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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
Moderator

USA
29992 Posts

Posted - 13 Nov 2015 :  05:39:41  Show Profile Send Wooly Rupert a Private Message
It's always bugged me (pun not intended) that for the drow, being made to resemble their chief goddess is considered a punishment. It's blasphemy to even step on a spider, so how is being made to look like one a punishment and not an honor?

Here's an older idea of mine, shared here a couple years back:

The other day, I thought of a way around the insane/bloodthirsty bit, for driders...

A traitor-priestess.

So you've got this traitor-priestess we'll call Eredrina. No meaning to the name, just pulled it out of thin air.

Eredrina serves Lolth openly, and Vhaeraun secretly, for those unfamiliar with the traitor-priestess concept. She is one day involved with (or does it by herself) the ritual to turn a drow into a drider. With intimate knowledge of the process and more than a little assistance from Vhaeraun, she figures out a way to do it that allows the drider to retain his prior personality. The new drider (we'll call him Peiter ) becomes a priest of Vhaeraun, and he learns that same altered ritual... Give it a few centuries, and you've got a growing population of intelligent, reasoning driders, capable of increasing their numbers.

Or, for a simpler alternative -- a ritual that restores the original personality of a drider. Either way, you get the same end result.

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The Masked Mage
Master of Realmslore

USA
1358 Posts

Posted - 13 Nov 2015 :  06:06:12  Show Profile  Send The Masked Mage an AOL message  Click to see The Masked Mage's MSN Messenger address Send The Masked Mage a Private Message
The idea behind the punishment was, originally, that being made a drider did not only change your appearance but also your identity. They were bound physically, mentally and spiritually to the queen of spiders. A drider could never become a priest of Vhaerun back then. It would be like a yochlol going and serving him.

More recently, such "abominations" have been changed within novels and in potential rpg to keep their original personality and mind, so the only punishment is deformity.
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Wrigley
Senior Scribe

Czech Republic
418 Posts

Posted - 13 Nov 2015 :  18:42:37  Show Profile  Visit Wrigley's Homepage Send Wrigley a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert

It's always bugged me (pun not intended) that for the drow, being made to resemble their chief goddess is considered a punishment. It's blasphemy to even step on a spider, so how is being made to look like one a punishment and not an honor?

Here's an older idea of mine, shared here a couple years back:

The other day, I thought of a way around the insane/bloodthirsty bit, for driders...

A traitor-priestess.

So you've got this traitor-priestess we'll call Eredrina. No meaning to the name, just pulled it out of thin air.

Eredrina serves Lolth openly, and Vhaeraun secretly, for those unfamiliar with the traitor-priestess concept. She is one day involved with (or does it by herself) the ritual to turn a drow into a drider. With intimate knowledge of the process and more than a little assistance from Vhaeraun, she figures out a way to do it that allows the drider to retain his prior personality. The new drider (we'll call him Peiter ) becomes a priest of Vhaeraun, and he learns that same altered ritual... Give it a few centuries, and you've got a growing population of intelligent, reasoning driders, capable of increasing their numbers.

Or, for a simpler alternative -- a ritual that restores the original personality of a drider. Either way, you get the same end result.


Lolth is chaotic, evil and cruel. Drow's had to find out how to venerate her during crown wars and it seems some misconceptions are still there in many cities. You became drider after the failure in Test of Lolth. In my point of view it is just another test of your loyality which almost all failed. As you have to be pretty powerful (5.level) to be noticed by Her and tried and you can become drider only if you failed to kill your opponent (former close one) but still lives. You recieve new powers and abilities, your form changes to Lolth likness and only thing that is wrong with you is your refusal by others in your city (possibly also Lolth not answering your preyers but that can happen on whim normaly). I believe that if you prove your supremancy and cunning you will find out that Lolth has not forsaken you.
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Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire

USA
13557 Posts

Posted - 13 Nov 2015 :  18:42:59  Show Profile Send Markustay a Private Message
Well, I don't think Araushnee was too happy with looking like a spider either - I always took that as part of her punishement when she became a demon (queen).

Thus, carrying forward, any of her followers that annoyed her will meet with something she herself had as punishment.

As for the whole 'the spider form is scared', I think that falls under the heading of 'church dogma', and is just something that happened over time. We can see in some of the early parts of Elaine's Evermeet novel that early form of worship of 'Drow gods' was VERY different then it is today, and we even still have some ancient evidence of that (I forget the name of that place, and what book it was in - Azulmult, or some-such?)

And since I've always found that 'mortal belief affects reality', and gods themselves change because of their own religions, it makes some sense that Lolth now follows the church dogma about spiders, whether that was her idea or not.

At least, thats how I see it within the canon. I don't really use any of that - as far as I am concerned, IMG being a Drider is reward, but thats homebrew. My own 'Misbegotten Realms' is very little like the canon one.

"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone


Edited by - Markustay on 13 Nov 2015 18:43:41
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Delwa
Master of Realmslore

USA
1213 Posts

Posted - 13 Nov 2015 :  19:48:53  Show Profile  Visit Delwa's Homepage Send Delwa a Private Message
Could it be that Lolth sees being made into a Drider as a punishment because she herself was basically turned into one by Corellon? If I recall, she was considered very beautiful before she was cursed. Gaining a deformity like that probably cuts deep into her ego. And maybe she reveres spiders because they are beautiful by themselves, in a way. Her humanoid form is beautiful, but in a different way. However, the half breed blend ruins the beauty of both. Maybe?

- Delwa Aunglor of Tangled Trees
I am off to slay yon refrigerator and spoil it's horde. Go for the cheese, Boo!

"The Realms change; seldom at the speed desired of those who strive, but far too quickly for those who resist." - The Simbul, taken from the Forgotten Realms Campaign Conspectus

My Forging the Realms Archives (Google Drive pdfs)
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Eilserus
Master of Realmslore

USA
1361 Posts

Posted - 13 Nov 2015 :  20:18:46  Show Profile Send Eilserus a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by George Krashos

How about a drow city ruled by a council of drider? The "Orborthae" (sacred spiders) enslaved the matron mothers of their city centuries ago and control them by means of a venom that each female is exposed to at birth and which is only kept in abeyance by an antidote known only to the driders (and involving their blood). Drider form is not seen as a curse, but rather a blessing of Lolth, and all males strive to attain drider form and join the ruling elite. The Orborthae dictate who is to be transformed and when and use the Ustilhar (as the female clerics of the city are known) to effect the transformation.

The "House" system has been debased to reflect groupings surrounding one or more drider, and as is traditional, there is much vicious infighting. Each drider or group of drider have their stable of female priestesses of Lolth and every female is examined for that talent. However the city is not as sophisticated as a traditional Lolthite drow city, and there are open challenges between drider and constant warring and assassinations. Because the drow females do not control the city, there is no check or control on breeding and each drider group fosters and promotes key male drow (who hope to be elevated) as one would use stud cattle.

Lolth revels in the unabashed chaos of the city, provides spells for the females (and even some rare males!) and has "blessed" the city with occasional drider variants of greater power (like Jarlaere "the Twice-Fanged": a massive two headed drider or Arblis "of the Blades": a devilishly swift four-armed drider who wields two swords and two axes and has armoured blades attached to his legs).

-- George Krashos



This is a pretty cool idea George and definitely like it. If the drider use the female priestesses for the transformation, I take it they most likely don't progress in higher level from when they were transformed or very rarely at all due to Lolth's will otherwise they'd perform the transformation process themselves (the ones that are transformed priests)? Would there be drider high priestesses, snakes whips and all? Unless Lolth won't allow drider to cast such spells and the reason behind keeping the female priestesses. Which would make for a kind of nice dirty secret behind the "honored" females who get to do the deed themselves on behalf of the drider council that can't be "bothered" to do it.

Alot to think about and play with. Thank you again sir!
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Eilserus
Master of Realmslore

USA
1361 Posts

Posted - 13 Nov 2015 :  20:21:48  Show Profile Send Eilserus a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by Wrigley

quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert

It's always bugged me (pun not intended) that for the drow, being made to resemble their chief goddess is considered a punishment. It's blasphemy to even step on a spider, so how is being made to look like one a punishment and not an honor?

Here's an older idea of mine, shared here a couple years back:

The other day, I thought of a way around the insane/bloodthirsty bit, for driders...

A traitor-priestess.

So you've got this traitor-priestess we'll call Eredrina. No meaning to the name, just pulled it out of thin air.

Eredrina serves Lolth openly, and Vhaeraun secretly, for those unfamiliar with the traitor-priestess concept. She is one day involved with (or does it by herself) the ritual to turn a drow into a drider. With intimate knowledge of the process and more than a little assistance from Vhaeraun, she figures out a way to do it that allows the drider to retain his prior personality. The new drider (we'll call him Peiter ) becomes a priest of Vhaeraun, and he learns that same altered ritual... Give it a few centuries, and you've got a growing population of intelligent, reasoning driders, capable of increasing their numbers.

Or, for a simpler alternative -- a ritual that restores the original personality of a drider. Either way, you get the same end result.


Lolth is chaotic, evil and cruel. Drow's had to find out how to venerate her during crown wars and it seems some misconceptions are still there in many cities. You became drider after the failure in Test of Lolth. In my point of view it is just another test of your loyality which almost all failed. As you have to be pretty powerful (5.level) to be noticed by Her and tried and you can become drider only if you failed to kill your opponent (former close one) but still lives. You recieve new powers and abilities, your form changes to Lolth likness and only thing that is wrong with you is your refusal by others in your city (possibly also Lolth not answering your preyers but that can happen on whim normaly). I believe that if you prove your supremancy and cunning you will find out that Lolth has not forsaken you.



Makes sense. I was skimming through Servant of the Shard a few nights ago and it stated: "drow don't test for loyalty because they expect none."

It'd be hard to pass a test when you don't really know what loyalty is in the first place, beyond basic survival that is.
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Evrat
Seeker

France
42 Posts

Posted - 13 Nov 2015 :  20:37:01  Show Profile Send Evrat a Private Message
Hi I have a question on a old novel : Cormyr

How was the king Draxius (and his previous identities...) ? A good King ? A Despote ? May some one knows about his secret and true identity (after the 1er Wizard of course) ?
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The Hooded One
Lady Herald of Realmslore

5037 Posts

Posted - 14 Nov 2015 :  04:44:15  Show Profile  Visit The Hooded One's Homepage Send The Hooded One a Private Message
Hi again, all. It's timely you've been discussing drow here, because Ed just handed me a reply for Zoe Bragg-Carbajales, regarding Eilistraee's "stats" as The Masked Lady.
Heeeere's Ed:

Hi, Zoe. First off, this is all unofficial. Yes, it comes from me, the creator of the Realms (including Eilistraee, Vhaeraun, and Mystra), but the first sentence below is there for good reasons…

Mortals in the Realms can rarely know the doings and specifics of the gods with certainty, because clergies and even the gods themselves sometimes avoid the truth, or the whole truth, or slant what they say so much. So it is with the “deaths” of Eilistraee and Vhaeraun. Vhaeraun entered Eilistraee’s realm and sought to destroy her, but perished there by her hand, and she subsumed his portfolios—or so the story spread among drow. Most assumed that meant she became the drow deity of thievery, but in truth, Eilistraee (who pronounces her own name “AISLE-iss-try-ee,” by the way) defeated Vhaeraun with Mystra’s indirect aid [Mystra IS the Weave, and it was the Weave that frustrated and drank Vhaeraun’s magics, but augmented those of Eilistraee] but did not slay her brother. Rather, she trapped his sentience within the Weave, leaving him in an “endless dream” engineered by Mystra, who enfolded him. In this dream, Mystra slowly convinced Vhaeraun to cooperate in a pact with herself and Eilistraee so that they could all survive what was to come: the Sundering, wherein both Eilistraee and Mystra would be “slain,” magic would go wild, and the worlds of Abeir and Toril would pass through each other and then be sundered.

Eilistraee emerged from her battle with her brother as The Masked Lady, and fulfilled her own portfolios of song, beauty, dance, swordwork, hunting, moonlight, and those of her brother, too: thievery, trickery, drow poisoners and poisons, drow males, and evil doings in the surface world. The death of Qilué Veladorn robbed her of some of her divine essence for a time (it leaked into the Weave, and only returned to her when Mystra herself recovered and could direct it back to its rightful home), but Eilistraee wasn’t slain, merely reduced to manifestations.

So from the end of 1375 to the summer of 1379, The Masked Lady has her “full” powers, and from late Flamerule of 1379 to the same month in 1489 DR, she is much reduced, being seen by mortals almost exclusively as her manifestation of a moving black mask outlined in a silver radiance and with two eyes of silver flame, that appears and silently guides (by pointing and touching and by imparting visions). After Flamerule 1489, Vhaeraun and Eilistraee are separate deities with the same powers and portfolios they had before 1375, but a new understanding, respect, and even friendship for each other. Some of their followers still war with each other, but the two deities do not. Thus far, Eilistraee’s teachings after the Sundering are the same as before the Sundering.

The Masked Lady: a 9-foot-tall long-legged, graceful, and dancing drow female surrounded by her constantly-swirling long tresses and a swirling black ankle-length cloak, her face always covered by a full-face mask. She has all the abilities, powers, and avatar specifics given in the 3e sourcebook FAITHS AND PANTHEONS, except that what she’s borrowed from Vhaeraun means her avatar does not lose her Extra Domain salient ability, and so retains all the things listed as being lost to her avatar on p25 of F&P. She carries the Moonsword, as noted, and the black cloak she gained from Vhaeraun acts as a second Moonsword (it can transform itself into one, and fly about to attack or aid her or others, as she wills, with her own movement rate and the best possible maneuverability) and can emit magical darkness as she wills, in extent and specifics, up to 90-foot-sphere about itself limits.

The Mask: an always-silent black full-face (brow to chin) mask that can absorb the energy of all spells into itself (including dispel magic) and be augmented thereby, and can heal or impart spells to mortals by touch. The mask can vary in size from as large as an adult drow’s fingernail to as large as huge castle gates, but is usually about double the size of a full-face mask a mortal adult drow might wear. It varies in visibility as Eilistraee wills, its silver radiance waxing or waning as she wills, and also in tangibility, from “not there” to velvety-soft to as hard as adamantine. As the Mask, Eilistraee never speaks, but can write words of fire in the mind of a mortal within 90 feet, and impart vivid and detailed mental visions (still images or “movies”) with the same range.

And there you have it. I hope this is of help in your campaign. As for the future, and Eilistraee? Well, I Do Have Plans...but we'll see. ;}


So saith Ed. Still spinning Realmslore daily, scribes!
love to all,
THO

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Irennan
Great Reader

Italy
2662 Posts

Posted - 14 Nov 2015 :  04:51:54  Show Profile Send Irennan a Private Message
Well, this is really interesting. I hope that it sneaks its way into canon Realmslore. Surely it is waaay better than ''The Sundering brought Eilistraee and Vhaeraun back''.

EDIT: I guess that this part:

''After Flamerule 1489, Vhaeraun and Eilistraee are separate deities with the same powers and portfolios they had before 1375, but a new understanding, respect, and even friendship for each other. Some of their followers still war with each other, but the two deities do not. Thus far, Eilistraee’s teachings after the Sundering are the same as before the Sundering.''

is canon, though, given the reply that Ed gave before?

EDIT2: removed lengthy quote, to avoid cluttering.

To all Facebook-using FR fans, you might be interested in checking out this page: https://www.facebook.com/groups/450517575051806/

Edited by - Irennan on 14 Nov 2015 18:09:42
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CorellonsDevout
Master of Realmslore

USA
1889 Posts

Posted - 14 Nov 2015 :  05:02:10  Show Profile  Send CorellonsDevout an AOL message Send CorellonsDevout a Private Message
Wow, thanks so much Ed and THO! That is very interesting, and the reference to Eilistraee and the Weave in Spellstorm makes even more sense now. It's good to see the two siblings not fighting so much anymore. I have always been fond of Vhaeraun and Eilistraee. It's good to see them both around again.

And I have been pronouncing her name wrong all this time lol.

So, since Eilistraee is still the Masked Lady, but she and Vhaeraun are now separate deities again, what exactly does this mean for Vhaeraun himself? You mentioned his portfolio is the same as it was befor his "death", but Eilistraee seems to still have some of his qualities. Any chance you could give some similar tidbits on him as well? I know you gave us a little (about him being him the endless dream), but now that he is awake again, so to speak, what's he up to? If Eilistraee can use a mask to appear before her followers, howdoes V communicate with his faithful?

Sweet water and light laughter
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Irennan
Great Reader

Italy
2662 Posts

Posted - 14 Nov 2015 :  05:05:27  Show Profile Send Irennan a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by CorellonsDevout

Wow, thanks so much Ed and THO! That is very interesting, and the reference to Eilistraee and the Weave in Spellstorm makes even more sense now. It's good to see the two siblings not fighting so much anymore. I have always been fond of Vhaeraun and Eilistraee. It's good to see them both around again.

And I have been pronouncing her name wrong all this time lol.

So, since Eilistraee is still the Masked Lady, but she and Vhaeraun are now separate deities again, what exactly does this mean for Vhaeraun himself? You mentioned his portfolio is the same as it was befor his "death", but Eilistraee seems to still have some of his qualities. Any chance you could give some similar tidbits on him as well? I know you gave us a little (about him being him the endless dream), but now that he is awake again, so to speak, what's he up to? If Eilistraee can use a mask to appear before her followers, howdoes V communicate with his faithful?



To my understanding Eilistraee was the ML till the 1489 DR, but now she no longer is. The writeup that Ed provided is in answer to a question specifically asking for the ML's stats.

To all Facebook-using FR fans, you might be interested in checking out this page: https://www.facebook.com/groups/450517575051806/
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CorellonsDevout
Master of Realmslore

USA
1889 Posts

Posted - 14 Nov 2015 :  05:09:24  Show Profile  Send CorellonsDevout an AOL message Send CorellonsDevout a Private Message
I figure it doesn't hurt to ask if similar stats can be provided for Vhaeraun. If she is no longer the ML, then ignore that part lol. It just sounded like she was.

Sweet water and light laughter
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Irennan
Great Reader

Italy
2662 Posts

Posted - 14 Nov 2015 :  05:13:44  Show Profile Send Irennan a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by CorellonsDevout

I figure it doesn't hurt to ask if similar stats can be provided for Vhaeraun. If she is no longer the ML, then ignore that part lol. It just sounded like she was.



It seems so to me, since the answer was to a question explictly asking for the ML's stats. Either way, yes, I would like to know more about Vhaeraun's dream, or what happened to Qilué, but that question was NDA a few months ago.

To all Facebook-using FR fans, you might be interested in checking out this page: https://www.facebook.com/groups/450517575051806/

Edited by - Irennan on 14 Nov 2015 05:28:57
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Bootravsky
Acolyte

USA
4 Posts

Posted - 14 Nov 2015 :  06:00:19  Show Profile Send Bootravsky a Private Message
Good evening, Mr. Greenwood and Lady THO!

I've been once again reading my battered copy of Forgotten Realms Adventures (for my money the best roleplaying book in existence), and a few questions cropped up:

First off, Tilverton is noted as having extensive deep and dark sewer systems. However, unlike many of the other cities, there is no apparent river or creek system in proximity to the city. What water source does the community use? Is this a city based on aquifers, or deep wells, or something? Aqueducts?

Moving on, Yhaunn, as a port town, obviously has pretty obvious docks and drydocks strung along the waterfonrt. Is the Stiltways located above a slough, or some other area of tidal inundation? Are the poorer residents a few blocks back from the waterfront subject to flooding during storm surges? Also, as Yhaunn is located in an old quarry, are there creeks that run down the perimeter to provide fresh water or for bathing?

Urmlaspyr, Yhaunn, and Westgate are roughly the same size, but the maps in FRA indicate that Urmlaspyr and Yhaunn have much tighter streets and smaller blocks. Does Westgate have larger streets through which mercenary armies may move with impunity? Yhaunn is definitely a tightly crowded community. Is this a matter where the castles of the merchant families of Westgate so dominant, that the poorer hovels are essentially transient and not marked on the maps?

Finally, I was reading through Lands of Intrigue,and was noting a peculiarity: there appears to be a disconnect between the maps and the apparent populations. Myratma and Zazesspur both have fairly simple road layouts, without the complexity of alleyways that would be expected. Was this a matter of cartographic simplification, or do cities along the southern Sword Coast simply have greater masses of humanity, with enormous tenement complexes?

Thank you for indulging my curiosity regarding the layout and structures of the Realms!
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Wrigley
Senior Scribe

Czech Republic
418 Posts

Posted - 14 Nov 2015 :  10:32:44  Show Profile  Visit Wrigley's Homepage Send Wrigley a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by The Hooded One

And I'd just like to tell all scribes that in your reply to Wrigley, you stated the "prophecies in the Realms aren't actually predestiny or unavoidable fate, but more after-the-fact interpretation" view perfectly, and it's what Ed believes/writes/designs...if the gods COULD control things perfectly, there'd be no heroism, as mortals would just be following scripts, so your adventuring is all for naught...


Thank you and Mr. Greenwood for this answer but it relates only to included theorem not my question. Could you please ask him to shed a little light on events surrounding the creation of Roll of the Years and those participating oracles (Alaundo, Aughatra, ...)? As they were divided by centuries it always bugged my how it was actualy made together.
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The Hooded One
Lady Herald of Realmslore

5037 Posts

Posted - 14 Nov 2015 :  17:27:27  Show Profile  Visit The Hooded One's Homepage Send The Hooded One a Private Message
Hi again, all.
Wrigley, Ed will indeed answer you when he can. Whenever I drop in to the Keep, I scoop up all posts and forward them to him. So he will reply...sometime. Promise!

(And BTW, all, the fact that Eilistraee herself pronounces her name that way doesn't mean that others across the Realms don't say it differently, and she still answers to all the variants. Qilué and the Seven and El always pronounced it "Isle-ISS-tree," even when addressing the goddess face to face, in the "home" Realms campaign.)

CorellonsDevout, Vhaeraun is back to being himself, with the same portfolios. His ethos is SUBTLY changed; he is now advocating drow dwelling in the World Above (the surface world) be good citizens where doing so will enhance their chances of staying alive and being accepted, and do their evil deeds as covertly as possible. In other words, do good when and where it profits them to do so.

Irennan, the lines you asked about at the end are indeed canon, according to Ed.

Evrat, Draxius was respected and increasingly feared throughout his reign; he was competent, firm, kindly...but increasingly, when nobles and others tested him, showed he could be ruthless. Or at least, that's what Ed has said (quite some time ago, now) speaking as Vangerdahast and Elminster to we Knights. (Yes, we ask questions, too. A lot.)

Bootravsky, Ed will have to give you proper answers, but here's how far I can go by myself, based on much Realmsplay over more than 30 years with Ed as my DM

Tilverton's water came from deep Underdark wells, pumping from a subterranean lake just north of the settlement and its sewers drained to a higher/shallower level of the Underdark well to the southeast, where there was a "fungus kingdom" of interconnected caverns crowded with all manner of molds and toadstools and lichens and, yes, myconids.

Yhaunn is a gigantic bowl that's well watered because the prevalent winds blow onshore up its mouth, and bring thick, clinging morning mists (rooftop cisterns collect wash-water). Drinking water comes in carts from wells in the heights inland, and a cask "fillup" costs 1 cp (so, no creeks); other wagons taking the nightsoil away at 1 cp for a large bucket dumped. Tidal inundations aren't common, but storm surges are, blown ashore, which is why dockside warehouses have "high-crib" pallets (waist high on most adult humans), with the goods stacked atop those, and why certain cargoes are brought from storage higher up straight to loading or from ship-hold unloading. The Stiltways began as ways of moving things dryshod from upper level of warehouse A to upper level of warehouse B, and they now snake everywhere among dockside buildings and for two to three streets back from the docks. And yes, flooding sometimes reaches five or six streets back from the docks, but folks just move upstairs; the ground floors are used for cooking, and all good stored there are in boxes, casks, or sacks so they can readily be "hauled up" stairs, or put on a trapdoor platform let down from the ceiling and winched back up, to the floor above; most dockside buildings that aren't warehouses are businesses on the ground floor (fish markets and packers, coopers, carpenters, etc.) and have two or three floors of inhabited space above, each with its own trapdoor-winch-hoist connecting with adjacent floors.
As for the street differences you noticed, explanations are fairly simple: Urmlaspyr and Yhaunn "just grew" (Yhaunn in a crowded bowl) in a country where coin is king and there's little overall planning and authority, whereas Westgate, Myratma, and Zazesspur all had far more authoritarian local government at various times, that have the power and inclination to demolish unwanted buildings and enforce wider streets and a simpler street layout. Alleyways breed disease and crime and lack of accountability, and so should be eliminated. (Many capitol cities in our own real world bear evidence of large-scale past clearances and "improvements" of this sort.)

And Delwa, I think you are onto something!

That's all for now, fellow scribes; awaiting the next message from Ed...
love,
THO
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xaeyruudh
Master of Realmslore

USA
1808 Posts

Posted - 14 Nov 2015 :  19:20:39  Show Profile  Visit xaeyruudh's Homepage Send xaeyruudh a Private Message
Nice questions Bootravsky! And cool answers!

I've pronounced Eilistraee isle-ISS-tray-ee, but I like the try-ee. Guess that just goes to show we all read things differently. And I like the fact that Elminster says it differently than the goddess herself... something about that just seems awesome.

Very happy that Eilistraee and Vhaeraun are both back, and that Vhaeraun was... humbled a bit perhaps, but not completely changed. I very much like the "shading" of drow, both on the surface and below. As black as they are physically, nuance is necessary. They're useless as NPCs if they're one-dimensional.

Question: Ed, do you have ideas about the Underdarks of other parts of Toril? There's an "Alternative Underdarks" article back in Dragon #267 (with Volo's Elminster-assisted take on some elven nations, Thank You!), which offers four ways to "change things up" if the classic Underdark doesn't suit us. Of course there are bits of these different ideas in "our" Underdark, but do you see the look and feel of the Underdark beneath the Hordelands or Kara-Tur or one of the other continents being perhaps significantly different than the one beneath western Faerun?

Also, is there an Underdark on Selune or any of the other planets in Realmspace?
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CorellonsDevout
Master of Realmslore

USA
1889 Posts

Posted - 14 Nov 2015 :  22:50:52  Show Profile  Send CorellonsDevout an AOL message Send CorellonsDevout a Private Message
Thanks again, Ed and THO! Glad to know about Vhaeraun

Sweet water and light laughter
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Eilserus
Master of Realmslore

USA
1361 Posts

Posted - 16 Nov 2015 :  23:53:12  Show Profile Send Eilserus a Private Message
Hi THO,

Has Ed made any mention of Selvetarm or Kiaransalee?

With Selvetarm supposedly slain (and now returned) with the Crescent Blade and its god killing ability, and Qilue being struck down with the same sword and being the Chosen of two deities, is it possible she isn't "gone" like we think? I'm not sure about her body, but if Manshoon is darn hard to kill because of his status as Chosen, Qilue should surely exist in some form?

I think the Qilue question was maybe asked a few pages back, so please disregard that question if so, unless its OK to say. ;)

Thank you. ;)

Edited by - Eilserus on 17 Nov 2015 00:02:53
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CorellonsDevout
Master of Realmslore

USA
1889 Posts

Posted - 16 Nov 2015 :  23:56:21  Show Profile  Send CorellonsDevout an AOL message Send CorellonsDevout a Private Message
I agree, though Qilue deserves to be with Elkantar in Eilistraee's realm (or Arvandor or wherever the souls of E's faithful currently reside), unless of course her soul was completely destroyed to the point where she doesn't even get an afterlife.

Hey, I am a sap lol.

Sweet water and light laughter
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Irennan
Great Reader

Italy
2662 Posts

Posted - 17 Nov 2015 :  00:01:39  Show Profile Send Irennan a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by Eilserus

Hi THO,

Has Ed made any mention of Selvetarm or Kiaransalee? With Selvetarm supposedly slain (and now returned) with the Crescent Blade and its god killing ability, and Qilue being struck down with the same sword and being the Chosen of two deities, is it possible she isn't "gone" like we think? I'm not sure about her body, but if Manshoon is darn hard to kill because of his status as Chosen, Qilue should surely exist in some form?

Thank you. ;)



Selvetarm and Kiaransalee should be back, if we go by the ''Sword Coast Adventurer's Guide''. THO mentioned that Qilué could have become a voice in the Weave, but I would also be very interested in knowing what happened to her. However, reading what Ed said about Eilistraee not being actually killed, and part of her power being dragged into the Weave as she was possessing Qilué, it follows that Qilué was dragged into the Weave as well.

@CD If Cavatina's soul survived, then Qilué's surely did too.

To all Facebook-using FR fans, you might be interested in checking out this page: https://www.facebook.com/groups/450517575051806/

Edited by - Irennan on 17 Nov 2015 00:02:25
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Eilserus
Master of Realmslore

USA
1361 Posts

Posted - 17 Nov 2015 :  00:28:43  Show Profile Send Eilserus a Private Message
Yep, I was counting on it. I was curious if there was any updates on them like Eilistraee and Vhaeraun. I've always liked Selvetarm and Kiaransalee. Any info to help weave them two into a campaign would be awesome. I imagine there might be some change in how they operate since their "deaths". For instance, Selvetarm was attempting to break his faith away from Lolth somewhat before he died and the Revenancer's lunatic faithful were creating that giant voidstone gate to open the way for an undead army. At least I think that's what the Crones were doing. Curious what they are working towards or how they operate now etc.
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Irennan
Great Reader

Italy
2662 Posts

Posted - 17 Nov 2015 :  00:41:22  Show Profile Send Irennan a Private Message
I would really like to see Selvetarm breaking free from Lolth (perhaps with the aid of his father and/or aunt), and even more to see him, Eilistraee and Vhaeraun reaching some sort of cooperation against Lolth, as unlikely as at is.

To all Facebook-using FR fans, you might be interested in checking out this page: https://www.facebook.com/groups/450517575051806/

Edited by - Irennan on 17 Nov 2015 00:41:37
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Barastir
Master of Realmslore

Brazil
1394 Posts

Posted - 17 Nov 2015 :  10:33:09  Show Profile  Click to see Barastir's MSN Messenger address Send Barastir a Private Message
Could I take a ride on Selvetarm's question and ask if Ed has seen my question on his temple and followers in Undermountain?

Besides, is there a different relation between driders and followers of the Thane of Lolth?

EDIT: In comparison with the relation between driders and followers of other drow deities, I mean.

"Goodness is not a natural state, but must be
fought for to be attained and maintained.
Lead by example.
Let your deeds speak your intentions.
Goodness radiated from the heart."

The Paladin's Virtues, excerpt from the "Quentin's Monograph"
(by Ed Greenwood)

Edited by - Barastir on 19 Nov 2015 10:18:26
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