| Author |
 Topic  |
|
Shadowsoul
Senior Scribe
Ireland
705 Posts |
 Posted - 21 Aug 2015 : 14:59:48
|
What is with Wizards and their fascination with cultists? Even the latest Hillsfar module, god awful, has cultists.
They are running this stuff into the ground.
|
“Fantasy is escapist, and that is its glory. If a soldier is imprisioned by the enemy, don't we consider it his duty to escape?. . .If we value the freedom of mind and soul, if we're partisans of liberty, then it's our plain duty to escape, and to take as many people with us as we can!”
#8213; J.R.R. Tolkien
*I endorse everything Dark Wizard says*. |
|
|
Gary Dallison
Great Reader
United Kingdom
6353 Posts |
|
|
George Krashos
Master of Realmslore
Australia
6646 Posts |
Posted - 21 Aug 2015 : 16:48:35
|
I've struggled mightily with the "factions". Mightily.
-- George Krashos |
"Because only we, contrary to the barbarians, never count the enemy in battle." -- Aeschylus |
 |
|
|
Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36779 Posts |
Posted - 21 Aug 2015 : 16:57:57
|
WotC is a firm believer in finding a concept, milking it for all its worth, continuing to milk it until its teats shrivel up and fall off, and then milking it for a little bit longer, before finally moving to another concept and repeating the process.
They did it with the Chosen of Mystra, and then Shar and the Shades, and now it's various flavors of cultists.
And it's a shame, really. Ed built into the Realms a lot of different groups with a lot of different interests; part of what makes his Realms so complex is the fact that all these different groups are constantly bumping into each other as they work towards various, not necessarily opposing goals. And there's plenty of powerful individuals, with their own agendas, also mixed in there.
And rather than embrace that complexity and the myriad opportunities it grants, WotC keeps choosing to dumb it down, embrace one group, pay attention to a couple others (mainly opponents of the Chosen Group of the Moment), and then utterly ignore the rest.
It's like I've talked about with a theoretical Thayan civil war that results in loyalist Thayans sticking with Szass Tam in Thay, and the rival Thay-in-Exile group basing itself in Mulmaster and trying to reclaim Thay from Sassy. Pit these two groups against each other, and so many others will come crawling out of the woodwork to aid one side or the other, to play them against each other, or work against both -- there's so much potential there that it's pure roleplaying gold, something that can be readily mined for years just by mixing up what each faction is doing and throwing a different group or two into the mix each time. Let one adventure be Harpers working behind the scenes to help preserve something in Mulmaster while Thay and Thay-in-Exile strive against each other for the same goal, and then the next adventure is Zhents aiding Thay against a Thay-in-Exile enclave somewhere else, while the Twisted Rune is trying to use the struggle to get something from that same enclave... But that's not the route they went; they chose the simpler path - as they always do. |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen!  |
Edited by - Wooly Rupert on 21 Aug 2015 16:58:16 |
|
|
|
Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36779 Posts |
Posted - 21 Aug 2015 : 16:59:31
|
quote:
Originally posted by George Krashos
I've struggled mightily with the "factions". Mightily.
-- George Krashos
Yeah, I'm really not a fan of the factions, myself. It's almost like a sports league, the way they're doing it. |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen! |
|
|
|
Delwa
Master of Realmslore
USA
1268 Posts |
Posted - 21 Aug 2015 : 17:05:34
|
WotC just doesn't like games of intrigue with more layers than an onion. If what I've heard about how political their organization can be is true, then I can understand not wanting to bring that same twisted mesh of insanity into their actual works. Still, I like onions. Having more enemies, cults, and factions than you can shake a stick at is how I run my games.
I can't decide if having that twisted package handed me in an adventure would be better for me, or worse. On the one hand, all my work would be done. On the other, there's more reading I've got to do to make sure I keep the web from getting too tangled.
|
- Delwa Aunglor
I am off to slay yon refrigerator and spoil it's horde. Go for the cheese, Boo!
"The Realms change; seldom at the speed desired of those who strive, but far too quickly for those who resist." - The Simbul, taken from the Forgotten Realms Campaign Conspectus |
|
|
|
Shadowsoul
Senior Scribe
Ireland
705 Posts |
Posted - 21 Aug 2015 : 18:46:04
|
The Realms is huge, why not have other conflicts with other groups going on? I mean the next AP is about demons being summoned by a spell that went haywire, aka an accident, but somehow we have all these adventures dealing with cults and fiends.
Wizards is really causing people to hate the Realms yet again. |
“Fantasy is escapist, and that is its glory. If a soldier is imprisioned by the enemy, don't we consider it his duty to escape?. . .If we value the freedom of mind and soul, if we're partisans of liberty, then it's our plain duty to escape, and to take as many people with us as we can!”
#8213; J.R.R. Tolkien
*I endorse everything Dark Wizard says*. |
|
|
|
Gary Dallison
Great Reader
United Kingdom
6353 Posts |
|
|
Dark Wizard
Senior Scribe
USA
830 Posts |
Posted - 21 Aug 2015 : 21:13:19
|
| Cultists of what? |
|
|
|
Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire
USA
15724 Posts |
Posted - 21 Aug 2015 : 21:39:40
|
The 'factions' thing, is something started by Warmachine (Iron Kingdoms setting). Although one can go even further back to Warhammer, and perhaps even back to the prehistoric days of Napoleonic miniatures (where everyone would have their 'favorite'), it only became 'personal' when privateer Press got a hold of the concept. They decided to put the PLAYERS, not just the armies/NPCs, against each other. It worked great, generated lots of 'buzz', and people clove to their faction like a RL political party.
Paizo brought it to RPGs. They looked around what was going on in other companies, and cherry-picked the best ideas. They had their fans sign onto factions as well... which always struck me as odd, considering it was an RPG, not an 'army' game. But whatever... it seemed to have worked for them (nothing generates better buzz then an internet community going at each other with "my sides better then YOUR side!").
So a few years later, here comes WotC limping-along after the 4e fiasco (or as I like to think of it, "Perkins' Folly"), and they are desperately trying to accomplish what Paizo did. Except Paizo did it first, and did it better. The WotC 'factions' thing just falls flat. Perhaps if they had a few designers left over there who could actually DESIGN it would have worked, but alas, all the 'brightest & best' have absconded for greener pastures long ago. They have a few bright spots every now and then, but most it falls into this 'more of the same' category we are talking about here (Cultists, and all those other directions they've gone-in the past few years. Rise of the Underdark, anyone? How the hell could they have made a drow storyline lame? 
As for those cultists... "Its a trap!" (I just like saying that) 
You see, there is an unheard of power on the rise in The Realms, one that even the gods are unaware of: Cultishia, patron of divine schisms!!! Her portfolio allows her to draw power where other gods falter - from their fractious churches! If she finds even just two people worshiping the same deity the same way, she'll whisper in one's ear, "you goddess is left-handed", and in the other, "your goddess is right-handed". Thus, for every religion there are dozens of 'sects', and within those sects are untold 'factions', and within those factions are numerous 'cults', and within those cults are many 'cells'... all to the delight of Cultishia, goddess of disharmony and discontent. All hail the true 'queen of chaos', for she will lay-low those 'gods' who think they are so high and mighty. |
"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone
|
Edited by - Markustay on 21 Aug 2015 21:50:41 |
|
|
|
TBeholder
Great Reader
2384 Posts |
Posted - 21 Aug 2015 : 21:52:37
|
quote:
Originally posted by Shadowsoul
What is with Wizards and their fascination with cultists? Even the latest Hillsfar module, god awful, has cultists.
Hasbro. Remember "there's no such thing as Lawful Evil"? Or this?
Trying to push ideology that currently doesn't have credible "image of the enemy", and only a few lame nebulous substitutes.
Their other options are evil blunderbuss smugglers, terrorists without any articulate goals blowing up schools Cormyr for some reason opened in garrisons (churches are... a very double-edged option here, you understand) and Dwarven Patriarchy.
Evil Wizards that torture poor little rats and pollute vast areas with crap they made in a tiny laboratory were used, but they seems to be a little outdated now. |
People never wonder How the world goes round -Helloween
And even I make no pretense Of having more than common sense -R.W.Wood
It's not good, Eric. It's a gazebo. -Ed Whitchurch |
|
|
|
Caladan Brood
Senior Scribe
Norway
410 Posts |
Posted - 21 Aug 2015 : 21:55:46
|
Yeah the "factions" bugs me too. Reminds me of MMOs where you grind for faction rep. It becomes silly when every backwater town in the North has representatives of all five.
Once I get that Phandelver weekend going I won't have any NPCs be of a faction or at least not have them invite a random murder hobo into the ranks. |
|
|
|
Dargoth
Great Reader
Australia
4607 Posts |
Posted - 21 Aug 2015 : 23:27:28
|
quote:
Originally posted by George Krashos
I've struggled mightily with the "factions". Mightily.
-- George Krashos
We need a modern (read 5ed era) Lords of Darkness quite alot has changed since 1372.
The modern Zhentarim would be unrecognisable to some from 1372.
The Churches and Cyric and Shar should be exstremely curtailed (I wouldnt be suprised if theres Crusades/Inquisitions running against anyone who follows Shar or Cyric. In fact declaring yourself to be a Follower of Cyric or Shar is probably a quicker way to end up dead then yell outing that you support Al Qaeda at an NRA convention
Red Wizards of Thay like Zhentarim has changed from being a land of Evil Wizards to a Land of undead and the Thay enclaves have switched from being commerical enterprises to centres for residence against Tam.
The Shades have lost most of the Cities leadership along with their capital city and now look like they have fractured.
The Daemonfey have been more or less wiped out
The Arcane Brotherhood have been wiped out and then reborn as a more benevolent organisation.
The Drow have gone from multiple deities to one deity and back to multiple dieities in 120 year period. A large number of drwo cities where destoryed or badly damaged during the War of the Spider queen and not doubt more where destroyed during the Spellplague.
The Cult of the Dragon has gone from loosing its founder and principal leader along with alot dragons/dracolichs to a sub division of the Church of Tiamat.
The Church of Bane has gone from being a major player in the Western Moonsea to complete control of the western, eastern and southern shore to only controling the eastern end.
I dont rember much happaning with the following in 3ed/4ed (Maybe some of the authors used them in the 4ed era)
The Night Masks (This is the only Major Organization from LoD that has been significantly altered through events)
Beholders
The Eldreth Veluuthra
The Fire Knives
House Karanok (Apparently they calmed down alot when Mystra was Assasinated by Cyric)
The Iron throne
The Kir-Lanans
The Knights of the Shield
The Kraken Society
Malaugryms (There werent alot of them left even in 1372)
Mind Flayers
Monks of the Long death (I could see their Monastaries fracturing between Kelemvor, Bhaal, Mykrul and Cyric)
People of the Black Blood
The Rundeen
The Shadow thieves
The Twisted Rune
|
“I am the King of Rome, and above grammar”
Emperor Sigismund
"Its good to be the King!"
Mel Brooks |
|
|
|
Jeremy Grenemyer
Great Reader
USA
2717 Posts |
Posted - 22 Aug 2015 : 00:05:19
|
In addition:
The Flame Door
The Scourge of Corrupt Nobility
The Fael Threl
The Dread Hood
Servants of Oraunntar
Faithful of Xarlhoun
The House of the Black Tear
The Favored Tentacle
(Followers of) the Dread One
The Tharthrallyd (one of several such Illithid cabals).
etc...
We do need an update. |
Look for me and my content at EN World (user name: sanishiver). |
|
|
|
TBeholder
Great Reader
2384 Posts |
Posted - 22 Aug 2015 : 00:08:05
|
quote:
Originally posted by dazzlerdal
As for having too many layers, I don't believe that is ever a problem. To me the realms is so good because it is as complicated as real life, and since you can never know the truth about real life, then it stands to reason that the realms should be as complicated.
And even more to the point, crowd of mostly-local interests stepping on each other's toes is a feature of Realms if not from day one, then somewhere close.
quote:
Originally posted by Caladan Brood
Yeah the "factions" bugs me too. Reminds me of MMOs where you grind for faction rep. It becomes silly when every backwater town in the North has representatives of all five.
Mindlessly ripping off wowcraft is something of a hobby for corporate "managers" everywhere. |
People never wonder How the world goes round -Helloween
And even I make no pretense Of having more than common sense -R.W.Wood
It's not good, Eric. It's a gazebo. -Ed Whitchurch |
|
|
|
Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire
USA
15724 Posts |
Posted - 22 Aug 2015 : 01:07:30
|
quote:
Originally posted by Dargoth
The Iron throne <snip>
The Iron Throne came to an abrupt end in the final pages of the GHotR. I think it was like one sentence.  |
"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone
|
Edited by - Markustay on 22 Aug 2015 01:08:05 |
|
|
|
Dark Wizard
Senior Scribe
USA
830 Posts |
Posted - 22 Aug 2015 : 04:12:12
|
quote:
Originally posted by TBeholder
Mindlessly ripping off wowcraft is something of a hobby for corporate "managers" everywhere.
After the MMO Wars now all MMOs are WoW.
Seems we have lost some long-standing organizations, or at least lost touch with their activities and whereabouts.
C'mon, Wizards, let's get a 5E FRCS/CG ready to go. |
Edited by - Dark Wizard on 22 Aug 2015 04:14:33 |
|
|
|
Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36779 Posts |
Posted - 22 Aug 2015 : 05:30:18
|
Factions in games are older than D&D or any miniatures game still being played. Remember, D&D grew out of miniature war games -- and you have to have factions in those, whether it's the army of a real-world nation or a particular type of gang in a dystopian future or something fantasy-based and entirely fictitious.
Having factions isn't the problem.
It's how they're applied.
And the way WotC is applying them now is that they're acting like factions are nation-states in a heavily interconnected international milieu. These factions are acting more like real-world nations than the way groups (especially the more secretive ones) would act in a fantasy world. They're certainly not acting the way Ed envisioned them, or as they've been described in pre-4E lore. |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen! |
|
|
|
Cyrinishad
Learned Scribe
300 Posts |
Posted - 22 Aug 2015 : 15:39:38
|
It seems that I'm with everyone else in that I like the fact that they are making the organizations in the Realms relevant, but not liking the way the Faction mechanism is being applied. The mechanism as it stands in the organized play league seems very bland, and it seems a bit contrived to try and hook in the same handful of Factions into all of the plotlines.
I'm trying to figure out a way to change the way it works in my home campaign, since the PCs don't necessarily belong to a particular Faction. The group is essentially their own Faction, so I'm looking at ways to make accumulating Renown points relevant without exclusively using the Factions specified in the published Adventure series. |
To know, is to know that you know nothing. That is the meaning of true knowledge. -Socrates
Don't cry because it's over. Smile because it happened. -Dr. Seuss |
|
|
|
Gary Dallison
Great Reader
United Kingdom
6353 Posts |
|
|
Eltheron
Senior Scribe
740 Posts |
Posted - 22 Aug 2015 : 17:42:45
|
Factions aren't really derived from MMOs. If anything, factions originated in tabletop minis wargaming, which is what D&D evolved from. IN MMOs, they use a reputation-quartermaster system, where you gain reputation and then unlock various rewards you can purchase from the faction quartermaster.
I don't mind the use of factions in D&D, but one significant problem with how they're implemented gives players the impression that each faction is somehow an "equal power" to the others, or a different political side. In the Realms, traditionally a lot of these factions would have overlapping goals or even use the same methods. And more than that, I'd never ever consider the Harpers as a politically equal or "power equal" to the Zhentarim or a Thayvian Enclave. As they're implemented, you never get to see the unique traits, methods, ideaology, or power structures of each faction. How the Harpers are "built" and organized, not to mention how they act on the subtle manipulation vs. directness scale, is extremely different than something like the Zhentarim.
I agree with the person who said that it can be utterly ridiculous going to a tiny outback Realms village like Conyberry and BOOM the Thayvians, the Harpers, the Lords' Alliance, the Netherese, the Many-Arrows Orcs, and Drow are ALL there with deep interests in the village. It's just plain dumb from a lore standpoint. But WotC doesn't present them this way because they're copying an MMO, they do it because of the nature of the Encounters/RPGA system and what it needs and requires for players.
Honestly, it's not an MMO problem. Lore enthusiasts (and anyone wanting depth) will be at odds so long as WotC favors the Encounters/RPGA weekly gaming store model - or tournament play.
|
"The very best possible post-fourteenth-century Realms lets down those who love the specific, detailed social, political and magical situation, with its thousands of characters, developed over forty years, and want to learn more about it; and those who'd be open to a new one with equal depth, which there just isn't time to re-produce; and those repelled, some past the point of no return, by the bad-taste-and-plausibility gap of things done to the world when its guardianship was less careful."
--Faraer |
Edited by - Eltheron on 22 Aug 2015 17:47:10 |
|
|
|
Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36779 Posts |
Posted - 22 Aug 2015 : 18:03:20
|
| And in addition to the power groups named by Dargoth and Jeremy, there are also lone mages, churches, merchant groups, nobility, and in some cities, guilds, all adding to any particular mix of activity in a particular area. The faction system also ignores those. |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen! |
|
|
|
Gary Dallison
Great Reader
United Kingdom
6353 Posts |
|
|
Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire
USA
15724 Posts |
Posted - 22 Aug 2015 : 19:25:55
|
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
And in addition to the power groups named by Dargoth and Jeremy, there are also lone mages, churches, merchant groups, nobility, and in some cities, guilds, all adding to any particular mix of activity in a particular area. The faction system also ignores those.
We are back to the 'layers' thing, which seems to be a bit too complicated in the 4e/5e D&D universe.
You have your local groups/powerful individuals, that operate within just a town (or a Dale), then you have your regional groups/individuals, which have some power with an entire nation or more, and then you have the setting-wide groups/individuals, some of which are these new 'factions'. They only seem to care about those monolithic, Realms-wide organizations (and not even individuals - they just ignore guys like Halster, Aumvor, and Larloch).
In most instances the more local the group, the less powerful, and thus the larger groups can infringe on their territories... but not always. Some localized groups prefer it that way - near their POWER CENTER - and even the larger groups don't dare cross them in their 'home territory'.
So it was an immensely complicated tapestry of intrigues Ed wove for us.
Now, its just a polyester blouse. No 'special care' required.  |
"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone
|
|
|
|
Eltheron
Senior Scribe
740 Posts |
Posted - 22 Aug 2015 : 21:37:02
|
quote:
Originally posted by dazzlerdal
I agree factions are older than mmos but WoTC is not emulating the old war games it is trying to emulate modern digital entertainment forms that have been popular for the last five years, and that is mmos.
I wouldn't be surprised to see in the new adventurers guide a new reputation system where you get rewards for killing ever greater numbers of enemies from opposing factions (assuming they haven't done that already, I wouldn't know I don't buy the new stuff)
Except that they're not the same, other than the name "faction".
The whole "it's MMO stuff" is really just plain wrong (and comes out of 4E bashing that compared the core game mechanics to MMO mechanics). It's something people say when they want to bash on D&D, but if you really understand how factions work in MMOs vs how factions work in D&D, they're more dissimilar than they are similar.
In an MMO, like WoW, factions are essentially daily quest hubs. You repeat the same thing over and over and over and doing so you get "reputation" with said faction. You never join a faction, you just get points with them for doing highly repetitive things (like killing thousands of the same enemies, over and over). At certain critical points, you can purchase better and better equipment or toys or mounts based on your level of reputation. It's massively repetitive, and provides ZERO advancement to the story.
In D&D, you most often JOIN the faction and your reputation increases are based on fulfilling various story/adventure requirements. The story advances partly based on which factions you're working for. You will get quests, but they're targeted (not repetitive). As time goes on, you learn more of your faction's secrets (which never happens in MMO factions), you meet higher-ups in the organization (which also never happens in MMO factions), and you main gain in rank or renown which impresses NPCs in the organization (also never happens in MMO factions). You may get access to special equipment or potions once you're higher up, or perhaps a discount, but this isn't always the case in D&D - whereas it's the ONLY purpose of a faction in MMOs.
It's only similar on a surface level.
|
"The very best possible post-fourteenth-century Realms lets down those who love the specific, detailed social, political and magical situation, with its thousands of characters, developed over forty years, and want to learn more about it; and those who'd be open to a new one with equal depth, which there just isn't time to re-produce; and those repelled, some past the point of no return, by the bad-taste-and-plausibility gap of things done to the world when its guardianship was less careful."
--Faraer |
|
|
|
Eltheron
Senior Scribe
740 Posts |
Posted - 22 Aug 2015 : 21:44:32
|
quote:
Originally posted by Markustay
So it was an immensely complicated tapestry of intrigues Ed wove for us.
Now, its just a polyester blouse. No 'special care' required.
I'm sorry, but haven't you been the person (for several years now) who regularly and consistently advocated accepting the Realms in any form WotC chooses to publish?
I mean, frankly, it looks like you got exactly what you paid for, so it seems a little too late for you to complain and lament about it now.
You reap what you sow.
|
"The very best possible post-fourteenth-century Realms lets down those who love the specific, detailed social, political and magical situation, with its thousands of characters, developed over forty years, and want to learn more about it; and those who'd be open to a new one with equal depth, which there just isn't time to re-produce; and those repelled, some past the point of no return, by the bad-taste-and-plausibility gap of things done to the world when its guardianship was less careful."
--Faraer |
|
|
|
Jeremy Grenemyer
Great Reader
USA
2717 Posts |
Posted - 22 Aug 2015 : 23:26:00
|
Eltheron, don't be a dick.
What Mark has advocated for over the years is to see the bright side and to find the good. That's something I admire about him, particularly in an environment where it's so easy to give in to the negative and see everything in a bad light.
He's contributed mightily to our shared knowledge of the Realms, and he's done a lot openly and behind the scenes to help other Realms enthusiasts and freelancers.
That, and I consider him my friend.
Markus has his morose moments, sure, but that does not mean he deserves the personal criticism you just leveled his way. And even if he did, you don't have the forum respect necessary to do something like that.
And no, this isn't an invitation to a conversation with Mark, or myself, as the topic. So BACK OFF. |
Look for me and my content at EN World (user name: sanishiver). |
Edited by - Jeremy Grenemyer on 22 Aug 2015 23:27:57 |
|
|
|
Eltheron
Senior Scribe
740 Posts |
Posted - 23 Aug 2015 : 00:22:13
|
quote:
Originally posted by Jeremy Grenemyer
Eltheron, don't be a dick.
What Mark has advocated for over the years is to see the bright side and to find the good. That's something I admire about him, particularly in an environment where it's so easy to give in to the negative and see everything in a bad light.
He's contributed mightily to our shared knowledge of the Realms, and he's done a lot openly and behind the scenes to help other Realms enthusiasts and freelancers.
That, and I consider him my friend.
Markus has his morose moments, sure, but that does not mean he deserves the personal criticism you just leveled his way. And even if he did, you don't have the forum respect necessary to do something like that.
And no, this isn't an invitation to a conversation with Mark, or myself, as the topic. So BACK OFF.
The only thing more annoying than people bemoaning exactly what they asked for is having to listen to the board's self-appointed white knight try to defend them.
In any case, "backing off" from people like you has never been in my style, Mr. Miscellany.
My question to Markus was perfectly on topic. Here's why:
On this board in particular, MANY people have strongly advocated for continuing the Realms from 4E rather than doing a reboot of any kind. In so doing, they wanted a reversal of many of the features of 4E, such as the spellplague, earthmotes, spellscars, dead gods, and so on. The thing is, once that's started to happen, the blandness of what remains from 4E comes out.
This is what many people advocated for, quite strongly. Remember the multiple threads started by part-time designers (or others) where quite a few forum regulars stated over and over how this was going to be the best way to go forward? They shouted down re-boots of any kind, and so on.
Those same advocates don't get to complain now about what they advocated for over the past few years. They got what they asked for, but when the reality actually hit they didn't like this or that. Too bad, I say: you reap what you sow.
Bland evil cultists, re-imagined iconic adventure material, and a re-working of former organizations into factions for Encounters/RPGA-style gaming is exactly what should have been expected based on what they were asking WotC to give them in 5E.
|
"The very best possible post-fourteenth-century Realms lets down those who love the specific, detailed social, political and magical situation, with its thousands of characters, developed over forty years, and want to learn more about it; and those who'd be open to a new one with equal depth, which there just isn't time to re-produce; and those repelled, some past the point of no return, by the bad-taste-and-plausibility gap of things done to the world when its guardianship was less careful."
--Faraer |
Edited by - Eltheron on 23 Aug 2015 00:49:47 |
|
|
|
Jeremy Grenemyer
Great Reader
USA
2717 Posts |
Posted - 23 Aug 2015 : 01:38:52
|
quote:
Originally posted by Markustay
Now, its just a polyester blouse. No 'special care' required.
I wouldn't be so quick to discount what's been printed so far.
You know as well as I do the tapestry is still there, it's just not being focused on (yet).
We know that Brian Cortijo did work on the Sword Coast Adventures Guide, so let's see what we get in terms of lore on different cults, power groups and people of influence, beyond the whole faction business. |
Look for me and my content at EN World (user name: sanishiver). |
|
|
|
Irennan
Great Reader
Italy
3802 Posts |
Posted - 23 Aug 2015 : 02:10:49
|
quote:
Originally posted by Jeremy Grenemyer
We know that Brian Cortijo did work on the Sword Coast Adventures Guide, so let's see what we get in terms of lore on different cults, power groups and people of influence, beyond the whole faction business.
Yeah, I have high hopes for that book. Not expecting in-depth write ups, because of lack of space. However, I expect updates to the current era with meaningful info and plot hooks. At this point, that is what's most important for the setting in general, much of the metastory of the past and all its apocalypses should be left behind. |
Mathematics is the art of giving the same name to different things. |
Edited by - Irennan on 23 Aug 2015 02:13:12 |
|
|
|
Jeremy Grenemyer
Great Reader
USA
2717 Posts |
Posted - 23 Aug 2015 : 02:21:09
|
quote:
Originally posted by Irennan
Not expecting in-depth write ups, because of lack of space.
Agreed. But sometimes just the mention of a group--like a short list of five or ten with brief write ups--is enough to add spice to a campaign and give DMs a starting point to build something with. |
Look for me and my content at EN World (user name: sanishiver). |
|
|
|
Topic |
|
|
|
Would they please stop with the cultists?
