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Irennan
Great Reader
Italy
3802 Posts |
 Posted - 05 Apr 2015 : 23:59:13
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quote:
Originally posted by xaeyruudh
Regarding the magazines... even back when they were actually magazines we paid for an entire issue, including the stuff we didn't use. Nothing has changed (or probably will change) in that area.
I think it should be more palatable for sourcebooks and novels to be released electronically, because they're not assortments of articles on varied topics. Dragon magazine, back in the day, was crowded with advertisements and articles for stuff that wasn't even D&D related... useless to me, but I still had to buy it all in order to get what I wanted. This would be different. Each product (the 5e Cormyr book, or Waterdeep book, etc) is one product and you won't be paying for stuff you aren't interested in. (Of course, the "jacket" text synopsis that normally appears on the back of the book could be read before purchasing. But ultimately it's similar to buying a shrink-wrapped adventure from your FLGS back in the day, and the product would be better due to the benefits electronic products have for us.)
IMO, it is not comparable to the current situation, for 2 reasons.
1)correct me if I'm wrong, but Magazines are rather cheap (surely way cheaper than APs, which currently seem to be the new way to release updates on the Realms). Magazines are also way easier to use, since you can directly go to the article you want, instead of flipping though a book looking for some crumbs of info.
2)It is true that perhaps people might find lore they don't like in some sourcebooks (and thus not get 100% of their investment returned in material that they may want to use), but at least -if they look for lore- they can buy something focused on that, not a book that is mostly crunch or adventure encounters, with some random line of updates.
I would be fine if they started releasing updates in the form of digital regional/themed sources, or printed, or whatever (so you can buy only the lore on the stuff you intend to use, as you say), as long as they actually do it. |
Mathematics is the art of giving the same name to different things. |
Edited by - Irennan on 06 Apr 2015 00:02:46 |
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Delwa
Master of Realmslore
USA
1268 Posts |
Posted - 06 Apr 2015 : 00:17:30
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Most magazines I know cost around five to ten bucks an issue for a physical copy. Five bucks a month I would pay for, say, a digital Dungeon Magazine if I could keep a digital copy of the issue like they have in the past. But I do see the problem for people that don't run the current edition and only want the subscription for the one Realmslore magazine article that may or may not be in the issue. If you could buy a single issue, that'd soften things up a bit, but I still wouldn't want to pay five bucks for a single two or three page article. This was the model Dragon was following, if I remember right.
If they continue digital production like they did for the Scourge of the Sword Coast or Dead in Thay adventures, I think it'll be alright. $17.99 is a bit pricey for just an adventure, but I would pay that for a searchable sourcebook. The benefit of being able to search a digital book for a word or phrase for me would offset the fact that I don't have a physical tome to hold.
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- Delwa Aunglor
I am off to slay yon refrigerator and spoil it's horde. Go for the cheese, Boo!
"The Realms change; seldom at the speed desired of those who strive, but far too quickly for those who resist." - The Simbul, taken from the Forgotten Realms Campaign Conspectus |
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Irennan
Great Reader
Italy
3802 Posts |
Posted - 06 Apr 2015 : 00:30:47
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quote:
Originally posted by Delwa
Most magazines I know cost around five to ten bucks an issue for a physical copy. Five bucks a month I would pay for, say, a digital Dungeon Magazine if I could keep a digital copy of the issue like they have in the past. But I do see the problem for people that don't run the current edition and only want the subscription for the one Realmslore magazine article that may or may not be in the issue. If you could buy a single issue, that'd soften things up a bit, but I still wouldn't want to pay five bucks for a single two or three page article. This was the model Dragon was following, if I remember right.
Hm, I see the issue. But still, it would be better than we have now, because you didn't have to buy magazines and pay for stuff that you didn't want just to get the core info on the ''present'' Realms, you had a CS and sourcebooks for that. Now you have to pay for stuff that you don't want (if you don't wish to run the AP or don't play 5e) to get a (very) small part of the current state of the Realms |
Mathematics is the art of giving the same name to different things. |
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xaeyruudh
Master of Realmslore
USA
1853 Posts |
Posted - 06 Apr 2015 : 00:33:34
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quote:
Originally posted by Irennan
IMO, it is not comparable to the current situation, for 2 reasons.
Both totally valid. Magazines were much cheaper, so we "wasted" less money on the portion that we didn't use. Sourcebooks are far more focused on a topic than the adventure paths we've seen so far.
The current ratio of fluff to crunch in the adventure paths makes them a totally pitiful tool for exploring the Realms. One of these days I'll get around to indexing the Tyranny of Dragons, but I don't think I'll be pleased with the results.
But if they were done properly... our reaction to them would be better. The adventure path model is not necessarily a horrible choice of vehicle... it's just the fact that we're only getting a few crumbs of lore in exchange for a kinda huge investment of money and reading time. |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36779 Posts |
Posted - 06 Apr 2015 : 00:54:38
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quote:
Originally posted by xaeyruudh
Yea, it needs to be a thing where you only buy what you want, and I think it will be.
Regarding the magazines... even back when they were actually magazines we paid for an entire issue, including the stuff we didn't use. Nothing has changed (or probably will change) in that area.
Actually, the major difference is that with print magazines, it's not feasible to set things up so that people can only buy one or two articles and not the rest. With digital-only magazines, this is highly feasible -- especially with them releasing the content a little at a time.
Also, the digital content WotC was offering behind the paywall was more than just the (pale shadows of the print) magazines. It was an all-or-nothing price, giving access to other digital features, even if all you wanted was the one or two dribs and drabs of Realmslore. |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen!  |
Edited by - Wooly Rupert on 06 Apr 2015 00:57:05 |
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Delwa
Master of Realmslore
USA
1268 Posts |
Posted - 06 Apr 2015 : 00:56:55
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quote:
Originally posted by xaeyruudh
But if they were done properly... our reaction to them would be better. The adventure path model is not necessarily a horrible choice of vehicle... it's just the fact that we're only getting a few crumbs of lore in exchange for a kinda huge investment of money and reading time.
This. If they did things like Murder in Baldur's Gate, I'd be ok with it. MiBG had two books, a Campaign Book and an Adventure Book.
The Campaign Book was kinda a Volo's Guide to Baldur's Gate. Who's who, how the city government ran, what shops were where and the quality of what they sold, etc. The adventure book was just that.
Even if they did a decent sized appendix of relevant lore to the adventure path, I'd be happier than with it scattered in tidbits throughout. |
- Delwa Aunglor
I am off to slay yon refrigerator and spoil it's horde. Go for the cheese, Boo!
"The Realms change; seldom at the speed desired of those who strive, but far too quickly for those who resist." - The Simbul, taken from the Forgotten Realms Campaign Conspectus |
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Delwa
Master of Realmslore
USA
1268 Posts |
Posted - 06 Apr 2015 : 01:01:07
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quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
[quote]Originally posted by xaeyruudh
Also, the digital content WotC was offering behind the paywall was more than just the (pale shadows of the print) magazines. It was an all-or-nothing price, giving access to other digital features, even if all you wanted was the one or two dribs and drabs of Realmslore.
That, I could get back onboard with. I had been debating subscribing since the Sundering announcement when I found out they were shutting it down. Having lore that I'd actually use was going to make it worthwhile for me.
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- Delwa Aunglor
I am off to slay yon refrigerator and spoil it's horde. Go for the cheese, Boo!
"The Realms change; seldom at the speed desired of those who strive, but far too quickly for those who resist." - The Simbul, taken from the Forgotten Realms Campaign Conspectus |
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xaeyruudh
Master of Realmslore
USA
1853 Posts |
Posted - 06 Apr 2015 : 01:12:03
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Wooly: wow, that is lame. My last Dragon and Dungeon purchases were the last issues of the paper magazines. I never got involved with D&D Insider, or knew their pricing scheme. I just assumed it was still a subscription to the magazines themselves. Bummer.
Delwa: that sounds brilliant; that'd be one great way of doing it. I was just aiming for having the adventure focused more on exploring the Realms, and describing each area in the adventure so that there's actual Realmslore beyond just the couple of names dropped in Hoard of the Dragon Queen. All the more damning to get it so wrong after recently getting it right.
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Edited by - xaeyruudh on 06 Apr 2015 01:13:01 |
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Delwa
Master of Realmslore
USA
1268 Posts |
Posted - 06 Apr 2015 : 01:25:59
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quote:
Originally posted by xaeyruudh
Delwa: that sounds brilliant; that'd be one great way of doing it. I was just aiming for having the adventure focused more on exploring the Realms, and describing each area in the adventure so that there's actual Realmslore beyond just the couple of names dropped in Hoard of the Dragon Queen. All the more damning to get it so wrong after recently getting it right.
My only complaint with the MiBG adventure was the packaging and the quality of the print. You had two thick magazines in the Campaign and the Adventure book, shrink-wrapped together with a laminated DM screen. The contents were great. But the magazine covers wear out too easily.
I don't understand why they didn't continue doing things that way. I can only guess that the adventure itself didn't sell that well. |
- Delwa Aunglor
I am off to slay yon refrigerator and spoil it's horde. Go for the cheese, Boo!
"The Realms change; seldom at the speed desired of those who strive, but far too quickly for those who resist." - The Simbul, taken from the Forgotten Realms Campaign Conspectus |
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xaeyruudh
Master of Realmslore
USA
1853 Posts |
Posted - 06 Apr 2015 : 02:10:36
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| I've heard a few people say that TSR lost a fortune making boxed sets. I've never believed them, but I can see how making a boxed set without the box would be cheaper. But surely they can do better than that... |
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Delwa
Master of Realmslore
USA
1268 Posts |
Posted - 06 Apr 2015 : 02:17:37
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Heck, the cardboard covers like Waterdeep and the North had would be fine for me. But honestly, I'd settle for the magazine covers if they'd just put more of that kind of content out.
I've just finished reading a review of the Elemental Evil adventure. It looks like it's going to be worth it for me to pick it up, but if you're not running 5E, you're still running into the problem of not enough bang for your buck. From what I read in the review (linked here if you're curious) it might be worth it for the generic lore ideas. I also like that they apparently included an appendix on how to fit the adventure into other worlds. But I've yet to hear anything about the amount of Realms-specific fluff is in it.
I like that most people agree that it's better than the Tyranny of Dragons adventures, but going forward I still want more than this trickle at some point. |
- Delwa Aunglor
I am off to slay yon refrigerator and spoil it's horde. Go for the cheese, Boo!
"The Realms change; seldom at the speed desired of those who strive, but far too quickly for those who resist." - The Simbul, taken from the Forgotten Realms Campaign Conspectus |
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Krafus
Learned Scribe
246 Posts |
Posted - 06 Apr 2015 : 14:07:43
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| Quite disappointed by this news, and it only reinforces my decision to steer clear of the Realms for now. When it comes to definitive information about a setting, I don't want to be "surprised," or to have to look up numerous sources in various media. I want a lot of reliable info from a single, easily accessible source - in short, a campaign setting book. The 3rd edition FRCS book was IMO one of the very best products ever published by Wizards. Having a similar product of comparable quality for 5th edition would at least be a balm over the wound of the steep reduction of new novels. |
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Shadowsoul
Senior Scribe
Ireland
705 Posts |
Posted - 07 Apr 2015 : 14:38:31
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When I look at the current state of things, all I can really do is just scratch my head because things are all over the shop.
Let's look at a few things:
1: Who exactly is their target audience? Well it doesn't really seem to be new people because the entry level into the game has increased. They've focused the game around the Forgotten Realms which then leaves new people to have to search for lore through old products, play the god awful Neverwinter game, and play through those horrible AP's. If I was new to the game I would say the hell with this and find another hobby. We can't say it's the returning crowd because just take a step back and look at everything. Bare bones product support is not really going to make the returning crowd happy.
2: Solid starting point. Nonexistent. I mean go and look at their website. It's colourful but by god is it a pain in the face to navigate. It's a big colourful mess that probably turns more people away than it does attract them. Why in Christ's name can they not have a functioning website like Paizo? Sure Paizo's site isn't all colourful but it get's the job done and done well.
When I look at the current state of things, you would think Wizards was a fledgling company that has never dealt with an RPG before. They clearly don't have a structured layout to this game and I believe we are seeing another failure in the making, except this time it isn't the rules. |
“Fantasy is escapist, and that is its glory. If a soldier is imprisioned by the enemy, don't we consider it his duty to escape?. . .If we value the freedom of mind and soul, if we're partisans of liberty, then it's our plain duty to escape, and to take as many people with us as we can!”
#8213; J.R.R. Tolkien
*I endorse everything Dark Wizard says*. |
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ZeshinX
Learned Scribe
Canada
210 Posts |
Posted - 07 Apr 2015 : 18:13:21
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What I think we're seeing with WotC/D&D 5e is a half-arsed approach. Frankly, everything so far tells me they have given up and admitted they are no longer the top dog of tabletop gaming. Paizo is. I think they know this, but rather than admit as much, they've simply walked away leaving their token effort, half-hearted tabletop game and simply started looking at D&D as a brand to develop everywhere but tabletop gaming (but even in that endeavour they seem to be failing, or have grossly over-estimated the value of the D&D brand).
Damn shame really, since the core mechanics of 5e are a rather nice chassis to build on. I abandoned D&D with 4e and 5e was ready to bring me back into the fold once again....but not anymore. |
"...because despite the best advice of those who know what they are talking about, other people insist on doing the most massively stupid things."
-Galen, technomage |
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Matt James
Forgotten Realms Game Designer
USA
918 Posts |
Posted - 08 Apr 2015 : 00:34:17
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quote:
Originally posted by ZeshinX
What I think we're seeing with WotC/D&D 5e is a half-arsed approach. Frankly, everything so far tells me they have given up and admitted they are no longer the top dog of tabletop gaming. Paizo is. I think they know this, but rather than admit as much, they've simply walked away leaving their token effort, half-hearted tabletop game and simply started looking at D&D as a brand to develop everywhere but tabletop gaming (but even in that endeavour they seem to be failing, or have grossly over-estimated the value of the D&D brand).
Damn shame really, since the core mechanics of 5e are a rather nice chassis to build on. I abandoned D&D with 4e and 5e was ready to bring me back into the fold once again....but not anymore.
It's not a matter of giving up. It wasn't a competition to begin with. Hasbro is not interested in tabletop roleplaying games. Their eyes are on the prize. That prize is the D&D brand. |
Edited by - Matt James on 08 Apr 2015 00:34:40 |
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Kentinal
Great Reader
4685 Posts |
Posted - 08 Apr 2015 : 01:20:07
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quote:
Originally posted by Matt James
quote:
Originally posted by ZeshinX
What I think we're seeing with WotC/D&D 5e is a half-arsed approach. Frankly, everything so far tells me they have given up and admitted they are no longer the top dog of tabletop gaming. Paizo is. I think they know this, but rather than admit as much, they've simply walked away leaving their token effort, half-hearted tabletop game and simply started looking at D&D as a brand to develop everywhere but tabletop gaming (but even in that endeavour they seem to be failing, or have grossly over-estimated the value of the D&D brand).
Damn shame really, since the core mechanics of 5e are a rather nice chassis to build on. I abandoned D&D with 4e and 5e was ready to bring me back into the fold once again....but not anymore.
It's not a matter of giving up. It wasn't a competition to begin with. Hasbro is not interested in tabletop roleplaying games. Their eyes are on the prize. That prize is the D&D brand.
So D&D movies and tea cups and shirts until all of us drop of old age?
The D&D Brand needs support to stay viable, which means at least some degree of maintenance. Maybe their model is working as it appears people that really appear not to like where the Editions have gone still are involved in discussions and some even buy novels.
Minimum expense calculated to result in best profit can work if the forecasts and results are the same.
All in all the Brand clearly needs to maintain appeal for continue revenue streams. |
"Small beings can have small wisdom," the dragon said. "And small wise beings are better than small fools. Listen: Wisdom is caring for afterwards."
"Caring for afterwards ...? Ker repeated this without understanding.
"After action, afterwards," the dragon said. "Choose the afterwards first, then the action. Fools choose action first."
"Judgement" copyright 2003 by Elizabeth Moon |
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BenN
Senior Scribe
Japan
382 Posts |
Posted - 08 Apr 2015 : 03:44:32
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| I wonder if some new lore will be released with the forthcoming Sword Cooast Legends CPRG. The developers are working closely with WoTC, it's set in Faerun, based on the 5e rules (with modifications), so I can imagine WoTC using this as a catalyst to generate interest in the table-top game as well. In other words, generating revenue from CPRG etc is the focus, and any additional revenue that results from the table-top game as a result is just icing on the cake. |
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Matt James
Forgotten Realms Game Designer
USA
918 Posts |
Posted - 09 Apr 2015 : 02:26:04
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quote:
Originally posted by Kentinal
quote:
Originally posted by Matt James
quote:
Originally posted by ZeshinX
What I think we're seeing with WotC/D&D 5e is a half-arsed approach. Frankly, everything so far tells me they have given up and admitted they are no longer the top dog of tabletop gaming. Paizo is. I think they know this, but rather than admit as much, they've simply walked away leaving their token effort, half-hearted tabletop game and simply started looking at D&D as a brand to develop everywhere but tabletop gaming (but even in that endeavour they seem to be failing, or have grossly over-estimated the value of the D&D brand).
Damn shame really, since the core mechanics of 5e are a rather nice chassis to build on. I abandoned D&D with 4e and 5e was ready to bring me back into the fold once again....but not anymore.
It's not a matter of giving up. It wasn't a competition to begin with. Hasbro is not interested in tabletop roleplaying games. Their eyes are on the prize. That prize is the D&D brand.
So D&D movies and tea cups and shirts until all of us drop of old age?
The D&D Brand needs support to stay viable, which means at least some degree of maintenance. Maybe their model is working as it appears people that really appear not to like where the Editions have gone still are involved in discussions and some even buy novels.
Minimum expense calculated to result in best profit can work if the forecasts and results are the same.
All in all the Brand clearly needs to maintain appeal for continue revenue streams.
I'm not suggesting I want to see it go this way. I'm suggesting this is how they're thinking. They want to move away from tabletop pen & paper games. Digital gaming and film licensing dwarfs all others. I played the last D&D MMO a good bit, and most everyone I played with had never played the tabletop RPG. Many knew D&D purely through NWN.
Those subscription numbers slayed anything the tabletop game produced. As far as novels, it's the similar. If the demand for novels was strong enough, more would be produced.
They're looking at metrics, trends, and processes. |
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CorellonsDevout
Great Reader
USA
2708 Posts |
Posted - 09 Apr 2015 : 02:44:15
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| Based on discussions here on Candlekeep, I would say the demand for more novels is pretty strong |
Sweet water and light laughter |
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Irennan
Great Reader
Italy
3802 Posts |
Posted - 09 Apr 2015 : 03:03:13
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Heh, I don't think that they consider our opinion as reliable data. If it were up to (many of) us, WotC would nearly only release FR books  |
Mathematics is the art of giving the same name to different things. |
Edited by - Irennan on 09 Apr 2015 03:04:11 |
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Shadowsoul
Senior Scribe
Ireland
705 Posts |
Posted - 09 Apr 2015 : 03:03:41
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quote:
Originally posted by Matt James
quote:
Originally posted by Kentinal
quote:
Originally posted by Matt James
quote:
Originally posted by ZeshinX
What I think we're seeing with WotC/D&D 5e is a half-arsed approach. Frankly, everything so far tells me they have given up and admitted they are no longer the top dog of tabletop gaming. Paizo is. I think they know this, but rather than admit as much, they've simply walked away leaving their token effort, half-hearted tabletop game and simply started looking at D&D as a brand to develop everywhere but tabletop gaming (but even in that endeavour they seem to be failing, or have grossly over-estimated the value of the D&D brand).
Damn shame really, since the core mechanics of 5e are a rather nice chassis to build on. I abandoned D&D with 4e and 5e was ready to bring me back into the fold once again....but not anymore.
It's not a matter of giving up. It wasn't a competition to begin with. Hasbro is not interested in tabletop roleplaying games. Their eyes are on the prize. That prize is the D&D brand.
So D&D movies and tea cups and shirts until all of us drop of old age?
The D&D Brand needs support to stay viable, which means at least some degree of maintenance. Maybe their model is working as it appears people that really appear not to like where the Editions have gone still are involved in discussions and some even buy novels.
Minimum expense calculated to result in best profit can work if the forecasts and results are the same.
All in all the Brand clearly needs to maintain appeal for continue revenue streams.
I'm not suggesting I want to see it go this way. I'm suggesting this is how they're thinking. They want to move away from tabletop pen & paper games. Digital gaming and film licensing dwarfs all others. I played the last D&D MMO a good bit, and most everyone I played with had never played the tabletop RPG. Many knew D&D purely through NWN.
Those subscription numbers slayed anything the tabletop game produced. As far as novels, it's the similar. If the demand for novels was strong enough, more would be produced.
They're looking at metrics, trends, and processes.
Sad really.
I always hate witnessing the downfall of something good because of greed. |
“Fantasy is escapist, and that is its glory. If a soldier is imprisioned by the enemy, don't we consider it his duty to escape?. . .If we value the freedom of mind and soul, if we're partisans of liberty, then it's our plain duty to escape, and to take as many people with us as we can!”
#8213; J.R.R. Tolkien
*I endorse everything Dark Wizard says*. |
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CorellonsDevout
Great Reader
USA
2708 Posts |
Posted - 09 Apr 2015 : 03:06:03
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quote:
Originally posted by Irennan
Heh, I don't think that they consider our opinion as reliable data. If it were up to (many of) us, WotC would nearly only release FR books
Lol true, we aren't necessarily reliable data, but my point was if WoTC/Hasbro/TSR or whoever looked around, they would find novels are in high demand. |
Sweet water and light laughter |
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xaeyruudh
Master of Realmslore
USA
1853 Posts |
Posted - 09 Apr 2015 : 15:27:57
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The "ouch" of the novels versus mmo subscriptions comparison is that there's no way novels can win. Back in the 2e/3e days, I'm sure WotC had thousands of customers buying novels, maybe even tens of thousands. But few/none bought every single novel that came out, because we're probably mostly fans of one or two worlds... meaning not all Realms fans bought Dark Sun novels, or Eberron novels. So a few thousand customers bought a novel or two every month, if there was ever two FR novels coming out every single months for an extended period.
Even if it was a couple hundred thousand fans, that's a drop in the bucket compared to the 11 million subscribers Blizzard had, paying 15 bucks a month (2 novels at current prices, 3 at old prices) every single month for several years. There's no competition. Blizzard may not have that many subscribers anymore, but that doesn't matter when the Powers That Be believe (and there's a strong case for believing) that 11 million+ people would still pay a monthly subscription fee for a product that "hit the spot" for them.
Even if they were publishing 5 Realms novels a month, right now, they wouldn't be selling 50 million books every month because D&D and FR novels probably don't have that kind of customer base. But they have reason to believe that MMOs have been shown to have those numbers.
Pretty effective argument for the industry evolving, and moving decisively away from books and novels.
I would argue that they don't need to (and shouldn't) move away from tabletop gaming and novels. Go ahead and make a good MMO; something that just KOs WoW. I'm not sure subscription fees are the right way to monetize it, but that's something for them to figure out with industry consultants. There's still a market for novels, and a tabletop RPG, on top of the MMO, and definitely on top of movies. These markets are so different from the MMO market that you'll have some overlap (meaning people who buy a combination or all of them) but they're not going to take revenue away from each other.
But like they used to say, you have to spend money to make money. And Hasbro has the experience to know where to get the information they need to make smart investments. So I still think the only reason Hasbro has defunded WotC is because WotC flubbed the 4e Realms so spectacularly that Hasbro is pondering putting someone else in charge of D&D. WotC is on probation, and as soon as they realize that selling a few copies of a $50 adventure path is inferior to selling much bigger numbers of cheaper books, they'll start getting back on track.
No rush though, as far as I'm concerned. I'm as eager as anyone to see new Realms books, but I'm having a grand time writing and converting my own 5e material and waiting to see what Ed's been up to. 
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Edited by - xaeyruudh on 09 Apr 2015 15:30:59 |
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Matt James
Forgotten Realms Game Designer
USA
918 Posts |
Posted - 09 Apr 2015 : 15:35:01
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quote:
Originally posted by CorellonsDevout
Based on discussions here on Candlekeep, I would say the demand for more novels is pretty strong
We are a niche within a niche. The demand isn't there.
Edited to add: we, as a community, need to find ways to adapt as well. Whether that means drumming up support for novels that tie to other media (FR MMOs, video gaming, et al.), or through other forms of media.
If the Realms will survive only through these emerging forms, we need to start focusing on those areas--and speak to continuity and flavor. We can't exclude content because it's not printed on paper. Does that make sense? |
Edited by - Matt James on 09 Apr 2015 15:37:52 |
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BenN
Senior Scribe
Japan
382 Posts |
Posted - 09 Apr 2015 : 16:22:31
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quote:
Originally posted by Matt James
quote:
Originally posted by CorellonsDevout
Based on discussions here on Candlekeep, I would say the demand for more novels is pretty strong
We are a niche within a niche. The demand isn't there.
Edited to add: we, as a community, need to find ways to adapt as well. Whether that means drumming up support for novels that tie to other media (FR MMOs, video gaming, et al.), or through other forms of media.
If the Realms will survive only through these emerging forms, we need to start focusing on those areas--and speak to continuity and flavor. We can't exclude content because it's not printed on paper. Does that make sense?
Hey Matt, I agree with you 100%.
For us long-time FR fans, I think we should think of ourselves as ambassadors, with a responsibility to introduce what we love to new people who only know the Realms from CRPGs etc. IMHO, enthusiasm for something has a substantially better perception than whinging about how things change. Adapt or wither. |
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ZeshinX
Learned Scribe
Canada
210 Posts |
Posted - 09 Apr 2015 : 20:17:33
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quote:
Originally posted by Matt James
quote:
Originally posted by CorellonsDevout
Based on discussions here on Candlekeep, I would say the demand for more novels is pretty strong
We are a niche within a niche. The demand isn't there.
Edited to add: we, as a community, need to find ways to adapt as well. Whether that means drumming up support for novels that tie to other media (FR MMOs, video gaming, et al.), or through other forms of media.
If the Realms will survive only through these emerging forms, we need to start focusing on those areas--and speak to continuity and flavor. We can't exclude content because it's not printed on paper. Does that make sense?
It makes sense. I won't support a model I don't feel fits our niche within a niche well though, nor will I act as cheerleader for it either.
I'll wish for their continued success and hope they get want they want with their new model(s), and that those willing to change/evolve/accept along with it get the same amount of joy and entertainment I did when it was a model I was more than happy to support.
I'll still keep my eyes open and buy any product I might get use out of, but I'll offer no active support beyond that for their current direction. |
"...because despite the best advice of those who know what they are talking about, other people insist on doing the most massively stupid things."
-Galen, technomage |
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CorellonsDevout
Great Reader
USA
2708 Posts |
Posted - 09 Apr 2015 : 22:59:11
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quote:
Originally posted by Matt James
quote:
Originally posted by CorellonsDevout
Based on discussions here on Candlekeep, I would say the demand for more novels is pretty strong
We are a niche within a niche. The demand isn't there.
Edited to add: we, as a community, need to find ways to adapt as well. Whether that means drumming up support for novels that tie to other media (FR MMOs, video gaming, et al.), or through other forms of media.
If the Realms will survive only through these emerging forms, we need to start focusing on those areas--and speak to continuity and flavor. We can't exclude content because it's not printed on paper. Does that make sense?
It makes sense, and I wouldn't mind so long as the new formats (say pdfs) are readily available |
Sweet water and light laughter |
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hobbitfan
Learned Scribe
USA
164 Posts |
Posted - 10 Apr 2015 : 01:27:11
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I see your point Matt. We probably will have to get used to new way of doing things.
The thing is WOTC isn't isn't communicating what they want to do or how they want to do it. Just that it might be different. That's not informative. That's cryptic.
It's frustrating enough that I might just give up the Realms for a bit. I've been trying to figure out what's going on since the Sundering when I came back to these forums. I am none the wiser.
When I try to ask the WOTC D&D team an earnest, honest question they ignore me yet they can joke around and answer silly rules questions. Yet they can't be bothered to talk about settings or future game plans.
edit: I apologize for how negative this post sounds. Too bummed to edit it into anything more coherent. |
Edited by - hobbitfan on 10 Apr 2015 02:11:42 |
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Shadowsoul
Senior Scribe
Ireland
705 Posts |
Posted - 10 Apr 2015 : 03:16:49
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quote:
Originally posted by hobbitfan
I see your point Matt. We probably will have to get used to new way of doing things.
The thing is WOTC isn't isn't communicating what they want to do or how they want to do it. Just that it might be different. That's not informative. That's cryptic.
It's frustrating enough that I might just give up the Realms for a bit. I've been trying to figure out what's going on since the Sundering when I came back to these forums. I am none the wiser.
When I try to ask the WOTC D&D team an earnest, honest question they ignore me yet they can joke around and answer silly rules questions. Yet they can't be bothered to talk about settings or future game plans.
edit: I apologize for how negative this post sounds. Too bummed to edit it into anything more coherent.
Wizards sucks is all I can say.
We get a set of fantastic rules but their strategy is something out of WTF land.
I mean it's actually a bit funny that they actually think their plan is actually going to work. |
“Fantasy is escapist, and that is its glory. If a soldier is imprisioned by the enemy, don't we consider it his duty to escape?. . .If we value the freedom of mind and soul, if we're partisans of liberty, then it's our plain duty to escape, and to take as many people with us as we can!”
#8213; J.R.R. Tolkien
*I endorse everything Dark Wizard says*. |
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Shadowsoul
Senior Scribe
Ireland
705 Posts |
Posted - 10 Apr 2015 : 03:19:50
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| Please someone tell me this isn't what got Ed so excited. |
“Fantasy is escapist, and that is its glory. If a soldier is imprisioned by the enemy, don't we consider it his duty to escape?. . .If we value the freedom of mind and soul, if we're partisans of liberty, then it's our plain duty to escape, and to take as many people with us as we can!”
#8213; J.R.R. Tolkien
*I endorse everything Dark Wizard says*. |
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