originally posted by Gyor
There have been 33 novels, 1 anthology, several appearences in video games, a bunch of comic books, art work, ect... for Drizzt, who changed what it meant to be Drow, who shaped the politics of the North and Sword Coast all the way down to Calimport, who caught the attention of countless fans, sparking an interest in the Realms, and helping to keep the Realms alive in some dark times.
Drizzt is almost a setting in his own right, 34 total books, that's more books alone then most D&D settings get period.
And its all about to end in October. Its a dark Omen for the Realms and I don't like it one bit.
I hope Drizzt has a happy ending, after everything, he deserves it.
A lot of the anti-Drizzt crowd don't seem to understand or appreciate how many doors he opened. A lot of the other novels, adventures, sourcebooks, etc. that we've enjoyed in recent years would not have existed if Drizzt was selling so well. But of course, there are some contrarian types who don't like when their hobbies become too popular and accessible to the masses.
no its because we're tired of drizzit. their are other characters.
right it's not that they don't appreciate Drizzt it's just that after 30 odd books about the guy you want something else. I mean I enjoyed the Drizzt books but I don't think,. by any means, that the books where the best the realms had to offer |
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Shadowsoul
Senior Scribe
Ireland
705 Posts |
Posted - 06 Sep 2016 : 13:51:23
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quote: Originally posted by Mirtek
quote: Originally posted by Seravin
quote: Originally posted by Mirtek
quote: Originally posted by Gyor
5e was supposed to be a golden age for D&D and FR and instead its turned out to be a Near Death Experience.
Well, it seems to be the golden age for D&D again at least.
5e is still ranked on top spots on the amazon charts and has already beaten (individually, not alltogether) each previous edition of D&D.
We may not like it, but WotC's strategy seems to be working.
Not sure your evidence can lead you to the conclusion it did. Maybe that pertains to 4th edition? But an Amazon chart isn't going to tell you relative sales for 1-3rd editions of D&D or FR material.
Nope, it's straight from Mearls on twitter
https://twitter.com/mikemearls/status/764241988128419840
I would like to chime in here to say that proves nothing what so ever. If all tthe editions had the same selling conditions then yes it would prove something, but since they didn't it means nothing. |
“Fantasy is escapist, and that is its glory. If a soldier is imprisioned by the enemy, don't we consider it his duty to escape?. . .If we value the freedom of mind and soul, if we're partisans of liberty, then it's our plain duty to escape, and to take as many people with us as we can!” #8213; J.R.R. Tolkien
*I endorse everything Dark Wizard says*. |
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Shadowsoul
Senior Scribe
Ireland
705 Posts |
Posted - 06 Sep 2016 : 13:58:03
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quote: Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
quote: Originally posted by Irennan
quote: Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
We used to... But that was when we'd see multiple novels in that time frame.
I saw something online today saying that WotC had recently increased their staffing from 15 to 23 people. Obviously, this doesn't mean much for novels, since those aren't written in-house... But if they're increasing staff, it means they've got more work to be done. Hopefully, this will lead to an increase in the content they provide.
And 8 people may not sound like a lot... But that's more than half of what they had before.
We don't know if those 8 people are going to work in the RPG team, or in the Marketing team (or something like that), tho. At least, I haven't read anything about that.
True, we don't have that info... But staffing up is a good sign, either way.
How would that be good if these new people being hired have nothing to do with D&D? |
“Fantasy is escapist, and that is its glory. If a soldier is imprisioned by the enemy, don't we consider it his duty to escape?. . .If we value the freedom of mind and soul, if we're partisans of liberty, then it's our plain duty to escape, and to take as many people with us as we can!” #8213; J.R.R. Tolkien
*I endorse everything Dark Wizard says*. |
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Irennan
Great Reader
Italy
3802 Posts |
Posted - 06 Sep 2016 : 14:12:59
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quote: Originally posted by Drizztsmanchild
You know if the novel line is truly coming to an end...they should have one more grand adventure involving everyone's characters against a world ending menace.Spanning a 10 book timeframe.
That would be cheap IMO. We don't need *another* cataclysm. It has become stupid. Yes, I'll be blunt: at this point it's flat out stupid that apocalypses keep coming back to back. Novels should add depth to the Realms, expand on how things work there. And while IMO it is fine to extend that to powerful entities, like gods (for example, showing us how they interact with their people, how they may work/think etc...), it is not fine when every plot that involves them in some way either ends up blowing up things, or involves some world-ending stuff going on, and culminates in the cliché of "and our usual beloved heroes save the world for the 1346237-th time from the plans of some mad guy who obviously wants to end the same world they're living in".
If anything, we need a real Sundering series, to explain how the changes that are described in the SCAG happened, and to set up the present-day Realms. Because the 6 Sundering novels did a rather poor job at that. |
Mathematics is the art of giving the same name to different things. |
Edited by - Irennan on 06 Sep 2016 14:18:23 |
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Eilserus
Master of Realmslore
USA
1446 Posts |
Posted - 06 Sep 2016 : 17:24:34
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Ugh, this is really happening isn't it? I've been reading Drizzt since I was in 6th grade (I'm 36 now). No more Elminster, Storm, the Baenres, I could go on, but this is depressing on so many levels. :( |
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CorellonsDevout
Great Reader
USA
2708 Posts |
Posted - 06 Sep 2016 : 19:10:22
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Amen to that |
Sweet water and light laughter |
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Mirtek
Senior Scribe
595 Posts |
Posted - 06 Sep 2016 : 20:50:42
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Wow, this:
http://www.enworld.org/forum/showthread.php?495194-Forgotten-Realms-novel-line-being-cancelled&p=6984014&viewfull=1#post6984014
here from Enworld makes it sound as if the end of the novel line is for real.
quote: Originally posted by slushlush.com So it’s true? This is the last book? Yes. The Devil You Know is the last book of the Brimstone Angels series.
I don’t like that. I can’t say I like it either, but if it helps, the last book was nearly Ashes of the Tyrant, cliffhanger and all, so really–
I WOULD HAVE KILLED SOMEONE. That’s kind of what I guessed. You can be a little dramatic.
The point is we’ve come to the end. It’s not the end of me, not the end of my stories, not the end of characters like Farideh and family, but it’s the end of the Brimstone Angels Saga. I worked my butt off to get The Devil You Know to you, my darling readers, in time to be published. You get an ending, and having been at this long enough to see lots of series get unceremoniously cut off, I think that’s something precious.
So if they nearly axed the brimstone angels with Ashes of the Tyrant they seem to be dead serious about ending the line. |
Edited by - Mirtek on 06 Sep 2016 20:51:49 |
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Drizztsmanchild
Learned Scribe
USA
228 Posts |
Posted - 07 Sep 2016 : 04:17:31
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quote: Originally posted by Irennan
quote: Originally posted by Drizztsmanchild
You know if the novel line is truly coming to an end...they should have one more grand adventure involving everyone's characters against a world ending menace.Spanning a 10 book timeframe.
That would be cheap IMO. We don't need *another* cataclysm. It has become stupid. Yes, I'll be blunt: at this point it's flat out stupid that apocalypses keep coming back to back. Novels should add depth to the Realms, expand on how things work there. And while IMO it is fine to extend that to powerful entities, like gods (for example, showing us how they interact with their people, how they may work/think etc...), it is not fine when every plot that involves them in some way either ends up blowing up things, or involves some world-ending stuff going on, and culminates in the cliché of "and our usual beloved heroes save the world for the 1346237-th time from the plans of some mad guy who obviously wants to end the same world they're living in".
If anything, we need a real Sundering series, to explain how the changes that are described in the SCAG happened, and to set up the present-day Realms. Because the 6 Sundering novels did a rather poor job at that.
We each see the novels differently. I don't really play D&D. The novels to me are more for entertainment and less for lore gathering purposes. Neither of us is wrong. But if there are no more novels, my interest in this will likely end as well. So I wouldn't mind another Realms saving crossover series |
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Irennan
Great Reader
Italy
3802 Posts |
Posted - 07 Sep 2016 : 04:24:51
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I wasn't implying that one of us is wrong and the other right (that's why I said "IMO" multiple times). But even from the perspective of someone who doesn't play D&D, repetitive storytelling focused on big-heroes and huge booms cheapens a world. It makes it less believable/relatable and more like random popcorn fiction. Besides, detailing and adding depth to a setting is a sign of good world building, unrelatedly to RPGs.
That's why IMO a novel series with yet another world ending threat is not needed, and a series that explains the changes that led to the 1490s FR/current era would be better as "the last FR novel series". |
Mathematics is the art of giving the same name to different things. |
Edited by - Irennan on 07 Sep 2016 04:25:20 |
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Shadowsoul
Senior Scribe
Ireland
705 Posts |
Posted - 07 Sep 2016 : 17:09:19
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Wizards should have just made a generic world. They could have blown that up as much as they like. |
“Fantasy is escapist, and that is its glory. If a soldier is imprisioned by the enemy, don't we consider it his duty to escape?. . .If we value the freedom of mind and soul, if we're partisans of liberty, then it's our plain duty to escape, and to take as many people with us as we can!” #8213; J.R.R. Tolkien
*I endorse everything Dark Wizard says*. |
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Drizztsmanchild
Learned Scribe
USA
228 Posts |
Posted - 07 Sep 2016 : 19:32:58
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Ras answered my question on this matter with this: "I am not talking about anything after "Hero" at this point" So take that as you will |
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Caolin
Senior Scribe
768 Posts |
Posted - 07 Sep 2016 : 20:46:24
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None of the current authors sound happy and Ed's Twitter feed is filled with stuff about his new setting
http://stormtalons.onderlibrum.com/
The writing is on the wall people. |
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Eilserus
Master of Realmslore
USA
1446 Posts |
Posted - 07 Sep 2016 : 20:50:16
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quote: Originally posted by Drizztsmanchild
Ras answered my question on this matter with this: "I am not talking about anything after "Hero" at this point" So take that as you will
That might be telling, but if RAS said WotC canned the novel line people might not buy the book in outrage or something. Have to wait for release of Hero to know anything more I imagine.
I hope the line doesn't end. I like my reading in the Realms. |
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Shadowsoul
Senior Scribe
Ireland
705 Posts |
Posted - 07 Sep 2016 : 21:49:43
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The novel's are actually what give the setting life. |
“Fantasy is escapist, and that is its glory. If a soldier is imprisioned by the enemy, don't we consider it his duty to escape?. . .If we value the freedom of mind and soul, if we're partisans of liberty, then it's our plain duty to escape, and to take as many people with us as we can!” #8213; J.R.R. Tolkien
*I endorse everything Dark Wizard says*. |
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Gyor
Master of Realmslore
1621 Posts |
Posted - 08 Sep 2016 : 02:24:11
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quote: Originally posted by Shadowsoul
The novel's are actually what give the setting life.
Exactly. Without the novels the realms will dry and die. I'm starting to dispise Hasbro now, wish Wizards of the coast had never been sold to them, and I wish they'd sell the IP to a more deserving and competent company. I wish I had the money to buy it off them. Or for the rights to revert to Ed. |
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CorellonsDevout
Great Reader
USA
2708 Posts |
Posted - 08 Sep 2016 : 02:31:13
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The novels have always been my primary focus. I'm going to miss them, if the rumors are true. |
Sweet water and light laughter |
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PMark
Acolyte
1 Posts |
Posted - 08 Sep 2016 : 19:14:06
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Hi folks! I just want to join in the chorus to say i also think that the novels are among the primary things that make a setting successful and popular and lively. Especially a setting which is a fairly generic high fantasy one.
RAS, Cunningham, Kemp and others made me interested in FR.Evans renewed it. Gross did the same for Golarion.
Novels are an entry point for possible new fans, it would be a shame to see it axed. The trickling down to 3 authors was bad already. |
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Shadowsoul
Senior Scribe
Ireland
705 Posts |
Posted - 09 Sep 2016 : 00:03:12
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I could actually see this as an intentional way to remove a lot of the feel of the Realms so Perkins and Co can do things as they wish and new fans wouldn't know the difference.
I see many business decisions going on in the guise of "caring about D&D". |
“Fantasy is escapist, and that is its glory. If a soldier is imprisioned by the enemy, don't we consider it his duty to escape?. . .If we value the freedom of mind and soul, if we're partisans of liberty, then it's our plain duty to escape, and to take as many people with us as we can!” #8213; J.R.R. Tolkien
*I endorse everything Dark Wizard says*. |
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