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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31701 Posts |
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Lord Rad
Great Reader
United Kingdom
2080 Posts |
 Posted - 16 Feb 2004 : 13:48:16
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| Bah! Im having the same problem with this link as I had previously - it just goes straight to the WotC home page! (must be a 404 redirect or something). |
Lord Rad
"What? No, I wasn't reading your module. I was just looking at the pictures"
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SiriusBlack
Great Reader
USA
5517 Posts |
Posted - 16 Feb 2004 : 14:51:44
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quote:
Originally posted by Rad
Bah! Im having the same problem with this link as I had previously - it just goes straight to the WotC home page! (must be a 404 redirect or something).
Yep, this happens more times than I can count with newly posted links by WOTC. Don't worry, it will be fixed in a day....or two. Whoever notices the link finally fixed please let the rest of us know.
You think they'd have these problems ironed out since they don't have a novels' board to moderate any longer.  |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31701 Posts |
Posted - 17 Feb 2004 : 03:49:33
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quote:
Originally posted by Rad
Bah! Im having the same problem with this link as I had previously - it just goes straight to the WotC home page! (must be a 404 redirect or something).
That's strange...I didn't appear to have any problems at all when loading up this page...
Anyway, what do we all think...?
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Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)
"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood
Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage |
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SiriusBlack
Great Reader
USA
5517 Posts |
Posted - 17 Feb 2004 : 05:42:30
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quote:
Originally posted by The Sage
Anyway, what do we all think...?
I was finally able to access the site this evening. Who wrote these stats? I can't find an author listed. A charisma of 18? Cale never had a chance did he?  |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31701 Posts |
Posted - 17 Feb 2004 : 09:16:22
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Maybe the Lady Whitney-Robinson wrote those stats for Tazi...I believe she also wrote her character profile as well...
Here's something I've been wondering...Has anyone seen the Sembian guardblades detailed elsewhere...?
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Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)
"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood
Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage |
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SiriusBlack
Great Reader
USA
5517 Posts |
Posted - 17 Feb 2004 : 12:29:02
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quote:
Originally posted by The Sage
Here's something I've been wondering...Has anyone seen the Sembian guardblades detailed elsewhere...?
Off the top of my head, no. But, I haven't subscribed to Dragon, for well over a year so if they were detailed in one of their issues..... |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31701 Posts |
Posted - 18 Feb 2004 : 08:47:19
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Actually, you may be right about those blades being detailed in a back issue of Dragon...I seem to remember a discussion on the WotC D&D forums a while back that said something to that effect.
I'll have to check the online Dragon article catalogue...Thanks Sirius...
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Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)
"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood
Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage |
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Richtin
Acolyte
USA
33 Posts |
Posted - 01 Apr 2004 : 01:32:49
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| i cant get on. is there another way on that site? |
"Where in the Nine Hells did you ever get the notion that I would fight fair?" |
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Arivia
Great Reader
Canada
2965 Posts |
Posted - 01 Apr 2004 : 02:02:20
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| For Wizards? No. |
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Magic Matt
Seeker
USA
70 Posts |
Posted - 01 Apr 2004 : 03:05:43
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Character Statistics: Thazienne Uskevren
I just don’t understand, I have read all of the Tazi novels, and this seems really off. 
She’s CG!????
A person of extreme wealth who steals the property of other people so she can get a kick out of the danger that she misses in her spoiled-pampered-self centered life, oh and she's GOOD and moral too?
She’s got an 18 intelligence????
But she’s silly and self-absorbed, she has people dupe her(a lot), she makes mistakes constantly, she doesn’t understand her own family. She goes to Thay, and doesn’t understand the basic social customs and get made a slave.
She’s got an 18 charisma?
Well maybe, but 14-16 sounds more plausible.
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"You had a choice between war and dishonor. You chose dishonor, and you will have war."
-Winston Churchill- (to Neville Chamberlain)
The fool doth think he is wise, but the wise man knows himself to be a fool.
-William Shakespeare, "As You Like It", Act 5 scene 1
He who will not reason is a bigot. He who cannot is a fool. and he who dares not is a slave.
-Sir William Drummond- |
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Arivia
Great Reader
Canada
2965 Posts |
Posted - 01 Apr 2004 : 03:32:02
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| Maybe those stats do make sense, considering this may just be an update to her stats as published just before 3e came out... |
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SiriusBlack
Great Reader
USA
5517 Posts |
Posted - 01 Apr 2004 : 06:50:08
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| I can see the intelligence and charisma possibly being a bit lower. But, hey, she did turn quite a few heads throughout her novels. Moreover, she can turn on the charm when she wishes to. Thus, a high charisma isn't off. Plus, I figure she's book smart from her family being affluent and being able to educate her. Hence, the high intelligence. As for CG, what alignment would you have chosen for her? |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36779 Posts |
Posted - 01 Apr 2004 : 07:01:13
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quote:
Originally posted by Magic Matt
Character Statistics: Thazienne Uskevren
I just don’t understand, I have read all of the Tazi novels, and this seems really off.
She’s got an 18 intelligence????
But she’s silly and self-absorbed, she has people dupe her(a lot), she makes mistakes constantly, she doesn’t understand her own family. She goes to Thay, and doesn’t understand the basic social customs and get made a slave.
Okay, two things to keep in mind:
1) Novel characters do not always translate well into stat blocks...
2) Intelligence and wisdom are not the same thing. I have known people that were very intelligent and yet consistently did stupid things -- like a guy who was very book smart, but removed three 35-pound weights from one end of a barbell without touching the three on the other side.
The way I look at it, intelligence is a measure of how much knowledge one can store and process. Wisdom is common sense. The two are not the same thing...
A RL example is Albert Einstein. None can argue his intelligence. but I've read that he often forgot simple things like combing his hair or changing his clothes... |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen! |
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SiriusBlack
Great Reader
USA
5517 Posts |
Posted - 01 Apr 2004 : 07:07:31
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quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
2) Intelligence and wisdom are not the same thing. I have known people that were very intelligent and yet consistently did stupid things
I call them teenagers or men in general from the age of 15-24. |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36779 Posts |
Posted - 01 Apr 2004 : 09:29:01
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quote:
Originally posted by SiriusBlack
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
2) Intelligence and wisdom are not the same thing. I have known people that were very intelligent and yet consistently did stupid things
I call them teenagers or men in general from the age of 15-24.
You may be on to something... The individual in my example fit into both categories when he made that brilliant maneuver. (Of course, so did I, but I didn't make that particular maneuver! ) |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen! |
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Magic Matt
Seeker
USA
70 Posts |
Posted - 01 Apr 2004 : 16:29:10
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As for alignment:
She is a thief, she dose this for kicks and not out of necessity or any possible altruistic motives.
1) Thieves- deliberately prey on other human beings.
2) Thieves- knowingly cause harm to other people, emotionally, financially, and sometimes physically.
3) Thieves- who commit burglaries while armed (as she does), always risk that they will kill their victim or another innocent person if discovered in the act.
4) Thieves- know that they harm society, know that if caught it will harm their families, yet they are selfish enough to still be thieves.
Perhaps if the thief is descent in their other aspects of their lives, such a person could be considered NEUTRAL, if not then they are by definition EVIL!
As for Tazi, chaotic neutral is the best that I would think she could be.
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"You had a choice between war and dishonor. You chose dishonor, and you will have war."
-Winston Churchill- (to Neville Chamberlain)
The fool doth think he is wise, but the wise man knows himself to be a fool.
-William Shakespeare, "As You Like It", Act 5 scene 1
He who will not reason is a bigot. He who cannot is a fool. and he who dares not is a slave.
-Sir William Drummond- |
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Magic Matt
Seeker
USA
70 Posts |
Posted - 01 Apr 2004 : 16:57:46
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As for Intelligence:
Tasi seems to have a problem with both knowledge and with logic, both aspects that go to a persons intellect, not their wisdom (common sense).
1) Tazi did not like schooling, she preferred to learn on the streets, as stated in the character write up. (knowledge)
2) Tazi doesn’t understand laws, customs, or basic facts of They or Calimshan when she visited. (knowledge)
3) Tazi doesn’t understand basic tenants of Sharess or Ibrandul religions in ‘Sands of the Soul’. (knowledge)
4) Tazi doesn’t understand her families business, or how commerce works. (knowledge)
5) Tazi can not put together simple clues that; her brother is a werewolf, that a wizard she is dating is evil, that the butler loves her, that the maid who gets special treatment and looks just like her with blond hair is her half sister, or any of the times that her family was under attack and she just did not catch on! (logic)
So, the best I would give this air head, is an Intelligence of 10.
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"You had a choice between war and dishonor. You chose dishonor, and you will have war."
-Winston Churchill- (to Neville Chamberlain)
The fool doth think he is wise, but the wise man knows himself to be a fool.
-William Shakespeare, "As You Like It", Act 5 scene 1
He who will not reason is a bigot. He who cannot is a fool. and he who dares not is a slave.
-Sir William Drummond- |
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SiriusBlack
Great Reader
USA
5517 Posts |
Posted - 01 Apr 2004 : 17:47:11
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Magic Matt,
You need to stat her up and send it to the WOTC online team or at least post it here. |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36779 Posts |
Posted - 01 Apr 2004 : 18:52:59
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quote:
Originally posted by Magic Matt
Tasi seems to have a problem with both knowledge and with logic, both aspects that go to a persons intellect, not their wisdom (common sense).
I am going to disagree with your arguments. And I will explain why for each.
quote:
Originally posted by Magic Matt
1) Tazi did not like schooling, she preferred to learn on the streets, as stated in the character write up. (knowledge)
How does this reflect a lack of intelligence? Preferring an education system more or less structured than an existing one does not reflect on personal intelligence in any way. 'Tis proven that not all people learn in the same way, and 'tis likewise proven that not all people function the same in the same circumstances.
I myself didn't like school for a long time either -- and part of the reason was because I was smarter than my classmates. I was, quite simply, bored.
And I think that a more practical approach to education -- like learning on the streets would obviously be -- could be of great benefit.
quote:
Originally posted by Magic Matt
2) Tazi doesn’t understand laws, customs, or basic facts of They or Calimshan when she visited. (knowledge)
If I went to China right now, I'd not understand their laws, customs, or some of their basic facts. The reason is not because I am not intelligent; the reason is because I've not studied that area in any detail. Ignorance means one does not have knowledge -- it does not mean that one is incapable of learning.
quote:
Originally posted by Magic Matt
3) Tazi doesn’t understand basic tenants of Sharess or Ibrandul religions in ‘Sands of the Soul’. (knowledge)
I don't understand the basic tenets of Shinto. Why? Because I've not had any real exposure to it. Again, ignorance means one does not have knowledge -- it does not mean that one is incapable of learning.
quote:
Originally posted by Magic Matt
4) Tazi doesn’t understand her families business, or how commerce works. (knowledge)
Not all of us can be financial majors. One person may rock on financial stuff, but draw much vacuum on something creative. His next-door neighbor may be a world-class artist, but have a hard time balancing his checkbook...
Neither factor makes one person more or less intelligent than the other. All people have subjects they excell at, and subjects they don't do so well on.
I, for example, can't get a handle on calculus... But, when I choose, I can make the English language sing and dance.
quote:
Originally posted by Magic Matt
5) Tazi can not put together simple clues that; her brother is a werewolf, that a wizard she is dating is evil, that the butler loves her, that the maid who gets special treatment and looks just like her with blond hair is her half sister, or any of the times that her family was under attack and she just did not catch on! (logic)
Just because a person does not observe something does not mean they are not intelligent. Something that may be painfully obvious to you would not necessarily be so obvious to someone else, particularly if that someone was involved in the situation.
A classic, real-life example is people who don't realize their spouses are cheating on them. If you never have reason to sit down and examine all the facts, then you are not as likely to assemble all the pieces into a picture.
I once had my heart broken because I did not take a step back and look at the situation from the standpoint of a disinterested third person. I saw the signs, but I did not have a reason to assemble them into the picture that I later saw.
quote:
Originally posted by Magic Matt
So, the best I would give this air head, is an Intelligence of 10.
I remain unconvinced of her lack of intelligence.
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Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
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I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen! |
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Magic Matt
Seeker
USA
70 Posts |
Posted - 01 Apr 2004 : 20:13:20
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quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
I remain unconvinced of her lack of intelligence.
Ok, I understand your arguments about Tazi, and would tend to agree on the individual points, but when taken in their totality, I think would lead to a finding that she is an ‘Air Head’. At least the preponderance of the evidence would show that perhaps she’s not the brightest light.
1) Sure formal education is not determinate; I did average as an undergrad, but 3.8 in grad school, so I know what you mean about unchallenging formal education. But, Tazi did not just dislike schooling (non formal private tutoring I would imagine given her families wealth), but the learning on the street they term as "wildings" in the Character Profile, dose not sound conducive to intellectual development.
2) Thay is one of the biggest threats to her country and most Sembian’s should know about such a prominent threat, surely if she was going to travel there she would pick up some information on the place.
3) Religions are such a major part of their lives, and they all seem to be very interdependent (same basic pantheon), a literate person might be expected to know a little bit about the various sets.
4) Not being able to decipher the logical clues to the central aspects of her life is I think pretty damaging. One or two blind spot is perhaps understandable, but not at the level she seems capable of.
But, what evidence is there to show that she deserves a super genius intelligence score? None!
The author doesn’t point out anything in any of the books that would lead the reader to a conclusion of intelligence. If there is not evidence to something like a 180 I.Q., but plenty of evidence that she lacks an understanding of the basic knowledge one would be expected an intelligent person to have, one must conclude that she is not brilliant.
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But, very interesting and enjoyable discussion anyway!
What do you think of the argument regarding the alignment of thieves, i.e. thieves can not be good?
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"You had a choice between war and dishonor. You chose dishonor, and you will have war."
-Winston Churchill- (to Neville Chamberlain)
The fool doth think he is wise, but the wise man knows himself to be a fool.
-William Shakespeare, "As You Like It", Act 5 scene 1
He who will not reason is a bigot. He who cannot is a fool. and he who dares not is a slave.
-Sir William Drummond- |
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Cronje
Seeker
56 Posts |
Posted - 28 May 2011 : 11:31:58
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| I know this is a very off-chance, but does anyone have her stats saved after all these years, or know where they can be found? The link leads to the D&D novels page now, and the write-up over on the Mirrorstone website (http://ww2.wizards.com/books/mirrorstone/Article.aspx?doc=fr_cptazi) throws out an error. |
Edited by - Cronje on 28 May 2011 11:32:36 |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36779 Posts |
Posted - 28 May 2011 : 15:11:07
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quote:
Originally posted by Cronje
I know this is a very off-chance, but does anyone have her stats saved after all these years, or know where they can be found? The link leads to the D&D novels page now, and the write-up over on the Mirrorstone website (http://ww2.wizards.com/books/mirrorstone/Article.aspx?doc=fr_cptazi) throws out an error.
PM me your email address. I'll email you the info. I have it in a Word document.  |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
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Topic |
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Character Statistics - Thazienne Uskevren
