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Brimstone
Great Reader

USA
3024 Posts

Posted - 05 May 2016 :  21:56:38  Show Profile Send Brimstone a Private Message  Reply with Quote  Delete Topic
Is it any good?

I looked through it a couple of months back.

Is it worth buying, or should I stay with my OGB?

How is 5E? Is it enjoyable like 3E?

Thanks!

As you can tell, I have been out of the loop for the last couple of years...

"These things also I have observed: that knowledge of our world is
to be nurtured like a precious flower, for it is the most precious
thing we have. Wherefore guard the word written and heed
words unwritten and set them down ere they fade . . . Learn
then, well, the arts of reading, writing, and listening true, and they
will lead you to the greatest art of all: understanding."
Alaundo of Candlekeep

Edited by - Brimstone on 05 May 2016 21:58:03

Irennan
Great Reader

Italy
2983 Posts

Posted - 05 May 2016 :  22:14:58  Show Profile Send Irennan a Private Message  Reply with Quote
It provides the status quo of the Realms&gods after the Sundering, but it doesn't give any explanation for all the stuff coming back, unless you count ''The Sundering'' as an explanation (and even characters like Dove, who have just died, are back w/o any explanation).

The lore is well written (and it's a nice read, given that the section about the Sword Coast is written from the perspective of travelers/explorers/etc), but a lot of the information can be found in previous books. As I said, if you have the 2e/3e books, this one is mostly useful to know what is back and what isn't (basically everything is back, tho). I think that this book was mainly written to introduce newcomers to the Realms.

As for 5e, I can't really comment on it, since I know the rules but I've never played it. It seems a solid system, albeit very simplified, if compared to 3.5e (and with much less options, but I guess that the last part is due to the fact that the system is still rather young).


To all Facebook-using FR fans, you might be interested in checking out this page: https://www.facebook.com/groups/450517575051806/

Edited by - Irennan on 05 May 2016 22:17:24
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Bladewind
Master of Realmslore

Netherlands
1253 Posts

Posted - 05 May 2016 :  22:47:07  Show Profile Send Bladewind a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I've been enjoying 5e FR via Baker's Lost Mine of Phandelver; its ease of play makes running games a blast. I think its the best starting set for D&D (my own introduction to D&D was via First Quest, also written by Rich Baker).

The 5E rules are simple, but I haven't found them lacking in detail or verisimilitude during play. The average combat is very fast and deadly. The increased lethality combined with the more forgiving injury and death rules makes lowlevel encounters and monsters useful well into highlevel play. I also like the balance they managed to introduce by the bounded accuracy and improved casting system, which reigns in the high level spellcasters quite a bit.

I am going to pick up the Sword Coast Adventurers Guide (SCAG) after I get my DMG copy. SCAG's price is a tad high, and would have been a recommendation at a tad lower pricepoint for sure.

My campaign sketches

Druidic Groves

Creature Feature: Giant Spiders
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Brimstone
Great Reader

USA
3024 Posts

Posted - 05 May 2016 :  22:52:26  Show Profile Send Brimstone a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Thanks guys!

"These things also I have observed: that knowledge of our world is
to be nurtured like a precious flower, for it is the most precious
thing we have. Wherefore guard the word written and heed
words unwritten and set them down ere they fade . . . Learn
then, well, the arts of reading, writing, and listening true, and they
will lead you to the greatest art of all: understanding."
Alaundo of Candlekeep
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moonbeast
Senior Scribe

USA
472 Posts

Posted - 05 May 2016 :  23:41:47  Show Profile Send moonbeast a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Irennan
It seems a solid system, albeit very simplified, if compared to 3.5e (and with much less options, but I guess that the last part is due to the fact that the system is still rather young).




I think 5e was introduced to be uncluttered and simplified as a selling point. And also, releasing a new edition from scratch meant that they had to focus on the basic elements/mechanics, rather than adding hundreds of options and choices.

It's likely that the "advanced" options/choices will roll out in the near future. It's not just likely, it's nearly guaranteed. The WotC website keeps running those Unearthed Arcana playtest surveys, and hints strongly at bringing back numerous "class kits" and optional features. I do agree with Wizards that none of that stuff should be officially published without a good amount of playtesting. Introducing new material that's untested simply means that they introduce a whole slew of unbalanced game elements, and that would simply suck for DMs and players alike.
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Irennan
Great Reader

Italy
2983 Posts

Posted - 06 May 2016 :  00:49:07  Show Profile Send Irennan a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Yeah, that's why I said that my guess is that the lack of options (if compared to rpev. editions) is mostly due to 5e being only like 2 years old.

To all Facebook-using FR fans, you might be interested in checking out this page: https://www.facebook.com/groups/450517575051806/
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
Moderator

USA
31515 Posts

Posted - 06 May 2016 :  00:51:01  Show Profile Send Wooly Rupert a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I've not played 5E, myself, but I've no objections with what I've seen of it -- I could not say the same thing about the 4E ruleset.

Also, when 4E came out, opinions on it were very strong -- depending on the person, it was either The Best Thing Ever or an Unholy Abomination Against Gaming. There wasn't a middle ground... With 5E, I've seen mostly positive commentary, and what little negativity I've seen directed at it was pretty mild.

I, personally, would not be adverse to trying 5E.

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Shadowsoul
Senior Scribe

Ireland
697 Posts

Posted - 06 May 2016 :  16:14:17  Show Profile Send Shadowsoul a Private Message  Reply with Quote
If you have FR books from previous editions then you do not need SCAG unless you are collect books. I found 5th edition to be simple but I find that it really tries to be like 2nd edition and since I use almost all 2nd edition stuff anyway, since Wizards is lacking in the content department, I figured I would just use that ruleset anyway. Gives me more of what I want.

“Fantasy is escapist, and that is its glory. If a soldier is imprisioned by the enemy, don't we consider it his duty to escape?. . .If we value the freedom of mind and soul, if we're partisans of liberty, then it's our plain duty to escape, and to take as many people with us as we can!”
#8213; J.R.R. Tolkien

*I endorse everything Dark Wizard says*.
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sleyvas
Great Reader

USA
7432 Posts

Posted - 06 May 2016 :  23:50:15  Show Profile Send sleyvas a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I like the idea behind 5e, but its sorely lacking in options. For instance, there's summoning rules, but there often are not creatures of the CR that you want to summon. The spell lists are bleedingly limited. That's why I feel the DMSGuild has come out, and in there we're starting to see people play with some ideas that are very interesting twists on rulesets. However, for every gem I've run across, I also see 10 that are just junk. That's why when I see someone who put a decent effort into converting some old lore, spells, etc... I really try to at least give them a review, etc...

Alavairthae, may your skill prevail

Phillip aka Sleyvas
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Brimstone
Great Reader

USA
3024 Posts

Posted - 07 May 2016 :  04:41:59  Show Profile Send Brimstone a Private Message  Reply with Quote
So 5E doesn't have a lot of rules bloat? Yet.

When I was checking out the 5E MM it looked like monsters AC really didn't escalate like it used to. Am I wrong on that assessment? Do character's still need the "Christmas tree affect" to be effective? That was the one thing that got annoying towards the end of 3e. All my character's were the same. Same feats, same gear, same magic items. Just different names of the character. LOL

"These things also I have observed: that knowledge of our world is
to be nurtured like a precious flower, for it is the most precious
thing we have. Wherefore guard the word written and heed
words unwritten and set them down ere they fade . . . Learn
then, well, the arts of reading, writing, and listening true, and they
will lead you to the greatest art of all: understanding."
Alaundo of Candlekeep
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moonbeast
Senior Scribe

USA
472 Posts

Posted - 07 May 2016 :  07:25:07  Show Profile Send moonbeast a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Brimstone

So 5E doesn't have a lot of rules bloat? Yet.

When I was checking out the 5E MM it looked like monsters AC really didn't escalate like it used to. Am I wrong on that assessment? Do character's still need the "Christmas tree affect" to be effective? That was the one thing that got annoying towards the end of 3e. All my character's were the same. Same feats, same gear, same magic items. Just different names of the character. LOL

It's not bloated yet. Just wait for a couple more years, because clearly many Players want the hundreds of new classes, hundreds of new feats, hundreds of new class kits, thousands of new magic items and gear, and hundreds of new spells, and hundreds of challenging new EPIC monsters to fight. They want this bloat, for the same reason that 5E is criticized for "not having enough options".

I remember that 8 months after 5E was released, in the official D&D Forums (now closed), some players were already demanding a SECOND Players Handbook (PHB).

For me, the game is fine as it stands now. It is extremely playable and the rules are streamlined. You spend more time PLAYING and having fun, and less time rules-lawyering, less time arguing about the thousands byzantine conflicting rules.

I do welcome the release of a few more 5E rulebooks that give new options, new playable classes or kits, and some new spells and monsters, but not to the extent that it's super-bloated like Pathfinder.


Edited by - moonbeast on 07 May 2016 07:26:54
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Irennan
Great Reader

Italy
2983 Posts

Posted - 07 May 2016 :  13:32:22  Show Profile Send Irennan a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I just want to see more subclasses. So that players can play w/e concept they have in mind, w/o heavily refluffing the rules.

To all Facebook-using FR fans, you might be interested in checking out this page: https://www.facebook.com/groups/450517575051806/
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froglegg
Learned Scribe

317 Posts

Posted - 08 May 2016 :  04:01:06  Show Profile Send froglegg a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by moonbeast

quote:
Originally posted by Brimstone

So 5E doesn't have a lot of rules bloat? Yet.

When I was checking out the 5E MM it looked like monsters AC really didn't escalate like it used to. Am I wrong on that assessment? Do character's still need the "Christmas tree affect" to be effective? That was the one thing that got annoying towards the end of 3e. All my character's were the same. Same feats, same gear, same magic items. Just different names of the character. LOL

It's not bloated yet. Just wait for a couple more years, because clearly many Players want the hundreds of new classes, hundreds of new feats, hundreds of new class kits, thousands of new magic items and gear, and hundreds of new spells, and hundreds of challenging new EPIC monsters to fight. They want this bloat, for the same reason that 5E is criticized for "not having enough options".

I remember that 8 months after 5E was released, in the official D&D Forums (now closed), some players were already demanding a SECOND Players Handbook (PHB).

For me, the game is fine as it stands now. It is extremely playable and the rules are streamlined. You spend more time PLAYING and having fun, and less time rules-lawyering, less time arguing about the thousands byzantine conflicting rules.

I do welcome the release of a few more 5E rulebooks that give new options, new playable classes or kits, and some new spells and monsters, but not to the extent that it's super-bloated like Pathfinder.




That's my fear.
IMHO rules light is why I am liking 5E so much, and yes the guide is very good.
Again just my MHO.




John

Long live Alias and Dragonbait! Kate Novak and Jeff Grubb the Realms need you more then ever!

On my word as a sage nothing within these pages is false, but not all of it may prove to be true. - Elminster of Shadowdale

The Old Grey Box gets better with age!
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Seethyr
Senior Scribe

USA
485 Posts

Posted - 08 May 2016 :  20:31:27  Show Profile  Visit Seethyr's Homepage Send Seethyr a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Please just give me more FR lore. I want to know the status quo everywhere so badly right now, but can only find bits and pieces. SCAG did an admirable job of covering some of it - but not the nitty gritty that I've always loved tearing in to. The rules bloat I can take or leave.

I would love to see an official binder and more extensive psionics updates though. I loved those classes.

More monsters never hurt anyone either (well, so to speak...)

All "Maztica Alive" products can be found below, linked to the campaign guide.

TWC1 The Maztica Campaign Guide

Newest Addition: TWR1 The Sea Demon's Pearl

Also, please come join us on the Maztica Alive Yahoo Group:
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sleyvas
Great Reader

USA
7432 Posts

Posted - 10 May 2016 :  01:16:56  Show Profile Send sleyvas a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by moonbeast

quote:
Originally posted by Brimstone

So 5E doesn't have a lot of rules bloat? Yet.

When I was checking out the 5E MM it looked like monsters AC really didn't escalate like it used to. Am I wrong on that assessment? Do character's still need the "Christmas tree affect" to be effective? That was the one thing that got annoying towards the end of 3e. All my character's were the same. Same feats, same gear, same magic items. Just different names of the character. LOL

It's not bloated yet. Just wait for a couple more years, because clearly many Players want the hundreds of new classes, hundreds of new feats, hundreds of new class kits, thousands of new magic items and gear, and hundreds of new spells, and hundreds of challenging new EPIC monsters to fight. They want this bloat, for the same reason that 5E is criticized for "not having enough options".

I remember that 8 months after 5E was released, in the official D&D Forums (now closed), some players were already demanding a SECOND Players Handbook (PHB).

For me, the game is fine as it stands now. It is extremely playable and the rules are streamlined. You spend more time PLAYING and having fun, and less time rules-lawyering, less time arguing about the thousands byzantine conflicting rules.

I do welcome the release of a few more 5E rulebooks that give new options, new playable classes or kits, and some new spells and monsters, but not to the extent that it's super-bloated like Pathfinder.





We're on about year 2 now, and they've released several modules, but only 1 rules expansion.... and that had a grand total of like 5 new spells. That's why I think they've come out with the DMs Guild. I'm honestly despairing of seeing anything truly innovative from wizards directly anytime soon. That's why when I find something good on DMs Guild, I want to spread the news.

Alavairthae, may your skill prevail

Phillip aka Sleyvas
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sleyvas
Great Reader

USA
7432 Posts

Posted - 10 May 2016 :  01:21:49  Show Profile Send sleyvas a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Seethyr

Please just give me more FR lore. I want to know the status quo everywhere so badly right now, but can only find bits and pieces. SCAG did an admirable job of covering some of it - but not the nitty gritty that I've always loved tearing in to. The rules bloat I can take or leave.

I would love to see an official binder and more extensive psionics updates though. I loved those classes.

More monsters never hurt anyone either (well, so to speak...)



If you'd like to see a "rules-light" version of the binder, check out my occultist binder version of the warlock in the red book of spell strategy (its pay what you want). I tried to make a 5e version that is relatively easy to implement, and rather than having to constantly "upgrade" which spirit you're working through because their power levels become too low, you could instead have societies that work with a certain vestige from the start of their career to its end. Thus, you can still use the old vestiges (from any source, including some of the 3rd party stuff), and just fit it to your storyline.

Alavairthae, may your skill prevail

Phillip aka Sleyvas
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Brimstone
Great Reader

USA
3024 Posts

Posted - 10 May 2016 :  19:08:49  Show Profile Send Brimstone a Private Message  Reply with Quote
So...I picked up The Sword Coast Adventure Guide today. I saw that it was a collaboration between WotC and Green Ronin. Call me surprised. I love Green Ronin's Freeport Setting from 3E. Is this now WotC's model? Collaborate with other companies on books? Also is there a list for any 5E Realms books(Novels, and Game)? I figure there is one somewhere!!! LOL

Thanks!

"These things also I have observed: that knowledge of our world is
to be nurtured like a precious flower, for it is the most precious
thing we have. Wherefore guard the word written and heed
words unwritten and set them down ere they fade . . . Learn
then, well, the arts of reading, writing, and listening true, and they
will lead you to the greatest art of all: understanding."
Alaundo of Candlekeep
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Irennan
Great Reader

Italy
2983 Posts

Posted - 10 May 2016 :  19:16:39  Show Profile Send Irennan a Private Message  Reply with Quote
The list is:

Sourcebooks: The SCAG

Adventures: Hoard of the Dragon Queen&Rise of Tiamat; Princes of the Apocalypse; Out of the Abyss

Novels: The 6 Sundering books; ''Spellstorm'' and (soon to come) ''Death Masks'' (by Ed); ''Fire in the blood'', ''Ashes of the tyrant'', and (soon to come) ''The devil you know'' (by Erin Evans); ''Night of the Hunter'', ''Rise of the King'', ''Vengeance of the Iron Dwarf'', ''Archmage'', ''Maestro'' and (soon to come) ''Hero'' (by RAS).

WotC has farmed their books to other developers, but their last book (a Ravenloft one) was fully made by them. So Idk if there will be other farmed projects.

To all Facebook-using FR fans, you might be interested in checking out this page: https://www.facebook.com/groups/450517575051806/

Edited by - Irennan on 10 May 2016 19:17:48
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Brimstone
Great Reader

USA
3024 Posts

Posted - 10 May 2016 :  19:20:09  Show Profile Send Brimstone a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Thank you kind Sir!

"These things also I have observed: that knowledge of our world is
to be nurtured like a precious flower, for it is the most precious
thing we have. Wherefore guard the word written and heed
words unwritten and set them down ere they fade . . . Learn
then, well, the arts of reading, writing, and listening true, and they
will lead you to the greatest art of all: understanding."
Alaundo of Candlekeep
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moonbeast
Senior Scribe

USA
472 Posts

Posted - 11 May 2016 :  03:30:56  Show Profile Send moonbeast a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Brimstone

So...I picked up The Sword Coast Adventure Guide today. I saw that it was a collaboration between WotC and Green Ronin. Call me surprised. I love Green Ronin's Freeport Setting from 3E. Is this now WotC's model? Collaborate with other companies on books? Also is there a list for any 5E Realms books(Novels, and Game)? I figure there is one somewhere!!! LOL

Thanks!

Collaborating with other small innovative companies is a good model. As for WotC, they really have no choice but to do that. Remember that the current WotC is a very small skeleton crew nowadays. The parent company Hasbro had laid off or eliminated several WotC staff positions around the time when 5E was just being released.

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see
Learned Scribe

191 Posts

Posted - 14 May 2016 :  03:22:22  Show Profile Send see a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Brimstone

When I was checking out the 5E MM it looked like monsters AC really didn't escalate like it used to. Am I wrong on that assessment?

No, you're right. The term for it is "bounded accuracy"; neither attack bonuses nor armor classes escalate like they used to (on either side of the PC/monster divide), and most minor bonuses/penalties are replaced by the advantage/disadvantage mechanic. Even magic item bonuses have been reduced; a +3 sword is the best available.

What escalates with level, in 5th edition, are damage and hit points. A low-level fighter will be able to hit that high-end monster a few times, but he won't kill it before it kills him; a high-level fighter (making multiple attacks at full attack bonus and rocking far more hit points himself) will. Which also means a true horde of orcs can eventually wear through a high-level character, rather than flailing hopelessly in hope of rolling 20s.
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Brimstone
Great Reader

USA
3024 Posts

Posted - 14 May 2016 :  03:47:28  Show Profile Send Brimstone a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Sounds good to me.

"These things also I have observed: that knowledge of our world is
to be nurtured like a precious flower, for it is the most precious
thing we have. Wherefore guard the word written and heed
words unwritten and set them down ere they fade . . . Learn
then, well, the arts of reading, writing, and listening true, and they
will lead you to the greatest art of all: understanding."
Alaundo of Candlekeep
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moonbeast
Senior Scribe

USA
472 Posts

Posted - 14 May 2016 :  03:52:52  Show Profile Send moonbeast a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Yes. Even a small warband of 30 orc warriors ( < CR1 each?) should have a chance to kill a lone 15th level Fighter.

Then again, that small warband of orc warriors will likely be led by at least 1 or 2 war shamans or clerics of Gruumsh, spell-casters that could make things difficult for that foolhardly brave Fighter (who thinks as if he's a one-man army).
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Brimstone
Great Reader

USA
3024 Posts

Posted - 17 May 2016 :  03:31:20  Show Profile Send Brimstone a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Almost done reading through SCAG. I like it. Gives a bare bones version of the Realms.

Is their any more info on the new and improved Zentarim out of Darkhold?

"These things also I have observed: that knowledge of our world is
to be nurtured like a precious flower, for it is the most precious
thing we have. Wherefore guard the word written and heed
words unwritten and set them down ere they fade . . . Learn
then, well, the arts of reading, writing, and listening true, and they
will lead you to the greatest art of all: understanding."
Alaundo of Candlekeep

Edited by - Brimstone on 17 May 2016 03:32:08
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Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire

USA
15675 Posts

Posted - 17 May 2016 :  14:35:24  Show Profile Send Markustay a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I don't know about the SCAG, but I was playing 5e with my sons and enjoying it, using two of the adventures set along the Swordcoast. It is a fairly straight-forward set of rules thats a good framework to set your games in, that lets you concentrate on RPGing, and not have to focus on the rules themselves.

I no longer play D&D and am no longer interested in FR, but if those are things you like, then I can recommend it to you, because we had fun with it.

"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone

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dazzlerdal
Great Reader

United Kingdom
4116 Posts

Posted - 17 May 2016 :  14:51:19  Show Profile Send dazzlerdal a Private Message  Reply with Quote
No longer interested in FR, what could possibly have happened to make a fellow obsessive no longer interested in the wonderful richness of FRs (aparr from the destruction of its future that is)

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